$%#!@& Kel tec P11


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BlkHawk73
December 30, 2004, 12:49 PM
Father in law bought a Kel tec P11 a month or so ago. First trip to range it was shooting all over the place. Figured it was just him since he's used to larger sized pistols (1911, etc). Took it out for a second time yesterday. First shot and the #$@!%* thing locked up tight. Slide won't retract...nothing. it's locked! :cuss: personally, it isn't something I'd ever own anyways, but this confirmed it and it'll now never be a model I'll purchase. :barf: Yeah, it's only one out of who knows how many of them made. Surely some are good but I'll pass on this model. Prior to shooting it, we had both worked the action/slide and everything seemed ok. Was cleaned too. One shot was all it took. Gun has a total of 81 rounds though it! :cuss: guess what I always say is shown here...you get what you pay for. :neener: (didn't tell him that though) :rolleyes:

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TheFederalistWeasel
December 30, 2004, 01:08 PM
I watched a guy at a local indoor gun range shoot some type of Kel-Tec he had just bought at the range, from 7 yards his groups looked like shotgun blasts from 50 feet.

He must of put 50 rounds thru it, took it up front to the range guy/sales clerk then both come back. Range guy fires a few rounds at a new target same distance, same results.

Both share some words about the quality of the gun, evidentially the range guy recommended it to the buyer, buyer was not happy.

The guns are cheap, you get what you pay for.

Preacherman
December 30, 2004, 01:18 PM
I haven't found Kel-Tecs to be inaccurate... just unreliable. On the other hand, there are those who swear by them, and carry them with confidence. Guess one has to get lucky...

mattf7184
December 30, 2004, 01:27 PM
Send it back to KelTec, guarentee they will make it better for you.

They make so many guns that there will be lemons.

jaxfl
December 30, 2004, 01:44 PM
I have the Kel-tec P3at and have fired alot of rounds through it I am sorry your P11 is not working correctly. The P3AT that I have has not been modified and holds a 12inch grouping at 12 yards, not bad for a close distance gun. I would send it back to the factory and have them fix it. You might also go to the http://www.ktrange.com under P11 and see if anyone there can help you with this.

Reservecop55
December 30, 2004, 02:56 PM
I also had a bad experience with a Kel Tec P11 a few years ago. It was never reliable and had the front sight fall off after 50 rounds. On the other hand, I have a P32 that I use as a hideout gun on duty. It has been 100% reliable and I can shoot a 1 inch group at 5 yards with ball ammo, and get the head shot every time. It seems like their .32s are a better design than their 9 mm guns

W Turner
December 30, 2004, 03:46 PM
I think you have to be unlucky to get a bad one more than you have to be lucky to get a good one. I have have three or four of the P11's and three of the P32's pass thru my hands in the past and they have all been accurate enough and reliable. My P3AT shares BUG duties with a SW638.

W

The Rabbi
December 30, 2004, 04:05 PM
I had a P32. It wasnt the worst gun I ever had (that was a Smith mini-Sigma). But it was close.
Hard to shoot, I found it horribly inaccurate, even compared to my Colt .25. It was ammo-sensitive. It broke. It's only advantage was size and weight.

Stasher1
December 30, 2004, 04:07 PM
I've got a P32 and a P11, and they've both been 100% reliable. I'd recommend sending the pistol back to Kel-Tec to have them take a look at it. I guarantee they'll make it right.

Dave R
December 30, 2004, 04:11 PM
What kind of ammo were you using?

If you were using Wolf, or another Russian steel-cased ammo, then blame the ammo, not the gun.

My P-11 will not digest Russian 9mm. Either the P-11 chamber is tight to spec, or the Russian 9mm is loose to spec. Either way, cases tend to get stuck in the chamber. When a case gets REALLY stuck, it locks up the gun.

Fortunately, this is not hard to fix. Manually push in on the back side of the extractor, to free the front end of the extractor from the stuck case. You can then retract the slide. The stuck case can probably be driven out with a dowel or even a pencil (depending on how stuck it is.)

If it locked up with brass-cased ammo, then I retract the above and you do have a lemon.

MR.G
December 30, 2004, 05:24 PM
Send the gun to Kel-Tec for repair. They have a lifetime warranty and a good service department. I have a P-3AT and a P-11 that are used for front pocket carry. They have been fired about 400 rounds each with no problems. Neither gun is real accurate, but I don't expect any gun that will fit in my pocket to be a tack driver.

BlkHawk73
December 30, 2004, 05:35 PM
thanks. I e-mailed Keltec about it. He's stubborn enough that he won't want to send it back. Got that "I can fix it" thing in him. He's willing to break the grip and buy another one (not serialized). :banghead:
He was using regualar green/yellow remington hardball ammo. It fired and ejected the last cartridge so the chamber is empty. Just locked up tight.

clipse
December 30, 2004, 05:37 PM
The only Kel-Tec I ever saw some one shooting was the only time I saw a frame break in two.

clipse

Man-O-War
December 30, 2004, 08:10 PM
I am sorry to hear about your bad experience with the P11. I have had one for a year now and I have never had a single malfunction with it. I only have between 300 and 400 rounds through it but it has always functioned fine. It is plenty accurate for a pocket pistol and immediately became my "always" pistol. You would be hard pressed to find me without it except at work.

My father-in-law has one also and he has not had a single malfunction in 200 - 300 rounds.

I agree with the other posters who suggested sending it back to Kel-Tec. Although I have never had to send anything back myself, their customer service has an excellent reputation. Hopefully your father-in-law will be able to fix it, but if not, I believe Kel-Tec will. Good luck.

Walt Sherrill
December 30, 2004, 08:22 PM
I've had several Kel-Tecs over the years -- and consider them every bit as good as a number of far more expensive guns. (And no more troublesome.) I carried a P-11 for several years.

I recently purchased a P3AT and have about 400 rounds through it. Flawless performance and accurate.

A friend has one and claims its horribly inaccurate. I was shooting 4" groups at 30", rapidly with mine, and he tried it. All of a sudden this accurate gun turned into a shotgun. He decided he needs to try his again -- as he's a pretty good shot with other guns. Sometimes it isn't the gun...

Shooting the OLD lacquer-coated Wolf ammo will cause a lot of guns to lock up solid. That's a WOLF issue, not a gun issue.

(I did a survey here a while back, and about half of the folks who tried Wolf ammo had a variety of problems -- including the gun gluing itself shut. The other half loved the stuff and never had a problem.)

azrael
December 30, 2004, 08:56 PM
Hmmm locked up tight?? bummer dude, I hate to hear that...Got 2 p-11's that I swear by...I will not say what kind of holster I carry it in, except to say that they guy that made them REALLY and i mean REALLY hates the color brown!!!

had a p-40 that I sweared AT!!!! :what:

Problems with wolf ammo?? I use them all the time in mine...I just run the bore snake through them when they start to get "sludgy" and go again..

Send it back to KT...They have a great return policy..

OHHH...for the "do-it-yourselfer" ya might wanna direct him to www.ktog.org ...lots of know how on that board...

9x19
December 30, 2004, 09:17 PM
I have a number of Kel-Tec pistols and all have been reliable and accurate for me. {shrug}

I'm curious how the slide is "locked" if there is no round/case in the chamber... please let us know what you all find out.

Kel-Tec's service is exemplary, should you decide to avail yourselves of it.

Here's one of my favorite P-11s.

Wilson 17&26
December 30, 2004, 09:53 PM
Kel-Tec is very slow with email, best call. Each year Kel-Tec closed for two weeks. They will open January 3rd and their toll free number is 1-800-515-9983. If requested in writing, Kel-Tec will reimburse you $20 for shipping on warranty work. I usually request the $20 hard chrome slide exchange or an extra magazine in lieu of the $20 refund.

I like P-11s and have several, including a mirror finished stainless steel. If you just don’t like your P-11, I’ll give you 70% of my FFLs (SportingArms.com) NIB advertised retail price plus pay his $15 transfer fee. However, I hope you decide to keep your P-11.
Wilson

clange
December 30, 2004, 09:55 PM
Father in law bought a Kel tec P11 a month or so ago. First trip to range it was shooting all over the place. Figured it was just him since he's used to larger sized pistols (1911, etc).
Well, i think it probably is him. The P11 isnt the easiest gun to shoot in the world. If i dont take my time, i'm all over the place. I was shooting like 4 inches to the left at pretty close range. I thought the sight was off (partly because the rear sight is slightly off to one side). I went and shot from a rest at the same distance and had a ridiculously small group dead center on the target. Not much to say other than me and that trigger dont go well together. :uhoh:

Shootcraps
December 30, 2004, 10:13 PM
Definitely send it in for warranty repair. I had one and it was 100%. Carried it all the time. I've got the 1911 bug so I traded it on a Rock Island .45. Don't have no more 9 millies now. ;)

Devonai
December 30, 2004, 10:14 PM
My P-11 is like a Swiss watch. FWIW, it's a whole lot more reliable than the pre-Kahr Auto-Ordinance 1911A1 I used to own. :p

Wilson 17&26
December 30, 2004, 10:22 PM
Most problems with accuracy can be traced to the P-11 trigger. Check out P-11 Trigger Shoe and Trigger Stop at http://1bad69.com/keltec

alamo
December 30, 2004, 10:28 PM
I'm wondering if the guide rod slipped off the indent on the barrel & the recoil springs came out and that's what caused it to lock up. Is it still jammed up?

sm
December 30, 2004, 10:43 PM
I was asked to T&E the P-11 years ago.

I like SA 1911s and BHPs - in wood and blue. I also learned to shoot with wood and blue K frame revolvers. I think I was asked - just to get ribbed a lot. See Glocks hate me. I have opened the box on a NIB Glock - and have the sight fall off. I have broken a few, oh they worked great for the owners, The gun gets in my hands - ka-put!

I was REAL thankful I learned to shoot DA Revolvers. The P-11 trigger sucked. I was determined to T&E this P-11. " Go ahead and tear it up". So I set out to "tear it up". I started with good ammo, WWB and Blaser. The gun was reliable, I became "used to" the trigger ( best one can) . I shot weak handed, I shot "limpwristed" to see what it took to quit.

One damn thing - I was sure better shooting a DA K frame after shooting the P-11...

I then went to hotter loading, +P , Nato, all weights. At one point " scoop the case with powder and stick a bullet in it". I left in the freezer, I left it in the snow for 2 days, tossed in mud puddles, poured sand in,on and oh hell, shake it in a bucket full of Sand. [ Note my test mirrored Vicker's on Glocks and Sand].

After a bit one "gets used to" the P-11. It is a close range defensive tool. I think of it as DA "revo with 11 rds". Even so I have taken small game, and shot steels " just to see". 40 steps is 40 yds in my stride, I can hit the 8" steel - have hit the steel 3 mags worth - nary a miss. Granted 60 steps is "trying" - my hits ratio goes down...still it is a hoot to hear "ding".

Not every gun is for everyone. Every Mfg lets a bad one out. I doubt I will ever own another poly handgun. I find a Nylon 66 - that is different.

So I trust my P-11, I use it for CCW. If I ever tear the thing up...I don't care. It is at this point a close range tool ...I still have fun with it though.

I had it in the snow the other day when we had snow ( I buried it for 2 days) ...I was testing something...damn thing worked- again. :D

Personally , A 1911 Commander size is what I prefer to carry for what the P-11 is in size.

9mm allows for affordable ammo . I have run mine 1k rds in one day - many times. See I run a min of 200 rds , with each mag for reliability before I carry that ammo, in that gun , with that mag.

My P-11 carry load ( let me check, drops mag) Is the Speer Gold Dot 124 gr +P .
The spare mag on my desk is the same, the one in the truck - Blazer 115 FMJ .

I quit attemping to keep a rd count. I saved the end flaps. I know I ran 3k in one week alone. So somewhere around 7k I quit counting. Gotta be well over 10k rds .

I ran 400 rds just the other day ....of mixed ammo I was asked to shoot up....

krang
December 30, 2004, 10:48 PM
Sorry to hear about the P11. Mine is my always carry gun. I have over 1200 rds. through it with no problems. It's been totally reliable and quite accurate at 20 yds. Lots of practise with it and the trigger isn't a problem for me. Keltec is the best as far as service.

Bemo
December 30, 2004, 11:39 PM
I was also thinking that maybe the guide rod slid off the barrel lug.

I've tinkered with mine a lot and with some polishing and following the directions on Ktog.org board have a nice shooter but always had problems with the 147 gr. hydra-shoks (maybe a OAL thing? I dunno, I prefer 124 gr. golddots anyway).

Nice testing SM. Now if you want some real torture testing stories about the P-11, then Clark's your man. He hasn't managed to blow his up yet, but it's not for lack of trying.

Call Kel-tec, they'll treat you right.

Stasher1
December 31, 2004, 09:37 AM
My P-11 is like a Swiss watch. FWIW, it's a whole lot more reliable than the pre-Kahr Auto-Ordinance 1911A1 I used to own.


Hell, mine is more reliable than my Kimber Stainless Pro Carry. The Kimber stays at the house, but the P11 goes with me everywhere.

I just thought of something else to check. Take a good look at the takedown pin. There have been cases of the pin walking out while firing. It'll lock the slide up if it comes out far enough.

Bemo
December 31, 2004, 10:32 AM
The pin is an easy fix with a Dremel.

albanian
December 31, 2004, 01:36 PM
I had a Kel-Tec P-32 that was unreliable also. Sent it back to the factory twice and then it broke in my pocket. :uhoh:

I don't think you always get what you pay for, sometimes you get less. :barf: I paid close to $300 for it including taxes belt clip. I have had a dozen guns that were far better for less money.

This is just my opinion but I really think Kel-Tecs are junk. I don't see any real level of quality put into them and I am not surprised that they break and don't work. They are cheap junk but they are small and light. If they were the same size as the Walther PPK or Mini Glocks, everyone would laugh at them. It is just so tempting to be able to carry such a small and light pistol that people will put up with some things that they wouldn't with a larger gun. To those that have them and and they work for you, I am envious because I would love to have a gun like the P3-AT but I just can't trust a Kel-Tec gun again. Maybe another maker will come along and make something similar but of much higher quality. I wouldn't mind paying 2-3 times as much if it was a truely good quality pistol. I would pay $400-500 for a well made P3-AT type of gun that was made out of Titanium or a better quality plastic. The Roaghbar (Sp) sounds good but it needs to be a little more time tested before I sink that kind of cash into a tiny pocket gun.

Shootcraps
December 31, 2004, 02:35 PM
This is just my opinion but I really think Kel-Tecs are junk.

One bad gun doesn't mean the manufacturer only puts out junk. They make and sell a lot of guns. EVERY manufacturer puts out a bad gun now and then.

Badger Arms
December 31, 2004, 03:01 PM
Anecdotal evidence doesn't tell us anything. First of all... Accuracy:

When people compare the 1911 to the P11 it makes he shake my head. No gun that small is going to be accurate at 50 feet... DUH! Put a 7" sight radius on the same gun and you'll tighten up your groups significantly. Problem is, you're still shooting groups at a range with a gun that's meant to save your life at point-blank range. If you think you're going to be shooting somebody in the head at 50 feet, DON'T BUY A KEL-TEC!

Second... Reliability:

The KelTec is a dirt-cheap weapon. It's really the cheapest NEW gun you can buy that has a good reputation for reliability. Good, I say? Yep. GOOD but not great. I've NEVER had a failure to feed or eject in either my P32 or either of the two P11's I've owned, one blued and one chrome. I have, however, HEARD of many malfunctions in both guns and EXPERIENCED malfunctions in my P3AT so I can understand people's problems.

Look at it this way. If you want an uber-reliable gun, stay away from the KelTec brand. Spend DOUBLE the money for a gun you FEEL will be reliable like a Khar or Glock 'compact'. It's a matter of economy. If it's your primary weapon, you're probably cheap, poor, or willing to shoot some rounds through it first to discover if it will work.

As for somebody who takes it out and locks it up first shot? Sounds fishy... send the gun to KelTec and sell it when you get it back.

Felonious Monk
December 31, 2004, 03:41 PM
Walt Sherrill - ditto. I've had several Kel-Tecs over the years -- and consider them every bit as good as a number of far more expensive guns. (And no more troublesome.) I carried a P-11 for several years.

I recently purchased a P3AT and have about 400 rounds through it. Flawless performance and accurate.

A friend has one and claims its horribly inaccurate. I was shooting 4" groups at 30", rapidly with mine, and he tried it. All of a sudden this accurate gun turned into a shotgun. He decided he needs to try his again -- as he's a pretty good shot with other guns. Sometimes it isn't the gun...

sm-- It is a close range defensive tool. I think of it as DA "revo with 11 rds"Exactly what George Kelgren designed it to be. No complicated manual of arms, just a DA like a revolver, but with 6-7 extra rounds.

I find that for people who like to work on their own cars, and can follow simple mechanical instructions, the P11 can be tweaked easily to be every bit the gun a Kahr, Glock or other high dollar Tupperware is, for a fraction of the price...PLUS a little time & effort.
I've been told by several who've shot it that my P11 has the best DAO trigger they've ever shot...but that's AFTER a fluff & buff, a trigger stop, trigger shoe, and at least 2 other mods I did myself, using instructions from KTOG.org and KTrange.com.
For those that want a jewel right out of the box, pay double and get what you're looking for. I take great pleasure in having as good or better for a fraction of the cost. Whatever trips your trigger.

albanian
December 31, 2004, 05:51 PM
"I find that for people who like to work on their own cars, and can follow simple mechanical instructions, the P11 can be tweaked easily to be every bit the gun a Kahr, Glock or other high dollar Tupperware is, for a fraction of the price...PLUS a little time & effort."

I was always told that you can't shine a turd. :D

I am very mechanical and what I notice is, it is better to start with quality if you plan on improving something. Trying to fix up poorly made stuff is not rewarding for me because I still feel like I have a pile of junk. It just isn't worth the effort to fix up up a Kel-Tec IMHO because the parts and materials are not made well enough to bother with. A Kahr K-9 is worth the effort because it is all SS and machined. I could see someone spending $1000 to have some custom work done to a Kahr or a nice 1911 but not for a Kel-Tec. :p That would be like spending $10,000 to totally restore a 1993 Hyundai. :evil:

sarge48
December 31, 2004, 06:05 PM
Get him a Makarov. They always go bang! I gave up on a P-11 many moons ago. :scrutiny:

sm
December 31, 2004, 07:45 PM
P-11 is what it is . Nothing more - nothing less.

Most likely - I won't buy another Poly gun, since I have this one....I'm gonna shoot and have fun with it.

One feature I do like - the hammer. I have exposed mine to a lot of 'stuff' , like sand, the hammer and all that open space, lets sand and all get out of the way, and the gun runs.

My experience with striker fired won't always do this. Some guns by design - stuff get in - can't get out.

I get a kick out tossing sand on it and then firing it...after the gasps, pour water, coke , tea...garden hose , slosh in a mud puddle - whatever to rinse- and continue on.

I used to do this to prove a point to students and such. Some had guns that they bragged about , never shot, and constantly cleaned and clean gun.

They couldn't shot worth a flip.

My point was - no matter what you have, you can't hit anything if you don't practice or take training.

Folks with tricked out pricey gun laughed at the police trade ins like Model 10, 3913, Some Glocks and Keltecs...The folks they were laughing at could shoot. Sure the guns had wear and scuff marks - it is tool.

So while the fella laughed, he was terrified of getting his $2k semi- custom gun with a logo pistol case - "hurt".

I told him he didn't need a CCW, in fact sell all his guns and hire a body guard if he was that anal. Sometimes pissing off a student and having another student a <gasp> "Girl" outshoot them with a trade in gun is all it takes...

He still couldn't hit crap - at least the darn gun got dirty... :evil:

Walt Sherrill
December 31, 2004, 09:06 PM
Actaully, the P-11 isn't a "poly gun." It has an aluminum frame, not polymer. The aluminum frame just happens to have a plastic cover on it... (which can be swapped for one of a different color.)

Lots of folks have problems with Kel-Tecs. Many, many folks don't have problems with Kel-Tecs.

But, of course, that seems to be true with most guns that sell for under $500. (The Makarov mentioned above is generally an exception -- but its also 9x18 and generally only 8 rounds. Good gun. But relatively big and heavy for the caliber.)

Wilson 17&26
December 31, 2004, 09:41 PM
Under $230 including upgrades, 6.6oz, three years old, hundreds of rounds and never missed a beat. When you get a good one, Kel-Tec value can’t be beat.
http://www.wilson-genealogy.com/pics/hcp32st.gif

albanian
January 1, 2005, 12:29 AM
"Anecdotal evidence doesn't tell us anything."

This is only partly true. One person telling one story about one gun doing something is not enough to base an opinion on but hopefully, many people will chime in each with their "Anecdotal evidence" and we can get an idea of what is going on.

We can't believe the gun rags and we can't believe the gun companies that are trying to sell us their guns but at least we can compile 1st hand accounts of gun and start to see trends.

If you do a search on Kel-Tec, you will find mixed reviews with an alarming number of negative stories. If you do a search on a Ruger GP-100 for example, you will find almost nobody has had a problem with them. You don't take one story as truth but hopefully if we get enough people telling their expriences, we may be able to avoid buying a gun that has a high degree of problems. Clearly the Kel-Tec guns are less reliable than a Ruger GP-100 but that is an extreme example. I am sure you can find someone that had a GP-100 that was not reliable and also had a KT P-11 that ran 100%. I look for trends and from what I have seen in person and by doing research is, Kel-Tec has more of a chance of having problems than I feel confortable with.

Felonious Monk
January 1, 2005, 12:58 AM
Albanian--Kel-Tec, you will find mixed reviews with an alarming number of negative stories. If you do a search on a Ruger GP-100 for example, you will find almost nobody has had a problem with them.Not an applicable comparison. Other S/A polymer guns, yes. A Revo vs. a SemiAuto polymer gun? No.

Funny thing is, you go and read some of the posts on GlockTalk or a Kahr forum, (and for that matter NAA and Rohrbaugh, too), and the overall percent of guns needing attention from the factory runs pretty consistent among all of them. There is NOT some "Chevy Corvair quality problem" with KelTec guns. A few need attention. Most don't. If they DO, you can rest assured you have the support of a company who goes a LONG way to make sure they solve your issues. If the problem persists, you can also depend on a VAST knowledge base on the forums re: these guns.

I understand that you don't like Kel-Tecs. Don't buy one! My experience has been QUITE different than yours. The tweaks and the enthusiastic following that these pistols have developed (2 dedicated gunboards just for KelTecs!) are part of the fun, and it is NOT as you indicating, shining up a turd.

Wilson 17&26
January 1, 2005, 01:54 AM
I have a sneaky feeling that Ruger would have just as many problems, if they made a pistol as thin and light as Kel-Tec. When considering the number of complaints, I like to keep in mind that Kel-Tec produces far more mouseguns than other manufactures, possibly more than all others combined. However for those that like a high quality detailed finish, with the weight of steel, a Kel-Tec won’t do. To each his/her own :)

alamo
January 1, 2005, 02:06 AM
Not an applicable comparison. Other S/A polymer guns, yes. A Revo vs. a SemiAuto polymer gun? No.

Absolutely. A full sized all steel revolver vs. a small, extremely lightweight polymer semi-auto? Good point. My P-11, P-3At & P-32s are quite reliable but they need more care, cleaning between fewer rounds fired and lubrication vs. my full-size revolvers. Not a complaint, they were designed for concealed carry & protection, not as plinkers to shoot all day with hundreds of rounds per outing although my P-11 could probably handle that easily. I only shoot my P-3AT and P-32s with 50 rounds at a time, then clean & lube. They work fine for that which is much more than I'd ever need for protection.

senior
September 1, 2006, 06:29 PM
saw where a problem was had with a kel-tec 32 that was shooting remington green and yellow .32, that right there could be the problem, i have no experience with the kel_tec 32, but i do have a NAA guardian that i used that stuff in, geezz, half a box and my .32 looked like it had been dipped in tar, i couldn't beleive how filty those rds are, cleand mine up and those remington rds are in the bottom drawer for a time i might get desperate!

Red$tinger.308
September 1, 2006, 08:04 PM
George Kelgren, an owner of Kel-Tec came up with the design for the Tec-9. Think about that. :eek:

Bobhwry
September 1, 2006, 08:22 PM
Kel-Tecs are cheaply made guns, thus the price!!

torpid
September 1, 2006, 08:56 PM
Ahh, vintage December 2004.

albanian
September 1, 2006, 11:59 PM
"Send it back to KelTec, guarentee they will make it better for you.
They make so many guns that there will be lemons."

The above should read:

"Send it back to Kel-Tec 3-4 time, they may or may not get it working for you.
They make so many guns that are lemons.":D

denfoote
September 2, 2006, 04:35 AM
Gee. I wonder if he ever got his gun fixed??? :rolleyes:

alamo
September 2, 2006, 09:44 AM
saw where a problem was had with a kel-tec 32 that was shooting remington green and yellow .32, that right there could be the problem, i have no experience with the kel_tec 32, but i do have a NAA guardian that i used that stuff in, geezz, half a box and my .32 looked like it had been dipped in tar, i couldn't beleive how filty those rds are, cleand mine up and those remington rds are in the bottom drawer for a time i might get desperate!

I'm curious as to why you'd post on a 20 month old thread? There are several recent Kel-Tec threads.

Not long ago a fella replied on a thread I had started almost 4 years ago - not to folllow up but just a mundane comment as if it were a new thread. I'm just curious as to why a few folks search back years on the forum to find a thread to reply to when there are many active threads on the same subject.

Brian Williams
September 2, 2006, 10:16 AM
This is an old thread, If you do not have anything to add to the original thread, DO NOT POST HERE, I will delete it.
Blkhawk73 I would like to hear if this ever got resolved.

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