[CZ52GUY]

http://www.idpa.com/rulebook/IDPA%20Rule%20Book2005c.pdf

Stay safe,

CZ52'

[HankB]

Looks like the new new rules have addressed many of the points made earlier in these forums. But I see they're effective on 04/15/05.

This seemingly violates the IDPA equipment stability rule, which states: Equipment rule changes will only be reviewed every (two) 2 years. Any equipment rule change will go into effect twelve (12) months after approval.

[Jim Watson]

They changed that, too.
Page 11
You will see "Stability of Equipment Rules. This rule applies to firearms only."
There you have it, the official definition of 'Equipment' is 'Gun'. Holsters and other gear are Something Else.

[HankB]

OK, so equipment is "Gun" and the new rules (like placing M625s in ESR) won't take effect for a year.

Gee . . . they issued new equipment rules recently, and now this week they have new new rules . . . did two years pass between "new" and "new new?" :evil: :neener:

[Jim Watson]

Wrong again, Hank.

Bill says that not only does 'equipment' mean only 'gun' but that 'stability' only applies if a gun is to be disallowed, as they did with the 5" barrelled revolvers.
The ONLY "equipment" change that will get the year delay is the weight limit in SSP which disallows some guns like the steel Sig-Sauers and Berettas.
Moving the 625 to ESR does not disallow it, it just changes divisions, so that and all other changes are effective in April, giving them just time enough to hash through a few more revisions so as to get out the embarassing contradictions and print the NEW New Rules out in time for the major Spring, Summer, and Fall matches.

I only have the Letter and the NNR in PDF and can't copy from them so you will have to read the details at
http://www.idpa.com/Rulebook_comments.pdf
http://www.idpa.com/rulebook/IDPA%20Rule%20Book2005c.pdf

[HankB]

Jim,

I see previous IDPA rules stated:In order to maintain stability within the International Defensive Pistol Association, equipment rule changes will only be reviewed every two (2) years. Any equipment rule changes will go into effect 12 months after approval. IDPA will NEVER be an equipment race; IDPA is about shooting, not equipment. (I think this is the previous rule - I don't have the most recent pre-January 2005 rulebook near at hand, and I'll stand corrected if this is not the most recent.)

Equipment used to mean gun, holster, mag carriers, etc. The new stability rule appears to redefine "equipment" as "gun" and as you say, it limits it to cases in which a gun will be "disallowed."

But the previous rule didn't appear to contain these limitations . . . shouldn't the old rule hold until 12 months after the new rule is implemented?

When they simply replace the old stability rule with a new stability rule, and make all changes effective right away under the new rule, ignoring the old . . . then doesn't that render the stability rule itself pretty much meaningless? :confused:

[OF]

. . . then doesn't that render the stability rule itself pretty much meaningless? DING DING DING DING!! We haaf a winnah! :)

Now to really make your head explode, ask yourself why if the rules state that all TACLOADs and RWRs are to be done off the clock, there are still two of them in the classifier!

- Gabe

[Jim Watson]

Well, the NNR doesn't state that TL/RwR ARE TO BE DONE off the clock, it just "urges" course designers to draft CoFs that way.
Me? I think they ought to be timed at least part of the time so as to add stress.

As to the definition 'equipment' = 'gun', Bill says he meant it that way from the start. And who are we to say he didn't?

[Burt Blade]

All organized sports have an arbitrary set of rules. The people who created the IDPA sport, and in effect own it, want it to remain true to the vision they created. They are not obligated to make it into what others thought it was, or want it to be. It will "sell" or it will not, depending on how many people want to play that particular game.

I primarily shoot Single Action Shooting Society matches (also called Cowboy Action Shooting). That organization also has an arbitrary set of rules, intended to preserve the founders’ concept of the sport. We also have people who spend a great deal of time discussing what it ought to be, or what they thought it was. Wisely, the Wild Bunch (Board of Directors) retained the power to say "This is what SASS is. Deal with it.", and thus do not have to accept changes voted in by a majority of people who did not create it, and don’t like the way it is.

[Taipei Personality]

and in effect own it,

Not in effect, in fact.

[CZ52GUY]

All organized sports have an arbitrary set of rules. The people who created the IDPA sport, and in effect own it, want it to remain true to the vision they created. They are not obligated to make it into what others thought it was, or want it to be. It will "sell" or it will not, depending on how many people want to play that particular game.

What's different about the IDPA fiasco is that much of what has been banned was legal for 3.5 years, is practical carry gear for most who use it, and penalizes those who were trying to do it right. That the owner of IDPA is now claiming that to satisfy his P&P's...that perfectly good gear is now banned...that he would without notice alienate sponsors, MD's, SO's, and a substantial portion of his membership...it's a real mystery to many of us.

Bottom line, there is negative reaction because of negative impact. Again, the negative impact is not on a few gamers, but on a substantial # of shooters that carry their now "banned gear" regularly.

As another on this board states so eloquently in his sig'...WE VALIDATE THAT WHICH WE ACCEPT. For many, they cannot in good conscience validate these changes.

Stay safe,

CZ52'