Garand Owners Chime In


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Norton
November 26, 2004, 09:11 PM
Took FIL out today for his first encounter with the Garand that I picked up last Summer from CMP. Rifle has been flawless in operation up till this point, but today was doing something new.

I'd put the clip in and the bolt would start to slam forward but would not strip the top round off. With a little encouragement, it would go....but, it has NEVER been a problem today.

Two variables: 1) Today was the first time shooting this gun in cold weather. Is it possible that the cold weather was gumming up the grease (Lubriplate) and not allowing the op-rod to come forward?

2) Trying out some clips that I got from Sportsmen's guide....they say IMI on the bottom. I've always used the handful that I bought at a gun show a while back. Possible cause?

I'm a little tweaked by this as the rifle has been 100% reliable with around 400 rounds through it. Today it was a pain on all 5 of the clips that we ran through it.

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RGO
November 26, 2004, 09:34 PM
It doesn't mean anything is wrong with your Garand. Many M1s need a bump on the op-rod to load the first round, since there is more resistance stripping the first round out of the clip. Springfield Armory knew about this situation and decided not to correct it.

valkyrie0002
November 26, 2004, 09:36 PM
I've had the same problem with a few of mine with a full clip even in warm weather. In my case I think it might be the added friction of the clip holding the rounds. Once the first round is off I don't have a problem.

Your new clips may hold rounds tighter.

How much grease do you use and how thick is it? I am using Militech grease.

Did you check for freedom of movement before you put the springs in. With op-rod in place- tip barrel up and down and be sure bolt slides back and forth freely.

Are you sure the op-rod is not rubbing the stock as it cycles.

Norton
November 26, 2004, 09:54 PM
Haven't done the "freedom of movement" test....but sure will when I get home and start breaking down to clean it.

Never been any indication of the op-rod contacting the stock, but will look closer.

Grease is another issue that I was going to bring up. I'm using just enough to very lightly coat the underside of the barrel assembly where is may conact the op-rod. Also using just a smidgen in the other indicated areas. I know where to greae....just not how much.

I'll make a point of using the "original" clips next time I'm out as well.....

lwaldron
November 26, 2004, 10:05 PM
I have an SA SG from CMP with a high serial number that indicates construction around the year 1955.
With some clips I have to bump, with others not. I think it just depends on how springy the clip is.
I use Militech grease, and I like to slather it on.
The rifle has always functioned flawlessly... except, of course, with the whole aiming through a peep sight business, as opposed to leaf and post.

1911Ron
November 26, 2004, 10:16 PM
Is lubriplate synthetic or is it natural, if natural cold may affect it. As others have said the clip may be the culprit also check the follower spring as it may not have enough umph to fight the sluggish grease. Good luck and good shooting :D

Swampy
November 26, 2004, 10:30 PM
Norton,

There is nothing wrong with your rifle.....

VERY FEW M1's will close when you remove your thumb from the top of the loaded clip. Most will require you to "do the bump" on the back of the op-rod handle.

This is one benign little bug that was never worked out of the design. Even John C. Garand himself, when demo'ing his rifle for the newsreels, had to bump the op-rod handle to get the bolt to close.

Watch old WWII and Korean War newsreels, old movies, new movies (SPR and BoB) and training films. You will see GI's, sailors, and Marines all "doin' the bump" when reloading their M1's.

I own LOTS of M1's...... Only ONE will close on the top round when I pull my thumb. All the rest require a bump.

Best regards,
Swampy

Garands forever

natedog
November 26, 2004, 10:46 PM
I actually like having to bump it, it prevents the bolt from closing on my thumb...However, mine is somewhat inconsistent- when it's clean, it always closes when the clip latches, but after a few clips it'll become erratic, sometimes closing, sometimes not.

Sleeping Dog
November 27, 2004, 12:56 PM
They require a bump to close only if there is no obstruction between the chamber and the bolt.

If it sees that your thumb is in the way, it will require no bump but will viciously and maliciously fly forward to draw blood.

They are mean critters.

Regards.

30Cal
November 28, 2004, 05:41 PM
3 of my 4 Garands need a bump to get up and running.

Ty

kayak bum
November 28, 2004, 08:05 PM
Both of mine need bumps from time to time.

Kevlarman
November 28, 2004, 08:31 PM
I have a bunch of clips for my Garand and it seems that a few will close upon removing my thumb while some need an oprod bump.

Doesn't bother me at all.

Red Tornado
November 28, 2004, 08:50 PM
Mine has required a bump pretty much every time I've fired it. I actually like it. I just like the feel of bumping it before it slams shut. Oh yeah, that way I'm also guaranteed that my thumb's out of the way.

Sleeping Dog, I got one of the sweet ones. It never closes on my thumb and I'm sure it's politely waiting for me to get clear. :rolleyes:
RT

Dienekes
November 28, 2004, 09:26 PM
SOP. Of my 6 CMP M1s only one routinely autoloads. The one I use most needs bumping most of the time. I have variously used auto chassis lube, Lubriplate, and most recently Militec with about the same results. Just part of the whole mystique, like the ping of clip ejection.

GIs were taught to bump the op rod as part of the loading process. It gets to be a habit quickly.

Dan the Man
November 28, 2004, 09:43 PM
I have a CMP Garand with a 1942 barrell date. In fact, it looks like all the parts match up (except for the stock; it was restocked probably in the late 50's or 60's). I have always had to 'bump' the operating handle to close the action. I thought that was the way they were designed. :rolleyes:

Regards
--Dan

anapex
November 28, 2004, 11:12 PM
The one I have 99% of the time requires a bump. As long as that's all it takes and it still works I'm happy ;)

RavenVT100
November 29, 2004, 10:58 AM
There is nothing wrong with your Garand. I have never shot an M1 that I did not need to bump for the first round through. It's just an artifact of the M1's design that things are a little tight for the first round, and you don't always have enough power to push that first one out of the clip. It's no big deal.

I am using TW-25B right now in my Garand, but I plan on buying some Lubriplate because TW-25B is overkill for a Garand. I use it on pistol slides.

Norton
November 29, 2004, 11:17 AM
I finally got a chanced to clean the rifle yesterday and didn't notice any unusual rub marks or things that seemed out of place.

Made a point of putting some extra Lubriplate on the underside of the barrel.....


Raven......grease on a pistol? I thought the Garand was about the only firearm that took grease. I'm always looking to learn......which pistol? I only ever use a little oil for lube on my handguns.

cslinger
November 29, 2004, 11:25 AM
No worries, the "Garand Bump" is normal for most Garands. As stated ole' John C. himself had to do it on occassion and you can see it in many news reels. As a matter of fact you can see them doing it in Band of Brothers which I thought was a cool nice touch of realism.

Sounds like a combination of your spring wearing in, the colder weather and a tight clip. I bet it works fine with your original clips and if not, don't worry it is normal.

Chris

Sistema1927
November 29, 2004, 11:48 AM
Get a "Holbrook Device". Best $40 I have ever spent. Without permanent modification it causes your Garand to work like an M14.

Swampy
November 30, 2004, 10:04 AM
Sistema wrote:

Get a "Holbrook Device". Best $40 I have ever spent. Without permanent modification it causes your Garand to work like an M14.

This is fine if all you want is for "Your Garand to work like an M14".....

However, if you care about quick reloading... installing a Holbrook device slows your reload down from being the fastest of the US Service Rifles to equal or slower than that of the slowest to relaod of the US Service Rifles.

It's been proven time and again that the M1 is faster to relaod than any other battle rifle out there. The M16 takes a bit longer due to more hand motions required to manipulate TWO magazines (one empty, one full), and the M14 takes even longer time due to the necessity to accurately grab the mag in just the right manner so that the release tab can be squeezed, then the full one must be inserted so that the front lip catches first, then rocked to lock on the rear side tab... THEN you can go for the bolt release.

The M1 when shot empty, in normal function, requires only that you grab a full clip, jam it into the mag well, then bump the op-rod handle with the heel of your hand as it's naturally leaving the top of the receiver from clip insertion. You are then back on the trigger. It can be done VERY fast.

Installing a Holbrook Device requires that you FIRST reach over the top of the receiver with your shooting hand to depress the clip release latch before you can reach for a new clip..... and with your hand over the top of the receiver the clip doesn't usually fly completely clear, dropping back down into the mag well... necessitating you to use more time to grab it and pull it free before going for the full one.

Maybe it's just me.... but why bother??? ;)

Keep em all original and I know they will all reload the same way too.....

Just my thoughts,
Swampy

Garands forever

Gunnutz13
December 1, 2004, 11:44 AM
Gee...you guys are lucky...having to do the bump...my 1944 SA would just love to take my thumb clean off.

But seriously folks...I always lube my M1 right before I shoot it...not with grease, which I use very sparingly, but with CLP...just a small blast before I start a blastin' :evil:

Sistema1927
December 1, 2004, 09:05 PM
Swampy,

To each their own.

Using the Holbrook device, I don't need a SLED, I can load anything from 1 to 8 rounds at a time, I can charge the clip in the rifle, or I can replace it with a full one.

Speed has never been a Garand requirement for me.

Stickjockey
December 2, 2004, 12:24 AM
My garand, while admittedly a CAI receiver with milsurp parts,( :o ) has always required a bump on the first round of a clip.

Stickjockey
December 2, 2004, 12:26 AM
Oops. Double tap. Sorry.

Swampy
December 2, 2004, 09:32 AM
sistema wrote:

Speed has never been a Garand requirement for me.

You must not be a Highpower competitor then.... :D

Best to all,
Swampy

Garands forever

Jmurman
December 2, 2004, 05:01 PM
Mine needs a bump too.

MAUSER88
December 2, 2004, 05:58 PM
All 3 of mine need the bump too.

CZ-100
December 2, 2004, 07:24 PM
YUP... I have to bump mine also..

It is Normal

BRONZ
December 2, 2004, 07:45 PM
Norton

I have to bump my match Garand no and then, don't sweat it. Mine have always been real tight clips. The olds beat up ones always work nice and smooth.

varoadking
December 2, 2004, 09:21 PM
All 3 of mine need the bump too.

Blackcloud6
December 3, 2004, 03:47 PM
When you load the clip by having the four fingers of your hand go down the side of the rifle (closed and striaght like a salute) and the heel of the hand touch the handle of the oprod. Then put slight back pressure on the handle, the bolt should then go forward when you release your hand up and away. No bump is then needed. I think many forget to apply the back pressure and are just using the heel of the hand to keep the bolt from going forawrd and giving a sever case of M1 Thumb!

I bleeive the hand method I describe above was how WWII soldiers were trained in th loading the rifle.

captain obvious
December 3, 2004, 04:25 PM
Mine depends on how it feels on any given day. Sometimes Miss Virginia will go on here own, sometimes she needs encouragement....

Swampy
December 3, 2004, 04:56 PM
Blackcloud wrote:

When you load the clip by having the four fingers of your hand go down the side of the rifle (closed and striaght like a salute) and the heel of the hand touch the handle of the oprod. Then put slight back pressure on the handle, the bolt should then go forward when you release your hand up and away. No bump is then needed. I think many forget to apply the back pressure and are just using the heel of the hand to keep the bolt from going forawrd and giving a sever case of M1 Thumb!

I bleeive the hand method I describe above was how WWII soldiers were trained in th loading the rifle.

BC.... the technique you describe is good and valid for avoiding M1 Thumb... but not for making the bolt go forward on it's own.

What you describe merely assists the clip latch to dis-engage from the op-rod. It does not do anything about the friction between the clip and the top round.

If you press the loaded clip in far enough to cause the bolt to come forward to the top round, the clip latch is already disengaged. It's an accumulated friction between parts, clip, and ammo that necessitates the bump to the first round. You will still need to bump the op-rod to make it travel.

I load my M1's exactly as you describe... each and every time. With one exception, they all still need "Da Bump" on the op-rod handle to close.

Best regards,
Swampy

Garands forever

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