[WonderNine]

I just bought several boxes of the 158gr. Sellier & Bellot ammo in .357 SP & FMJ. Their website lists the bullet energy from both at 693 ft/lbs which is the main reason I bought it other than the price. I'll be shooting it out of a Ruger Blackhawk 6.5" so I want to get the most powerful loading I can for the cheapest price.

My question is, how can this be possible? I just got the ammo today. I shake the cartridge and I can hear the powder shaking inside.

I have some 165gr. Remington Core-Lokt .357 that is rated at 610 ft/lbs. energy and I can't hear the powder in the case. I also have several other brands that are loaded slightly below that and they seem to be loaded full of powder as well.

Perhaps there's a different type of gunpowder they use? I've always heard that Sellier & Bellots ammo is hot and the .357 is loaded to original 1935 specs, but from what I've seen, I'm doubting it. I haven't shot the stuff yet. Perhaps this weekend.

[444]

The amount of powder in the case doesn't tell you anything at all unless you know what powder is being used. Even then it would only be a subjective finding unless you weighed it.

From what I understand, big ammunition manufacturers might not even use the same powder from lot to lot. They buy powder in huge quantities and work up their load using that powder to acheive the results they want. They try to get the most mileage out of the powder they buy and may use the same powder in any number of different loads and calibers as long as they can make it do what they want. The powder they use is referred to as canister powder and may not be a powder that is available to reloaders.

[Tamara]

S&B is pretty toasty, but if you want some "loaded to original specs" .357, I'd recommend Georgia Arms "Deerstopper" loads. Yum!

[MCNETT]

I agree, don't think that you can tell the velocity of the cartridge by the noise that the powder makes in the brass! You also might want to check and see what bbl length they used to get the velocity.
-Mike

[dude]

I don't quite know 'how' but you can sure feel the difference out of my Ti sunb!! I carry them loaded into the little blue beast out fishing beacuse of this.

[WonderNine]

I agree, don't think that you can tell the velocity of the cartridge by the noise that the powder makes in the brass! You also might want to check and see what bbl length they used to get the velocity.
-Mike

Thanks, I always assumed that 4" barrel was the standard for pistol calibers, but with the Czech ammo, it may be different. My Blackhawk has a 6.5" barrel, so if it's loaded as they say it should be pretty warm and toasty, just the way I like it! :D

[WonderNine]

I don't quite know 'how' but you can sure feel the difference out of my Ti sunb!! I carry them loaded into the little blue beast out fishing beacuse of this.

Hehe, I used to have a .41 magnum Ti snub....210 grain cartridges.....BOOOM!!!

:D

[444]

I am not sure how factory ammo is tested. If you look at a reloading manual, they tell you how they obtained the data for the loads. Often times they don't use a conventional gun at all but a "universal receiver" with a pressure barrel. Obviously the results will be different than those obtained from a revolver. The results you obtain may be very different from those obtained at the factory. One factor is the temperature at which the round was fired. Barrel length is certainly another factor.

Don't get too caught up in all this. If a given load shoots 100 fps faster than another load in their test senario, odds are, it will do the same under other conditions. The actual numbers won't be the same, but the difference probably will be.

[ThePerfectOne]

S&B is pretty hot, but if you want some REAL hot loads for few $, than try out IMI .357 magnum 158gr, JSP.
theoratically they generate less ft lbs, but the recoil and the muzzle flame are impressive, especially compared to other .357's.

[coonan357]

S&B is pretty warm , but not as warm as the american eagle brand ( federal ) I don't think your targets going to care if its a few pounds short of the box listing or slower in speed . :rolleyes: S&b does make a quality product I have to admit for the price , and there primers are a &^%&*!!!! to get out , it's liken to staked in ones ..

[bpisler]

Try and find some armscor 125gr fmj's
their websight lists them at 1775fps
from a 5" barrel.I tried some thru my M-28,the most flash i've seen from any 357 mag and loud as well.The recoil was similar to firing 158gr american eagle's in my 3" M60.

[Porter Rockwell]

Beg, borrow or buy a chronograph and then post the results.
Judging a cartridges power by felt recoil or by powder capacity doesn't tell us anything substantial.

[dude]

If y'all want some HOT factory .357mags get yourself a box of Fioochi 142g TCFMJ (pointy FMJs) and blast away!! I just DIG shooting them out of my 6" Dan Wesson compensated fixed barrel out at 100 yards. KA-BOOM!

They are the only .357 factory loads that will actually give the Dan a decent kick............... and overpower the compensator/expansion chamber enough for a muzzle jump that keeps you from looking down the sights for a follow-up shot.

[WonderNine]

S&B is pretty warm , but not as warm as the american eagle brand ( federal ) I don't think your targets going to care if its a few pounds short of the box listing or slower in speed .

Why do you say the Federal is warmer? Federal's website only lists the American Eagle 158gr. at 535 ft/lbs while the S&B 158gr. is rated at 693 ft/lbs.

I don't understand the comment about the targets?!?! :confused:

[WonderNine]

If y'all want some HOT factory .357mags get yourself a box of Fioochi 142g TCFMJ (pointy FMJs) and blast away!! I just DIG shooting them out of my 6" Dan Wesson compensated fixed barrel out at 100 yards. KA-BOOM!

dude, I've been looking for the Fiochi's, but I can't seem to find anyone that has them at a decent price.

[dude]

I find them on sale on ocassion for $10/box at Kieth's guns in Gresham Oregon. I like to keep a few 100 around.

I have also seen them for sale online at sights linked off the Fiocchi website.............they have selection of their dealers there.

http://www.fiocchiusa.com/stateshtml/cities.html

It can be a bit confusing though. If nothing shows up for your state, click again down below on the 'find a dealer' icon and it will then tell you to choose a city in your state. This happened to me when I chose Oregon and the reply was only a place in Northern Cal (yuck).......but I then clicked in the 'find a dealer' just below and came up with several in Oregon by city. Go figure.

[coonan357]

the remark about the targets and speed and force exerted is a point which i laugh at the target weather its paper or a animal is not going to know the difference when it gets hit . all it knows is that it got hit . and as for the ameican eagle brand Vs. S&B , the recoil was far more noticable with the americans than the federals , in the coonan it is very noticable . it broke two of my buffers . and the flame was way brighter . a coonan is a semi automatic 1911 style pistol , its like shooting a pressure barrel , no forcing cone gap , the speeds are up to 200fps over a revolver .

[dude]

yea.....but it jams alot more than any of my .357 revolvers

[WonderNine]

the remark about the targets and speed and force exerted is a point which i laugh at the target weather its paper or a animal is not going to know the difference when it gets hit . all it knows is that it got hit . and as for the ameican eagle brand Vs. S&B , the recoil was far more noticable with the americans than the federals , in the coonan it is very noticable . it broke two of my buffers . and the flame was way brighter . a coonan is a semi automatic 1911 style pistol , its like shooting a pressure barrel , no forcing cone gap , the speeds are up to 200fps over a revolver .

I don't care what my paper target or whatever I'm shooting thinks of my target ammo I want a big boom! :D I want to practice and always shoot hot ammo.

How do you use buffers in revolvers? Are we talking .357 Sig now all of a sudden?
:confused:

[Hal]

I don't care what my paper target or whatever I'm shooting thinks of my target ammo I want a big boom!
Start handloading----> Use Blue Dot powder.

[444]

If you want to get serious, quit shooting factory ammo and begin handloading.
As Hal mentioned, the first load you want to try is this: http://recipes.alliantpowder.com/rg.taf?_function=pistolrevolver&step=3&cartridgeID=1015&bulletID=24&powderID=10 .357, 110 grain bullet, Blue Dot Powder, 2040 FPS velocity, :what:

Keep in mind that this makes your .357 mag handgun shoot a 110 grain bullet faster than a .30 Carbine can shoot a 110 grain bullet.

[Tamara]

How do you use buffers in revolvers? Are we talking .357 Sig now all of a sudden?

A Coonan is a .357 Magnum 1911-type pistol. (As coonan357 pointed out in his post... ;) )

[Poohgyrr]

Coonans are really neat pistols that shoot .357 Magnum revolver rounds. Kind of like how Desert Eagles shoot regular .44 Magnums, except Coonans are 1911 designs, much more handier than a DE, and very accurate.

If you look at Coonan357's signature at the bottom of his post, you'll see a link to some info on this fine pistol (www.dancoonan.com).
:cool:

[coonan357]

I don't know about yours , DUDe but my coonan hasn't jammed on me to date , but I have an early model when dan was still the owner , I have shot later production when dan was an employee of the company and later yet after he left coonan arms and those in my opinion are nothing but garbage jammo matics , and if you used half of the reloads I have put thru my coonan you would have split the cylinders (except for rugers) and if you want a big show (boom and flame ) wondernine I would recommend reloading too . 2400 and bluedot powders make nice fireworks shows . and thank you Tamara and Poohgyrr for clearing up that my Coonan is not a sig.357 :barf: (even though I like sigs )

[WonderNine]

So now I got several people saying the S&B's are way hot and one person saying they are loaded less than 500 ft/lbs...

[Erich]

This thread just reminds me of how irritated I am at SAAMI for wussing out the specs on the .357 mag . . . and, for what? I'm glad that Georgia Arms and the some of our (usually wussy) European brothers are making the original recipe.