Is Breakfree CLP only suitable for AR, or suitable for any firearms?


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ShootAndHunt
October 30, 2004, 11:18 AM
I heard lots of recommendations about using Breakfree CLP to clean the AR, and when I use it on my Bushmaster, I found it is very wonderful: I don't need to use solvent then oil anymore, just one time wipe and the job is done. The effect is also impressive, it seems the CLP lubricate the rifle very nicely, the action is much smoother.

Then I am thinking of using the CLP on all my other firearms: AK, SKS, and several bolt action rifles. However, I never see somebody use CLP on these rifles, is there a reason? Could I safely use CLP on all my firearms? or CLP is just designed for a specific type of guns?:confused:

Some one also said that one should never apply CLP to certain parts of the gun, such as the barrel and gas tube, because the Teflon inside the CLP might not be good at these places, is this true?

Thanks,

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Onmilo
October 30, 2004, 11:30 AM
CLP is fine for all firearm applications.
I prefer M-Pro 7 CLP to Break Free CLP because the M-Pro stuff isn't as toxic but both will work fine.

Mulliga
October 30, 2004, 11:45 AM
Some one also said that one should never apply CLP to certain parts of the gun, such as the barrel and gas tube, because the Teflon inside the CLP might not be good at these places, is this true?

No. CLP works fine practically everywhere. That said, never clean the gas tube on your AR - and clean the carrier key carefully.

EDIT: Okay, there might be some finishes I don't know about that might be harmed by CLP somehow...I've just never run into them. ;)

Chipperman
October 30, 2004, 12:21 PM
I clean all of my firearms with CLP.
Never had any problems with it.
Fine on metal, polymer, wood.

GlocksRock
October 30, 2004, 01:26 PM
"That said, never clean the gas tube on your AR - and clean the carrier key carefully."

Could you please explain to me why there is a need to carefully clean the carrier key? I'm new to AR's and don't fully understand this.

Houndawg
October 30, 2004, 01:42 PM
The carrier key gets nasty. The gas tube stays relatively clean because the gas pressure blows the soot out of it, only to get collected in the carrier key, at the base of the bolt recess in the carrier, and on the bolt behind the gas rings. This is why many people say that the AR15/M16 "sh?ts where it eats".

After a shooting session run a solvent wet pipe cleaner in and out of the carrier key. Notice how black it is. If you push the pipe cleaner far enough in, it will come out of the gas port in the bolt recess and you'll probably see a glob of carbon getting pushed out by it. If you don't clean out the carrier key, it'll eventually get clogged up and the rifle will malfunction.

Speaking of Teflon, it has no practical use in lubricants. It was originally added as part of the PTFE craze started by Slick 50, who started putting small amounts of PTFE in their wonder-oil to get people to buy it. I don't think Break-Free uses it in their CLP anymore.

Sistema1927
October 30, 2004, 01:45 PM
Use it everywhere, and when you are done, make sure to put a dab behind your ears and on your wrists. It drives the chicks wild!

Chris Pinkleton
October 30, 2004, 03:00 PM
Just make sure to keep it away from some plastics -- I uglified the outer casing of the scope on my grampa's old .22 pretty bad with a sloppy application of CLP. It made the plastic turn white and bubble up.

Works fine on my Glock, though.

chevrofreak
October 30, 2004, 03:27 PM
Breakfree isnt suitable for use on any firearm.

campergeek
October 30, 2004, 11:11 PM
I bought a small can of Breakfree CLP a few months back to add to my cleaning supplies. I got to liking the stuff so much that it ran out quickly and I now use a big can. I generally use it for cleaning all actions (except the SKS) and for wiping down the metal after cleaning. Bores still get solvent.

Today I found yet another new use when I winterized my outboard (1967 Merc 200 - runs like a top). Once I had the internals taken care of I prepared to wipe all external surfaces down with a thin coat of oil. Looking around, I didn't have any 3-in-1 or light oil on hand, but I noticed the can of Breakfree on the workbench. Now the old outboard is showroom clean & shiny, thanks to a Breakfree wipedown.

shoobe01
October 31, 2004, 12:29 AM
Some people are worried about teflon streaking in the barrels of precision rifles. This kills accuracy, somehow. I have no idea if this is true or not, but as its more or less impossible to get the teflon out of a barrel I never let CLP touch my PSS. But I use it everywhere you ought to (ie, not the gas system) on my various autoloading devices.

SteelyDan
October 31, 2004, 01:07 AM
Sistema, if you think the babes like BreakFree, try putting a little Hoppes behind your ears...

On a more substantive level, no, CLP is not the best choice for cleaning, lubricating, or protecting. But for one item that does all three, it's pretty darn good. If the SHTF, I'd grab my little 4-oz. bottle of BreakFree and be happy to have it. In any other scenario, I'd use other stuff for my guns, except that I do use the CLP for my AR, just because, um, I do.

ShootAndHunt
October 31, 2004, 01:09 AM
I generally use it for cleaning all actions (except the SKS)

Why not SKS? too cheap for using the expensive CLP on it?:D

c_yeager
October 31, 2004, 02:57 AM
If your lazy (like me) or cheap (also like me) you will get a whole lot of mileage out of CLP. Its not the BEST at anything really. But, it does an adequate job of just about everything. You could get by for a long time with CLP as the only chemical in your bag. If you have the coin or have really high standards you could buy seperate products for each cleaning/protecting/lubricating task you have and do MUCH better than CLP. Personally, with the exception of getting lead out of a barrel I have never felt the NEED to buy anything else.*



*this is only since i have decided that i don't care to have the cylinder face of my revolvers all nice and shiny. CLP is NOT up to that task.

MrMurphy
October 31, 2004, 08:24 AM
CLP is the cleaning equivalent of duct tape. Not the best at any one thing but quite useful for nearly everything.

Black Talon rounds were black because of a Teflon coating to aid lubrication and feeding. Teflon won't hurt your bore. It's slippery, that's all.

I've used up like five cans of CLP on M16s and AR's, another can on several AKs, and probably three cans on all my other guns. Never had a problem.

Bartholomew Roberts
October 31, 2004, 10:08 AM
The issue with Teflon/PTFEs in CLP was that in high heat, the breakdown of PTFE creates a caustic by-product that can etch the rifling. It isn't a huge issue; but it was enough that the military no longer uses CLP with PTFE (Breakfree stopped offering it to the public as well around 1998).

So unless you have some six year old cans of Breakfree lying around (I know I do actually), don't worry about it.

Like the others sais, Breakfree is a so-so solvent, a decent lubricant, and an excellent protective coating. Other specialized products can usually outperform it on one of those three; but few do so well at all three.

I've been using Breakfree since 1988 on all my guns with no trouble at all. It will work just fine. I recently switched to SLIP 2000 Gun Lubricant (actually a CLP product) though because I have found it better than Breakfree on all counts.

campergeek
October 31, 2004, 11:29 PM
Why not SKS? too cheap for using the expensive CLP on it?

One of the first things I learned about breakfree was that it has a tendency to get everywhere - and that the greasy film left behind is very persistent (something I consider a good thing in most cases). However, when I got my SKS I read up on all of the conventional wisdom, including that the firing pin should not be lubricated. I try to keep the pin on mine clean & dry, and keep the breakfree can - or any other lubricant - a safe distance away.

Okay, maybe saying I don't use breakfree on the SKS isn't entirely true now that I really consider it. I'll wipe the outside of the bolt with my trusty oily rag, which is pretty well saturated with breakfree by now, but I won't spray the stuff on directly.

R.H. Lee
October 31, 2004, 11:38 PM
Breakfree is so-so, but it tends to get mix with the carbon and get gummy after awhile. I prefer using Mobil 1. It keeps the carbon fouling in suspension.

artherd
November 1, 2004, 03:43 AM
I have heard the same thing with regards to CLP down the bore of a precision rifle. Infact, I use nothing but a brush down my precision (ie, sub 1 MOA) rifle.

I use TW-25B on most of my guns now (very nice dry lube that picks up nearly nothing.) Never down the bore, as I belive it does contain powered PTFE.

870
November 1, 2004, 07:22 AM
I like MrMurphy's comparison of CLP to duct tape.

I use it for all my guns and love it.

Last year while drilling a hole I realized that I didn't have any cutting oil handy, so I grabbed the CLP and it worked beautifully. I have found another use.

870

chevrofreak
November 1, 2004, 09:54 PM
RileyMc, I too use Mobil-1 on many of my firearms. I've found that Mobil-1 will also remove more dirt from my bore than Break Free will.

Lucky
November 19, 2006, 02:55 AM
Thanks for the tip on Slip 2000. Bartholomew do you know if there is any point in getting the EWL version?

Jackal
November 19, 2006, 03:44 AM
Hell, I use it as after shave....

Dr. Dickie
November 19, 2006, 05:10 AM
CLP is outstanding as a protectant. I usually scrub with ATF, rinse with WD-40 (just as a cheap organic solvent), apply a final spray of CLP to clean off the WD-40 and protect the surfaces, then grease what needs lubrication.

Bartholomew Roberts
November 19, 2006, 10:38 AM
Thanks for the tip on Slip 2000. Bartholomew do you know if there is any point in getting the EWL version?

I haven't used that version. My understanding is that while it exceeds the requirements for CLP on the LP part, it doesn't remove at least 80% of the fouling (the requirement for the C part) consistently.

One thing I have noticed with the SLIP 2000 is that you need a heavier application of the Gun Lubricant product to get the same use you would with Breakfree CLP. It lubricates just great initially; but it doesn't seem to last as long in use. It also works better when applied to a clean surface with no lubricant on it than it does if you apply it over CLP or some other product.

My records for use are 800rds in a day with Breakfree, 420 rounds in a day (started short stroking due to fouling at this point until more lube was added) with SLIP2000 in a rifle that had been using Breakfree, and 596 rounds over two weeks in a rifle that saw nothing but SLIP 2000 (still running fine when I finally cleaned and relubed it after the second range trip).

One nice advantage to the SLIP2000 though is easy clean up. Carbon wipes right off most surfaces and it doesn't leave a ton of crud/baked on crud behind like Breakfree.

ocabj
November 19, 2006, 06:36 PM
I prefer Militec since I come from the old school ideology that teflon is bad (primarily in bores).

I'll use Breakfree CLP to clean up any parts in non-competition guns, though, since it is a good cleaner.

But for my service rifle highpower cleaning, I stick with M-Pro 7 and Militec for the parts and Montana Xtreme solvent and oil for the bore.

mrmeval
November 19, 2006, 07:15 PM
CLP out performs most of the herd when it comes to protecting the gun.
Ed's Red cleans carbon and other gunk off like nothing else. It does not clean copper fouling.

Here's an earlier thread about some other companies product
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=50682

jamz
November 19, 2006, 08:00 PM
I tried Breakfree CLP, but it stunk so bad I ended up throwing it away. Not sure what's in it, but it hit me the wrong way, hard, and I'm not really smell sensitive.

I'll see if I can pick up M-Pro7;s CLP... I love me my M-Pro 7.

Lucky
November 20, 2006, 02:49 AM
I haven't used that version. My understanding is that while it exceeds the requirements for CLP on the LP part, it doesn't remove at least 80% of the fouling (the requirement for the C part) consistently.

One thing I have noticed with the SLIP 2000 is that you need a heavier application of the Gun Lubricant product to get the same use you would with Breakfree CLP. It lubricates just great initially; but it doesn't seem to last as long in use. It also works better when applied to a clean surface with no lubricant on it than it does if you apply it over CLP or some other product.

My records for use are 800rds in a day with Breakfree, 420 rounds in a day (started short stroking due to fouling at this point until more lube was added) with SLIP2000 in a rifle that had been using Breakfree, and 596 rounds over two weeks in a rifle that saw nothing but SLIP 2000 (still running fine when I finally cleaned and relubed it after the second range trip).

One nice advantage to the SLIP2000 though is easy clean up. Carbon wipes right off most surfaces and it doesn't leave a ton of crud/baked on crud behind like Breakfree.


Thanks, I think I'll order the EW then, since I can use Hoppes#9 to help clean.

The Scandinavian
November 20, 2006, 03:28 AM
The issue with Teflon/PTFEs in CLP was that in high heat, the breakdown of PTFE creates a caustic by-product that can etch the rifling. It isn't a huge issue; but it was enough that the military no longer uses CLP with PTFE (Breakfree stopped offering it to the public as well around 1998).

So unless you have some six year old cans of Breakfree lying around (I know I do actually), don't worry about it.

Now you've got me worried! "Prehistoric" (bought circa 1998) CLP that clearly states on the label "With PTFE" has been all that I have used on all my firearms for nearly a decade. I checked Breakfree's website and couldn't find anything about this problem there - is it really something that a normal user should be concerned about?

"T.S."

Dr. Dickie
November 20, 2006, 07:23 AM
PTFE is basically a perfluoronated compound (has fluorines instead of hydrogens on the carbon backbone). Under high heat, the fluorines can breakdown into hydrofluoric acid (really, really, nasty stuff).
How likely is that to happen in the bore? No guess. Considering how hot the barrel gets, you might form some. But IIRC, the PTFE on pans was only supposed to form if you left the pan on the stove and it got REAL hot (like red hot).
For the small amount of CLP you likely have in your bore, I would not sweat it; however, since you can get a new can of CLP Breakfree for about $3 at WallyWorld, why not toss what you got and sleep easier tonight.

BsChoy
November 20, 2006, 08:18 AM
I use it on everything from my Featherwieght to lawnmower and couldn't be happier

The Scandinavian
November 20, 2006, 08:51 AM
however, since you can get a new can of CLP Breakfree for about $3 at WallyWorld, why not toss what you got and sleep easier tonight

Yeah. More like $5 here but you still make a good point.

I've just been through my collection cleaning the bores again with Hoppes just to be on the safe side :uhoh: . Although I don't shoot until my barrels get red hot, I suppose the combustion temperatures are high enough for a few nanoseconds to maybe make a few picograms of hydroflouric acid? I'm not going to worry about it anyway :cool:

Cheers
"T.S."

springmom
November 20, 2006, 09:16 AM
Um.....

Because I use Hoppe's #9 on all my other guns, I've been using it on my AR. Is that a problem? It certainly seems to get everything clean, although certainly not very fast.


It's only had a total of 200 rounds through it so far, and it's been cleaned thoroughly

Springmom

Bartholomew Roberts
November 20, 2006, 10:24 AM
Now you've got me worried! "Prehistoric" (bought circa 1998) CLP that clearly states on the label "With PTFE" has been all that I have used on all my firearms for nearly a decade. I checked Breakfree's website and couldn't find anything about this problem there - is it really something that a normal user should be concerned about?

I doubt it. You can find a more detailed discussion in the pre-THR archives at The Firing Line (before December 2002). IIRC, Breakfree has something like 1% PTFE added to it. At temperatures above 600F (which is right around cookoff temperatures for many rifles), it forms a hydroflouric acidic gas. Assuming that whatever gas created by 1% of PTFE is left in the barrel and not blown out by the next shot fired, it could theoretically cause etching.

I don't recall any cases of this happening in real world use, though I know that benchrest shooters generally hate CLP because they get wider dispersion using it than they do using other cleaners. The fact that they can switch cleaners and fix the problem suggests that the lube is the issue and not etching though.

The earlier post I made in this thread was dated 2004 and I've learned a bit more about the subject since then.

rero360
November 20, 2006, 10:41 AM
Miltec all the way, started using it on my SAW and M9 a couple of weeks ago and haven't looked back, clean up goes from a 30 minute to hour long ordeal to a 15 minute quick wipe down. can't wait to start using it on my 240, it really holds up well to the sands here in Iraq, kuwait as well for that matter

Bartholomew Roberts
November 20, 2006, 10:53 AM
Because I use Hoppe's #9 on all my other guns, I've been using it on my AR. Is that a problem? It certainly seems to get everything clean, although certainly not very fast.

Hoppes #9 will work fine as a solvent for cleaning your AR. However, the Hoppes gun oil that comes with their cleaning kits will burn off at lower temps than CLP and doesn't offer the same level of protection if you are shooting a moderate (12-15 rounds per minute consistently) firing schedule.

Most of us use some type of CLP because it acts as a solvent and a gun oil, so we get to save a step in the cleaning process. It is also what the military uses, so you know you are at least getting the basic level of protection necessary for the rifle.

springmom
November 20, 2006, 12:01 PM
Thanks, Bartholomew. I'll pick some up. And it's okay to use it in the barrel to clean too, or is that still a matter of debate?

I want this thing to last a long time. It's way too much fun to mess up!!!! :D

Springmom

Bartholomew Roberts
November 20, 2006, 12:49 PM
Thanks, Bartholomew. I'll pick some up. And it's okay to use it in the barrel to clean too, or is that still a matter of debate?

I wouldn't hesitate to use Breakfree in my bore and I've used Breakfree for about 8,000 rounds in a barrel and had no problems with it. I've since gone to SLIP2000 Gun Lubricant because it makes for easier clean-up and disposal (no petroleum distillates or harsh chemicals that are hard on your hands) but still meets the same military specifications as Breakfree CLP. If you do use Breakfree, use gloves like you would with any harsh chemical solvent. There are medical studies showing that prolonged exposure to bare skin may cause irritation (http://taylorandfrancis.metapress.com/(40xrnwv1f1cv5z55otb4cdyl)/app/home/contribution.asp?referrer=parent&backto=issue,4,11;journal,4,36;linkingpublicationresults,1:110614,1) and is not healthy for you (http://taylorandfrancis.metapress.com/(01rujaenzy32naawarmksi55)/app/home/contribution.asp?referrer=parent&backto=issue,4,7;journal,1,7;linkingpublicationresults,1:107850,1).

Probably not a big issue for recreational shooters; but for those of us who shoot a lot it is something to be aware of... It is always a good idea to check out the Material Data Safety Sheet for any gun cleaning product (SLIP2000 does not have this online, unlike Breakfree and many other manufacturers).

springmom
November 20, 2006, 01:04 PM
Thanks. I'll see if I can find some at Gander Mountain today (when I go buy some more .44mag ammo....shhhhh....):neener:

Springmom

Nitrogen
November 20, 2006, 03:24 PM
I usually use gun scrubber to get the sticky film that CLP leaves out, then reapply clp to lube the parts that need lubing.

CLP, or any other lube tends to attract all sorts of pocket lint and fuzz on my carry gun, so I usually like to scrub EVERYTHING out then relube it.

MAUSER88
November 20, 2006, 04:02 PM
I've been using it on all my firearms for the last 15 years. I'm very satisified with it.

Wes Janson
November 20, 2006, 08:53 PM
What the heck is Type IV Hypersensitivity (or whatever they said) and how does CLP cause increased lymphocyte proliferation?

In other words, if I get CLP on my hands twice a month while cleaning weapons, what long-term health effect will it have?

Ala Dan
November 20, 2006, 10:25 PM
suitable for any firearms~!:cool: :D

Bartholomew Roberts
November 20, 2006, 10:33 PM
What the heck is Type IV Hypersensitivity (or whatever they said) and how does CLP cause increased lymphocyte proliferation?

You would have to ask a medical professional about that. I wouldn't begin to understand what it means; but I am pretty sure I don't want any. According to Google, it can mean anything from an allergic skin reaction to something worse (http://www.hon.ch/Library/Theme/Allergy/Glossary/type4.html).

In other words, if I get CLP on my hands twice a month while cleaning weapons, what long-term health effect will it have?

Well, the two above show up as the same link; but there were actually two different studies. You can't find the second study using the search at that website but if you google "CLP skin penetration" then you can see a synopsis.

The short version is that the mice used in the above study have skin that is 6-36 times more permeable to CLP than human skin is, so they absorb more CLP internally. I do know that I would seriously consider wearing gloves when using any type of gun cleaning chemical. If you are cleaning twice a month, that is some serious potential exposure ten years down the road and most of those chemicals are not people friendly.

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