reasons for wanting a CCW


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Joe America
December 25, 2002, 03:07 AM
Hi all.
Today my wife and are trying once again to obtain a CCW.
I was wondering what to put on the form as the reason. They are obviously looking for am answer other than for self protection and such. Any suggestions as to what would be a good answer would be appreciated.
Thanks

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Hkmp5sd
December 25, 2002, 03:22 AM
Let's see...

"Well, why do cops carry guns? Oh yea, to protect themselves from bad guys. Do Bad guys routinely try to rob/rape/murder cops that are in full uniform and walking down the street at night? No huh, they're looking for unarmed victims. Hmm....guess that's why I want a CCW, so they will go look for someone else!"

Then again, you could say you were the only person in the state of California that admits voting for GW Bush and you are receiving death threats. :)

Seriously, you may want to talk to Jim March. He's the expert on CCW's inside California.

dinosaur
December 25, 2002, 07:19 AM
Really? On my permit it says "Protection". Which brings up a point. Driver`s Licenses (CDL`s) were standardized throughout the states some years ago. Why isn`t the 2nd Amendment the standard for firearms? :confused:

David Scott
December 25, 2002, 01:13 PM
Read the newspapers. Armed robberies, assaults, carjackings, etc. Sure, it may never happen to you, odds are it won't. But the odds are that my house won't catch fire, and I still have a fire extinguisher and homeowner's insurance. I think of my Ruger P95 in its holster as a combination of crime extinguisher and violent-felony insurance. The odds are no comfort when you're bleeding to death in a dark parking lot while some no-good felonious bastard runs off with your wallet.

80fl
December 25, 2002, 03:41 PM
There are many here who are more up to date on CA laws, but in Siskiyou Cty, a simple "protection" is enough.
Depending on county, your mileage may vary.

Tamara
December 25, 2002, 03:53 PM
Paging Mr. March! Mr. Jim March to GL&R, please! :cool:

Smiley
December 25, 2002, 03:54 PM
tell them the permit is for "all lawful purposes."

then tell them it is none of their business.

foghorn
December 25, 2002, 10:37 PM
I have a CCW and live in KA. I have had them in two different counties now. My understanding is that you can divide the state into two different attitudes about CCW's. Those locations where it doesn't matter what you put down, you won't get the permit; San Francisco, etc.. And those where the only reason they have you list a reason is so that if the local newspaper reviews their application files they will at least see a reason listed, and if you don't have a criminal record you'll probably get the permit (a lot of Central Valley counties and far north counties). In the county where I live (in Central Valley), the detective in charge of reviewing my permit application flat out told me not to worry about what I listed as a reason. Packing.org has sample "cause statements" in the KA section.

AR-10
December 25, 2002, 11:31 PM
It varies from state to state.

In Iowa self defense is not a valid reason, and will be cause for denial. :mad: :mad: :mad:

Ease of transportation to and from hunting and shooting areas is a valid reason, but is not a limitation.:confused: :confused:

You are perfectly able to carry a weapon for self defense in Iowa (with a permit), as long as you do not admit that it might be a valid reason.:rolleyes:

The availability of permits varies from county to county, because Iowa is May Issue, and some counties won't. The mindset at the state level is this; they don't really want people defending themselves, but they realize that there are so many potential firearms transportation violations that can be incurred unwittingly that a carry permit is a good thing to have if you want to go to the range.

Blackhawk
December 26, 2002, 12:06 AM
Jim March's research is great for PRK inmates to refer to. He posted a thread on TFL a year or so ago asking about "reasons". It collected a bunch of good responses.

Too bad "shall issue" isn't nationwide until the 2A gets restored whenever that might be.

Lennyjoe
December 26, 2002, 05:14 AM
Because its your legal right to defend yourself.

Self Preservation.

Plan-B
December 26, 2002, 04:37 PM
While I like the poetry and stance of the "because I want to protect myself" responses, they don't really do much to help Joe secure his CCW. The reality is that these wont fly in much of California.

My cousin has a CCW from Yolo County (just outside of Sacramento) and his reasoning was for the transportation of high value computer equipment. He used to work for a company that dealt with the liquidation of computer equipment. Although he rarely transported the equipment himself, he was granted his CCW. He no longer works for that company but doesn't have a problem renewing the permit.

Joe America
December 28, 2002, 12:52 AM
Thanks all for you replies.
I have found Mr. March's site, and have been looking else were also. I don't know what I will put on the app. just yet. I think I will contact the Chief of Police and see if I can pick his brain about what he is looking for. I want to know if he even issues the permits, or just jacks a person around untill they get tired of spending money on permits, and just starts carrying illegaly. If he isn't interested, I may try elsewhere for the license

puppage
December 28, 2002, 12:27 PM
Here in CT they don't ask "why" on your application,(which you get from the local police dept. Only when you take the temp. permit to the State Police Barracks do they ask why. I wrote down "for personal protection. I did find it odd that on my local application they asked "place of employment". Since when do you need to be employed to excersize your constitutional right?

dd-b
December 28, 2002, 01:16 PM
It's so dependent on the locality that general advice from us here is pretty much useless. Beyond the obvious things like "Don't mock the person who gets to make the decision on your application", and other really basic stuff like that.

pogo2
December 29, 2002, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by foghorn
My understanding is that you can divide the state into two different attitudes about CCW's. Those locations where it doesn't matter what you put down, you won't get the permit; San Francisco, etc.. And those where the only reason they have you list a reason is so that if the local newspaper reviews their application files they will at least see a reason listed, and if you don't have a criminal record you'll probably get the permit (a lot of Central Valley counties and far north counties).
I don't believe this is completely true. In addition to the "no reason good enough" counties like SF and LA, and the "any reason OK" counties in the rural areas, there is a third category of county. In these counties, which include San Diego, Orange, Riverside, etc., you have to come up with a plausible reason that you are more at risk than the average person. Reasons that I have seen work include:

1. You carry cash every night from your business to the bank.
2. You are a doctor carrying drugs in your bag.
3. You have received documented death threats.
4. You have a restraining order against a known violent person.
5. Your job is collecting rents in cash in a marginal neighborhood.
6. You are a criminal lawyer or judge and certain felons have a grudge against you.
7. You are a truck mechanic who responds to fix broken down trucks at all hours in all locations.

So it all depends on the particular county where the original poster resides. He did not reveal his county.

instantkarma
December 29, 2002, 11:36 PM
I live in Iowa and can't get a CCW, BUT everyone I know carries
pistols, shotguns or rifles behind truck seats, under seats, and their idea is its no ones bussiness! its their right! 2nd and the right of LIFE, liberty and the persuit of happiness!

Russ
December 30, 2002, 05:15 PM
Tell them you regularly carry around a bunch of cash for your business if you have one. If not, get to know the Sherriff or DA. You should go to www.calnra.org and look for Jim March's webpage. He is the authority on CA CCW and is a member of this board. Here it is http://www.ninehundred.net/~equalccw/

BTW, if you vote for a DemocRAT in California, you vote to have your guns taken away in the long run.

Zundfolge
December 30, 2002, 11:14 PM
pogo2, you forgot the most common successful reasons for getting a CCW in the PRK.

8. I am the [brother, sister, spouse, nephew, major campaign contributor and/or mistress] of [local powerful politician].

9. I am [local powerful politician].

:rolleyes: :mad: or :( ... I ain't sure

Viking6
December 31, 2002, 01:23 PM
I agree we should try to help Joe word his application in a fashion that will get his CCW. But it really galls me that "expensive computer equipment" takes precedence over a person's "life". Oh, well, gall in check. Good luck, Joe.

Shamaya
December 31, 2002, 03:39 PM
puppage said: "I did find it odd that on my local application they asked 'place of employment'. Since when do you need to be employed to excersize your constitutional right?"

Applying for and receiving a "permit" to carry a firearm isn't about a constitutional right; it's about a government-granted privilege -- one that can be taken away. Nowhere in any of the concealed weapons permit/licensing regulations I've studied -- multiple state statutes -- have I ever seen the words "constitutional right."

I entered the AZ "permit" system when I was young and gullible (or younger and gullibler, to be more accurate :D). Because I was already in the system when I got wise, I renewed. But had I to do it over again, I'd forego the whole process as it has a fingerprint requirement here that I find quite rude and insulting. And I will not be offering fingerprints and asking for permission to exercise my rights when I relocate to a new state, hopefully next Spring. I also carry wherever I go -- including in states that prohibit self-defense under threat of violent assault by armed government agents and felony prosecution -- without any government employee's permission, which I do not require. I have done so for years, and I will continue to do so until the day I die. If I am ever "caught" exercising my rights and placed into a situation where I am being persecuted for same, let the chips fall where they may; I understand the risk and have long been prepared to deal with it, even if it means I pay the highest of prices.

Joe, if you get turned down, do your best to get it in writing and keep that paper locked away somewhere safe -- it may one day be used as evidence.

pogo2
December 31, 2002, 04:24 PM
Angel Shamaya: You practice civil disobedience in the face of unjust laws, like Ghandi, Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King, Jesus Christ and George Washington. You seem to be in good company.

Plan-B
December 31, 2002, 04:45 PM
I agree we should try to help Joe word his application in a fashion that will get his CCW. But it really galls me that "expensive computer equipment" takes precedence over a person's "life". Oh, well, gall in check. Good luck, Joe.

I couldn't agree more. But it's our same "system" that says fast food companies have to be responsible for our common sense (or lack thereof). Bottom line is that people that we empower to represent ourselves turn around and tell us that we're not responsible enough to defend our natural right to live.

Shamaya
December 31, 2002, 05:15 PM
Pogo2 said: Angel Shamaya: You practice civil disobedience in the face of unjust laws, like Ghandi, Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King, Jesus Christ and George Washington. You seem to be in good company.

I'm not in league with any of those fine people; I'm a speck, comparatively -- an itsy bitsy grain of sand.

Other than Washington, those folks were willing to go to jail and be sentenced harshly for their causes. (Washington, far as I can tell, would've stood his ground to the death, in battle.) I am not willing to go to jail for exercising my rights.

Suggested Reading:

NO ESCAPE: Male Rape in U.S. Prisons (http://www.hrw.org/reports/2001/prison/)

Anyone that wants to put me through that for exercising my rights and harming nobody deserves a full magazine of extra hot self-defense loads.

--AS

CAP
December 31, 2002, 10:47 PM
If the reason of 'to protect my children, family and self' are not enough then you may have to go the way of your conscience.

Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.

puppage
January 1, 2003, 09:13 AM
You got it, Cap. Truer words were never said.

Mastrogiacomo
January 3, 2003, 04:19 PM
I applied for a gun license last year (?) almost. I wanted a Class A -- right to carry concealed and loaded. As a woman I was traveling through Boston at night and returning to an empty, unlit, parking lot to get my car in the back. Then over the summer, we had a string of rapes on women in the North End. None of this made an impression on the Chief. I was told buy pepper spray. Flat out refused me even though I stated the dangers (the detective was impressed with my letter) and stated the "all lawful purpose" line. So much for the right to carry in the People's Republic of Massachusetts. I guess they're waiting for something to happen to me first. Hope I live through it ...:rolleyes:

pogo2
January 3, 2003, 04:54 PM
Mastrogiacomo: I once lived in Boston for 7 years and can understand the dangers of the place, as well as the typical liberal attitudes of the politicians and police. I'm sorry they turned down your CCW request.

I told myself that if I ever took a job in Boston, I would move to southern New Hampshire and commute daily into Massachusetts. You can easily get a New Hampshire CCW permit, and I have heard that out-of-state people can generally get a non-resident MA CCW from the state police. It's too bad you can't do something like this to finesse your problem.

waterman
January 4, 2003, 10:40 PM
I live in a rural NE Oregon county. The deputy asked me that question when I applied for mine. I said "I think it would be a safer place if everyone got a ccw." He said. " Me too." Then he processed the paperwork and 3 1/2 weeks and $65.00 later, Voilla!




waterman

Justang
September 28, 2005, 02:34 AM
nm

Rezin
September 29, 2005, 12:23 AM
Here in PA, there were check boxes... Self Defense, Target/sport shooting etc. Right on my PA CCW, says "Self Defense"

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