Confused, Kansas/Missouri handgun laws


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KaceCoyote
October 16, 2004, 04:34 PM
Alright, I'm 19(20 in november) in Kansas I've been told I can buy a handgun, in Missouri its 21. Now I live in Missouri, and I know I cant just pop over to kansas to buy a gun but heres the catch... I live with my Grandparents in MO to finish up my 2 yr, however my mother lives in Kansas and I'm listed as a resident at both homes so I live in Kansas AND missouri....so can I buy in Kansas or is the fact I live in Missouri aswell gonna hurt me? If I -can- buy in Kansas can I bring it back to Missouri?

Any info would be appreciated.

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Hawkmoon
October 16, 2004, 06:49 PM
What address is on your driver's license? Does either state allow you to vote in state elections at 18? If so, where are you registered? Did you file an income tax return? If so, what address is on your tax return?

It's things like this that help determine your legal place of residence.

As to buying in one state and carrying it to a home in another, you need to re-read the state law and determine if it prohibits purchasing a handgun if under 21 years of age, or if it prohibits OWNING a handgun if under 21 years of age.

One of Many
October 16, 2004, 07:05 PM
I am assuming you are attending a school in Missouri, and your temporary residence is with your grandparents, but your permanent address (and the address on your drivers license ) is in Kansas, at your mothers home.

If that is correct, then you can only purchase a handgun in the state of Kansas (your official address).

If you have registered to vote in Missouri and kept your drivers license in Kansas, that may muck up the situation, because then you have a conflict of address. Generally, school addresses are considered non-resident (especially for out of state tuition and fees) and all official correspondence from the school goes to your permanent address (your parents).

Missouri has some real pain in the a## laws for purchasing handguns. When I lived there years ago, you had to take a complete description of the gun to the local police and let them run a criminal check on you as purchaser, and on the gun to make sure it wasn't on a stolen property list, then you had to take two signed letters of character reference on business letterhead paper to the county sheriff to be issued a permit to purchase. I don't know if that has changed any in the last twenty years, but I doubt it.

You should be able to purchase in your home state and transport to your temporary residence, as long as you comply with any local laws at the temporary residence. Since you are living in a private residence and not on school property, that is likely not an issue. Check for any local gun storage laws that may apply. Be sure that when you transport the gun, it is locked in a case, unloaded in chamber and magazine (no loaded magazines/speedloaders anywhere in the vehicle), with the gun case in an inaccesable part of the vehicle, with ammo in a seperate container in a different part of the vehicle.

Good luck and safe shooting.

zastros
October 16, 2004, 07:20 PM
Except for the letters of reference, the process for buying a handgun is still the same.

Kamicosmos
October 17, 2004, 08:20 AM
I'd wait a year dude. Better safe than sorry.

But, to know for sure, go to your County Sherrif and ask him how the laws apply to your particular situation. Especially in MO, where we have to get a purchase permit to buy a handgun. Would kinda suck to show up at the sherriffs office to get your permit and find out you just broke some gun laws, eh?

And uh....if you're using a tempory address in MO to get in-state tuition rates...better hope they don't figure it out. That's breaking several laws, AND if you're getting federal student aid....that's a federal law you're breaking.


What wicked webs....

Gray Peterson
October 17, 2004, 09:10 AM
Asking the county sheriff is the WORST thing you can do.

You are still a resident of Kansas. You'll have to purchase your handguns in Kansas, but you can bring them into MO at any time, no Permit to Acquire needed, and if you have a License to carry from Maine, you can carry in Missouri.

pparker
October 17, 2004, 12:55 PM
As a fairly frequent pistol purchaser in Missouri, let me chime in. I can only address Cass County, but here, one must make application and then give the county up to five days to check your background, but it usually takes less. They don't ask for any information about the pistol, so the license is kind of a hunting for the pistol license. Specific information about the weapon goes to the county office from the dealer. Our local sheriff's department is "gun friendly" - they comply with the law, but I've never been hassled in any way. Of course, this does nothing for someone whose legal residence is in Kansas or is under 21 in Missouri. Wait until you're 21, buy it in Kansas, then bring it to Missouri. You can legally carry concealed in the car at 21, but nobody has ever asked me about that anyway. Better safe than sorry, however!

KaceCoyote
October 17, 2004, 03:51 PM
Heres why I'm in Missouri...

Me and my mother lived here, Mom gets enguaged and moves to Kansas. I'm still in the middle of my 2nd year for college so. I move in with my grandparents to finish up before I move to Kansas perhaps. THis handgun permit business is stupid, just plain stupid.

My Savage can assasinate somone at over a hundred yards loaded with those nasty "cop killer" bullets. I can punch through any armored vest in the nation with my EVIL .30-30 Marlin 336C but holdon, LOW AND BEHOLD i try and get a handgun. Oh no, watch out folks I'm gonna suddenly try and make my own CCW illegally and go do drivebys. Nevermind the weapon in question is the smallest, least accurate member of the gun family. This drives me absolutely nuts.

FW
October 17, 2004, 08:05 PM
My Savage can assasinate somone at over a hundred yards loaded with those nasty "cop killer" bullets. I can punch through any armored vest in the nation with my EVIL .30-30 Marlin 336C but holdon, LOW AND BEHOLD i try and get a handgun. Oh no, watch out folks I'm gonna suddenly try and make my own CCW illegally and go do drivebys. Nevermind the weapon in question is the smallest, least accurate member of the gun family. This drives me absolutely nuts.

Don't worry, the anti's finally understand this. But instead of getting rid of some of the stupid laws concerning handguns, they will use this reasoning to created additional restrictions for the firearms you've mentioned.

Any reason to ban a [fill in the blank] (handgun, "assault" rifle, .50cal, etc.), can be used a reason to ban any firearm.

Kamicosmos
October 18, 2004, 12:14 PM
KaceCoyote: Your location says St Louis? But it sounds like you live on this side of the state in the KC area?

Anyways, I really think it would be best to wait till your 21. I don't think you qualify as a Kansas resident in this case, since you've always been in Missouri. As long as your over 18, it doesn't matter where your parents live. Unless you have a resident address, or a car registered in Kansas, you're not a resident, so I don't think you'd be able to get away with buying a gun in KS.

Also, I wasn't aware of the under 21 handgun purchase law in kansas. Was pretty sure it's 21 like MO. I am still digging through the KS laws...I'll post back what I find.

Black Snowman
October 18, 2004, 12:30 PM
My understanding is that the limit is 21 in KS. I have heard the legal work-around for someone under-age to get a handgun without braking any laws is to have someone of legal age (21+) buy the gun and then they can immidiately transfer it having the gun store do the paperwork.

18 is too young to buy one outright but if you can find someone to do the purchase and an FFL willing to work with you you can have it transfered legally. In MO this might require 2 permits, one for the origional purchaser and one for you. If you can't get a permit you might be out of luck.

Hawkmoon
October 18, 2004, 01:02 PM
18 is too young to buy one outright but if you can find someone to do the purchase and an FFL willing to work with you you can have it transfered legally. In MO this might require 2 permits, one for the origional purchaser and one for you. If you can't get a permit you might be out of luck.
This is getting VERY close to being a strawman purchase. In fact, sounds to me like it IS a strawman purchase. Not worth the risk. Wait another year and make it all legal.

Gray Peterson
October 18, 2004, 04:49 PM
18 is too young to buy one outright but if you can find someone to do the purchase and an FFL willing to work with you you can have it transfered legally. In MO this might require 2 permits, one for the origional purchaser and one for you. If you can't get a permit you might be out of luck.

I'd do it in Kansas.

"Are you the actual purchaser of this firearm", from what I have been told, means that if you give money to someone to buy it for you. Meaning, you give someone $600, and they buy you a Springfield XD-40 or something, and then give it to you. That's textbook strawman purchase.

I'm not sure if the ATF has clarifiied situations involving someone buying it and then selling it to you for financial considerations, as that's a pure commerce transaction and therefor applicable to the laws of your state. Federal law only applies the juvenile possession statute in the federal law only to under 18 folks.

Could always give them a call and ask anonymously.

And there are certainly plenty of ways to find out places to buy firearms in Kansas off paper. Kansas does not require PTA's or anything like that in purchasing firearms. Kansas possession of firearms by juveniles statute applies only to people under 18, so that doesn't apply to Kace either.

You're considered a resident of Kansas. You can still bring concealable firearms into Missouri, no PTA required, because you didn't actually buy it in Missouri.

Black Snowman
October 18, 2004, 05:01 PM
To keep if from being a straw man purchase the recieving party MUST get the gun TRANSFERED BY THE FFL not simply have the person give them the gun. It is legal for them to do this transfer, but not legal to sell the gun outright. Having said that I AM NOT A LAWYER. This is what was posted by someone else and they might not have been a lawyer either.

The laws are so convoluted and bizarre they have us crawling out of our skins just to figure out how to buy them without being sent to prison. Fun stuff.

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