The Best 1911?


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PinnedAndRecessed
September 24, 2004, 02:48 PM
I'm in the market for another 1911 or clone. I have had a Mk4/Series 70 since the mid 70's and have only put about 2000 rounds through it. It was rebuilt/tricked up/tuned by the late Jim Clark and then by Trapper Guns (Michigan) and is a finicky target piece. It's almost a trophy and I hesitate to shoot it much.

So now I'm looking for another gun I can shoot with a clear conscience; a 1911 or clone that is absolutely durable. Accuracy is secondary and price is no object. An absolutely reliable weapon even after several hundred rounds with a really dirty powder (I use Unique).

It also must be Kalifornicate legal, but that doesn't seem to be much of a problem since even high dollar guns have made the list.

If you've had a bad experience with a particular brand, I'd like to hear about it. Conversely, if you're impressed with a brand, I'd like to hear about that, as well.

Thanks, in advance.

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ruger357
September 24, 2004, 03:30 PM
Don't know if it's the best, but I have had great luck with my SW1911.

Kruzr
September 24, 2004, 03:32 PM
If money is no object, the Ed Brown Kobra Carry is a very nice piece of work....and very accurate to boot.

Berg01
September 24, 2004, 03:34 PM
I'm not in the habit of recommending anything I don't have firsthand experience with. I own an SW1911 with adjustable sights, and I can vouch that it is accurate and very reliable using good reloads, and every factory load I have tried in it. Since it has a firing pin block, I think it is legal in CA, although I think that a local retailer would know for sure.

PinnedAndRecessed
September 24, 2004, 03:35 PM
How many rounds have you fired in it? Will it feed SWC? May I ask what you paid for it?

BigG
September 24, 2004, 03:36 PM
Series 80 Gold Cup Enhanced is my favorite. YMMV

ruger357
September 24, 2004, 03:41 PM
PinnedAndRecssed,
So far around 500 rounds. Feeds SWC, JHP with no problems whatsoever. Paid $690.

Old Fuff
September 24, 2004, 03:44 PM
You are going to get a lot of opinions ... :what: :what: :uhoh:

If I was in your shoes, and within reason money wasn't an object, I would look for another early Series 70, or a pistol made before the Series 70 but after World War Two. I'd want a pistol in perfect mechanical condition, but not necessarly perfect finish. I would expect to have it refinished anyway after installing better sights, and some minor reliability work.

Why? Because these pistols were made with no-compromise steel by workers who knew what they were doing and did it well. Unfortunately you seldom see that today.

An alternative would be to have a pistol hand-built, after carefully choosing the aftermarket suppliers who would supply the parts. Personally, I'd rather start with the best stuff in the first place. If you do a bit of research on this forum you will quickly find that it's filled with threads about problems with this or that 1911 style pistol being currently produced.

But next to nothing in the way of complaints about the older guns.

BigG
September 24, 2004, 04:22 PM
next to nothing in the way of complaints about the older guns.

Fuff: with all due respect, I bet there is less than 1% of the posters here who have and shoot an old Colt or US Pistol.

The majority have recently come upon shooting and buy the latest models at their local dealer.

Personally, I've shot quite a bit of standard 1911A1 and while they are hell for reliable, they are uncomfortable. Not only that, a nice condition one is cost prohibitive today. Unless I were J. Paul Getty I would never spend $4,000 for a unfired WWII 1911A1 like I see some people advertising.

So most of the old shooters changed their NRA 1911A1s and destroyed the collector value. The newer Colts are just as good as the older WWII and prior US Pistols except in the eyes of collectors.

So it's not surprising there are no complaints about the older guns; nobody shoots em. ;) YMMV

Old Fuff
September 24, 2004, 07:06 PM
Ya think ..... ?? Nobody shoots the post-war through 1970 guns?? Comes as news to me. It will also come as news to 1911 Tuner.

$4,000.00 !!!!!!!!! Not unless it is an exceptional collector's item. Local shops will sometimes have post-war guns in finish-worn condition for anywhere from $600.00 to just over $1,000.00 - which I agree is outrageous, but the basic quality is there.

P&R is looking for a totally reliable shooter. He already has his "fancy gun." Also it just might be that one of those guns that was modified (usually by adding adjustable sights) that collectors' turn their noses up at might fill his needs, and for a sharply discounted price. The only "confort" issue I can think of has to do with the grip safety, and for those who have a problem the cure is easy - on either old or new guns.

As I read his first post, P&R is looking for opinions - mine, yours and everybody elses. I said he'd get a lot, and he is. He can pick and choose whatever he wants, and so can everyone else.

But I think you'll find a lot of opinions that agree that functional reliability wasn't and isn't a likely problem with the older guns as much as it is with the current ones.

And I back my opinion with over 50 years of experience ... :D :D :D

bountyhunter
September 24, 2004, 07:28 PM
So now I'm looking for another gun I can shoot with a clear conscience; a 1911 or clone that is absolutely durable. The STI Trojan is kali legal again. It's about $1600 worth of hand fitted 1911 that can be had for about $950. I believe I have well over 20,000 rounds through mine (don't really keep track) and it is still perfect. All orignal parts except recoil spring, I had to re-tension the extractor at about 15,000 rounds.

Johnny Guest
September 24, 2004, 07:29 PM
Old Fuff wrote: . . . I would look for . . . a pistol made before the Series 70 but after World War Two. I'd want a pistol in perfect mechanical condition, but not necessarly perfect finish. I would expect to have it refinished anyway after installing better sights, and some minor reliability work. Wow, how strange that you wrote that today, and that I read it while wearing exactly that pistol, rigged out in precisely that manner. Mine is s/n C2346XX, indicating 1948 production - - Just five years younger than myownself. I picked it up at a Fort Worth Gun Show maybe fifteen years back, in excellent working condition, but the finish of the left side was badly marred, and the barrel had been deeply pitted with corrosive ammunition.

I took it to Dave Walters in Dallas, who had done some work on my IPSC pistols in the early 1980s. Dave KNOWS about real, working sidearms. We discussed some details, and I asked him to fix the pistol as if his own son was going to carry it to war. He fitted a new barrel and polished the throat. He installed high, fixed sights, tuned the ejection and gave it a crisp 4-1/2 pound trigger. He then gave it a rather plain, service finish, just short of dull. The pistol wears a set of old National Match Colt stocks with medallion, and a checked, arched, mainspring housing with lanyard loop. Accurate? Maybe four inches at 25 yards, or a bit less, but it’ll do that all day, every day, and not be fussy about diet or weather.

This pistol isn’t very pretty, but then, it hasn’t been pampered. The field finish has become scratched and holster worn, and what of it? This is a working weapon, serious as a heart attack, and it’ll do to carry up the river and over the mountain.

I carry a Commander most of the time, because of the lighter weight. I took the Government Model out this morning for the monthly law enforcement match. My lowish rank in the standings was my own doing, and NOT from any lack on the part of the old Colt. It may have been the ugliest pistol in the contest. I know I was the oldest, ugliest cop there.

BigG, what you say about few THR members shooting old Colts may be close to correct. Just count me amongst the “One Per Centers.” Oh, and, I occasionally shoot my 1950s vintage National Match, as well. ;)

Best,
Johnny

Kruzr
September 24, 2004, 07:53 PM
The STI Trojan is kali legal again. It's about $1600 worth of hand fitted 1911 that can be had for about $950. I believe I have well over 20,000 rounds through mine (don't really keep track) and it is still perfect. All orignal parts except recoil spring, I had to re-tension the extractor at about 15,000 rounds.

While I think they make a very good gun for the money, STI still won't ship new guns to Kali. FWIW and IMO, I wouldn't support a company who gave in to the anti's in the state. STI is the ONLY manufacturer who stopped shipping to the state just as the anti's had hoped when the manufacturer liability law passed. There are plenty of other choices without supporting a company who contributes to the demise of their own industry.

JMHO.

RugerOldArmy
September 24, 2004, 08:54 PM
My vote: Kimber Stainless Gold Combat II (If you want nightsights, otherwise a stainless Kimber Gold Match II)

PinnedAndRecessed
September 25, 2004, 12:23 AM
I can't find the SW1911 in either my Gun Digest (2004) or Shooter's Bible (also 2004). Is that what it's called? Or does it have a different model designation?

How many variations are there? Is there a base model and then another model?

Ruger 357: That price you quoted, does yours have adjustable sights, etc?

jamz
September 25, 2004, 01:50 AM
One more vote for the SW1911. I've a thousand rounds or so through it, not a single malfunction. Not even one. FMJ, JHP, you name it. Mine shoots a little high though, once the barrel warms up.

-James

http://firearms.smith-wesson.com/store/index.php3?cat=293581&sw_activeTab=1

there are the models.

By the way, Tuner1911 has a few thoughts on reliability in a thread around here somewhere...... ;)

-James

silent one
September 26, 2004, 12:01 AM
pinned and recessed,

My vote would be for the pre series 2 kimber. I own two of them, and neither has given me a single problem with over 40,000 rounds through them. All I do is change the recoil springs every 5 or 6,000 rounds, keep them clean, and well lubed. Both are the Classic custom models, which were their base .45's. I also have a high regard for the new Springfield Mil-Spec .45's. I own three, and they run flawlessly. They are inexpensive, and are a high quality weapon, IMHO. Price does not always denote quality. I have owned some high end .45's, that weren't worth the steel they were made from. I also have, and have had, some relatively inexpensive weapons, that I would bet my life on, to perform, should the need arise.
I know when I was looking for a good .45, I would go to my local range, and just observe shooters, and see what make of weapon they were using. Believe me, if you want to get an education in firearms, just observe, and ask questions at a range, and you will see first hand, what works, and what doesn't. Most shooters are more than willing to give you honest feedback on the weapon they are using. Some will even go so far as to ask you if you would care to try their weapon. It might be worth a shot. :)


Good luck, and be safe,

SILENT ONE

Ala Dan
September 26, 2004, 12:25 AM
Greeting's All-

I won't argue with the highly respected opinion of my very good
friend the silent one, as I consider him a 1911 .45 caliber
expert; cuz he has tons of experience with these fine weapons.

And my recommendation probably is far from the best, but have
you taken a look at the Para Ordnance single-stack, SA 1911
model SSP? Available in the standard barrel length of 5 inches,
or the Commander size 4.25 inches; this weapon is worthy of
taking a look at.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

one45auto
September 26, 2004, 01:40 AM
I'd recommend the variant I myself own and use, a Colt Model 1991A1 Stainless.

PinnedAndRecessed
September 26, 2004, 02:55 AM
Re Springfield Mil-Spec 45: I think I looked at one today. It has a steel frame, fixed sights and ambidextrous safety. If it's the same one, it's selling for $650. Does that sound about right?

Also, I'm reading alot about MIM parts. Never knew there was such a thing till I started reading posts on THR.

Do you know about MIM in Springfield? How would the amount of MIM parts in this 1911 compare with others.

PinnedAndRecessed
September 26, 2004, 02:57 AM
Colt is not shipping anything to central Kal at this time. Dealers are griping that Colt doesn't seem to have their act together because we're not seeing any new handguns. Period.

It's a shame, too. Cause I've always liked Colt.

Rob96
September 26, 2004, 06:22 AM
because we're not seeing any new handguns. Period.

That's odd, I've seen them around here. Last July I bought, a new Colt stainless 1991A1, have seen other dealers with re-intro Series 70's, another dealer that has some XSE's. Many seem to end up on the auction board, being sold for higher than gunshop prices.

Higgins
September 26, 2004, 11:02 AM
Just curious re: older Colts. Seems I read that back when Colt was supplying 1911's to the military and also selling them commercially, the ones they held out for commercial sales were the ones that weren't up to military spec for some reason. In essence, the rejects were held aside for "fixing" and then commercial sale. I'm not slighting Colt or stating any opinion. Just passing on info I've read and requesting further info. Anyone know more?

Old Fuff
September 26, 2004, 11:33 AM
Yes, no and a positive maybe …

Both individual parts and the finished pistols were subject to inspection by both government and Colt inspectors. The Government inspectors sometimes rejected parts for less then consequential reasons. When this happened Colt would sometimes refinish the parts and use them in commercial guns, but in some ways, especially in terms of a higher level of polishing and bright blue finish, the standards for commercial guns was higher then those for military models. The practice of using refurbished “condemned” military parts in commercial guns went back to at least the days when Uncle Sam’s Army was buying model 1873 Single Actions. In any case, components with material or workmanship defects that couldn’t be completely corrected were never used in commercial guns. Colt wouldn’t have risked its reputation to save a few pennies by using truly defective parts.

The Real Hawkeye
September 26, 2004, 12:10 PM
Here's what you should do. Buy a Springfield US GI Model, then send it off to Yost for a very basic overhaul, replacing critical small parts, fitting and tuning. You will end up with an excellent, no nonsense, Government Model that will work every time, and shoot great. Total cost should be less than a grand.

silent one
September 26, 2004, 12:47 PM
Pinned and Recessed,

I think the Springfield you were looking at may have been the PX915IL, which is a "loaded'' version. The one I was referring to was the base model G.I. Mil- Spec. These are basically what the original G.I. pistols looked like during WW-2. There are different versions of this weapon. The WW-2 version has low sights, small ejection port, and a lanyard loop on the end of the main spring housing. These are selling for approx $439.00 around here. The other version has the high three dot sights, larger ejection port, and no lanyard loop. These sell for approx $469.00. Both versions are nice, but the small sights on the WW-2 version, take a little getting used to.
As far as MIM parts, there is a plethora of opinions, and information on this subject. Personally, I haven't found a problem with any of my weapons that utilize MIM parts. Actually, I don't think there are many manufacturers who don't use them today. I don't think Springfield uses more, or less MIM parts than any of the other manufacturers. There are many posts on this subject. Some are nagative, and some are positive. You have to decide for yourself. There are many after market companies that manufacture replacement small parts made from steel, if you should care to replace the MIM parts. Personally, I'm one who believes, ''if it ain't broke, don't fix it".


good luck, and be safe.

SILENT ONE

P.S. If you want expert advice on the .45, you can ask 1911 tuner, or ol fuff.
If you wish to know about the Sig, or Para Ordnance, there's Ala dan. They don't call him "Mr Sig" for nothing :D

Jim4003
September 26, 2004, 02:13 PM
I like my SW1911. Good reliable gun with good features. Only thing I am not happy with is the SW1911 billboard on the slide, a nice rollmark like Smith used to use would look better in my opinion.

schromf
September 26, 2004, 02:56 PM
Old Colts, count me in that 1% in spades. They work, and work, and work.

You said dollars weren't an issue, look in this issue of Shotgun News, Look for Surf City Firearms ( there in Kali ) there are some interesting old Colts in the ad. They range from reasonable to a Singer with POR. Check out item #14 its an Ithaca, price isn't outrageous, interesting.....

Bang for the buck hunt down a Sistema, or get a NRM Colt. One is a $300 ish dollar option ( depending on condition), the Colt can be had for around $550 NIB. I own one of each both are very reliable. If you are wanting to shoot SWC's and HP, the NRM is a very good option.

Jax
September 26, 2004, 04:25 PM
I can't understand why the Valtro (http://www.valtrousa.com/)
clan hasn't chimed in yet.

I've only heard good things about their 1911.

I'm hoping to see one here in TX before I plunk down my money. If you are in SoCal, you can go visit them and see for yourself.

1911WB
September 26, 2004, 04:35 PM
Definitely Les Baer, definitely! I've had my Concept VI (full sized SS) about 5 years. I think it costs about $1600 retail now. It is very well-fitted, extremely tight (about the only valid complaint I've heard about Baers), fires everything with no malfunctions in the about 1500 rds. I've put thru it (includes ball, lead SWC's & Hp's). It is the most accurate 1911 & has the best trigger (slick 3.5 lbs.) I've ever experienced. :)

PinnedAndRecessed
September 27, 2004, 10:31 PM
Who is yost?

And, what do you think about the mil-spec Springfield? The one I looked at had Novak type sights and ambidextrous safety. (I shoot left-handed.)

He's asking $650 and doesn't budge.

I don't know much about MIM parts but I've heard all firearms manufactured today used them. What about MIM in Springfield?

thanx

PinnedAndRecessed
September 27, 2004, 10:40 PM
You said: "I've seen them around here.."

There is one other store I've not checked. After Kalifornicate outlawed the 50BMG one of their salesgirls said the cartridge could shoot a plane out of the sky and she approved of the ban. THIS FROM A GUN SALESPERSON!!

Another person behind the counter said he could see the logic.

AND ALL THAT WHILE THEY HAD TWO 50BMG'S FOR SALE ON THE COUNTER!

I gave them a lesson about the 2nd Amendment and left in disgust. I then contacted the owner who was very surprised that two of his salespeople (who, I might add, are young Kalifoooooooooooooooornians) would say something......

THAT FREAKING STUPID!!!!!!!!!1

But, I guess I'll go back to see if they have any Colt 1911A1's.

schromf
September 27, 2004, 10:47 PM
Who is yost?

Probably in reference to Ted Yost, very top drawer smith. You might check his site and see if he has any already made guns available. He does on occasion.

Dienekes
September 28, 2004, 12:15 AM
FWIW, I plowed a windfall into a stainless Springfield Mil-Spec some months ago to get back to some .45 ACP shooting without putting more wear and tear on my old Colts--at least that was my excuse. Haven't had too much time to shoot it a lot but am now up to about 500 rounds through it. 90% of the ammo through it has been my old H&G 200 gr. SWC cast bullet, and in the initial 100 rounds with questionable mags I had about 4 failures to feed. It has been clear sailing since then and I expect it will continue.

The only things I have done to it were to change the front sight to a dovetailed unit to get a little more sight height, and to fit a matt hard-chromed lanyard loop mainspring housing (because I like them).

Thus far it is a good shooter and looks like it will be a serviceable piece. I like it.

Simpler is better.

PinnedAndRecessed
September 28, 2004, 12:56 AM
You said: "Simpler is better."

Tell me about it. I started off with your basic Mark 4/Series 70. Out of the box (circa, 1978) it jammed everything but 230 grain fmj.

I sent it to Jim Clark to have feed ramp and ejection port modified, Smith and Wesson sights installed, slide tightened for accuracy, mag well beveled, ambidextrous safety and ~3 pound trigger pull.

It fed everything fine. But sometimes the hammer follows the slide, probably because the trigger pull is too light.

I use nothing but reloads and use Unique powder. It's really dirty and because the slide to frame fit is so tight it jams after about 200 rounds.

Plus, the screw holding the sight in place has a tendency to back out and it's near impossible to find THAT EXACT SCREW! But after fingernail polish, loctite and super glue, I think the sight will stay in place. Especially since I rarely shoot it anymore.

Anyway, it's a fine gun......for the purpose for which it was designed, viz., informal target shooting.

But you're right. I want something simpler.

saltydog452
September 28, 2004, 03:28 AM
If it was mine, (and I wish it was) and didn't have the large Bomar sights or heavy duty 'tiger tooth' stippling, I'd send it back to Jim Jr. and ask him to do a street trigger job.

salty.

Berg01
September 28, 2004, 11:26 AM
I can't find the SW1911 in either my Gun Digest (2004) or Shooter's Bible (also 2004). Is that what it's called? Or does it have a different model designation?How many variations are there? Is there a base model and then another model?

Ruger 357: That price you quoted, does yours have adjustable sights, etc?


I'm not Ruger 357 but I can answer your questions. It is called SW1911 on the Smith & wesson website. There is a base model with a fixed rear sight and rubber grips. There is an adjustable sight model with rosewood grips, and this is the one I have, and I paid $744.00 for it. There is also a Performance Center model that is awesome, but a lot more expensive. There is also a commander length model, that has scandium (sp?) in the frame I think.

One neat thing about the SW1911 is that it comes with 2 Wilson 8-round magazines, so you're saving @$30.00 right off the bat, sonce many of the new 1911s come with 1 mag. Based on my experience, I would recommend this gun to anyone interested in a decent 1911, but as expressed in this thread, there are many good choices in 1911s these days, so you can easily drive yourself nuts trying to settle on one. But they are great guns, and a ball to go out and shoot with. Good Luck.

bountyhunter
September 28, 2004, 01:18 PM
I can't understand why the Valtro
clan hasn't chimed in yet.


Because the waiting list is about a year long to get one.

TK73
September 28, 2004, 01:42 PM
If you're speaking about factory or semi-custom 1911s that can be had within a reasonable time frame I have to agree with 1911WB that one of the LES BAER pistols is the way to go. Evaluate your requirements thoroughly, though. The features I prefer on a 1911 might not suit you and vice versa.

Regarding my Baer Premier II, it never had a single-malfunction till now and I shoot a lot of handloaded semi-wadcutter ammo at moderate velocity out of it. I have three other Bears, one of them chambered for the 9 mm Luger, and they seem to be equally as dependable. I haven't shot the Baers I acquired later as extensively as I have shot my old Premier II, though.

Certainly, there are a lot of great, equally gifted pistolsmiths in America that can build you a phenomenal 1911 match or carry gun out of a plain-Jane model like the Springfield-Armory 1911-A1 G.I. 45 Series or Colt 1991.

Best Regards!

PinnedAndRecessed
September 28, 2004, 01:46 PM
I did a google on Ted Yost and got a bunch of hits of people referencing his name. But I couldn't find a site for Ted Yost.

His name is used in connection with Gunsite guns. Is that the one?

andrew17
September 28, 2004, 01:54 PM
I think this is it.

http://www.yost-bonitz.com/

davek
September 28, 2004, 03:04 PM
Old Colts, count me in that 1% in spades. They work, and work, and work.

Count me in too. I've got two of them. A 1911 made in 1913, and a 1911a1 made and customized in 1959. The 1911a1 (my nightstand gun) works flawlessly. The 1911's only hangup is that it only likes one particular magazine. Reliable and accurate as hell with that one mag, but spits out every other I've tried.

The Real Hawkeye
September 28, 2004, 03:14 PM
Yeah, that's the Yost I meant. If you ask him to leave out the magazine (I am assuming you already have a few) and the front strap stippling from the *1 package, I think it would come in at just a little over a grand (Before, I had estamated it at just under a grand, whoops), even including the price of the Springfield WWII GI Model. At any rate, it's a great value. He has a great reputation. I intend to get the full *1 package on my Springfield GI Model, including the polished flats, which is a nice extra he offers. Just have to recover from recently buying the Scandium S&W Commander-sized SW1911 Sc. The Yost *1 package will be my very next investment in 1911s.

ruger357
September 28, 2004, 04:07 PM
PinnedAndRecessed,
Sorry I didn't get back to you, but it has fixed Novak three dot sights.

PinnedAndRecessed
September 29, 2004, 01:26 PM
After extensive consideration I've decided to purchase a Sig 220ST. I had my heart set on another 1911 but then I checked out the Sig at a gun store. The ergonomics are unbelievable. I've owned several Sigs in the past and they were all top notch.

Maybe another 1911 in a month or two. Out here on the left coast we can only buy one handgun a month.

The Real Hawkeye
September 29, 2004, 01:37 PM
The Sigs are nice, and very reliable. I used to have three of them, and never had a problem function-wise, but a while ago I made a choice in favor of the 1911 design, and haven't looked back. Starting off with a double action shot and then switching to a single action shot is a formula for disaster in a lethal confrontation.

PinnedAndRecessed
September 29, 2004, 01:50 PM
Hawkeye said, "Starting off with a double action shot and then switching to a single action shot is a formula for disaster in a lethal confrontation."

Why?

The Real Hawkeye
September 29, 2004, 02:00 PM
Maybe I'm over stating it just a bit. My point, however, is that going from a light single action shot to another light single action shot promotes consistancy, while consistancy is harder to achieve when you must switch from double action to single action, especially during the high stress of a life and death confrontation. In that context, consistancy can save your life. Inconsistancy can get you killed. The mechanics of a double action shot and a single action shot are very different, and require a change in grip and finger position. This takes much more concentration, which is a commodity in short supply during a life-threatening confrontation. KISS, "Keep It Simple, Stupid," is a good philosophy to follow for combat preparedness. Expect your IQ and motor skills to drop by about 50% when someone starts shooting at you. That's why you should "keep it simple, stupid."

PinnedAndRecessed
September 29, 2004, 02:21 PM
Hawk.

I understand. I'm not looking for a carry gun. If I could carry it would be a revolver. But I'm on the left coast and haven't jumped through their hoops to get a CCW.

I mostly buy because I admire a particular piece. Time doesn't even permit much shooting so I just open the safe periodically and admire the wares.

But I have heard your point about sa/da before. I think the appeal comes in because there have been some cases of police officers w/single action weapons accidentally shooting a suspect. The LEO's were pumped full of adrenaline and didn't realize how much pressure they had on the trigger.

The Real Hawkeye
September 29, 2004, 02:34 PM
That's bad training. If a person is not willing to put in the hours for correct training with their weapon, perhaps a traditional double action auto is a better choice for them than the 1911.

As for your situation, I now understand. You are a collector. I am too. I have all kinds of handguns, including reproductions of blackpowder revolvers, and antique Colt revolvers. You could defend yourself with them quite well, of course, but that's not why I have them, as there are much better choices nowadays.

Considering your purpose in buying handguns, the Sig is not a bad choice. It wouldn't be a really bad choice for self defense either, but, in my opinion, there are better choices. That's all I'm saying. Apparently, this question is not relevant for you, though. In which case, the Sigs are very cool guns. You might want to look into an old Luger too, or a broom handle Mauser. Those are really cool. Have fun.

PinnedAndRecessed
October 11, 2004, 04:31 AM
I was looking for another 1911 and examined a Sig 220St and fell in love with the Sig's ergonomics, heft and grips.

Long story short: I ordered a Sig.

Meanwhile am going to drop my Mk 4/Series 70 Colt to have a solid bushing installed.

Will range test both.

BTW, is Wolf 45 ammo any good? Any adverse impact from a steel cartridge case?

GSB
October 16, 2004, 03:11 PM
After extensive consideration I've decided to purchase a Sig 220ST

I like 1911s alot. That said, a SIG P220 is my home defense pistol. When I take it to the range, I do at least fifty rounds of DA/SA transition practice. It's not even an issue for me anymore (no more of an issue for me than remembering to take the safety off is for regular 1911 shooters). The muscle memory is so there at this point I don't even think about it.

PinnedAndRecessed
October 16, 2004, 03:58 PM
I agree. Sig is great. I've owned the 220, 226, and 230. I didn't much care for the 230's ergonomics but it was a fine piece.

The 220 (45 ACP) shot as well out of the box as my extensively modified and target accurized 1911.

The thing that struck me about the 220ST though, was the heft. It has a steel frame.

Plus the grips. They feel like lambskin.

GSB
October 16, 2004, 05:10 PM
Plus the grips. They feel like lambskin.

The grips are my one complaint with my 220 (standard version). They are hard plastic and not the best if your hands are sweaty. It looks like I'll have to settle for Hogues, as it doesn't look like Burner makes as set for the 220 yet.

saddlebum
October 16, 2004, 05:48 PM
nowlin!

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