Thinking about a 10mm?


PDA






rblack
February 21, 2003, 02:54 PM
Lately I've been thinking of getting a 10mm semi-auto. Now I really don't want to spend a lot for this purchase, so I got my favorite dealer to get me a price on a full size Witness in wonder finish. He can get one overnited for me for $ 350 out the door. I haven't owned a Witness pistol in a long time and was wondering if anyone has this particular gun and what they think of it? Thanks for any input...................

If you enjoyed reading about "Thinking about a 10mm?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
BigG
February 21, 2003, 03:15 PM
I've heard nothing but good about Witnesses. Mike Irwin, IIRC, has a 10mm Witness. He'll prolly check in or you can PM him.

WS42
February 21, 2003, 04:00 PM
From what I’ve read on different message boards people really like them. I’ve considered buying one myself.

ArmaLube
February 21, 2003, 04:58 PM
The incredible and truly fabulous 10mm will rise again. Whatever pistol you buy, in this caliber, will represent a great choice and will give you the knock-down power that one should have in a serious defensive weapon.

S&W's contributions in this caliber were meaningful and represented good quality. Bargains in used 10mm Smiths are worth seeking. They would be wise to re-introduce the 1076 and 1006 models.

Good luck with whatever you decide to buy.

"ArmaLube (http://www.armalube.com) Hits The Mark"

dairycreek
February 21, 2003, 05:06 PM
I think that the 10mm is a fantastic round. Can't comment on the Witness - absolutely no experience with it. But, a word to the wise on the ammo. In this part of the world (Northwest Oregon) it is not only scarce but very high in cost. All my friends who are 10mm fans are also handloaders so no problem with them. FWIW! Good shooting;)

agtman
February 21, 2003, 05:13 PM
The Tanfaglio Witness 10mms are a nice economical pistol for someone just getting into this caliber.

A number of posters have had no problems with their Witnesses and related they were great shooters right out of the box, with the trigger only getting better over time (smoothing out).

Some posters have also related that when they did experience problems with their Witnesses, EAA, the importer, was a b*tch to deal with in getting the problem fixed under warranty. So you might want to do a Search and read the various posts - pro & con - to get a handle on the different opinions.

As for ammo, if you reload, fine; if not, the best sources for relatively inexpensive 10mm ammo are probably the CCI/Blazers or Georgia Arms (a 1000-rd case of reloadable G.A.'s 10mm/180gn FMJ runs $180 - or 18-cents per rd).

HTH. :)

rblack
February 21, 2003, 05:29 PM
Thank you to everyone for your replies. I'm really torn right now because he also has a S&W Performance Center model 66f comp 357 that he'll let me have for $550 out the door and its NIB.

BigG
February 21, 2003, 06:56 PM
Gotta get a digital camera. Have this powerful urge to take pictures of my Delta GC and post it everytime one of these threads come up like Sean does! :evil:

nvrquit
February 21, 2003, 07:24 PM
... to EAA(IMO, of course). Agtman, you were very "nice" in commentary about what some EAA cust. ser. "veterans" went through.

From my research on the matter, it has appeared from same, that the full size Tan's suffer less problems than their compact siblings. Caliber-wise, for some reason unknown, the compact .40 S&W's and 10mm's appear to have experienced more "problems" than others. The 9mm Tan's seem to be the most trouble free, though I have turned up only one .38 Super that experienced any issues and these were related to magazines, not the pistol itself.

Not to put you off a Tanfoglio(please, call the pistol a Witness or Tan, don't curse it by calling it an EAA), but read the posts on my experiences on the following links:

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=74160&highlight=EAA

http://pub105.ezboard.com/fczechpistols82792frm35.showMessage?topicID=8.topic

http://talk.shooters.com/room_30/20419.cfm

Read all the comments from both myself and others that experienced good and ... not so good things in dealings with EAA. If you still deside to purchase, please do yourself a favor and see if you can put at least 100 rounds through the pistol before your committment is finalized. If not, good luck and I hope that no one has to go through what I expereienced

Kahr carrier
February 21, 2003, 10:45 PM
Buy them both.:D But its a hard choice those S&Ws are nice.:)

DeltaElite
February 21, 2003, 10:53 PM
Definitely get a 10mm, I was shooting my Delta Gold Cup today and I remember why I got one. Big booms and very accurate. :D

dairycreek
February 21, 2003, 10:54 PM
FWIW I would go for the S&W. It's just so doggone cool! Good shooting;)

M58
February 22, 2003, 03:48 PM
I like the two Smith 10mms I have!

12-34hom
February 22, 2003, 04:28 PM
Ordered a Dan Wesson "Razorback" [serial # 04] in 10mm. From what i've read on the 1911 forum, it's everything its promised to be by the makers.

I had a Glock model 20 and was sold on this round, but not the Glock.

12-34hom.

Sean Smith
February 22, 2003, 04:52 PM
The EAA Witness is OK, but you are probalby better off just finding a used S&W 10xx for about the same money. Some examples:

1006:

http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?ItemNum=3961783

1076

http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?ItemNum=3959781

Grayrider
February 22, 2003, 06:30 PM
rblack,

I will comment on both the 10mm Witness and 1076, given that seems to be the trend here. My 1076 was cheap used, has been 100% reliable with all ammo, and pretty accurate. I would never sell it. My only complaints are it has a pretty gritty and sloppy trigger (although not very heavy); and it cannot be caried cocked & locked. I am used to that method of carry. Still, a hell of a pistol.

My 10mm Witness is the target ported model currently offered from CDNN for $329. Very cheap IMHO. You get porting (no, the flash does not blind one at night contrary to popular belief), adjustable sights, and the Tanfoglio "wonder" finish. The latter is very hard and resistant to damage. Mine has a great trigger--far better than my Smith.

However, the Witness needed some adjusting. The sights were off from the factory--way too low. Adjustables were a good idea on this gun. It had feeding issues. I polished the ramp to a mirror finish and now it is reliable with most ammo. Really hot stuff does not eject reliably. By really hot I mean pushing the envelope to the limit. Stronger springs would probably fix that, but I don't want to affect cycling with more conventional hot loads.

Given the choice of only one in that price range, get the Smith to be sure you are happy. If you are patient and want some customizing options, get the Witness. You can get hi-caps for it, ambis, sights, grips, comp, 40 barrel, etc. If you can afford both, you would have two cool guns or you could get a 1911 in 10mm. Several great options here, and after all it is all about the 10mm no matter what the platform!

GR

jonptoms
February 22, 2003, 06:34 PM
natchez has blazer 10mm fro $9.60 a box. IF you want reloadable the GA ammo is $10/box, and UMC Factory 180JHP @ 1150fps is $14/box case price.

Stevie-Ray
February 22, 2003, 08:18 PM
I love my Delta Elite and wouldn't trade it for anything. It is so tight and accurate, it is a pleasure to shoot. The powders used in 10mm are also so clean burning, the gun is a snap to clean. AA-7 for all my reloads does the same. 10mm will never fall by the wayside as far as I'm concerned.

Mike Irwin
February 22, 2003, 09:30 PM
I like my Witness, a LOT.

The only problem with it is that it is undersprung from the factory.

The first thing you should do is to get an 18 or 20 pound spring from Wolfe.

agtman
February 23, 2003, 11:48 AM
For the money involved ...


... you have some options in 10mm guns, as you can see by the comments posted above.

Used but excellent-condition 10mm S&Ws (or, sometimes, LNIB) are out there for about what you'd pay for a new Witness - you just have to be patient and keep searching. The 9-rd mags are still plentiful, and you also have a few options on grip style for the Smiths: factory arched or straight backstrap, or Hogue rubber grips. Also, you can swap out the white-dot sights for Novak tritiums, new springs can be had from Wolff's, and 10XX-series parts are still available from Smith or Brownells.

One virtue of the full-size 10mm Witness is that it brings CZ-style ergonomics into your hand. The Witness has a fundamentally different feel to it, especially in distributing hard recoil, from a Glock, a large-framed S&W or any 1911-pattern single-stack gun. Many people like that feel, and it's no surprise that the CZ was chosen as the template from which to create the first commercial 10mm pistol - the Bren Ten.

Notice I said "different," not "better." How a person responds to "felt recoil" based, in part, on a handgun's particular frame shape is a very subjective individual thing. Still, I've always liked CZ-style ergonomics, but I also like the big Glocks and Smiths. YMMV.

If you enjoyed reading about "Thinking about a 10mm?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!