Best Surplus 7.62X54R?


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556A2
December 30, 2002, 12:17 AM
I was pondering which of the military surplus is considered the "best" in 7.62X54R. I have a block of Non-Corroisive Czech surplus and it did fine, but I'm down to 15 rounds and need more, but the shop where it came from is about a cool 40 miles from here. Also does anyone have any experience with the Wolf ammo in this caliber? BTW, I REALLY REALLY perfer non-corrosive....really.

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JeFF D
December 30, 2002, 12:30 AM
Your really limiting yourself by not shooting corrosive and I'm wondering why, cleaning up after shooting corrosive ammunition is really simple. Just swab the bore with ammonia+water combination right after shooting and thats it your done clean nomal after that.
Also I dont think there is any czech surplus that is non-corrosive even though the seller may label it as such it is still corrosive.

If you still will only shoot non-corrosive wolf is good. Winchester is great if you can find it.

telewinz
December 30, 2002, 07:23 AM
Check out AIM, they have 630 rounds of Russian ammo for $50. Its slightly corrosive but vary accurate. Just swab it out with windex (gas system too) and don't worry about it. I also use corrosive 8mm Mauser and the windex works great, plus I have a shiney, streak free bore.:)

DMK
December 30, 2002, 11:21 AM
Jeff is right. Some of the surplus stuff is better than the commercial stuff and much cheaper too! For the price of 12 boxes of Wolf, you can buy a case(720 rds) of Czech Silvertip ($60 @ www.ammunitionstore.com). And yea, it's corrosive. Don't believe everything SOG tells you.

I've even heard from unverified sources that all 7.62x54R is corrosive, even the commercial stuff so why fight it. :)

Best also depends on the rifle. I took a few Mosins out to the range along with a few different kinds of ammo. They all preferred different brands.

Stinger
December 30, 2002, 11:48 AM
I've even heard from unverified sources that all 7.62x54R is corrosive, even the commercial stuff so why fight it.

Well I will verify that the Wolf is NOT corrosive. I have shot countless rounds through my M44. Any surplus gets the Windex treatment, though.

Stinger

DMK
December 30, 2002, 12:03 PM
Stinger, I probably shouldn't have even posted that because it is just hearsay.

I'm probably not going to buy commercial anymore anyway. It's not as accurate in my rifles and nowhere near as cheap. I do run a couple patches of 50/50 ammonia and water down the bore after shooting any ammo in my Mosins.

Erich
December 30, 2002, 05:03 PM
Well, some fellow over on gunboards.com (the serious Mosin nuts) has posted in great detail about his experiments that prove that at least some Wolf 7.62x54R is corrosive . . . sure be a bummer to learn you bought into the wrong lot by finding rust down the bore of a nice collectible . . .

Stinger
December 30, 2002, 05:09 PM
A couple of extra patches down the ol' bore is not that big a deal if you suspect dirty ammo.

Getting the corrosive salts out is much easier than that durn copper!

Stinger

444
December 30, 2002, 05:31 PM
I guess I am just repeating what has already been said, but if you want non-corrosive ammo, you have to pay for it. IMO, Winchester is the best, and I guess the only reason I say that is because I trust them more than I trust the other stuff. I have shot a lot of Wolf in a vairety of calibers and it is good ammo. It shoots OK in everything I have tried it in, although I didn't do a whole lot of load testing to find the most accurate loads in my rifles. I just bought what was convienient and shot it.
I personally don't have a problem with shooting corrosive ammo. I would rather not, but the price is too good to let pass. I usually take Windex and squirt it down the bore before I leave the range. I then run a couple patches through the bore, then a couple with regular bore cleaner. When I get home I clean as normal and as far as I know I haven't had any problems.
There is of course a third option; handloading.
I have handloaded a lot of 7.62x54R ammo on a Lee Loader which cost me something like $15.00. The Lee Loader, a mallet, a block of wood, and some bullets/primers/powder and you are ready to go. You can then tailor your loads to do what you want. You can duplicate the service load so that your sight settings are still accurate, you can load some very light loads which permit short range practice with very little recoil and noise, and you can load expanding bullets for hunting.
I have tried S&B ammo which is supposed to be non-corrosive. It shoots OK and is middle of the road as far as price is concerned, but I don't like the brass for reloading. The primer pockets aren't deep enough. If I am going to buy commercial ammo, and pay the price, I at least want reloadable brass for my effort.

benEzra
December 30, 2002, 08:12 PM
The new Wolf 148-gr 7.62x54 is fantastic, IMO. I shot 15 rounds of it through my VKT M39 at 100 yd last week and was quite pleased. Shot right to point of aim, which is a first; the heavier milsurp loads I've used in the past tended to shoot high. (I believe the sights of the M39 are regulated for a 148-grain load or thereabouts, so the new Wolf is perfect).

I am still getting used to shooting distant targets with open sights, but I managed to put 4 of 5 into a 1 3/8" (3.5 cm) group at 100 yards, shooting from a rest and sandbag. I am not that great a rifle shot, so this is absolutely fantastic shooting for me. Two of the rounds impacted only 1/8 inch apart center-to-center, making a single elongated hole. Unfortunately, I blew the last shot, which opened the overall group to a little over 4 inches

I was expecting the Russian-military-style packaging (rounds stacked, paper inserts between rows), and instead it comes in a neat box with snazzy plastic insert, like premium U.S. brands. Ammo is clean, and cases are copper-coated steel rather than lacquer coated.

As to fouling and odor, this particular load seemed very light on both. Hardly smelled at all compared to most milsurp stuff, anyway. Carbon fouling was noticeable, but not terrible.

I have some corrosive stuff on hand, but from now on I'm going to be shooting mostly Wolf, since it does make cleaning much less of a hassle.

bE

benEzra
December 30, 2002, 08:16 PM
Regarding corrosiveness of all Russian made ammo--it is possible that some early lots of Barnaul were semi-corrosive, but I am convinced the recent Wolf and Barnaul aren't. As a test a while back, I shot some semi-corrosive Russian milsurp and some recent 200-gr Barnaul SP (both use the lacquer-coated steel case) and then set empty cases from both on a shelf for a couple of weeks. The inside of the milsurp case had rusted considerably in that time, but inside of the Barnaul case was clean and smooth except for the light dusting of carbon fouling.

bE

556A2
December 30, 2002, 11:53 PM
I guess I'll just invest in some Windex then, I'm heading to the closest gun shop near here since they told me they carry 7.62X54R in bulk.

Erich
December 31, 2002, 10:56 AM
Just so you know, 444, the Win-USA is S&B!

444
December 31, 2002, 03:21 PM
I have heard that rumor, although I don't believe it. When the Winchester first came out, I bought a case of it. I have also shot a few hundred rounds of S&B. I have reloaded every piece of that brass. I can tell you this, if S&B makes the Winchester, or Winchester makes the S&B, they don't use the same brass. There is no question about that.

DMK
January 1, 2003, 01:24 AM
I believe the sights of the M39 are regulated for a 148-grain load or thereabouts Actually, everything I've read indicates that the M/39 was designed for a 200gr. "D-166" bullet. You're right though, they all seem to shoot way high.

I just epoxied a small silver bead about the thickness of spagetti on top of the front sight. Now I can use the rear sight to adjust for whatever load or distance I wish.

You can also use a similar trick to raise the front sight on 1891s and Mosin carbines, but use a small piece of electronics shrink tubing straight down over the front sight and trim it to the desired length.

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