.22's and water moccasins


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beckrodgers
February 13, 2003, 07:02 PM
Anybody ever just go snake shootin? I've been going since 1991. The funny part is I did most of it with an old Bear- cat and Winchester 18-shot auto. One day, I decided I needed a better way to unload and load to cross county roads. That's when my search started for high-cap mags detachable about early 94. Since then (91), I have personally killed several thousand mean snakes. And I mean mean. I have many stories I would like to tell. Some funny, some not so funny. But, I figure it's good practice. So let me know if you would like to hear some. Most now done with a Ruger 1022 semi-custom with 500,000 plus rounds thru it.

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Preacherman
February 13, 2003, 07:04 PM
Moved to Hunting forum.

Double Naught Spy
February 13, 2003, 10:57 PM
What a dumb idea, but I assume it goes with the poor understanding of snakes. For starters, snakes are niether mean nor nice. Their little reptilian brain really is not sophisticated enough to have emotions. Also, snakes do humans many favors by helping to keep rodent populations in check. Except for poisonous snakes, the rest of them here in the US really pose no real threat to humans. Yes, they can bite and it may hurt a bit, but a lot of animals can cause painful bites that are not going to cause any real damage.

As for the poisonous snakes, yes, they may pose some danger to humans, but most such snakes go about their beneficial tasks without ever encountering humans. Sort of funny is the fact that many snake bites are the result of humans trying to mess with, capture, or kill the snakes in question. The confrontation is started by the human, not the snake. There are some bites that come as the result of the human stepping on a snake, but if you step on a lot of animals they will bite you. The fault comes from not looking where you are stepping.

redneck
February 13, 2003, 11:07 PM
Well I fer one hate snakes an find it somewhat satisfyin when I can thwart the deadly onslaught of a big ol garder snake with a lawnmower, weedeater, gun etc.
Ya just gotta understand that with some critters I expect more personal space than others. A pretty lady? Well she can come as close as her sense of smell will let her. A snake? Well then my personal space suddenly becomes as far as my eyes can see ;)

I remember readin somewhere that snakes, or mother nature or something like that adjust their population on their own. Somehow just naturally works into their breedin and how many hatch out. I really doubt our new friend is going to kill them all, in fact I doubt he's even put a dent in the population. So if huntin em gets him some time in the great outdoors an a chance to brush up on his shootin, more power to him.

So welcome aboard, spin us a yarn an maybe some folks will chime in.

Art Eatman
February 14, 2003, 01:14 AM
Even the non-poisonous moccasins are aggressive, or "mean". It's not so much that they can hurt you as make you hurt yourself. :) Fortunately, we don't have moccasins out here in the desert. :D

My policy is that I pretty much ignore snakes, except for rattlers around the house. It's impossible to get rid of all mice; the little doofers love woodpiles and the hidey-holes around sheds, barns, the garage, and suchlike. Mice attract snakes. So, I work as needs be on both species...

Art

Bruz
February 14, 2003, 01:37 AM
personally killed several thousand mean snakes

I have always been under the belief that if I can't eat it I won't kill it, but begining to give it a second thought regarding pests...if you can kill several thousand snakes in your yard, you may have a snake problem!

Azrael256
February 14, 2003, 04:50 AM
I would be EXTREMELY wary of water moccasins. I learned this the fun way. We were clearing brush, and dad spotted one on TOP, yes, I said on TOP, of a brush pile several hundred yards from the creek. Scared the living **** out of all of us. So, dad proceeds to draw his K-frame and empty four rounds of snakeshot into the little sucker. That did him pretty good... well, maybe not. About an hour later, I go walking by, and the little bugger raises up his head, mouth opens, fangs come out... I took down a 3" oak sapling that was between me and... well... anywhere but near that snake. So, dad, being dad, decides it's time to chainsaw him. Now, THAT did him good. Cut one of 'em in half, and they don't last long. We got to looking at him after that, and we counted about 20 bloody holes where the snakeshot hit him.

Since then, it's been SWCHP's until they stop wriggling when they fly in the air from the shot.

Art Eatman
February 14, 2003, 09:14 AM
It is not at all unknown for fishermen in the Gulf Coast country to have a moccasin drop from a tree into the boat. Snakes are known to beome the sole occupant of a boat.

Some fishermen carry a .410 "Snake Charmer" along with them. A high level of excitement in the use of one of these has been known to create a second problem, leading to a frantic search for that roll of duct tape which is back at the truck or at home...

:D, Art

Carlos Cabeza
February 14, 2003, 10:00 AM
Sink the boat Art ????:D .......
I do a fair bit of early spring hawg (Bucketmouth) fishing and have had moccassins chase me, mouth agape ! They are VERY aggressive and will bite without provocation. I don't leave the house without a .22 sidearm anymore. I have also learned to use some ballistic nylon shin protection. Man, I would hate to die on a farm pond in the middle of Nowhere, OK.

XLMiguel
February 14, 2003, 11:04 AM
When I was a kid, I used to caddy at a golf course outside of Richmond, VA, that had several water hazards. Part of teh job was to go after the balls that the duffers shanked into the water, and I learned early on to watch out for Mr. Cottonmouth. They are indeed aggressive, but I found that a 7 iron to be pretty effective at pacifying the critters. When properly motivated (and I was), one could take the head clean off with a stroke or two. I generally don't bother things that don't bother me, but those things will come after you.

scotjute
February 14, 2003, 12:08 PM
I grew up in north Louisiana in the 60's on a farm bordering a bayou and have killed several hundred water moccassins and maybe a grand total of 50-60 other poisonous snakes. I've clubbed, shot, stoned, stomped, macheteed, hoed, shoveled, and even picked up water moccassins. I have found the water moccassin to be the most aggressive of our poisonous snakes. Particularly large ones that are in remote areas. I have seen them make absolutely no effort to get out of the way and have seen several cases where they actually follow you. What I don't know is if those were simply curious or viewed me as prey or just what. However they're normal behaviour is to flee the approach of man.
I have never seen a poisonous snake up higher than about 6' in a tree. A water moccassin normally has to have lower limbs on the tree/bush in order to climb higher due to their "S" shape pattern of movement and thick bodies, unlike many non-poisonous snakes that can literally climb straight up using the rough bark (for example have seen a chicken snake about 25' up a pine tree with no lower limbs). (did see one snake up as high as 8' over water but I couldn't identify it, luckily it didn't drop on top of me)

Smoke
February 14, 2003, 12:09 PM
I will always kill a poisonous snake that presents itself to me. I used to kill all snakes until I saw a Bullsnake eating a rattlesnake. I changed my opinion on non-poisonous after that.

I too enjoy a leisurely afternoon of snake/turtle shooting. A brick of .22s a good rifle and a cold six pack is a nice way to pass the time.

GUNS & BEER!:evil: Horrors:what:

Drink responsibly. Shoot responsibly. You can do both.

Keith
February 14, 2003, 01:16 PM
OK, I'll withhold judgement on the shooting of poisonous snakes. I figure they do some good by killing rats, but then so do non-poisonous snakes which presumably fill any vacuum left by killing the poisonous snakes. It seems a little odd to me to actually seek them out and kill them, but I don't have to live around them, so... go for it!

But why in hell would anyone cruise around drinking beer and shooting turtles for crissakes?

Keith

redneck
February 14, 2003, 02:19 PM
Box turtles an snappin turtles can be pretty common around stock tanks/ponds an stuff depeding on what part of the counrty your in. Not sure that they cause problems, but then I don't go swimmin with em.
Besides you can make turtle soup, tutle shell handles for your knife an your .45, get a big'n and you've got the potential for a super tactical altra camo helmet for the next time you want to make an amphibious attack :D

Smoke
February 14, 2003, 03:17 PM
You don't cruise for turtles. You sit in the shade of a mesquite tree on the tailgate of your pickup with the cooler beside you.

Cruising would suggest drinking and driving...kinda against the responsible part of my post.

Turtles are destructive to stocked tanks. They seem to multiply prolifically and have few predators. They are also challenging to shoot. When they surface only their head is visible. Try shooting a turtle in the head at 50 yards. You must be quick too, they'll dive if they spot you. Its great fun.

Don't knock it 'til you've tried it. We don't have Prairie Dogs in this part of the state so one must improvise.

Art Eatman
February 14, 2003, 03:31 PM
Farm pond = stock tank, in ranch country.

You get a bunch of turtles in the tank, the fishing goes to zip, zilch, nada. I'd rather have fish than turtles.

Park the truck, get comfy, shoot turtles with a .223 from about 50 to 75 yards.

They don't go to waste; the coons eat them. Or coyotes. Then you can go out at night and call coyotes.

"Food chain".

:D, Art

Smoke
February 14, 2003, 03:37 PM
.223, ART?:what:

We always just used .22's. I like the way you think though....come on over to Bosque County and lets shoot some turtles!

Keith
February 14, 2003, 04:33 PM
Ah, I see!

Where I grew up it was considered bad form to shoot turtles in the same way it was to kill song birds and the like. I can see that in a small tank where it might be a choice between turtles and bass, you'd choose the bass!

Thanks for educating me!

Keith

Lexter
February 14, 2003, 05:01 PM
To quote Mike in VA:
"...watch out for Mr. Cottonmouth. They are indeed aggressive, but I found that a 7 iron to be pretty effective at pacifying the critters. When properly motivated (and I was), one could take the head clean off with a stroke or two."

Mike- Club selection is truely everything!! Kinda like shot placement?



Lexter in NC

Bikeguy
February 14, 2003, 05:13 PM
Just so you know, most of the above discussed actions are illegal in GA. Killing venomous snakes is not, but contrary to what most people will tell you ALL snakes will try to get away from you if they have the opportunity.

Box Turtles are becoming very rare in the southeast. There is certainly no reason to kill them.

The vast majority of "water moccasins" are actually other, harmless water snakes. Cottonmouths very rarely climb trees. Copperheads are actually much more aggressive than cottonmouths according to the preliminary findings of research done by Whit Gibbins.

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with legitimate hunting. But killing snakes and turtles just because you can or because you don't know enough to stay away from a venomous snake is asinine and downright despicable.

edited to add: killing predatory turtles in a fishing pond for game management purposes is also excluded from the above - but shooting at the surface of the water is just not a good idea.

JPM70535
February 14, 2003, 05:34 PM
I've always been of the opinion that the only good snake is a dead snake, and that all snakes are good for are "Boots" "Belts", and "Hatbands". They may as has been stated keep the rodent population in check, but I figure I can always thin out the offending critters if it becomes necessary.

beckrodgers
February 14, 2003, 06:13 PM
I'm becky typing for Bobby. Here we go. To the fellas who say something like "shootin snakes is assinine" or that "all snakes will move away from you" or one of the other responses and specifically to Double Naught Spy: I say this, I believe it was 1995. A man had a stroke. Drove his truck into a ditch on hwy 8 west of Cleveland, MS. He was bitten while unconscious 18 times by 3 different poisonous snakes. They shipped him to Memphis. One of the doctors said we could treat the strokes, but it's real difficult to treat these venemous bites. Anyway, the man died. I was not trying to debate morals.
One of my favorite related stories happened in 1996 at the Mid-South Fair. I walked into an exhibit of the Pink Palace Museum. I saw several stuffed animals and snakes. I asked a group standing away from me "Hey, who over there knows about snakes?" I repeated it and finally a big bear of a man walked over and asked what I wanted to know. I said breeding habits, eating habits, habitats, yearly cycles and can species interbreed? He asked what I wanted to know all that for. I said well, I have killed several hundreds of snakes. His eyes got real big. He said, really, how? I said, I shoot em. By this time, there was a dozen people listening. He said really, "Where do you shoot em?" I said, in the head. Anyway this could get long, but he introduced himself as Walter Winfrey, Memphis Police Chief. I said, well who over there knows about these snakes? The question was repeated and I answered, "in the head". This went on for 5 minutes or more. I was ignoring him, looking around him and he kept repeating "well I'm the chief of police" and I said finally, "well I'm Bobby Coleman, I know who you are. I used to work for you. Anybody over there know about snakes"? Finally I said oooooh, where am I shooting em? Mostly in the water. While I stand on the side of the road, in the Mississippi delta in Washington County, Sunflower County. Anyway, it was kinda funny and we still talk about the former MPC. I finally sent him one of those big Time/Life type encyclopedias that I had on snakes. Never got a reply from him.

Bikeguy
February 14, 2003, 06:16 PM
How open minded!:rolleyes:

Sorry, I'm not buying the truck in the water story. I here about people getting killed by "nests" of cotton mouths in lakes around here all the time. Problem is they don't live this far north in GA, with a few rare exceptions. Can you say "urban legend"?

beckrodgers
February 14, 2003, 06:42 PM
hey folks, I didn't know the man that had the stroke and was bitten and died but, I did read it in the Bolivar County Newspaper. If I can find the story, I will share it with you.
There was a guy that swore water moccassins could not possibly be longer than 5'. Needless to say, he was, (I hate to use the word proven) shown different. Also, it takes the fun out of it when we disagree so arrogantly. Thanks.

Art Eatman
February 14, 2003, 06:50 PM
Hey, Bikeguy, aren't "box turtles" the same as terrapins? Land turtles? Anyway, I don't bother them. I generally stop on the road and pick them up and set them down in the bar ditch. (Not the one they came from...) Gotta be careful picking them up; they'll pee on you.

I use a .223 so as to avoid ricochets; I also consider the angle, as well. And an oak-covered hill is across the way.

Besides, 50 turtles in a 1-acre pond is a bit over-crowded. Gotta do my part to balance out the eco-system!

:), Art

beckrodgers
February 14, 2003, 06:57 PM
we tried to find the story in the Bolivar Commercial. Their website does not go back past last summer at this time.

Bikeguy
February 15, 2003, 12:10 AM
CRAP! Just wrote a response, clicked submit, and my computer crashed. ARRRGGGH!

I'll try again! Art - Box Turtles are a strange lot. They have the heads and feet of terrapins and the shells, lifestyle and lifespan of tortoises. Technically, I believe they are terrapins though.

Terrapin - fresh water turtles like snapping turtles and river cooters. They are voracious fish eaters and have to be controlled in some small farm ponds.
Turtles - true turtles or "sea turtles"
Tortoises - like Galapagos and Gopher tortoises.

Yes, I am a geek!

Human killing can have an impact on snake populations. Western Diamondbacks are dissapearing in some of their normal range due to rattlesnake round-ups. Other places are still crawling with them. The smart thing to do is to either avoid those places or behave accordingly when there. If you see it and it has not bitten you, leave it alone. It will sure leave you alone. 3/4 of those bitten by snakes are bitten when trying to handle or kill it. They were there first, they are there for a reason, and they don't want a thing in the world to do with you.

I've seen Whit Gibbons purposely step on cottonmouths (wearing snake boots, of course) and then pick them up with a fake hand. They struggle to get away, and only about half of them bit the fake hand when they could not get away.

Sorry I got so heated, but in almost every case, killing these animals is senseless, unnecessary, and completely unsporting (and often illegal). Especially when it is a non-venomous snake that is purely beneficial to man and can cause him no harm whatsoever (unless the man is a chicken farmer!)

Art Eatman
February 15, 2003, 10:35 AM
For sure, if you kill all the snakes we'd be bum-deep in rat and mouse poop. That's my main objection to rattlesnake roundups; they harvest too many.

I never have been all that interested in herpetology, although I read Ditmar's autobiography many years ago. Fascinating book. But I've never gone all bat-guano against snakes. "They're just there," and no big deal.

I still remember from childhood my seeing a king snake kill a rattler. I stood by and watched that for a long time! Never seen such, since then.

The south Texas brush country, the "brasada" of which J. Frank Dobie wrote, has beaucoup rattlers and lots of stories. Must be lots of food, 'cause they truly grow huge. One of the guys at our deer lease killed one that was right at 6-1/2 feet long, and I could barely reach around it with both hands--around 6+" diameter...

Art

beckrodgers
February 15, 2003, 10:52 AM
more on moccassins.
July 5, 2002, location, Bolivar County, MS, just off hwy 61, outside of Shaw, MS, on a gravel road in an area we call Cleo's. I was recovering from Chelation therapy on the 3rd and was feeling real bad because I couldn't go shooting. So I went for a drive and paused at Cleo's which is ditches on either side, rice fields, overgrowth, etc. I had my Browning Hi Power and I got out of my car and was walking down the road about 75 yards. I turned to come back to the car, it was about 20:20. The road was moving and I stopped. There were 10 snakes between me and my car on the road. Needless to say, I did not fire toward my car but I did manage to kill 10 snakes. After running dry, 4 mags, I got in my trunk and got my 10/22 with 5-25 rd. mags and proceeded to finish off a credible number of moccassins. By that time, I was almost carried away by huge swarms of mosquitoes and had gone thru a large can of bug spray. Anyway, there are several places that I shoot. All are isolated and I personally never shoot turtles on purpose because I have seen them actively take part in moccassin population control.
My cousin Pat went by there the next day and told me "man, that's like me and Lloyd used to find em over there." Anyway, there are many stories and events and inumerable snakes- namely moccassins.

Zorro
February 15, 2003, 10:43 PM
12 Gauge shotgun loaded with #6 shot!

Devastates both and limited range and ricochet round.
:)

TJC
February 16, 2003, 11:20 AM
Sorry for all you snake lovers, but the only good snake is a dead snake.
I'm just thankful we don't have cottonmouths here in NJ. We only have their nonvenomous cousins, the common water snake. They are just plain nasty but harmless. I still shoot them whenever I can.

Bikeguy
February 17, 2003, 06:14 PM
classy - killing a harmless animal just for the heck of it.

I guess it is true what they say about there being no cure for stupidity.

454c
February 17, 2003, 09:26 PM
I have never liked snakes since a copperhead chased me as a kid.And yes, I was in my territory.A 12 gauge made sure it stayed my area.:neener: Since then I have had many run ins with them.Some will chase you, I don't care what anybody says.Snakes and snapping turtles will destroy a fish population in a hurry.Did you know a turtle will do flips in the air when shot out of the water with a 30-06?:D Ever pull your stringer of fish out of the water and find a snake with its fangs buried in one of them?Of course it was the biggest bass we'd caught that day.:cuss:

Art Eatman
February 18, 2003, 12:06 AM
Bikeguy, you ever grab a sparkplug wire, and the insulation wasn't as good as you thought it was? Now, that high voltage won't hurt you--but as the old saying goes, "It'll make you hurt yourself." as you reflexively jerk away.

Some folks are (IMO) inordinately disgusted by and even afraid of snakes and spiders. It's a reflex. It has nothing to do with stupidity. Killing harmless snakes may well be wrong, but that again has nothing to do with stupidity.

My wife is quite intelligent. Lotsa common sense. (Enough common sense not to make personal attacks in a public forum and go against the rules of the forum.) But I gayrawntee you that no matter how much I reason with her about snakes, she's forever gonna be a lot worse than Fat Broad in the BC comic strip about whopping snakes. :D

Art

Johnpl
February 19, 2003, 07:50 AM
Is this an urban (or rural?) myth?: When I was young, a long-haul truck driver once told me that he would occasionally find the heads of rattlers and cottonmouths stuck to his tires, the fangs imbedded in the rubber. The story goes that the snakes were run over, the head severed, but the snake was quick enough to react and strike back at the tire before being beheaded. I highly doubt it, but it does make for an interesting mental picture!

Speaking of mental pictures, do you remember in "Lonesome Dove" when the cowboy falls into the nest of cottonmouths?

scotjute
February 19, 2003, 10:44 AM
Has anyone actually seen a "nest" of cotton-mouth moccassins?
I've seen places with a lot of snakes, but I've never seen them all "balled up" or in a "nest".

Has anyone ever seen a cotton-mouth moccassin over 5' in length? I've seen several 6' rattlers, but longest moccassin I've ever seen was about 4 1/2', and I've killed way more moccassins than rattlesnakes.

As for other snakes, if they're non-poisonous I go out of my way to leave them alone. They eat rodents and some even eat other snakes.

Art Eatman
February 19, 2003, 11:39 AM
Johnpl, snakes just aren't that fast. The rubber of a tire is way too hard for a fang to stick into. And the rpm of a moving tire would sling that head a long way, even if it momentarily hung.

Snakes do gather up to den during the hibernation time. There will also be a "nest" when the young ones hatch (from eggs) or birth (directly from Mama).

beckrodgers
February 19, 2003, 09:12 PM
hey guys, to answer a couple of questions: first, and easiest, would be a simple yes. But, yes I have both shot and captured water moccassins over 6' long. One in a restaurant in Boyle, MS that was crawling around under the pool table. My cousin Lloyd is 6'6" and all of 140lbs. The headless snake was held above my head, above his head and in an "S" shape with his tail dragging the floor. This was right across from a place called "Wild Bills" convenience store. That is the short answer to length question.
By the way, the next night I was told some fellas pulled in and stepped on a large moccassin which they then dispatched with said 12ga, it was probably the mate to our previous guest. They (snakes) often are in 2's or pairs.
I don't know how long a post I can make so I will answer some of our experience with matted-up, balled-up snakes later or next time.

Bikeguy
February 20, 2003, 08:20 PM
wish I had known ahead of time that it was going to be on so I could tell you guys to watch it, but National Geographic just had a show on where Whit Gibbons used the fake hand to pick up cottonmouths and copperheads. Out of the 50 cottonmouths he and his research team have picked up so far, only 17 have bitten the hand. Generally speaking, the bigger the snake, the less likely it is to bite.

beckrodgers
February 20, 2003, 10:31 PM
hi folks,
this is a second part to last night's answer. There is a place in the MS delta that has four 5-acre catfish ponds. It is deserted and abandonded. I frequently in the past have used this area to shoot in. One of the ponds somehow got completely empty. Great place to shoot. Anyway, I was carrying my ruger 10/22 with 12, 25 rd mags, Browning Hi-Power with 2, 30rd mags, 2, 14 rd mags.
Pat was walking ahead of me thru some very high grass and weeds. He motioned for me to stop. It was like and eternity. He motioned me forward looking to his left, out into the water, he asked: Do you see them? I said yes. So we quietly arranged our gear as well as we could. What we saw was an island about 50-75 ft square, out 30 or so yards off the bank. On this island was a slithering mass of moccassins, at least at a very conservative 500 snakes. We were in shock for 2-3 seconds. We opened up on the mass. It was a truly dangerous area. I killed at least 300 snakes from that 1 pond in an hour. Pat killed a like number. Never moving from our spot. Those ponds, judging from the empty one, are 25-35 ft deep. This is the short version of that event. I have seen smaller numbers of groups of snakes, but never that many. We went back later that afternoon and did a lot more shooting. We shot there all that day. I can only wonder what would happen if my chute malfunctioned and I wound up heading for a pond like that. I have basically thought about it everytime I go shooting. This spring, my sweetheart Becky, will be carrying 2 cameras along with her choice of firearm. She has also seen quite a bit of this MS delta in the 2 years she's been going down there with me. She is a professional photographer and has killed many moccassins, (mean, black, nasty, fanged cotton-mouthed, yellow-belly critters) both in and out of the water. I hope this answered the question of balled up snakes. Im still searching for the newspaper article on the man who crashed his truck and was then bitten. I've seen them in trees, I have seen them leap out of a 2-3 in hole in tree trunks. I have also mistakenly walked upon a mound. Anyway, we titled this 22's because that's what we use mostly for extreme practice. Also use shotgun, Browing Hi power, govt model 45 and various other 22's. There are many more events and this was definitely the short version. Thank you for allowing me to post. Thank you for typing for me Becky.
Bobby

Zorro
February 20, 2003, 11:13 PM
PIT VIPERS!

A fake Hand will not work! Unless it is normal Mammal Body Temputure!

Pit Vipers "See Infared!" That is what the pits see!

A fake hand is detectable, particularly to "More Experienced" Snakes as a fake.

Bikeguy
February 20, 2003, 11:50 PM
Yes, they are. That does not mean they won't (and don't) strike at something grabbing them that does not happen to be giving off mammal level heat. The copperheads (also pit vipers) that were picked up almost invariably bit. Additionally, the cottonmouths did not bite Whit's leg (in a snake boot). They can see (though not well, which is why they sometimes come towards a person when disturbed) and in self defense it is doubtful that they really rely on their heat sensors. Can they tell the difference? Sure. Might they bite a real arm more frequently? Sure, but who's gonna do the research?

Another interesting fact is that about 1/4 of all venemous snake bites in the US are "dry bites" - bites where no venom is injected. If they were mean abd out to get us, why would this be?

labgrade
February 23, 2003, 12:37 AM
Snake-Stuff = always "fun enough."

Growing up in NW LA (the good LA) & the Everglades, we did ply the 'mocs some. Our best best was wading chest-deep w/ .44 solids.

I did my share of being a one-man ecological disater area & look back on it with - not quite shame, but a moderation based on experience. We should learn somewhat from it all, no?

A real consideration is always the probability of a Bouncing Betty bullet. Rick Rabbit sucks. Y'all know what I mean. Some areas are more prone towards safety than not.

Box turtles aren't ter's, they're tortii. (FWIW)

Besides the topic, there is no other subject that will bring out the "Ins & Outs" of What Snakes Do other than a "Snakes" thread. ;)

beckrodgers
February 23, 2003, 06:08 PM
yes, I agree moderation is the key. My poor old dead daddy used to tell me, "son, if you want to carry on, don't get carried away." and I think moderation is good. Many times, I have gone to shoot and for the whole year not seen one snake. Turtles every year. Back in 92 and 93, I know this sounds gross, but those old country roads and county highways were covered (litterally) with frogs or toads. You could not drive in the evening or morning without running over hundreds of hopping critters. In the years since (5-6 past) there are still a lot of frogs, but nothing on the scale of before. I remember reading in several different pubs about the demise of frogs. for whatever reason, there are way less frogs. Coming out of Warren road onto Interstate road one day late evening, I saw a crane bird swooping off with a moccassin in its mouth. I tooted the horn and the bird dropped its prey. In the last few years there were an abundance of those crane looking birds in the delta. Thanks

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