Need help on finding a type of 9mm


September 29, 2004, 01:58 AM
Does something like this exist?

1. California legal

2. Grip safety

3. single stack

4. under 24 ozs

Thank you,


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George Hill
September 29, 2004, 02:14 AM
At least not that know of.
I think Colt and Springfields would meet the criteria, but fail the weight test.

September 29, 2004, 02:36 AM
Is a Sig 225 Cali legal?

September 29, 2004, 02:39 AM

Thanks for the reply.

This is for an idea I've had for The Wife's carry gun so I was trying to keep the weight down for her. I've just mentioned it to her and she does not know what weight she could handle.

So it may be possible to push that weight test upwards some.

September 29, 2004, 02:45 AM
the 225 is legal!

I'll go to the Sig page and check it out, thanks!

September 29, 2004, 02:47 AM
26.1 ozs! So cool.

Though I can't find where it mentions the grip safety.

I don't know anything about a grip safety standard on all their models?

September 29, 2004, 05:02 AM
I don't know anything about a grip safety standard on all their models?

Nope, no grip safety, and only one model I know of has a manual safety. They are equipped with a decocker, the trigger is the true safety.

Jim Watson
September 29, 2004, 08:20 AM
Springfield Ultra Compact 9mm.
Mine weighs 25 ounces empty on the kitchen scales.
Has grip safety and thumb safety, being largely a sawn off 1911.

It has a titanium firing pin for drop safety, a notch in the barrel hood to serve as loaded chamber indicator, and a key lock in the mainspring housing to protect the children, so there is a good chance it is OK in California.

Check it out.
Let HER check it out, nobody else matters.

Get her some training. The 1911 action is easy to shoot well but is a little, JUST a little, more demanding to operate than the usual run of "convulsive response" pistols you see so many of now.

September 29, 2004, 08:46 AM
Let me second what Jim Watson said since I've been there and done that - let your wife pick out the pistol. My wife has always been gun-tolerant but no more than that. After a Kel-tec P32 I got for her died (my fault, don't ask), we went to get her a replacement for car carry. She has small hands. I was thinking Bersa .380 or a Sig P232. She tried them all out. But at the store owner's suggestion, she picked up a S&W 642, one of the lightweight, no-hammer-showing .38's. Love at first sight. She's not only tolerant of it, she's now forever bugging me to take her to the range. I would never have picked that gun for her. She's rapidly becoming a gun nut and can normally outshoot me with the revolver. Point of all this, I was almost instrumental in getting her something she wouldn't have been comfortable with and probably would never be really good with. Her choice was the right one. My 2 cents worth.

September 29, 2004, 01:37 PM

The PX9505L is California legal and is a seriously beautiful gun. I'll show it to her.

What she wants is to be ready to fire, not have to flick a safety off but have the peace of mind that some inadvertant happening will pull the trigger and put an ND through her leg.

Thus my search for a 9MM grip safetied, single stacker (small hands or I'd get her the XD9) CCW-able weapon.

She does not like the idea of me carrying my no safeties Glock at all, I think she would have been happier had I purchased an XD.

Thanks again all,


September 29, 2004, 02:25 PM
Perhaps an H&K P7 PSP or P7M8 will meet with her approval. It is a single-stack, has a grip safety (the front of the grip is hinged at the bottom), and is a 9x19. It does not meet the weight requirement, coming in at about 28 ounces. I am not sure if it is CA-legal. It appears on the CA DOJ list, so I believe it is CA-legal.

Jim Watson
September 29, 2004, 04:44 PM

I fear she has about talked herself out of a gun. I know of nothing that meets all those specifications.

I don't know if the P7 qualifies. It is a SQUEEZE cocker, not a "hold and the safety clears" gun. Worth a look, though. Anything is worth a look, as Murfster describes.

Any handgun without a manual safety will have a relatively long heavy trigger pull and is not much subject to having some outside agency mysteriously pull the trigger. Especially if it is carried in a holster which covers the trigger guard, as most do these days. She should not be carrying a gun of any sort loose in her purse, in my opinion.

If she can get over the psychological need for a grip safety, a Kahr would be a good choice. I know a lady who depends on a P9.

If she just must have a gun with grip safety and no manual safety, you are looking for an original S&W Centennial .38 revolver, models 40 and 42, made 1953-1974. Not a 9mm single stack, but that is as close as I can get.

September 29, 2004, 04:54 PM
The Kahr P9 or TP9 are great choices for folks with smaller hands... Good triggers, lightweight yet full powered... But no grip safety.

The only gun I could recommend for open purse carry would be a revolver and that still wouldnt be a recommendation without reservation...

September 29, 2004, 05:23 PM
I think a XD is the only pistol to meet the requirements...

Being a Sigfan myself, me personal belief is that external safeties are highly overrated and are meant to combat carelessness.

Training specific to the weapon and an always present caution with it is the best route IMHO.

No safety available is going to make up for poor gun handling.

I would follow Murphsters advice and take her to see and hold every different kind of pistol she possibly can and make her acutely aware of each pro and con and possibly your opinion of every weapon. Make sure she understands each facet of each weapon and let her decide which is the best for her needs. Trust me, she will fall in love with one eventually and overlook or compromise some of those perceived requirements for it.

September 29, 2004, 07:30 PM
I've talked with The Wife and she thinks I'm doing all this just as an excuse to buy another gun....the nerve of some folks.

She likes the Bersa .380 and will carry it IWB (who said anything about a purse?) at 10:30-11:00 round chambered but with the decocker on safe.

The decocker is a little hard to get moving though, when she practices it takes quite an effort for the lever to move up. So I'm thinking a grip safety would be the way to go then.

Jim Watson
September 29, 2004, 07:40 PM
Now wait a minute, just WHO is "thinking a grip safety..."?
This is supposed to be about her.

A Bersa has no grip safety, the decocker/safety is in a horrible location and should not be left engaged, and none of it matters because once decocked you (she) must crank through about a ten pound trigger pull to fire it. No outside agency credible to the world's police and armies or the lawyers of the gun compaines is going to make something like that go off by itself.

If she can comfortably consider that fact, there are a lot of suitable guns. I still like a Kahr for the job.

September 29, 2004, 07:47 PM
i would say stay away from 1911 style pistols with grip safeties and their light trigger pulls.

A heavy first shot double action is a perfect "safety"

A Kahr or even the Bersa would make a fine choice.

September 30, 2004, 01:53 AM
As someone else has noted the Sig 225 doesn't have a grip safety, but most double action guns don't. And I just overlooked that part of your criteria. sorry.
That said. The 225 is light, single stacked. Its trigger takes a bit of force to move to prevent accidental discharges. Also the decocking lever is easy to reach. Oh and for an added piece of mind the hammer basically sits at half cock away from the firing pin.
There is no external manual safety to remember. May be worth a look. Maybe not.

September 30, 2004, 10:47 AM
Anotehr vote for Springer Ultra-Compact 9mm.

My wife does well with hers.

September 30, 2004, 01:38 PM

I showed her your post so she is fine with the Bersa......though I would like her to step up to a 9mm at some point.

September 30, 2004, 01:40 PM

The nearest shop to me had a whole bunch of Sig guns but not one 225.

No Kahrs either....

September 30, 2004, 01:43 PM

Yup, that is an awesome gun, at least looks wise. Not yet any practical experience with the weapon for me of course.

edit: Though on the website thewy have it in black grips, I suppose that is how it ships. Really though that gun deserves some uptown grips.

October 1, 2004, 09:45 PM
My wife's came with attractive cocobolo grips, the ultra-thin kind.

I thought we might have to get a short trigger, but the thinner grips set her up for perfect finger pad placement.

Only thing I'm not perfectly happy with is the thumb safety: it is a bit spongy in comparison to my SW1911.

BTW, she wants me to get cocobolo grips on my SW1911, so that we match. The things we'll do for love...

October 2, 2004, 11:57 AM
I don't know about CA law but hear are some options:
1. Kahr
2. Bersa
3. Beretta 84
4. Sig 239
5. Sig 232

None of them have grip safeties but who cares? Why the hang up on a grip safety? As are as I know, only 1911 pistols are going to have grip safeties so why bother? The SIG doesn't have a grip safety and is probably one of the safest gun you can buy.

Also, you really do have to let your wife pick out the gun. I bought my wife several guns that I thought would be perfect for her but she ended up liking a Walther P-1 that I bought on a lark. I bought her a Walther PP, Bersa .380, Kahr 9mm, CZ-70, Mak, and a few others and for reasons of her own, she didn't like them. Some were bad choices because she couldn't operate the controls. The Mak and CZ-70 were too stiff for her to operate. The triggers and levers took too much force and she didn't have it. She is not a weak person but I just didn't think.

If I were you, I would just let her go check out some guns with you and buy her whatever she likes as long as she can handle the recoil and will shoot it. It is better to get her a small .22lr that she likes and can shoot than a 9mm that she won't touch. The one thing I have learned is you can't tell what a woman is going to like anymore than you can tell what a guy is going to like. I am surprised at my wife for picking a full sized handgun when all the while I was trying to buy her a "ladies" sized gun.

October 2, 2004, 03:06 PM
I think the XD-9 Compact is the best bet. My wife is comfotable enough with the full-size.

October 2, 2004, 11:49 PM
Go with the SIG and you will have no regrets.
Actually, I do have one regret. I wish I had bought two P-225's instead of one.:D

October 3, 2004, 11:47 PM
So I shouldn't pick something out for her and have my name engraved on it so she knows it is from me?

I'm actually trying to talk her into shooting .45 the next time we are at the range.

She is hesitant, any advice on how to talk her into it?

October 4, 2004, 01:47 AM
1911 45s are rather mild to shoot, have her watch you shoot one.

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