Why a Revolver?


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ezypikns
November 5, 2004, 11:44 PM
I haven't been shooting too long. Almost all my experience has been with semi-autos. Why do folks enjoy shooting revolvers rather than automatics?
I'm truly curious.

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Brian Williams
November 5, 2004, 11:49 PM
No mags
Do not have to pick up brass
Consistent trigger pull
Very accurate

Besides Revolvers have an inner beauty because of the cycle of the cylinder goes round and round

http://www.gunpix.com/gallery/Handguns/Double_Action_Revolvers/JohnM's 1917.jpg

Where Autoloaders are bottom feeders.

ducktapehero
November 6, 2004, 12:03 AM
Although I have heard of revolvers jamming I have never seen it in person, I can't say that about auto's.

greyhound
November 6, 2004, 12:34 AM
Well, the legacy way back to the Civil War blackpowder for one. The 1911 devotees might be able to make an argument there, but from what I've learned here .38 revolvers played a big part in WWII, even if they weren't the standard sidearm....

tc300mag1
November 6, 2004, 12:38 AM
i like to shoot both .. course ya cant shoot the really big boomers in a auto i really like shooting my 454 casull depends what im shooting on what platform hunting and such i like my wheelies ... selfdefense i carry a auto ..target usually a 45 auto of some style all depends what i doing

MrTuffPaws
November 6, 2004, 12:39 AM
Pull trigger, go boom. Always.

Okiecruffler
November 6, 2004, 12:42 AM
For whatever reason, I just shoot them better. And 5 rounds of 357 at the ready is awfully comforting.

Jim March
November 6, 2004, 12:51 AM
It'll feed any bizarre ammo shape you want. Speer is now taking advantage of this with JHP designs with such a "flying ashtray" profile they'd be impossible in autos, such as the 135grain 38+P, 200gr 44Spl/44Mags, 250grain 45LC. They're probably the biggest vendor doing so but smaller outfits have been doing the same for years.

A revolver has no lower power limit needed to operate the action. A magnum revolver can take anything from bearstopper-grade monsters down through "special" plinking ammo that won't mess up squirrel meat.

With the barrel and sights one fixed piece, accuracy for a given price range is MUCH higher with a wheelgun. $200 worth of low-end Taurus 38spl in good condition will shoot groups tighter than most $400+ brand new semi-autos.

In a close-range fight, a wheelgun can't go out of battery on muzzle contact. A 38 or 357 5-shot snubby is the most difficult handgun type to grapple away from you; when combined with the muzzle contact issue, it is THE dominant defensive weapon when the range closes to 5ft or less.

It's much easier to make sure a revolver is in good shape before you buy it, even without shooting it. See also the "revolver checkout thread", this forum.

Boats
November 6, 2004, 01:14 AM
Oh good, I get to say what needs saying:




WHY NOT?!?

PinnedAndRecessed
November 6, 2004, 01:15 AM
Guns are like women. I love 'em all.

(Oops! Here comes my wife. Gotta run!!!!!!!!!!!)

Dienekes
November 6, 2004, 01:57 AM
Like a light saber, they have more class. Good examples are boringly reliable, have very good triggers, excel in accuracy, and are versatile and elegant.

No doubt there are high-speed low-drag operations where a semiauto is preferable, but 99% of us cope well enough with a classic wheelgun 99% of the time.

If I felt an imperative need for a semiauto I would arrange to have a appropriate long gun nearby for a quantum improvement...

Majic
November 6, 2004, 04:38 AM
It's something you just have to experience. Either you will like it or not. They are boringly simple to operate, accurate, and reliable yet requires a greater skill to shoot well in double action.

Ex-MA Hole
November 6, 2004, 05:32 AM
They can be shot from withn your pocket in the event of a car jacking.

They don't jam.

Jeff Timm
November 6, 2004, 06:40 AM
The revolver is more reliable than a semi-auto, but not by much.

The revolver is more difficult to shoot under stress, holds much less ammo and is slow and relatively difficult to reload.

The real advantage of the revolver, is power, single action accuracy and flexibility of ammunition.

I can take my .357 Ruger and carry it with anything from snake shot loads to 158gr flat nose gas check bullets that leave the barrel at 1200 fps, and get all these rounds over the counter at Wal*Mart or other common sources.

I also note my Ruger .44 Magnum Super Blackhawk is less expensive, lighter and more accurate than a semi-auto pistol in the same caliber.

Geoff
Who needs more practice.:cool:

Ex-MA Hole
November 6, 2004, 07:37 AM
The revolver is more reliable than a semi-auto, but not by much.

How do you figure?

jc2
November 6, 2004, 07:55 AM
The revolver is more difficult to shoot under stress, holds much less ammo and is slow and relatively difficult to reload.
I'd say the revolver is easier to shoot under stress once you have mastered it, and point you to names like Bill Jordan and Jelly Bryce (http://www.gutterfighting.org/jellybryce.html). Even Cirillo "made his rep" with a revolver. LEAs found that after the large scale switch to "easier to shoot under stress autoloaders," the hit ratios remained the same--LEOs shot more rounds with autoloaders but placed the percentage on target. When you move out of LE there's always McGivern who amply demonstrated that a revolver is capable of very fast and very accurate shooting.

As for reloading, a good revolver man with speedloaders will always beat average man with magazines--it's all about practice. I've seen far too many fumbled, dropped, inserted backwards magazines to give them any kinds of "always better" waiting.

What tends to underemphasized anymore it that speed and accuracy of fire (where revolvers excel) is more important than volume of fire (where autoloaders excel).

BTW, I like and shoot both (and have carried both).

Little Loudmouth
November 6, 2004, 08:23 AM
Reliability
Durability
Accuracy
They come in .41 mag. What else needs to be said? :D
And of course, the fun factor (Autos are fun too, but I like revolvers better)

Majic
November 6, 2004, 08:31 AM
relatively difficult to reload.
Not quite true as people forget one important fact. The magazine is a part of the pistol. You can certainly reload a cylinder faster and easier than you can reload a magazine. Now you can switch out magazines rather quick, but a point in time comes when you run out of pre-loaded magazines then where is all that speed?

valnar
November 6, 2004, 09:13 AM
Why do folks enjoy shooting revolvers rather than automatics?
Step away from the mindset of a gun as your CCW or self-defense weapon. Imagine that 6 shots is no big deal. Just enjoy it for the fun of it.

Robert

Magnum88C
November 6, 2004, 01:33 PM
Revolvers can shoot MUCH more powerful ammo. . .conversely, revolvers can also shoot MUCH less powerful ammo than an autoloader. Example, my .454 can fire anything from the very light CCI shotshells, or cowboy-action .45 Colt rounds lumering out of the barrel at 750 fps, or I can load a 360-gr pill at a tad over 1500 FPS.

I can shoot revolvers more accurately than autoloaders.

I think they're more elegant.

As far as capacity, it suffers in relation to people who carry vundernines. But look at the popularity of big bore autoloaders, particularly .45s. A six shot revolver gives up little to the .45s, and something like a 686 plus, with 7 rounds of .357 magnum, gives up one round compared to a full-sized 1911, on the initial load. Reloads for both charge the weapon with 7 rounds. Besides, most of us are not going to war, you're not likely to run either type of gun dry in a civilian role, despite what hollyweird shows you.

For me, the rounded butt of the revolver is easier to conceal. I carry IWB, so the length of the barrel (up to about 7.5") doesn't make a difference, neither does the cylinder width, however, the square butt of the autoloader IS harder to conceal.

They don't make plastic revolvers.

It's a preference thing. Rent one if you can and try it. Some people don't like them, some love them.

P5 Guy
November 6, 2004, 05:57 PM
The badguy looking at the business end can tell it is loaded!

Highland Ranger
November 6, 2004, 09:12 PM
Aesthetically pleasing . . . .

thatguy
November 6, 2004, 09:41 PM
Highland Ranger beat me to it. They just look nicer. I also appreciate the part about not chasing brass all over the field. For defensive use there are no safeties to remember how to use under stress. They come in truly powerful calibers. A misfire requires only another pull of the trigger rather than a clearing drill.

Semis and revolvers each have their strengths and weaknesses. I like and own many examples of both. I carry both. But being old and conservative in my tastes I generally prefer the wheel guns.

Like this one. How could life get better than a pristine 5 inch Model 27?

http://www.fototime.com/9DDEA996733710A/standard.jpg

Fumbler
November 7, 2004, 01:19 AM
Why a Revolver?
My reason: Variety.
One day I'd like to have at least one of every major firearm action type.


In a close-range fight, a wheelgun can't go out of battery on muzzle contact. A 38 or 357 5-shot snubby is the most difficult handgun type to grapple away from you; when combined with the muzzle contact issue, it is THE dominant defensive weapon when the range closes to 5ft or less.
In a close range fight, if the bad guy knows what he's doing, he could simply grab the cylinder. It takes a WHOLE LOT of force (so much it can't be fired at all) on the trigger to get the cylinder turning if there's that much force holding the cylinder still. Think about it, some revolvers wont shoot DA if the rear of the cylinder is dirty, that doesn't cause even a fraction of the drag a man's fingers on the cylinder would. I love my revolver, but it, and no firearm, is perfect.

chaim
November 7, 2004, 03:32 AM
For the most part the answers are here. Even though it means repeating here are my reasons (no particular order):

-Far more reliable. All my autoloaders are generally reliable and I would be willing to rely upon them to save my life. However, all my autoloaders (and all my best friend's, and he has some pretty high end ones) have failed at least once. I can't say that about most of the revolvers I've owned. Thus, in a life or death situation, while I trust an autoloader, I feel better with a revolver that has never bobbled in any way.

-If it does fail, it is usually faster to get back into action. Autoloaders take several steps to get back into action, unless it is a catastrophic failure in which case it isn't getting back into action. With a revolver you simply pull the trigger and the next round fires, unless it is a catastrophic failure.

-At contact distance I'd much rather have a revolver. An auto pushed up against someone will often be pushed out of battery and if it is out of battery it won't fire. A revolver will fire no matter how hard you push it against someone or something. I know Fumbler mentioned that a bad guy could grab the cylinder, but they could grab the slide of an auto at close ranges as well so that isn't a weakness of a revolver that an auto doesn't share (I also suspect that the slide is a larger and more ergonomcially shaped "target" than the cylinder and thus easier to grab). Also, that involves the BG needing to do a specific action, while going out of battery when you put the gun against something does not require the BG to do anything.

-In most defensive shootings there are no more than 3 shots fired. A 5 shot snubby is more than enough, and certainly a 6 or 7 round revolver should be quite comforting. If more are needed, with practice one can get pretty fast with a speed loader (sure, maybe not faster than a mag change, but for most of us the difference won't be decisive).

-With all the worry over whether or not hollowpoints will expand, I feel more comfortable with some of the shapes available in revolvers that won't work in autos. From the ancient and effective SWC-HP where if the HP doesn't open you still have the sharp cornered, full caliber Semi-Wadcutter to the "flying ashtrays" you have many options that will never work in an auto.

-Caliber. You won't find .357mag, .45LC or .41mag in reasonably sized and priced autos (2 of those you won't find in any autos). Loaded right, all of these can be as or more effective than .45acp.

-Looks. I just like the looks of a nice revolver more than most autos.

-Simplicity. At 3am if I wake to someone busting in the sliding glass door, I don't want to have to worry if there is a round chambered, if the safety is disengaged, if the mag is fully seated, etc. "Point and click" simplicity (though there will be no "click" if you pick a loaded gun ;) ).

These are just a few off the top of my head. There are many other good reasons as well (though I did try to stay with the more practical reasons, with one exception, and with the same exception I mostly stayed away from the more subjective reasons).

First Person Shooter
November 7, 2004, 08:11 AM
I think revolvers are MUCH easier to shoot for several reasons

1) there is no malfunction drill for a wheelgun
2) Grip size isn't determined by the size of the cartridge/mag and therefore can fit a wider variety of grips and hands
3) wheelguns usually point more naturally
4) I can load down a revolver for practice and teaching and then add power as the shooter learns or the need arises

A simple padlock will keep your wheelgun from unauthorized hands.

Jeff Timm
November 7, 2004, 08:21 AM
Quote:
The revolver is more reliable than a semi-auto, but not by much.

How do you figure?

Experience during the last generation of Revolver / Semi Auto conversions, OK, as reported in the Gun Press, and talking to two police instructors at my old gun club back in Ohio during the 80s & 90s. Doing range support for the US Army 1979-81 at Fort Knox. One revolver problem (S&W M 10 hammer spring screw loose.) Many problems with M1911A1s (obviously well worn shakers) Of course the AMU guys insured the weapons were squeaky clean before they were fired (much to the annoyance of some).

Geoff
Who notes similar patterns when he goes to indoor ranges.

ducktapehero
November 7, 2004, 08:47 AM
Like a light saber, they have more class. That's a great example, I'm gonna use something like that in my signature if'n ya don't mind.

Nuclearmike
November 7, 2004, 03:16 PM
I was a committed auto-loader guy for many years. Being an engineer type I did a lot of research on handguns for CCW and read an article about a felon-LEO confrontation where the felon grabbed the LEO's revolver around the cylinder preventing the LEO from firing his weapon. That clinched it for me and I bought autos almost exclusively for many years afterward. Well, due to life circumstances (wife kids, etc.) over time I had very little chance to practice with my autos and lost confidence in what I would do in a pinch if my auto malfunctioned so I traded a S&W 1026 for a S&W 686. To my great surprise I have really enjoyed the 686. So much so that I have began to make a weekly trip to the neighborhood range. I've never found an auto that comes anywhere close to the DA trigger of my 686 and I think it is a much more natural pointer than any auto I've had. Add these things to the variety of ammo I can put through my revolver and I'm hooked. In fact, I have my eye out for a M-29 or M-25 now.

Majic
November 7, 2004, 03:45 PM
read an article about a felon-LEO confrontation where the felon grabbed the LEO's revolver around the cylinder preventing the LEO from firing his weapon. That clinched it for me and I bought autos almost exclusively for many years afterward.
What if you also read where you can grab a semi-auto and push the slide back out-of-battery?

Fumbler
November 7, 2004, 04:46 PM
I love the .357 mag, but if someone wanted lots of power in an auto there's the .357 Sig, and even better, the 10mm.
So, as far as powerful practical cartridges for most people, autos aren't lacking.

Everyone should still own at least one revolver :)

Ex-MA Hole
November 7, 2004, 06:05 PM
Jeff-

I guess your statement about them being "Not much" better than a semi is what has me perplexed.

Everything that I have read, seen and experienced has led me to believe that a revolver is A LOT more reliable.

I have never had any issues with revolvers, and many with semis.

I guess we have had different experiences.

M

Nuclearmike
November 7, 2004, 07:50 PM
What if you also read where you can grab a semi-auto and push the slide back out-of-battery?

That might have swayed me towards revolvers or if I had read articles about both problems I might have have gotten very confused and bought a baseball bat. :)

Peter M. Eick
November 7, 2004, 08:09 PM
Having spent a fun day on the range with my 1939 Registered magnum and my worked over Python, I can only say that revolvers are just plain accurate and fun to shoot. Autoloaders are quick to burn up rounds but otherwise I prefer a good accurate revolver.

Cosmoline
November 7, 2004, 09:08 PM
--Better fit in the hand
--No safeties to remember
--MUCH better trigger pull, esp. compared with DA or DA/SA pistols
--Able to chamber a wider array of loadings
--Can handle more pressure than a pistol
--Faster, trouble-free draw
--More rugged frames and barrels.
--On average, less expensive than a semi

Compare, for example, a standard semi such as a Glock 17 or Beretta '92 with a standard revolver such as a Ruger GP-100/Security Six or a Smith & Wesson Model 13. The revolvers will run from $150 to $300, the pisols will run from $500 to $700.

Fumbler
November 7, 2004, 09:17 PM
$150?! Where do you find those?
I've never seen a new revolver (.38spl or bigger) for less than $350.

Ala Dan
November 7, 2004, 09:31 PM
You haven't lived a life full of "Gust-O", 'till you master a revolver!

Just what most of us "Old Timers" grew up on.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

Okiecruffler
November 7, 2004, 09:38 PM
There is the 357sig, but I've never bought the arguement that it's equal to the mag. And give me a good stout Ruger wheelgun, and I can come up with some loads that are just downright stupid stout. Start loading like that for an auto, and reliablity is likely to be the least of your worries.

Cosmoline
November 7, 2004, 10:36 PM
$150?! Where do you find those?
I've never seen a new revolver (.38spl or bigger) for less than $350.

I was talking about used ones. Which brings up yet another point in the wheelgun's favor--they last longer. You can buy a cheap, used revolver such as a Security Six for $175 to $225 and have a top-quality firearm. Ditto an old K-frame .38. Not too many semis can be had for that price, and what ones there are usually aren't top quality. Or they chamber weird cartridges. The Makarov is one of the very few exceptions.

Cosmoline
November 7, 2004, 10:38 PM
There is the 357sig, but I've never bought the arguement that it's equal to the mag. And give me a good stout Ruger wheelgun, and I can come up with some loads that are just downright stupid stout. Start loading like that for an auto, and reliablity is likely to be the least of your worries.


The .357 Sig's round is MUCH less versitile than the .357 Mag's. The Sig was designed to duplicate the high-velocity 125 grain .357 Mag load. It could never replicate the 180 grain or 200 grain loads I prefer out of the Mag.

Fumbler
November 7, 2004, 11:08 PM
You can get some cheap quality autos. The Ruger P series come to mind. They're $300 new and I've seen them go for $150 used. Many police trade in autos are very cheap, my Sig 228 was $325, S&W 9VE's in a local shop are only $200. I've never seen a centerfire revolver, new or used, for less than $200. That might just be my area.

Which brings up yet another point in the wheelgun's favor--they last longer
A revolver will shoot loose and have to go to a smith. If you run a lot of rounds through an auto you just swap recoil springs and keep on going. You might say revolvers dont have slide rails to crack, but they do have top straps that wear away.

I'm not saying I like autos better. It's just that neither the revolver or auto is really that much better for personal defense or range work than the other IMHO.

Again, everyone should own at least one of each :)

fedlaw
November 8, 2004, 10:32 PM
Accuracy, in my hands:

SIG P220: 7yds.: 5" groups
15 yds.: 10" groups
25 yds.: 20"+ groups for those few that actually hit the target
50 yds.: Hard to tell, never hit paper

S&W 629: 7yds.: 1 .44 cal. hole
15yds.: 1 .44 cal. hole
25 yds.: 1+" groups
50 yds.: 1.5" groups

All shots offhand. 7 & 15 yd. indoor; 25 & 50 yd. outdoor. Both guns were accuratized by their respective mfgr's.

Your results may vary.

Guy B. Meredith
November 9, 2004, 01:03 AM
Uh, don't forget the 8 shot revolvers with moonclips.

I've shot somewhere between 25,000 and 30,000 rounds through my two main guns with no shake or other problems yet. Probably closer to the latter, but I can't convince myself that I spent THAT much money buying PMC 158 gr .357 magnum ammo before taking up reloading.

Mainspring set screw backed out when my 686+ was new and gave me a start, but I figured that one out pretty quick.

Penforhire
November 9, 2004, 01:27 PM
To the question of why? For me it is the fun factor plus I happen to shoot my revolver more accurately than my autos. Could just be the grip design. Why fun? More varied ammo choices (chambered in .357 Mag) and, yeah, it looks much classier than any auto.

Norman Dog
November 9, 2004, 02:22 PM
Because they are cool machines.

22luvr
November 9, 2004, 07:23 PM
simplicity of battery.

I like all guns and have both but my bedside gun is a 6 shot revolver. Why?
My wife has and will shoot my revolver but will not touch any of my semi-autos. If you should need to give a gun to an untrained relative or friend in an emergency, a revolver is no-brainer simple. Just tell'em "point it and shoot."

Besides, can you ever picture Humphrey Bogart holding a semi-auto at hip level? Jack Webb without a revolver? Revolvers are sexy, aren't they?

Sean85746
November 10, 2004, 04:52 PM
When I started my life as a Junior G-Man, I was issued a Smith & Wesson Model 13 3" round butt K-Frame .357magnum revolver.

I had owned many wheelguns, and I still do. I love them. I love the look of a wheelgun, I love the feel of a wheelgun, and I love the feeling of accomplishment having MASTERED the wheelgun.

I have old single actions that my Daddy and Grand Daddy owned. I have the 5" Smith & Wesson Military & Police (pre-model 10) that my Grand Daddy used to blow a pair of gun toting robbers out of his gas station and into hell with.

I have the pearl handled Colt Detective Special that My Grammy Jeanne carried in her apron as she took the daily deposit from the gas station across the street to the bank.

Now...I carry a Glock. I love my Tactical Tupperware...but you know...it just don't have the "soul" a wheelgun has. Even my beloved 1911's or my dear dear Hi Powers don't have the personality of those old-fashioned round things.

Every once in a while, when I leave the house, and I pull my custom 3" Smith Model 66 out of the safe, and stick it into a holster on my belt..and grab a couple of speedloaders from the ammo box...I feel like I have shaken hands with an old friend.

THAT is "WHY REVOLVERS"

Sean85746
November 10, 2004, 06:03 PM
No mags
Do not have to pick up brass
Consistent trigger pull
Very accurate

Besides Revolvers have an inner beauty because of the cycle of the cylinder goes round and round

http://www.gunpix.com/gallery/Handguns/Double_Action_Revolvers/JohnM's 1917.jpg

Where Autoloaders are bottom feeders.

I have an OLD Military & police (pre-model 10). It has a set of Herret's like the one yours appears to heve. Mine is a 5"...slick as butter!

R.H. Lee
November 10, 2004, 06:14 PM
Autos require higher maintenance, can be finicky about magazines and ammo, are subject to limp wristing and lack of lubrication failures. A revolver can sit in a drawer for 50 years and be good to go in a second.

Black Snowman
November 10, 2004, 06:31 PM
Bullet design is another advantage in a revolver. With no feed mechanism to contend with you can have a cylinder for a bullet (wad cutter). The very few autos that can fire this kind of round can ONLY fire this kind of round and are still netoriously finicky.

Case in point. I have several guns in .40 S&W. A Glock 24P, CZ 85 Compact, CZ RAMI and now my new S&W 646. The only one of them that will shoot Golden Sabers reliably is the 646. They hang on the ramps of my 3 autos.

More options for reloaders. Like seating long for extra case capacity and power without raising pressures to dangerous levels. (http://10mmtalk.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=472)

ID_shooting
November 10, 2004, 06:50 PM
Riley almost hit on my main point to using a revo for SD or CCW, no mag springs to go weak on you. And like others have mentioned, simpler to bring into service, more ammo choices, not as bulky for the power, and easyer to reload if you are into mag retention.

The Rabbi
November 10, 2004, 09:59 PM
Idiot-proof. Dont discount this either. I have seen very experienced shooters at IDPA pull their 1911's on signal, pull the trigger and nothing happen. Failure to seat mag, failure to rack slide, failrue to click safety off, you name it.
If you took a Smith handejector of 1899 that had been sitting undisturbed since manufacture in a dry place and put new .38 SPcs into it does anyone doubt it would fire? Try the same thing with a Colt 1911.
My biggest thing for revolvers is the double action trigger. When I pull the trigger I am operating the whole gun. On an auto I am only releasing the hammer and the gun is doing the rest. This is why Jerry always says in all his years he has never outperformed his revolver.
I never heard of anyone disabling a revolver by grabbing the cylinder. You'd have to be a maniac to do that. I have heard of people disabling Berettas by grabbing the slide over the top and hitting the take down button. Saw one guy do this in about 1 second. I have also heard of one guy who had trouble pressing the grip safety of his 1911 because his hand was in an awkward position.

buzz meeks
November 10, 2004, 10:25 PM
Anything mechanical can fail and at some point revolvers can have catastrophic malfunctions. I know because I read it on the internet. But trust me, if you shoot revolvers long enough you cease to worry about the what-ifs. They work.

ezypikns
November 11, 2004, 12:01 AM
Yesterday I picked up my second revolver, a 6" blue GP100 .357. I can't get to the range till Friday but I'm really itchin' to try her. And for all of you who brought it up, revolvers are real pretty. Thanks for all the info and opinions. Once again 'The High Road' proves that like its members, it can't be beat.

WEPS
November 11, 2004, 12:47 AM
I like revolvers but i won't carry one. For me they are harder to hide and ammo capacity leaves much to be desired. I wan't to be able to throw many many rounds down range as fast and accurate as i can with minimum reload time. I just don't see this happening with a weel gun, atleast not from me.

triggertime
November 11, 2004, 01:48 PM
While alot of people praise the revolver for its simplicity, don't forget that revolvers can and do malfunction.

Case in point: I took a sparkling clean Ruger SP101 .357, that had been left loaded for about 1 year from its hiding place out to the range to test fire some .38 Special ammunition.

I opened the cylinder and removed 5 rounds of Winchester Silvertip 145gr. .357 Magnum (that had been left in the gun for 1 year) and replaced it with 5 rounds of brand new Sellier & Bellot 158gr. FMJ .38 Special.

I then proceeded to test fire the S&B ammo. 5 rounds went into the target at a distance of 5 yards and grouped fairly well. I quickly dumped the brass onto the ground and reloaded with 5 more rounds of S&B. I reaquired my sight picture and began to pull the trigger. Instantly, I knew something was wrong. The trigger moved about halfway and the cylinder refused to turn!

Now remember, this was a clean gun, with a clean cylinder. And I only shot 5 rounds and the gun suddenly became a 25oz. paperweight...

After opening the cylinder, I saw what was wrong. The S&B ammo shot so dirty that there was and excessive amount of powder residue all over the recoil shield. This was causing the cartridge rims to bind so badly that the cylinder would not turn.

After wiping the inside of the gun down with a 'Lead Away' cloth, I tried again. Same drill, I loaded 5 rounds, shot a decent group, dumped the brass, reloaded and discovered that the cylinder still refused to turn.

Perplexed, I wiped the gun down once more and took a box of Winchester Super Match 148gr. Wadcutter ammo out of my range bag and hoped that it was just the ammo and not the gun. Sure enough, I shot 25 rounds of Winchester Super Match without incident.

I followed up with 5 rounds of 1 year old Winchester Silvertip 145gr. .357 Magnum and two boxes of Federal American Eagle 158gr. JSP .357 Magnum. No problems.

Lesson learned: 1) Revolvers can and do malfunction. 2) S&B revolver ammo is junk. 3) Revolvers can and do malfunction! 4) S&B revolver ammo is junk!

Now you get to kick the lid off the 'what if...' bucket and think.

The Rabbi
November 11, 2004, 03:18 PM
Lesson learned: 1) Revolvers can and do malfunction. 2) S&B revolver ammo is junk. 3) Revolvers can and do malfunction! 4) S&B revolver ammo is junk!

Lemme see if I understand you:

You loaded ammo in a Ruger SP that fouled the gun so much it bound the cylinder. When you used different ammo it worked just fine. If you had used the same ammo in a different gun it might have worked just fine. And your lesson is that "revolvers" malfunction?? Someone needs a course in logic here.
I am not arguing the revolver never malfunction. Hammers probably malfunction on occasion too. But if someone posted the same comment about, say, Kimbers, the obvious lesson is that Kimbers dont do well with some kinds of ammo so use different ammo. Not that Kimbers can and do malfunction (like anyone needed reminding).
Yes, revolvers do fail to work. But they fail to work a lot less often than autos. And btw, I carry two.

Oracle
November 11, 2004, 03:33 PM
I'm not downing revolvers here, I have them and like them. A stoppage in a revolver, unless it's caused by something like a primer not going off, is usually more difficult to clear than a stoppage in an auto. A "tap, rack, bang" drill usually clears most auto stoppages, while a revolver stoppage usually requires more work.

But, reliable revolvers and autos generally have so few stoppages anyway that it's not something to worry about.

Marshall
November 11, 2004, 03:44 PM
I wan't to be able to throw many many rounds down range as fast and accurate as i can with minimum reload time.


Although I carry semi-auto's also, I'll take 5-8 (before reload) stone cold reliable, well placed 357 Mag revolver shots in a defensive situation over the spoken thought of point and spray and day. :)

triggertime
November 11, 2004, 05:05 PM
Rabbi: I need a course in logic? Lets examine this again. I took a clean revolver, with a clean cylinder, with no fouling present what-so-ever and I shot 5 rounds of Sellior & Bellot ammunition that shot so dirty that the fouling bound the revolver to the point that it became unusable.

The gun was cleaned on the spot and 5 rounds of the same ammunition was shot again, with same result, binding. Yes, Rabbi, from that experience it is logical to say that revolvers do malfunction and that the ammunition that I was shooting was garbage. I don't need a course in logic, perhaps you need a lecture on denial instead?

BTW, why is it that you have the chutzpa to attempt to make people look like a shmegege when they disagree with you? That's not the high road, sir. The high road is to relay a personal experience that one has had with a revolver so that people do not succumb to a false sense of security out of the desire for 'simplicity'.

And for what its worth, Rabbi, the remainder of that S&B ammunition was later tried in a Smith & Wesson model 64 with the same result, binding.

Lastly, this is not the first time that I've had problems with revolvers malfunctioning. It is just one experience of many that I felt like sharing so that someone would perhaps learn from it, instead, I get you kvetching about my logic. Feh.

The Rabbi
November 11, 2004, 08:50 PM
You had a bad experience with a particular revolver and a particular kind of ammo. You could reasonably conclude that you shouldnt carry that ammo in that revolver and it might be a good idea not to carry that ammo in any revolver. But to conclude that "revolvers malfunction" based solely on your one experience (altho now you allow that there are more) is not logical.
I dont think anyone ever said revolvers never malfunction. I wouldnt say that. They have a number of weak points and well-known patterns of malfunction as well as the weird, off the chart event. Like any other mechanical object.
But I would maintain that revolvers malfunction less than autos. This is especially true when factoring in operator error (e.g. failure to seat mag). It is even more so when one considers failures caused by ammunition. In fact, the S&B is the first time I have heard of ammo that did not function well in a revolver (altho yours is not the first story about it). I have to say I have shot S&B in different calibers (.45 and 9mm) and never had a problem.

But this brings up the bigger issue of stories like this. I have heard way too many like yours that end with "so you see pistol X or ammo Y is total junk" based on nothing other than one experience and sometimes even that is hearsay. If someone believed all those stories they would decide to carry a rock instead. But then my cousin's brother in law carried one once that......

And I dunno what all them ferren words are. When it comes to other languages, b'klal I am just verblunget.

zeke
November 12, 2004, 07:02 AM
When started shooting pistols, went with SA semi (45 acp). There were a couple of mistakes made starting this way, but was easier to be accurate with the sa trigger pull, as compared to DA revolver pull. Was more than a couple years till purchased fiirst revolver. While certainly not an expurt DA wheelgunner, have found my accuracy improving with all handguns, while practicing DA revolver trigger.

Wished now had started on 22 DA revolver, concentrating on acclimating to the DA trigger. Once this had been learned, the trigger control may have transferred to almost any type of pistol, fairly quickly. As it is, am starting to appreciate the advantages of DA revolver, especially for house.

For some, it may be better not to have a medium or light sa trigger, in stressfull situations, especially when just waking up from sound slumber. No safety to disengage. Less to go wrong.

This isn't to say there aren't advantages to semi's. These may be include better recoil control and capacity, as compared to similar powered rounds from revolver.

As it is, bedside pistol is now 696. Used to be 45 acp semi.

Am also a handloader, who saves brass. Nothing beats a revolver when there is snow on the ground.

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