[Waitone]

Out of the clear blue my soon-to-be-21year old daughter up and informs me she wants to learn to shoot. I think living by herself had something to do with it.

Anyhow we do the safety session and equipment review. We then pack up and go to the local range with a large rental board. Not wanting to influence her decision she fondled just about every gn on the board ranging from J-frame S&W through 1911 style.

Of everything on the board (and it was a large sample of brands) she ups and chooses a Glock 17. Now as a confirmed 1911 bigot it was a hard blow to take for a father who wants on the best for his little daughter.

A Glock! I tried to talk her out of it. I talked with her about the Dark Side--no effect. We even talked about the existence of evil in the world--no effect.

Then I shifted to the "Nice girls don't. . . ." argument--no effect.

We discussed the merits of tupperware vs American steel--no effect.

So we rented a Glock 17 where she proceeded to shred a target in a most impressive manner. At the end of one box she turned to me with a big grin on her face and said, "Can I shoot another box?" Which she did. By the end of the session she was handling it like a cell phone. Complete familarity.

OK. So the train is on the track. I will lose this one. Since I reload .45 ACP and .38 SPL it would be nice to reload 9mm for her Glock. Is it possible. Seems I remember threads on the TFL saying Glocks don't digest reloads.

Am I wrong?

[duncan]

I reload 9mm all of the time for various 9mm's including a Glock 26, 19, 17, and my current love, the Glock 34.

No problems. Glocks have some pretty heavy duty throating jobs on those barrels straight from the factory. Basically will feed anything - and that's the problem at least in 40SW and 10mm. High pressure and you get bulges in your brass. But they will feed long loaded rounds quite nicely.

Now loading 40SW in a factory Glock without an aftermarket barrel with a tighter chamber is truly not a great idea. But that's what BarSto, KKM, and Federal Arms barrels are for. Avoid the kaboom with lead bullets in Glocks by using barrels designed for lead.

But as to 9mm reloads in a Glock, from slow target loads barely doing 900 fps to hot nuclear rounds doing NATO's 1350 fps requirement, a Glock will do it safely.

No problems in any of my six Glocks or two 1911s;)

[Matthew_Q]

Well, that sound like wommenz for ya....

They like what they like... I'da definitely tried to steer her to my favorite... the 1911...

Let me borrow your daughter for a while... I'll learn her... :D



(and AFAIK, Glocks should eat reloads, but don't use lead!!!)

[Sven]

When I showed my Glock to a female acquantance, she said "its easy to shoot, I just wish it had personality".

She recommended that I put a sticker on the Glock to spice it up.

Oh-kaaaay.

[Duke of Lawnchair]

I'm glad she chose the Glock.

Why? Because it fit her the best. If the results are what you say they are, then she made the right choice!

[Mr. Chitlin]

"Now as a confirmed 1911 bigot it was a hard blow to take for a father who wants on the best for his little daughter. "

Looks to me like she got it.:D

[Carlos Cabeza]

Girls like girlie guns !!!!!!!:D
Personally, I won't take a screwdriver to do a hammer's job !

[Schuey2002]

Alriiiiiiiiighty then.

Another member of the "Dark Side".. cool!:D :neener:

[Blackhawk]

She sounds like a great daughter! :D

How much is she going to be shooting? I sorta got the idea that she's going to practice to proficiency, then not that much.

At about 11 cents/round for range ammo, can you really afford to reload 9mm?

I opened the thread wondering which Glock she wanted to shoot -- Gaston or somebody else... :D

[Jason Demond]

Glock=FMJ ammunition only.

[10-Ring]

Because of the polygonal barrel, Glocks don't take to kindly to lead reloads, as long as you stick to FMJ's you should be ok. Be happy your daughter found a gun that fits her & works well for her! Think of it this way, it could have been a Jennings! :D

[DonGlock26]

Walmart has Winchester white box target 9mm ammo 100 rnds for $10. Enjoy!

[Stevie-Ray]

That's cool about your daughter. I sympathize about her lack of enthusiasm with the 1911, but at least, by God, she's into shooting. And IMHO, she's chosen one of the better "subordinates." :D J/K, Glock fanciers.

[Blackhawk]

Glock=FMJ ammunition only.Really?

Seems like the Glockenpackerleoagencies use JHPs in their Glocks.

I knew about the lead bullets, but I never heard FMJ only.

[DeltaElite]

That Girl has good taste. :D

As for Glocks being Girly Guns.....
The Glock 20 sure ain't no Girly Gun. :D
The Glock 21 ain't either, 45acp and takes 45 Super.
Yah, those are Girly Guns. :neener:

Of course if you can talk her into a Delta, then you would have accomplished something. :D

Have her check out the Glock 19, I personally prefer the midsize Glocks to the full size Glocks.

[one-shot-one]

:p just proves sometimes the student does surpass the teacher.:neener:

[Quack]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Glock=FMJ ammunition only.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Really?

Seems like the Glockenpackerleoagencies use JHPs in their Glocks.

I knew about the lead bullets, but I never heard FMJ only.


you are correct, no lead.
jacketed ammo is fine though

[Al Thompson]

I *think* Jason meant jacked for reloads or factory. (does any factory load lead 9mm?)

My ex was a strong revolver fan until I got a G26. I hid it at a buddy's until the divorce was final. :D

[El Tejon]

IME the Glock 17 is an excellent 1st gun for any new shoot, simple just like their teacher--El Tejon.:p

[Standing Wolf]

Glocks may be ugly, but better a Glock than nothing at all.

[Kahr carrier]

Well Glocks are reliable and it sounds like she shoots it well .So its all good ,Maybe you can steer her to a 1911 after she gets bored with her Glock.:)

[9mmMike]

The best gun is the one she'll shoot. You should be proud (like it would be possible for you not to be) that she chose and chose well. You done good.
Mike

[rick458]

Strong the Darkside is:evil:

[arinvolvo]

She likes the glock eh? Show her a Steyr...she will like that too....and then you never have to admit that your daughter bought a glock.:D

[isaidme]

It wont let her down!She sounds like a real catch!!!Did she by any chance give the Glock19 a shot if not she should.

[isaidme]

Stick with the FMJ ammo though

[Ian11]

Think of it this way.

Its WAY better than if she brought some unemployed drug addict home.;)



But thats just to make you feel better. ;) The Glock 17 is an excellent choice for defense. Wait 'til she tries the G19 and G26:neener:

[Croyance]

Oh the shame! Look at it this way, it could just be a phase. There are worse ones, like being into the "badboy" type.
You can try "The power of Christ compells you!":evil:

[arinvolvo]

Ok I look at it this way....either she is INTO handguns or she is not....

Now that we know that she is INTO handguns...the fact that she likes the Glock is irrelevant....

Celebrate the fact that you have raised a handgun enthusiast...and support any model she prefers....it is simple as that.

[T.Stahl]

Could you please stop to spread this "FMJ only" misinformation? :confused: Thank you!

Fact is: Due to the polygonal rifling of Glock factory barrels the use of unjacketed bullets can lead to a lead build-up in the barrel. If you do not like to remove this lead every 50 or so rounds, then it's better to stick to jacketed bullets, which includes, but is not limited to, Full-Metal-Jackets.
Glocks will work just as well with JHP, JSP, TMJ,... , and not only FMJ.

[Jack19]

Waitone, I hate to say it but....you're wrong. :D Why saddle the poor girl with a heavy 1911 with only 8 shots? A nice light Glock with 18 rounds of 9mm on tap is just the thing. Drastically cuts down on reloading requirements, and as long as she never falls into the spray and pray technique, which I know she wont because Dad is a 1911 shooter, she'll be fine.

And, CDNN is selling standard cap G17 mags for 59$.

I've been through maybe 30 pistols in the last 20 years, I carry a Glock 19 with G17 mags, so I might be biased. lol

[SteveA]

Please ask her to do some serious research before she makes her decision.

Here are a few starters on Glock for her.

Gun Zone (http://communities.prodigy.net/sportsrec/glock/gz-g35-40kb.html)

Glock Kaboom (http://sigforum.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=674608412&f=320601935&m=641601245)

From Sig Forum (http://sigforum.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=674608412&f=430601935&m=9806032&r=4226032#4226032)

Glock Talk Forum (http://glocktalk.com/)

Several Others - LEO Problems (http://sigforum.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=674608412&f=430601935&m=5486093221)

I've owned Glocks - now I don't. There are just too many failing in my neck of the woods to make me happy. The Bernallio Sheriff's Dept is currently borrowing guns from the Albuquerque Police Dept to support the damaged Glocks that the armorer returned for repair. In all fairness, because of the deals they cut LEO's and Departments, a lot have gone to them to keep budget's on track. That put's a lot of Glock's out there. Perhaps it unfairly makes them more obvious to us because of their sheer numbers when compared to others - I don't know but it is a thought.

I don't like or dislike Glocks. I just no longer trust them. After all the BS about why is over - the final analysis is this:

Do I think I will be personally affected by a Glock failing if I use one? No.

Have others been personally affected by a Glock failing at a rate that exceeds all other firearms manufacturers that I know of? Yes.

Is it worth the risk to my life to take the chance that the Glock I might need to use to defend my life will fail - and possibly at a critical time? NO!

[Zak Smith]

Do not use unjacketed lead bullets in a Glock.

In this thread on TFL: "Glock KB's" (http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=82), MarkCO posted data supporting the statement that even hard-cast lead bullets will "lead" a Glock barrel leading to extreme overpressure conditions".

In particular:

Steve, there are several issues related to guns that I know a little about, this issue, I know a lot about. Not only have I worked on it professionally, but it is a hobby too. I used several methods to measure pressure including Oscilloscopes and FFT, transducers, strain guages, piezo electroincs, etc.

I never saw peak pressures deviate by more than 2000 psi round to round and with jacketed, no more than 1200 psi round to round. 5,000 psi variations imply large velocity variations on the order of more than 100 fps. That is way too much. When I quote numbers, I have used conventional statictal methods or standard mathematical analysis to determine them.

I started out with a 33,000 psi round with a std dev of 719 psi. After 500 rounds with jacketed bullets, the pressure was 33,000 with a std dev of 823 psi. After 50 rounds with lead, 34,200 psi, 100 rounds 35,100 psi, 150 rounds 38,800 psi, and at 200 rounds 41,000 psi, 300 rounds 45,000 psi.

The last few started to have greater std devs approaching 2000 psi, but the results are still statistically accurate. Notice this is NOT linear. Also the velocity started to climb at about 5 rounds fired, by 50 rounds it was 40 fps higher than the first round. By 100 rounds it had climbed by about 90 fps. At 150 rounds, 80 fps higher and at 200 rounds it was about 30 fps higher. Velocitites are all averages with no std dev exceeding 30 fps. Also, realize that this was in controlled conditions with each charge hand weighed, and tight chambers in pressure barrels.



So in summary, he developed two 33,000 PSI loads: one with jacketed bullets and one with hard-cast lead bullets. After 500 rounds, the jacketed load was still at 33,000 PSI - no increase and therefor safe.

Starting with a clean barrel, after 50 lead -> 34,200 PSI (up from 33,000).
After 100 rounds lead, 35,100 PSI.
After 150 rounds lead, 38,800 PSI.
After 200 rounds lead, 41,000 PSI.
After 300 rounds lead, 45,000 PSI.

The SAAMI max for 9x19 9s 35,000 PSI, +P is 38,500 PSI.

Reloading is fine for Glocks, just make sure you do not use lead bullets.

A double charge or a squib that's "shot through" by mistake will still blow up your gun, just like it will a 1911. Be careful.

-z

PS. One of my rather reckless friends used to shoot lead reloads through his Glock. It eventually blew up through the mechanism described. He had it fixed and now uses an aftermarket barrel for lead.

[Carlos Cabeza]

I'm just kidding you guys about the girlie glocks :D I am actually looking at a small lightweight gun for an ankle BUG.
I forgot to comment on Waitone's daughter being into shooting...
THAT"S GREAT ! I BET YOUR A PROUD FATHER ! CONGRATS !:D

[braindead0]

Fact is: Due to the polygonal rifling of Glock factory barrels the use of unjacketed bullets can lead to a lead build-up in the barrel. If you do not like to remove this lead every 50 or so rounds, then it's better to stick to jacketed bullets, which includes, but is not limited to, Full-Metal-Jackets.

From what I've been able to determine, it's not the polygonal rifling, it's the *Glock* polygonal rifling. I've yet to hear of similar problems with other poly rifled autos.

That's the reason I'd never buy one, it's like buying half a gun..then you have to buy a new 'full capacity' barrel to shoot lead...yack.

[Nero Steptoe]

The late Carlos Hathcock's favorite handgun was his G21. Too bad he's not around, so that "somebody" could call him "girlie" to his face! ;)

I've fired tens of thousands of my reloads through Glocks, with no problems. I do use jacketed or plated bullets.

[Gewehr98]

My Daughter wants to Shoot a Glock (oh the shame!)

Have her shoot a Glock. Just make sure it's held solidly in the target holder frame so when the bullets hit, the plastic Glock pieces don't go flying everywhere.:evil:

(Owned, and sold, a Glock 17 some years ago, never regretted it...)

[isaidme]

My Glock never bought the big one and the truth is Glocks have had less problems than the majority of the firearms out there!Just recently did they have a major recall on a batch.People who hate Glocks try to either bring up the rare propblems with Glocks or make them up,it really is nonsense!!!Some people feel they have to buy a gun and then spend money out the a$$ fixing them up and making them reliable.The only thing a Glock needs are new sights for some and some hi-caps.:cuss:

[Gewehr98]

The only thing a Glock needs are new sights for some and some hi-caps.

They need to be properly broken in, too. ;)

http://mauser98.com/gingerglock1299-1.jpg

[Sgt]

Waitone,

I suggest you get her enrolled in one of the 12 step programs and quick!!!

HK Maybe...but a Glock....I feel your pain....my cousin...well...he's on the same downward spiral...next he'll do away with leather and start buying those plastic holsters to match his glock....:barf: It's all down hill from here....

[LostOneToo]

I have always been a Browning HP fan and it wasn't until I held a Glock 36 for the first time that I actually thought I might be interested in a Glock. All of the previous Glocks just didn't feel right when I held them but the 36 was perfect. I still love my Brownings, both in 9mm and .40 cal, but I carry the G36 everywhere I go because of its' size and dependability. I also have a rather nice 1911 that was put together by a Navy armorer for nat'l competition and it's my bedside gun. There are worse things she could chose other than a Glock but if she likes it, let her go for it; they are probably the best functioning, least likely to malfunction auto's made and you don't have to take it to a gunsmith to make it work properly right out of the box.;)

[wanderinwalker]

And it is okay to shoot reloads through Glocks. I have a Glock 17 and a 26, which I feel are excellent pistols. Both had about 150 rounds of factory ammo to break them in and then nothing but reloads. They will digest anything that I can fit in the magazines that resembles loaded ammunition and I have no fear of a failure with the 9mm. (I won't own a .40 of any brand, and if I want a .45 it will be a SIG P-220.)

Don't ask for an exact round count, I don't keep track. It's not too high though, probably only about 3-4k through the 17 and about 500 through the 26. (I've only had the 26 for 2 months, the 17 for about 8. Gimme some more time!)

Too bad there aren't more girls like your daughter! Going to try to get my girlfriend out shooting sometime. Hoping for the best! :)

[care-less]

shoot all the9mm reloads you want in the Glock; just make sure they are jacketed bullets; NO LEAD. It smears in the poly rifling, and causes pressures to go through the roof.

[Shweboner]

Put an XD-9 in her hands... She'll never look back.

I wont even say the word Glock after shooting the XD.

~Brian