[Old Partner]

The Town of Sahuarita AZ, has posted a sign in the park stating that "Firearms are prohibited.

This is the same thing the City of Tucson tried to do before the State of Arizona pre-empted them from doing so. So now we have to fight the same battle all over again, BAH!

I wrote to the Director of Parks and Recreation, Debbie Summers, stating that the sign was not proper and she emailed me back with "I have forwarded your message to our Chief of Police"...

I just sent her the following:

December 13, 2004

Dear Ms. Summers.

I am confused for a few reasons:

1. Why would you forward my message to the Chief of Police? I thought you were the Director of Parks and Recreation...

2. If the Chief of Police is in charge of Parks and Recreation, then, what do you do?

3. Nowhere in Chapter 15 of the Town Code are firearms even mentioned, so from whence do you (or The Chief of Police) gain the authority to prohibit firearms from Sahuarita Lake park?

If you still think you can make this prohibition valid, you should check with your counterpart at the city of Tucson. They tried to do the same thing and the State of Arizona overruled them.

If you do not remove this prohibition from the sinage within the next 14 days I will be forced to bring suit against the Town of Sahuarita and use as precedence the City of Tucson and its failure in the same regard.

Please advise as to how I should proceed.

Respectfully,

My name and address

:fire: :fire:

[Valkman]

Good letter. What you need to get passed is a law at the state level prohibiting localities from passing any new gun control laws without it going throught the state legislature. We have that here in NV, otherwise we'd see more laws from North LV and Boulder City, and maybe LV also.

[Standing Wolf]

If you do not remove this prohibition from the sinage within the next 14 days I will be forced to bring suit against the Town of Sahuarita and use as precedence the City of Tucson and its failure in the same regard.

Good for you!

[armoredman]

The City of Tucson did change thier signs last time I looked. I also warned the City of Marana to change thier signs in thier one park, as AZ state law is quite clear on how parks are to be posted, to allow CCW permit holders to carry on any state city or municipal parks, and signs must be visible advising of this fact. It is NOT a crime to be armed, whether open or concealed, in a park in any area of Arizona EXCLUDING reservations, as long as the armed citizen is a valid CCW permit holder. Most LE I know is aware of this, and I don't know of any recent prosecutions of this nature. Do try the gentle legal route, and if that doesn't work contact Brassroots in Tucson for help. They did a lot of the legwork to get the law change in the first place, IIRC.
Good luck - Sahuarita has a park? You mean Green Valley missed a golf course opening?

[Zonamo]

What you need to get passed is a law at the state level prohibiting localities from passing any new gun control laws
It's already on the books, which is why Old Partner is justifiably perturbed.

Arizona Revised Statute 13-3108. Firearms regulated by state; state preemption; violation; classification (http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/13/03108.htm)

Subsection A. Except as provided in subsection C of this section, a political subdivision of this state shall not enact any ordinance, rule or tax relating to the transportation, possession, carrying, sale, transfer or use of firearms or ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components in this state.

Subsection C. This section does not prohibit a political subdivision of this state from enacting and enforcing any ordinance or rule pursuant to state law, to implement or enforce state law or relating to any of the following:

Par C-5. Limiting firearms possession in parks or preserves of one square mile or less in area to persons who possess a concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112. The political subdivision shall post reasonable notice at each park or preserve. The notice shall state the following: "Carrying a firearm in this park is limited to persons who possess a permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112."

The City of Tucson already lost on this one and changed their signs to the exact language prescribed by law to allow CCW holders to carry in city parks. Given that the law has already been upheld by the Arizona State Supreme Court, the Town of Sahuarita would be stupid and crazy not to back down, and pronto.

[AZRickD]

http://www.ci.sahuarita.az.us/contacts.cfm

Various Mayors, Park directors, city councilmembers.

pcconklin@cox.net

nov659@cox.net

gvancamp@cox.net

martyscasa@aol.com

tucsontaylors@aol.com

maritajohn@cox.net

lynneskelton57@hotmail.com

lynneskelton57@hotmail.com

[gunsmith]

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=83630&highlight=heller

[AZRickD]

You might also get the local press involved. Gotta be some pro RKBA writers in the area.

With a well-placed newspaper article, radio segment, or TV spot, instead of a handful of dispersed internet gunnies knowing about this, you'll have thousands in your area know about it. You might even find one or two allies with which to plan further acts of freedom fighting.

Rick

[AZLibertarian]

...It is NOT a crime to be armed, whether open or concealed, in a park in any area of Arizona EXCLUDING reservations,... Of course, you're right on all of this, but just to make sure no one misinterprets what I highlighted in your quote above, National Parks are also excluded.

[Ryder]

Why would you forward my message to the Chief of Police?

Turning herself in for breaking the law perhaps? Haha, as if these do-gooders are ever held accountable. :fire:

[Old Partner]

I just got a phone call from Charles Heller (a CCW instructor and radio talk show host here in Tucson) and he told me that the Town of Sahuarita is blanking out the "Firearms Prohibited" notice on the signs.

One more small step...

:cool: :cool:

[Leatherneck]

Way to go, O.P. That's what it takes: calm reference to statute and an implicit willingness to take it further. Good job.

TC
TFL Survivor

[armoredman]

Good Job! As for parks, you are correct, national parks/monuments are no firearms :cuss: . National FORESTS are gun friendly, depending on state/local law.... :)

[Ryder]

I was once kidnapped by 4 drunks in a National Park who were threatening to leave me face down in the swamp. All I can say is thank the heavens for El Toro because when they parked the car to let me out and do their deed I pulled a houdini on them by flattening out in a shallow ditch a few feet away. They were staring out over top of me into the dark discussing the situation. I could "feel their breath". Guess they were scared of the dark because I didn't end up having to shred them to ribbons with the single edged razorblade I had removed from my wallet.

They can have their freaking National Parks! That's just a little more excitement than I need on a daily basis.

PS - Way to go O.P.!

[AZRickD]

Charles sent me an e-mail
I had a nice chat with Miss Summers today...

She told me that all the signs have been "whited out." I asked her if
she had lawyers with white out working on the signs and she said
it was "white tape."

She asked me what a mother with 2 children should do if she saw a man
with a gun and I suggested that she wave and thank him for lowering crime.

She said that maybe some of those people should roam their neighborhoods
together to so lower crime and I told her that when they do, the media
calls them "militias," and suggests that they are racists.

I also suggested training seminars for those who complain about guns,
rather than those who carry them, and also suggested she read that article that went across these very wires a few weeks ago about sheepdogs. She seemed receptive to that, and siad that she did "understand the right to bear arms." Yeah right, like a fish understands a hook...

I told her about the open carry with a permit "dilema" she might now
face, and she seemed to be aware of it vis a vis the Tucson ordnance. Funny how that news seemed to have travelled ahead of the pack to her... Miss Summers also claimed that said park was less than a square mile, so they could post it with the right signage. I suggest some of you activists down there get a legal sescription of the park and politely lay it on her desk, before she hires a new signmaker.

Oh by the way, she said in closing that her goal was to "get people to
read the new signs, so at least she had been successful in that." Funny how
bureaucrats measure progress, isn't it?

Charles Heller
www.Libertywatchradio.com
Live stream Sunday 12 - 2 PM MST at:
http://216.12.166.21:8600/liberty.ogg.m3u
520 419 2500