[oldfella]

This oldfella is grateful to have found this board, through a link form another board; I am an avid reader of boards dealing with guns, although I know little to nothing about guns, ammo, or even know to improve my aim. I was especially drawn by Jim March's writings, specifically his post of February 18, 2001 - that portion dealing with "slight hitch" or hesitation on some DA revolvers. You see, I just bought a new S&W hammerless revolver, Mod 640, and it does have that bit of hesitation before the hammer drops… I was tempted to return it as "defective"… it has not been fired - too cold for these old bones for range time yet. It took me couple of months to decide on this particular gun, after lots of comments and recommendations from savvy handgunners; I was originally thinking about one of the lightest snubbies, but was told that the lighter the gun, the heavier the "kick" - this model is heavier and a ¼" longer barrel… I'm not even sure what ammo to use for this specific gun. - I need all the help I can get. Regards, Oldfella.

[PlayTheAces]

Welcome oldfella. When does one qualify for oldfellahood? I'm trying to figure out if I'm there yet or not. If I'm not there, I gotta be knocking on the door.

[oldfella]

Thanks for the welcome, PlayTheAces - Qualification for "Oldfellahood"?... well, lets see - December 3, you're almost there, my friend.

[Kahr carrier]

Heck I would take it out and shoot at the range and see how it does before sending it out. I would fire about 500 rounds thru it to break it in .And if it doesnt function to your satifaction,then send it back. Try Starfires or Hydroshocks thru it.:)

[oldfella]

Thanks, Kahr Carrier - "Starfires or Hydroshocks"... I don't really know what kind of ammunition that is - remember, I'm kinda "dummy" about guns & ammo. I've been reading about Winchester: .38 Special +P; 125 gr super - X Jacketed Hollow Point; and .357 Magnum 145 gr Super X Silvertip Hollow Point... anny good?

Yes, I intend to shoot a few rounds, but I hear a lot of talk about getting "bloody" hands from the recoil; his oldfella is afraid of been blown back by it. What do you think?

Oldfella

[Old Fuff]

Hi there, and welcome aboard. Old Fuff here. I suggest you forget the so-called hi performance ammunition for the time being. Buy some .38 Special Mid-Range Wadcutter cartridges. These are loaded with 148 grain lead bullets that are blunt at the front and designed for target shooting. Accuracy is high and recoil is low so you won’t get kicked around. Best of all, they cost less then the hot stuff. This way you can get in some economical practice while you get use to your new revolver. Sometime down the road you can decide if you really need the fancy manstoppers that you keep reading about. I’ve been there and done that. Over 50 years of experience does count.

[Gordon]

Jeez Old Fuff took the words outa my mouth. Just to add more weight to the 148 wadcutter mid range reccomendation : these rounds which were once the most common ammo around (as they still are the MOST accurate centerfire ammo made) are getting hard to find because sheeple like to buy the weird 'trick' stuff-supply and demand. To top it off with a most controversial FACT many professional ballisticians and forensic patholigists believe that the full wadcutter is the best "manstopper" you can stuff into a .38 snub. This is because you can't get a bigger meplat than a full wadcutter, 750-800fps is enough to get the required 10-12 inches of penetration, and other 'expando shocker' ammo don't go fast enough to expand reliably in a snub and you can use that 148 grain weight to get better penetration than lighter(less sectional density) bullets, And you can shoot rapidly for repeat hits with midrange load because recoil and blast doesn't pull you off target. Us ol boys should relax and show them young blasters how to shoot with wadcutters, I do and sure get their attention at range. Makes the best home defense load for women too. That said I kinda like the Remington +power 158 grain lead semiwadcutter hollowpoint load , but it does work better in 2 1/2" and longer barrels. Welcome friend.

[Blackhawk]

Welcome to THR! :D

[ruger357]

Welcome aboard.

[Kahr carrier]

Starfires and Hydroshocks are Hollowpoints.You can always practice with 38 special in your 640.:)

[Mastrogiacomo]

You have a nice revolver with the 640, but personally, I'd use .38 ammo rather than .357. Why? To reduce the recoil and make the shooting experince more pleasant. I have the 442 model of S&W which I regret because it's a snub nose, double action only (tough trigger pull) airlight (15 oz) that hurts like Hell to fire. I'm a female shooter so maybe I'm just overly sensitive. I've since changed the grip to a Hougue and looking ino getting a model 686 -- which I plan to shoot only .38 ammo through. Avoid those light weight guns -- they hurt....A LOT. :uhoh:

[oldfella]

- Thanks much, OldFluff & Gordon - I take it that the ammo you mention is Remington... I will take your advice and soot up the place weather permitting. I'll hold off on the other "high performance" ammo for carrying/self defense. You see, I'm already learning about this stuff.

Kahr Carrier - thanks again, I suppose the ammo you mentioned is Remington... or the types of ammo you all mentioned is common to all manufacturers?

Black Hawk & and Ruger357, thanks for the welcome.

Mastrogiacomo - I too am sensitive to the recoil, mainly because I'm not a strong youngster (85). My new toy came with a black wrap-around semi-hard rubber grip, but I've been thinking about getting one of those soft rubber grips - what do you all think?

[Mastrogiacomo]

I would definately look into changing the grip. The harder handles, though some wooden ones look beautiful -- they're really painful. I changed the factory grip on mine and I love how it feels and expect to see an improvement when I head to the range. Most people I've spoken with have felt a vast improvement. I think if you picked out a grip by Hougue, which is excellent and cheap by the way, you'll be much more comfortable with the .38 load and the cushin for your hands. The gun has enough weight that the recoil should be very mild if not manageable with the ammo difference and the Hougue grip. :D

[Old Fuff]

Oldfella;

Remington does make .38 Special Wadcutters, but all of the other major manufacturers do too. In addition your dealer should be able to get you commercial reloads made by smaller companies that are satisfactory and cost less then the major brand stuff.

[oldfella]

Thanks, Mastrogiacomo and Old Puff - I appreciate your advice. I've just ordered the soft rubber grips from Houge. The inners of my new toy are being "polished" by a gunsmith for a smoother trigger pull.

I also have an almost new baby Glock (G-26), but my weak hand is really weak and have difficulty raking the slide. I put night sights (AO Big Dot); a 3.5lb Stock Glock Connector; Extended Mag Catch; Extended Slide Stop Lever and mag/grip pinky extensions on 3 magazines - plus 800 rounds of Sellier & Bellot, 115gr and 1 Box of Speer GoldDot +P 124gr GDHP HD ammo - I'd like to sell all of that... with it go a new Galco Paddle Holster, a Glock Video and a shooting book by Brian Enos - I sure would like to get rid of all of it for $600.

[Mastrogiacomo]

Just a final comment about the ammo -- I was given the wadcutters recommendation too when I complained about my revolver. I asked my gun dealer about this and he felt they were really dirty to use so I plan to keep using Winchester.

I'm very sensitive to the kick of a gun since my left hand has taken a beating between my father's work and my Arnis classes -- Filipino stick fighting. It does murder to the joints which is why I gave it up. I take protecting my eyes, ears, and hands very seriously so I do whatever is necessary to reduce any uncomfortable side effects from my new hobby. I'm sure if you stick with the .38 ammo in your gun and have the Hougue grip installed, you'll have a blast at the range. Stay safe. :D

[oldfella]

Thanks, Mastrogiacomo - I thought that the plain lead bullet left hard to remove residue - is that what you mean by "dirty"?

[Mastrogiacomo]

Yes, I think the reside of the wadcutters is quite black. This is what my gun dealer said anyway. Maybe it's more lead? If so, that can't be good to make that much of a mess. I never bought it given a lot of folks didn't recommend it. If you use any good name brand, I'm sure you won't have a problem and the grips should really help. Just be careful if you do you .357 ammo to clean it first to prevent any problems. :)

[Mastrogiacomo]

I meant to say "if you do use" .357 ammo instead of the .38, clean the gun first so there's no problem. It's about dinner time here. Best of luck. :D

[oldfella]

Thanks for clarifying that for me, Mastrogiacomo, I certainly will keep that in mind. Some one on another forum suggested a mixture vinegar and peroxide will clean stubborn lead residue, but you'll have to work hard to remove that stuff - you might have to use a fine metal pick, similar to what dentists use.

[Old Fuff]

Because .38 Wadcutters (all brands) are loaded to low pressures they often leave a black soot-like burned powder residue. This is nothing to worry about because it will easily wipe off. You need nothing more then a piece of cloth and some powder solvent (WD-40 also works).

I doubt that leading will be a problem, but if it is a brass brush will remove it. Also lead bullets are a lot easier on the bore then jacketed ones. Most bad leading comes from a combination of hot (not mild) loads combined with too-soft bullets. At this stage of the game I suggest you stick with commercial solvents rather then the home brewed kind.

[oldfella]

Old Fuff - firstly I'd like to apologize for using couple or three variations of your user name, I've just noticed it. My missus has been after me to get my eyes checked, and to get hearing aids... bad in both departments. I will get my eyes checked in the next week or so, and most probably have to get new eye glasses. As for hearing aids, I think not; I could buy a good running car for the money they are asking for two hearing aids - obscene!

You are right about the cleaning of the powder residue, especially on stainless steele. As for lead residue, well, it shouldn't be too awfully difficult cleaning a 2¼" tube, right?

Regards, Oldfella

[Old Fuff]

Don't worry about the spelling, I know what you mean. My eyes and hearing are in about the same shape as yours. We may yet end up forming the over-the-hill gang. Anyway, I think you are going to be able to enjoy your new "toy." Just go out and have fun.

One other thing. Winchester and Remington offer a .38 Special load using a full-jacketed 130 grain bullet at about 800 fps - which is mild. At one time it was used by the U.S. Military in their snub-nosed revolvers - also Navy pilots during World War Two and after. It makes a satisfactory practice round, but I still prefer the old wadcutters. As the "military" type cartridges are not expensive you might give them a try. They do burn cleaner then wadcutters.

[Mastrogiacomo]

Hey guys, it's not all about age!:D I've been wearing hearing aids since they picked up I was deaf back in Kindergarden -- did I spell that right?;) Because of the way I lost my hearing (German Measles) I developed a learning disability, rather complex and more than one. One part of it being poor spelling. I'd make a lousy editor and you can imagine how much fun I had through school -- particuarly college and Grad school where errors are costly. You take what comes and deal with it the best way you know how. All else, leave it to God. Luctor et Emergo -- Struggle and Emerge.:D

[oldfella]

I did say 2¼" barrel - that's wrong, the S&W Model 640 has a 2 and 1/8" barrel.
It sure is nice to for you folks to fill me in with all this info- my desk is full of notes - now I have to hits the local stores, but doubt if I'll find the ammo... small town; I probably have ask he gun dealer to order it for me.
Mastrogiacomo, you are doing well for yourself, with all this martial arts stuff - and a CCW, no doubt.
Old Fuff, thanks much... to both of you. Regards, Oldfella