Rem 870 vs Moss 590


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QKRTHNU
December 25, 2002, 01:20 AM
Since the 9mm vs .45 & AR vs AK threads are already broken in I noticed this one was missing. :cool:

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Gewehr98
December 25, 2002, 01:28 AM
http://mauser98.com/870trenchsmall.jpg

The only thing better than the 870 in this picture is to see Runt holding it bayonet forwards in an aggressive stance. ;)

PATH
December 25, 2002, 01:40 AM
Lexus or Yugo? Aw heck it is the Rem 870!

Gewehr98
December 25, 2002, 01:55 AM
A Chevrolet pickup. :D

Hkmp5sd
December 25, 2002, 01:58 AM
I like polls where I have one of everything!:D

870 is best, of course!

tcdrennen
December 25, 2002, 02:01 AM
We have both, though the 870 is a CHP surplus that came with a 3 round tube, and has had an extender to 7 rounds and a Sidesaddle added.

Now, the Mossberg has the heavy barrel, 8 round tube, ghost ring sights and just generally does everything I want a defensive shotgun to do :D

riverdog
December 25, 2002, 09:41 AM
Gewehr98
That looks like a 20" slug barrel, but where'd you get the heat shield et al? Nice set-up.

RustyHammer
December 25, 2002, 11:07 AM
Have both ...

and prefer 870 because of it's smoother action.

Gewehr98
December 25, 2002, 12:26 PM
Which, of course, came with Remington 700-style rifle sights. The heatshield is the standard metal job you can pick up anywhere. I milled a slot in it for the rear rifle sight.

The front end is somewhat harder to come by. It was from a boxed Remington military contract set intended for the Vietnam-era Remington 870 Mark 1 shotguns. It included the magazine extension tube, mag spring, and combination barrel clamp/sling swivel/bayonet lug. I bought one boxed set at the Cal Expo Gun Show in Sacramento back in 1997. It was only a partial set, missing the barrel clamp, but having the mag tube and bayonet lug bottom half.

I moved here to Florida, and just up the road from me in Merritt Island was a gun shop called B&H Guns. In their display case were several of the same boxed sets, all for sale. I snagged another one, and it was complete, yippee!

The set has a gold bead front sight threaded into the top of the barrel clamp. I ended up milling a slot in the clamp to fit the slug barrel's ramped rifle sight. After my modifications, it looks like it was intended to be that way from the start.

The bayonet is the standard M-7 from the M16/AR-15 series. It's funny how it locks on with the tip pointing upwards like that. Not a big deal, that's an extra-full turkey choke threaded into the muzzle, for my household 3" Magnum 000 buckshot carry loads. The patterns at 40 yards are TIGHT!

If you look at an original 870 Mark 1, it'll have the wood stock and forend. That's where I departed the norm, and went with the SpeedFeed black synthetic Monte Carlo set. It aligns the eye right now with the rifle sights.

Next addition is gonna be Meprolight inserts front and rear. :D

sm
December 25, 2002, 12:40 PM
I prefer the 870
Drop is bit low for me, moleskin works.
trap stock comes closer

Gasp!! I don't have one [forgive me I have sinned...]
but, when I get another shucker, it'll be a 870
easier to shoot my buddies and let him clean it...age makes one wiser :D

riverdog
December 25, 2002, 01:59 PM
The heatshield is the standard metal job you can pick up anywhere. Never seen one for sale. Must be another California thing.

Gewehr98
December 25, 2002, 02:05 PM
Here's a couple places:

http://www.atigunstocks.com/SHTSHIELD.html

http://www.combatstocks.com/index.cfm

http://www.outdoorguides.com/outdoor/stocks.htm#Tac%20Star%20Barrel%20Shroud

Schuey2002
December 25, 2002, 03:49 PM
Remington 870 is the better of the two choices.

I've never really cared for Mossy's , and I really don't know why..
Probably because I've never owned one..

Ignorance is bliss. ;)

mlk18
December 25, 2002, 08:40 PM
I used to own a Maverick 88 and Mossberg 500, both were
good shotguns that got the job done. I recently picked up
a Remington 870 Security and so far I really like it. But am I
willing to say one is "better" than the other? No, I think that's
subjective.


mlk18

Erik
December 25, 2002, 09:48 PM
Both are fine, servicable shotguns.

Though just one's classic.

tobeat1
December 26, 2002, 11:25 AM
I am left handed. My wife is right handed. The 590 just made better sense for me. Tang mounted safety is nice.

Line Rider
December 26, 2002, 11:41 AM
I like the 870 design. But, in the recent years Remington has gone to the cheaper plastic trigger housing and the dimpled magazine. Also, they have added a trigger lock. It's a great idea, until you get a call at 2:00 am on an armed robbery at the Kwik Rip and you can't find the little green key.

The Mossberg 590 a1 is what I bought for a duty weapon.

Captain Bligh
December 26, 2002, 12:27 PM
I prefer the 870. Don't like the Mossy's safety location. I also don't like Mossy's noisy forearm. The thing rattles. That's not good for stealthy applications like laying in wait for squirrels, turkey, or deer. (Indiana doesn't allow rifles for deers. Has to be blackpowder, bow & arrow, or shotgun with slugs.)

I'm sure Mossy is a fine gun. It's just not my preference.

RJ

Delmar
December 26, 2002, 01:11 PM
Had a Mossberg years ago, but the cheap spot weld on the action bars broke so moving the handle did nothing. Went back to the 870 and will never leave it.

ruger357
December 26, 2002, 01:17 PM
870 all the way.

Andrew Wyatt
December 26, 2002, 04:44 PM
Left handed.

Mossberg fits right.

870 doesn't.

JHP147
December 27, 2002, 10:30 AM
Over 10 years ago, I helped clean a batch of 870s, many of which the PD had been using since the mid 1960s. I matched the serial numbers to the city inventory lists with date of purchase to prove it. They looked like they had been used as boat oars. Some were rusty boat oars. But time after time, they WORK. Guess it will be true of the newer ones. We had some Mossbergs, not sure of which model, that would bind, were always visible on the shotgun "to be repaired" rack, were a pain to clean, and looked worse in 3 years of use than the 870s in 30...I'm left handed so the safety situation stinks, but I have learned to use my finger as a safety, like the smartmouth in the Blackhawk Down scene.
Advantage:870-until somebody can show me a Mossy than can handle the abuse the street monsters can deal out.

ruger357
December 27, 2002, 10:32 AM
The 870's are a snap to clean.

nascarnhlnra
December 27, 2002, 12:06 PM
I prefer the safety location on the Mossberg as well as the ten year warranty.

Wildalaska
December 27, 2002, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by Line Rider
I like the 870 design. But, in the recent years Remington has gone to the cheaper plastic trigger housing and the dimpled magazine. Also, they have added a trigger lock. It's a great idea, until you get a call at 2:00 am on an armed robbery at the Kwik Rip and you can't find the little green key.

The Mossberg 590 a1 is what I bought for a duty weapon.

The dimples can be taken out for about $20.

If you are worried about losing the key, why lock the trigger in the first place.

Traveler
December 27, 2002, 02:51 PM
It's good to see that you disqualified the Winchester M12 from the start. As a combat shotgun it so far surpasses the others they're not worth debating.

eap
December 27, 2002, 03:56 PM
i had a 590 once, felt cheap and sloppy. my 870 rules!

Dave McCracken
December 27, 2002, 08:10 PM
Ladies and gennulmen, my $.02....

I admit to bias, 40 years of near perfect service will bias the H*ll out of anyone.

There's very little out there in Shotgunland I haven't attempted with an 870.Actually, many 870s.

And usually I hit the clay,drag home the venison, grass the bird, or negatively affect the bad guys' sphincter control.

My lifetime total has to be approaching 50K rounds. Other than deliberately induced glitches or badly abused agency weapons, zero probs.

While the Mossie's a good serviceable weapon, I doubt that equal use under same conditions would have run up that record...

Gordon
December 27, 2002, 11:47 PM
Hey what about High Standard Flite King pumps? I think they cheapened this design up and out popped the Mossberg 500 series. A 590 sure looks like a Flite King. I keep a flite king riot gun at work. My favorite "riotgun" was the Ithaca Mod 37 in the Nam. I never saw a 870 there personally. I dont currently own a Mod 37, last one I had was a LAPD gun NEW IN BOX! I sold it to a LEO who paid me alot because they werent making them anymore and he had to have one. You could pump it with trigger held back KA-BLAMKABLAMKABLAM ect.Any way I've never seen a flite king or mod 37 fail in use. That said of course I favor 870s since the 80s its all I would use in competiton ect. I know how to fix em which is more than I can say for ANY OTHER PUMP GUN!:D

Ala Dan
December 28, 2002, 05:54 AM
I voted for the Remington 870, and in particular the Remington 870 Marine Magnum! What a nice weapon, WOW!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

MiniZ
December 28, 2002, 10:59 AM
For me, there are pros and cons to both. I havent shot my 590 or my 870 enough to break them yet, so until that happens I'll reserve judgement.

mons meg
December 28, 2002, 06:12 PM
As my old boss from Long Island used to say..

"Not for nothin, but..."

It is my impression the 870 represents an entire family of guns. The 590 is a purpose built shotgun for police and military use.

So what are we really debating here? Whether we like the 870 Police models better than the 590?

Line Rider
December 28, 2002, 07:58 PM
Good point Wildalaska about the key. The way my luck goes the last guy who had the shotgun unloaded it, locked the trigger and took the key home with him just before he started four days off. :D lol

I do own a Marine Magnum 870 and I'm now looking for an older Police Magnum.

GunGeek
December 29, 2002, 01:03 AM
Carried an M590 in the Marines. Anyone who says a 590 can't hold up to the wear and tear has never seen what Marines do to a weapon. When I got out it was the first shotgun I bought.

Until I have one fail on me I have to go with what works.

Mark IV Series 80
December 29, 2002, 01:25 AM
Rem 870, 20" Cyl.

chaim
December 29, 2002, 04:08 AM
I had a Mossberg 500 that I really liked but got rid of due to financial problems at the time. Now I really want a Rem 870 (actually I'd like both).

Maybe in a few months I'll get one of each so I can really accurately answer this poll.

Skullboy
December 29, 2002, 02:23 PM
Rem 870 all the way.Easy to get parts, and LOTS of accessories.
http://www.printroom.com/_vti_bin/ViewImage.dll?userid=Skullboy&album_id=121643&image_id=8&param=17710
My Rem 870 Police Magnum has a Choate pistol grip stock, B-square scope mount, Tasco PDP3 Red Dot sight,Scattergun tech oversized safety and forward sling mount.

SKBY.

cratz2
December 29, 2002, 10:35 PM
I prefer the 870 as it was my first shotgun and have never had a failure of any kind with any that I've ever owned, new or used.

But I do also appreciate the added heft and features that come with the 590A1.

Still, if I could only have one shotgun, I probably wouldn't consider it being anything other than an 870.

Kahr carrier
January 2, 2003, 09:07 AM
870-:D

NIGHTWATCH
January 4, 2003, 05:13 PM
870.

.45FMJoe
January 6, 2003, 10:25 PM
590 :D

I have my father's old 500 that he bought new in 1968. In New York, he would take it with him hunting in all sorts of foul weather. He told me that gun has been to hell and back. Guess what? This many years later, I shoot the hell out of it at the range and it has yet to malfunction. My friend recently picked up a 590 Marine and I'm in love. After I've recovered from my 3 new 1911 purchases, I'm getting my own 590 Marine.

Whit
January 7, 2003, 06:04 PM
My first SG was a Mossy combo, it had a 26" and a 20" IIRC, used it to finance the purchase of my first Rem 870. My vote is the 870. ....Whit

swampgator
January 8, 2003, 02:05 AM
I think the action of the 870 is so much nicer.

If Mossy could figure out how to take the wiggle out the action, I'd be a happy man.

Bainx
January 10, 2003, 09:13 PM
I vote 870 since Mossy feels loose and wobbly in my hands.

kokogirl
April 18, 2006, 12:41 AM
I'll take my 590 anyday over 870.

1) shell elevator stays up when loading, unlike 870.
2) 2 ejector pins. (better than 1, heh)
3) i've seen what marines do to 590's and they hold up perfect.
4) also easy to clean

my 2 cents

Persuader4ever

Terrierman
April 18, 2006, 06:23 PM
Been shooting that Wingmaster for what is now just about thirty years and it has not failed me yet. And it still looks reasonably slick. Pre dates screw in chokes so I have a 28" VR Mod bbl and a 26" VR IC. I love that gun and will never get rid of it - far far too many memories there to ever consider that option. So I guess you know which one I voted for...

Blacky
January 11, 2008, 11:32 PM
Actually I have both, a Rem 870 and a Mossberg (500 Tactical Cruiser 12ga. 18.5) just so I don't have to choose and I sleep so much better without that dilemma weighing me down.

The Ghost Ring sights on the Mossberg look pretty cool but if I'm shooting slugs at anything over 100 yards Ill get a slug gun with a red-dot or something.

birdbustr
January 11, 2008, 11:38 PM
Remington wins another one of these. Not surprised. Oh well you still have your top tang safety and a few dollars saved.

Kokogirl: Obviously you've never taken down an 870, or you wouldn't even try to use "ease of cleaning" as an advantage over the 870. Also, how many ejectors does it take to eject a shell? I've never heard of a problem ejecting from an 870 or even a broken ejector.

Remington 870 since 1952!

stevereno1
January 11, 2008, 11:45 PM
"Carried an M590 in the Marines. Anyone who says a 590 can't hold up to the wear and tear has never seen what Marines do to a weapon. When I got out it was the first shotgun I bought"

Wow! I believe this soldier's opinion above the rest. Money talks, Bull... you know the rest.

Sir Aardvark
January 11, 2008, 11:51 PM
I think that the only thing that the Mossberg has going for it is its price, and, just to be nice - the safety is located on top where it has "easy access" with your thumb (or so I've heard).

The sheer volume of aftermarket parts and accessories available for the 870 alone would move it into the #1 spot.
Add to that its legendary reliability and ease of use and you now have a Classic!

Big Boomer
January 12, 2008, 03:44 AM
now you are going to make me buy an M7 for my 590A1! I'll have to pick one up at the next gun show!

Firepower!
January 12, 2008, 05:28 AM
I am in minority here but I like my Moss. Its not 590 but its 590A1 which is being used US marines. How I got, well they gave it to me! It short (shortest pump action I have seen) and reliable under rugged conditions. Rem. is good but for sporting.

It would help if we knew for what purpose the two are being compared.

Mat, not doormat
January 14, 2008, 04:35 PM
I've got a mossy 500 in 12, and an 870 express magnum, in 20. I've managed to jam the 870 in loading more than any shotgun I've ever had. If the shell doesn't lock into the mag, it'll pop out behind the carrier, and stick between it and the bolt. If you short shuck it, same deal. Only reason I haven't sold the thing is that my grandpa gave it to me. I do shoot the Mossy a good bit. I'm not a lefty, but the tang safety is still easier to live with than the behind the trigger variety. That said, though, if I'm shooting a pump, it's more likely to be a '97 than one of the modern ones. I tend to shoot autos more than modern pumps.

~~~Mat

BobbyQuickdraw
January 14, 2008, 04:51 PM
Voted 590 for my needs.

To something posted earlier:

Heat Shields, aka Barrel Shrouds, in California fall under the list of "Qualifications for an Assault Weapon." So they're less common here because, believe it or not, put enough fun things on your shotgun and it becomes an assault weapon. You either get 2 or 3 things off the list, which includes barrel shrouds, pistol grips, bayonet lugs, folding stocks, etc.

Also, the barrel shroud isn't an option for the 590 when you select ghost ring sights, though I'm not entirely sure why. Perhaps the mounting interferes with the sighting or something.

geekWithA.45
January 14, 2008, 05:12 PM
The 870P is a marginally more solid gun.

Being a lefty, I prefer the tang safety on the mossies.

Blacky
January 14, 2008, 05:15 PM
What is a good source for after market products for the 870?

mr.trooper
January 15, 2008, 12:16 AM
While i DO prefer the Mossberg tang safety, The Remington is of better overall quality.

Nothing Wrong with the Mossberg AT ALL, I love Mossberg products, but the Remington is better quality, and its only a few bucks more.

WildeKurt
January 15, 2008, 09:47 AM
I'm a big fan of the safety location on the 500 too. Seems like an intuitive location to me.

Firepower!
January 16, 2008, 03:52 AM
590 A1 Compact Crusier.

Firepower!
January 16, 2008, 10:13 AM
Moss 590A1 Compact Cruiser

doubleg
January 16, 2008, 10:25 AM
I really like the 590 barrel attachment, mossberg should make that standard for all their shotguns..

rantingredneck
January 16, 2008, 11:13 AM
Remington Vs. Mossberg........Hmm let's see.......

The first two 12 ga. shotguns I owned were both Remingtons (a mod 31 pump and an 1100). Then I went out and bought my first shotgun (the other two were inherited), a Mossberg 835. Then I went and bought 3 870's, then traded for a Mossberg 500.

I use both Mossbergs and Remingtons, but I prefer the 870. My mossbergs are fine hunting weapons, but when the fecal matter hits the air circulation machine I'd rather have an 870.

Firepower!
January 16, 2008, 01:25 PM
590A1 Compact Crusier... no pump action comes close to it.

Zach S
January 16, 2008, 01:55 PM
The 870s are nicer, have better fit and finish, but I prefer my mossberg due to my dominate left eye.

I'm pretty sure I've covered this a few times in the past five years...

ApexinM3
January 16, 2008, 06:05 PM
Like comparing Ford versus Chevy. Same thing... get what suits you best. Both are excellent choices, very stout, and have fantastic reputations. Personally I prefer the Mossy, but have no objections to the Remington. I need to get a Remington, in fact...

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