Practice without glasses?


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priv8ter
February 23, 2003, 12:39 PM
Now, before anyone thinks I am promoting the unsafe act of practicing without some fomr of eye protection, I am not. Here is my question:

I wear corrective lenses. Some nights, they get left in the living room, which is far from the bedroom and my home defence weapons. I was just wondering if anyone out there had ever thought of seeing how poorly they shoot without wearing their glasses, to simulate a late-night home intruder.

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AZTOY
February 23, 2003, 01:09 PM
I wear glasses too, But i can see with out them. If i got woken up in the middle of the night i would be fine. My eyes can adjust for not having on glasses!

If i had on my glasses and thay got broken of dropped that would mess me up for a few second into my eyes adjusted!! :uhoh:

If a intruder was in your house all shots would be up close and with a shotgun you should be fine!!:D

I shoot with and with out glasses. Pistol and open sites rifels i use glassses.
Rifles with scopes i don't use my glasses.

10-Ring
February 23, 2003, 01:32 PM
I wear glasses as well. Although a remote possibility in real life, shooting w/o glasses in a SD situation is still a possibility. I've tried it & as long I'm w/in reasonable ranges, I'm ok. I do however have my glasses on my night stand & even an emergency pair close by those.

sm
February 23, 2003, 02:06 PM
Granted, my glasses are bi-focals...may have a little 'help' above for distance...I do practice without them-using safety glasses of course.

I am fine without glasses for shooting--just don't ask me to read anything (like station instructions, headstamp on a cartridge).

we do have some students that really require glasses...even so we have them shoot without at distances of say out to 7 yds...also we all shoot at night, using only whatever available light may be cast. This helps in 2 ways, a) muzzle flash of loads, and shooting with or without glasses sure changes things. Educational.

pax
February 23, 2003, 02:36 PM
I regularly practice without mine. I'm blind as a bat without them, but can still identify family & friends out to about 35-40 feet. So that is the furthest distance at which I practice shooting without glasses. Obviously I worry somewhat about target identification past that distance, but it's unlikely to get involved in a defense shooting at that range anyway.

pax

When asked whether his vision was an impediment in the gunfight, he [Harvey Faulk] answered, "I wasn't trying to see him clearly. What I was trying to do was save my life." -- from a newspaper article about a one-eyed man who shot an armed intruder

sm
February 23, 2003, 02:52 PM
Good point you bring out, and one we also strongly advise.

At what distance can you positivley identify threat?

.

Yohan
February 23, 2003, 04:19 PM
Tried contacts? There's a new type of contact lenses that are out- and basically, you can sleep in them for a month. Good stuff.

Blackhawk
February 23, 2003, 04:41 PM
If you've practiced SD and HD shots at close ranges where the objective is fast and accurate shots on target instead of precisely aimed shots, you won't have any problem. You will instinctively "point shoot" accurately. If you've got the time to dawdle, great, but if not, you'll do just fine.

The key is PRACTICE, which teaches your muscles what you want done without requiring precise and clear visual input.

Skunkabilly
February 23, 2003, 05:01 PM
I HAVE to wear glasses for target identification. DOn't want to zap the roommate :o

sm
February 23, 2003, 05:08 PM
Yep, agree.
Easier to teach this to new shooters, especially women. Don't have to 'untrain, unteach', unlike the guys (sorry, but true)--gals don't seem to buy into all the gobbly gook -magazines or gadgets.

I learned to "not think', per se the hard way. When competed I always got into trouble trying to overide the remarkable human computer. PRACTICE, and the human brain, hand, eye...etc., computer--Works.

Blackhawk
February 23, 2003, 05:25 PM
I HAVE to wear glasses for target identification. DOn't want to zap the roommate Does the roomie often enter by kicking the door in and screaming agressively at o'dark thirty?

Mastrogiacomo
February 23, 2003, 05:41 PM
My left eye is nearly 20/20 -- so even though I shoot right, I visualize left. I practice without the eye glasses since in a street situation (I don't often wear glasses except for TV, computers or driving in unknown areas) the chances of me having them on is nill. I have thought on occassion of getting a prescription pair of shooting range glasses. But not sure yet if it's practicle.:cool:

Sven
February 23, 2003, 05:45 PM
I'm nearsighted - I can see the front sight sharply, but targest in the distant are blurred if I try to focus on them at very long range.

As the target is blurred anyhow, I seem to be able to shoot without lenses.... just get me binocs to check that 25 yard target, please.

sm
February 23, 2003, 06:01 PM
My eye doc ordered for me some static stick ons for my shooting glasses. Available online, some drug stores...

Don't use all the time...purposely practice without. It is nice though when I do use them...I can read stage instructions, where to sign my name...or with new students I can read info, shoot, fill out forms , etc.

these run about $25 for 3 pair...bunch cheaper than Rx shooting glasses, and when my eyes change--again cheaper. OH a bonus, when a friend is fishing and can't see the lure (much less the knot) these work great on regular polarized sunglasses. Big dummy won't admit he is as blind as a bat..he just follows the hood ornament to drive...

Lone_Gunman
February 23, 2003, 08:01 PM
Blackhawk, the implication of your last message would be that if someone breaks into your house screaming, its ok to shoot them without proper visual identification.

I am not sure you meant for it to come out that way, though, did you?

DMK
February 23, 2003, 08:29 PM
Does the roomie often enter by kicking the door in and screaming agressively at o'dark thirty? They may if the building is on fire or some other such emergency!

The law of averages dictate that house fire, sickness or an injury are much more likely scenarios than an armed home invasion. Shoot first, ask questions later is not an option in civilian life.

Blackhawk
February 23, 2003, 10:58 PM
Lone_Gunman wrote:
Blackhawk, the implication of your last message would be that if someone breaks into your house screaming, its ok to shoot them without proper visual identification.

I am not sure you meant for it to come out that way, though, did you?DMK wrote:They may if the building is on fire or some other such emergency!
The key word, gentlemen, is "aggressively" as in "screaming aggressively", which I said.

There's a world of difference between a scared/warning scream and an aggressive/battle/blood curdling scream.

You won't mistake what the latter one is communicating and what it says about your future.

Lone_Gunman
February 23, 2003, 11:28 PM
Not trying to get picky here, but Blackhawk, your response makes even less sense than your original statement.

How, exactly, does one scream non-aggressively?

Imagine a jury...

"Yes, your honor, I didnt actually identify the man I shot, but I could tell from his aggressive scream that he was a bad guy who meant to do me harm."

Making life and death decisions on your interpretation of a scream might put you into a murky situation, legally speaking.

Of course, I am not a lawyer, so I cannot offer specific advice on how scream interpretation is perceived by juries.

Blackhawk
February 24, 2003, 12:01 AM
Not trying to get picky here, but Blackhawk, your response makes even less sense than your original statement.

How, exactly, does one scream non-aggressively?Maybe it doesn't make sense to you, but screaming is pretty much a natural universal language all unto itself.

It's most UNnatural for an attacking human or animal to NOT scream during battle if the outcome is in doubt. Not surprisingly, military organizations have fostered and taught effective battle screaming for millenia.

I remember bayonet drills in Basic Training in 1967 when the DIs practically forced us to scream at the dummy as we ran it through. Guess what? We were MUCH more aggressive and effective when giving a loud scream than when not. They weren't girly "eek" type screams -- they would curdle your blood.

Almost any animal will turn tail if you charge and unleash one on him -- it's than universal language thing saying "you are going to die, violently!"

Learn the vocabulary of the language, but since hand-to-hand combat veterans are becoming scarcer every day, you may have to settle for library research.

"Yes, your honor, I didnt actually identify the man I shot, but I could tell from his aggressive scream that he was a bad guy who meant to do me harm."
It would be a statement to the jury, not a judge, and I would be very happy to demonstrate, just as I'm happy to demonstrate for training purposes, and they're something I'll definitely use should I again get into a serious tussle with man or animal.

In any event, not even the Army holds you responsible for what you do for the first minute or so after you're suddenly awakened from a deep sleep. I'll take my chances with a jury, thank you very much.

cratz2
February 24, 2003, 12:05 AM
I tried shooting at 7 and 15 yards sans glasses once. 7 yards wasn't too bad, 15 yards was on paper. I don't think I would do as well in the dark as in the bright day.

For home defense, I think it would be pretty unlikely I would ever have to shoot without my glasses. In a SD scenario on the street or in a mall/building, it could happen. Just one hit or a good shove. I've also shot weak handed and try to shoot maybe 8 rounds week-handed every time I shoot my carry gun. i think it would be difficult to reload week-handed only. Of course, that's another reason to carry a back up gun. ;)

pax
February 24, 2003, 12:26 AM
Blackhawk,

Another factor, easily overlooked: most of us recognize our loved ones' voices, even when the loved one is under stress.

Cratz2,

Not so far fetched. If the HD scenario begins with you sound asleep, there's a good chance that you would have time to grab either your gun or your glasses, but not both.

Btw, it is possible to reload weak hand only. I don't recommend trying to do it without having someone who knows what they are doing show you how to do it. Takes some serious attention to safety, too -- I'm talking of the obsessive, compulsive, paranoid variety. But it can be done.

pax

However, never daunted, I will cope with adversity in my traditional manner...sulking and nausea. -- Tom K. Ryan

Gary H
February 24, 2003, 12:35 PM
Tried contacts? There's a new type of contact lenses that are out- and basically, you can sleep in them for a month. Good stuff.

That would be Ciba's Night & Day lenses. Be careful, I've had six of my overnight patients develop corneal ulcers with this lens. This is a very bad outcome. I limit my patients to one week wear and very careful follow-up. Anyone that sleeps in any other lens is a candidate for the "Darwin Awards".

Topgun
February 24, 2003, 02:44 PM
Good thing burglars are NOISY.

We always think we are gonna KNOW when they are in the house.

If I were a burglar, I think I would make sure I was QUIET.

Or learn to say "Yes dear, it's me" in a slurred voice after I flushed a toilet.

THEN ransack the place.

:D

Russ
February 24, 2003, 02:50 PM
I have lost my glasses within 2 feet of me and I had to call for help finding them because I can't see a detail without them. I can see people and objects although they are fuzzy. So, in a pinch I could hit something. I would hope it wasn't someone I knew because I couldn't tell until I got my glasses to see detail. One interesting thing I have found, if really in a pinch, put a small pin size hole in a piece of paper and look through it and I can see perfectly.

moxie
February 24, 2003, 03:40 PM
I understand your concern, but you don't have to practice without eye protection at all. Simply wear non-corrected shooting glasses or goggles and you'll be safe while simulating how you might have to shoot without glasses at home if an intruder woke you up. Cheers!

Lone_Gunman
February 24, 2003, 11:07 PM
I understand your point, Blackhawk.

But actually the comment I made would be directed to a judge, not a jury, in your initial hearing to enter your plea.

Hopefully you will have more than a scream to back you up though! "Taking your chances" with a jury these days is kind of like playing russian roulette with 6 rounds!

Do you think they will really cut you a break because you were startled?

Blackhawk
February 24, 2003, 11:18 PM
But actually the comment I made would be directed to a judge, not a jury, in your initial hearing to enter your plea.Makes ZERO difference what you say to that judge. You're responding to an indictment. My sole words in that event would be "Not guilty, your honor."Do you think they will really cut you a break because you were startled?Absolutely!

Being in fear of your life is absolute justification for using deadly force.

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