Night Vision


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telewinz
December 26, 2002, 06:24 PM
I'd like to get a night vision scope for under $200. Walmart has a 3X 'Night owl' for about $149. It has IR and I guess is a "1st generation scope". I have no need or real use for it but it might be fun to play with. Any comments would be appreciated.

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Preacherman
December 26, 2002, 06:32 PM
Moved to Firearm Accessories.

rock jock
December 26, 2002, 06:34 PM
Caveat to this post is I don't own a NV device. BUT, I did quite a bit of research on them last year when I was going to buy and the concensus I read was that the 1st gen stuff is mostly junk. You get what you pay for. I would save up and buy a good gen 2, or preferably, a gen 3 device.

Jeff OTMG
December 26, 2002, 08:24 PM
Since it is a toy and you don't expect much out of it, then go for it. I have a set of Soviet tanker googles. They are fun to play around with and only cost $200, but they can't compare to my 2nd gen PVS-4 scope or 3rd gen PVS-7 goggles.

762x51
December 26, 2002, 10:39 PM
I would agree with rock jock. I have played around with some of the 1st gen goggles and they arent very helpful. Very blurry/snowy. I would save up for some Gen 2 or 3 gear if you really want it.

Gordon
December 27, 2002, 12:06 AM
I respectfully disagree having used/using them. I bought a ANPVS-2 to put on my m-14 and it works just like it did in nam, real good to 200 yds kinda hard to see reticle though. The ANPVS-4 I have on my Colt H-bar IS brighter and clearer and you can see reticle real good. And being 2nd gen it is much smaller and lighter. Here is the wild card: the Russian Sibir Yukon 1st generation with weaver mount was so clear and nice (IR laser is huge and makes everything very clear for 200 meters) I bought 2nd gen for $800 (1st gen for $400) and it is much better than ANPVS-4 in every way. I cant afford over $2000 for a 3rd generation only those who use my tax dollar can.

Jeff OTMG
December 27, 2002, 01:19 AM
Gordon, is this the equipment that you are referring to?
http://www.nightvisionstore.com/rifle.html

If so, how do you find it better than the PVS-4 and where do you get yours from at those prices?

Correia
December 27, 2002, 03:45 PM
I got to use a 3rd generation a little while ago. I don't know what model it was, but it was the monoculer that you could wear on your head. It was something like military air grade or something.

It was abso-freaking-lutley amazing. I can see why our guys own the night with these things.

Unfortunatly it cost a small fortune.

Gordon
December 27, 2002, 09:40 PM
Them be the ones. I got the first gen from them and the second gen from KALINKA optics I asked for the best price they could give me and it was $900 (not 800) and got priority mailed from St. Petersberg Russia in 5 days! The Sibirs seem to have MUCH sharper optics (I think the glass is ground on Zeiss equiptment) than ANPVS-4 (and much much better than ANPVS-2 comparing first gens) and the SIBIR is lighter(titanium) has weaver mounts, AND the laser which wont work in war(but you can turn it off) lights up REAL good and the ANVS-4 aint got one. Hey it looks like they have SIBIR gen3s for 1800 ask Kalinka girl in D.C. to cut you a deal!

444
December 27, 2002, 11:15 PM
A buddy of mine has two third generation night vision rifle scopes. I wanted to see how they worked so we went out jackrabbit hunting at night. I was really disappointed in them. If a man was standing out in the open, you could see him fine. If a rabbit was on the dirt road you could see it fine. However, if a rabbit was in the brush (sage brush) you really couldn't tell what was rabbit and what was brush, it was all just dark stuff in the scope. He also had a big IR flashlight, it looked just like a maglight that held about six D batteries. Using this IR light, you could see clear as day for about 15 feet through the scope. After that, it was just dark junk in the scope. Maybe if there had been more moonlight ? Maybe if we wern't out in the middle of no where with absolutely no other light ? We both got one rabbit a piece and it was a neat experience to be sitting in total darkness next to a guy then see a muzzleflash, turn on a light and see a dead rabbit.
I decided after that that night vision wasn't worth the money they charge for the stuff. I am sure that I could easily see the stuff in my yard at night. But if someone was using a little concealment and staying close to the ground, all bets are off.

Gordon
December 28, 2002, 12:56 AM
My goats are giving birth this week and I hear coy dogs yipping as I write. It's amazing how they know something is just born. I am closing now and picking up the 20 ga. 870 with the gen. 1 Sibir mounted and am turning on IR and going to search around barn and corral with #3 buck shot I used this combo last spring to put and end to 2 coy dogs(which killed 2 goat kids in 2 nights).Anything 40 yds or less is dead meat even in this light rain.:)

V-fib
December 28, 2002, 03:05 PM
Check out Harbor Freight Tools I got a real nice 1st gen scope from them for $89.95 It's 2.4x compact and has a infrared Illuminator. (It usually sells for about $130 so watch for sales) Russian made uses a common 9v batt. Its great for home surveillance watching wildlife and I used it this fall when I was deer hunting to look for deer after shooting light was gone so as not to spook them when I left my blind. I bought a 2nd gen scope a couple years ago which was clearer but not worth the 1200.00 I paid for it. I sent it back, just couldn't justify the cost. 2nd gen scopes are coming down in price now I've seen a few for under $600 but thats still too much for me and besides their is now 3rd and 4th gen scopes. I figure in about 5 years 3rd gen scopes will be below $500 and then maybe I'll consider one of those but in the meantime the scope I mentioned above works and does the job just great.:cool:

Flotsam
December 28, 2002, 06:09 PM
I used one of the pvs7's once while in the guard - 3rd generation NVG - it was pretty amazing - could easily make out people in fighting positions etc. just using moonlight. Did not give great depth perception, though. Cool toy.

tw1112
December 28, 2002, 06:34 PM
Is it only 3rd gen nightvision that compensates for bursts of light? I mean, say I am out patroling in a wood area, and someone turns on a bright flashlight..or a car headlight, which nightvision would be able to lower the amplification so that I wouldn't be blinded?

444
December 28, 2002, 07:05 PM
I was reading something interesting about night vision in this months Small Arms Review. A company called Infared Imaging, INC. has out a Digital Night Vision Viewer. It uses solid-state digital technology to provide an image equal in quality to gereration 3 products for up to 150 feet. It is not affected by bright light at all, and it is much cheaper than current vacuum tube stuff. The unit goes for $499. Of course it isn't a riflescope, but it might be interesting.

www.digitalnightvision.com

Gordon
December 28, 2002, 08:07 PM
Some first gen stuff in rifles has anti flare, my Israelian ANPVS-2 does . All 2nd gen stuff has anti flare. I too saw that digital infra red viewer and was interested. Cant wait for technology of that to hit rifle scopes, potential much cheaper than vacuum tubes or microplates with better all weather image quality.

444
December 28, 2002, 08:20 PM
Yeah, but you gotta wonder if we will be allowed to have it ? I would like to check out the termal imaging stuff but everywhere that sells it (that I have seen) says LEO or military only.

Kaylee
December 29, 2002, 05:29 PM
Out of curiosity, what effect would high power strobe lamps have on NV stuff? Can the 3rd Gen stuff compensate that rapidly?

-K

Derek Zeanah
December 29, 2002, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by Kaylee
Out of curiosity, what effect would high power strobe lamps have on NV stuff? Can the 3rd Gen stuff compensate that rapidly?

-K The 3rd gen stuff is supposed to automatically compensate without damage to the tube, but that doesn't mean I'd risk a $3,000 tube to find out. Makes for a reasonable argument for a monocular, rather than goggles (one eye works ambient, and one sees the amplified scene).

St. Gunner
December 31, 2002, 07:53 PM
Anyone try the Newcom stuff? I was thinking about using some christmas money to buy the 1st gen rifle scope for some hog blasting. How far can you see with it with some ambient light, it's a question I can't seem to find an answer to. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Gordon
January 1, 2003, 12:05 AM
Unless you have a depravation permit is night hog hunting allowed? I dont want to encourage any poacher but a good gen 1 with a laser illuminator is good up to 100yds.:cool:

St. Gunner
January 1, 2003, 09:00 AM
Gordon,


Hogs are non-game here, you can blow em up with the proper explosive permits, shoot em full of holes with a full auto, poison em, or shoot em with night vision.:D

So is the gen 1 stuff we have to choose from not as good as the old starlight stuff? I'd been told that that stuff was good to a 300yds or so. I may be opting for one of the ATN 40mm tube, 75mm objective scopes I have seen, then I can use it dring the day to. I can shoot 100yds on a bright night with the scopes I have right now.

So what are your ranges on gen II and Gen III?

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