[TheeBadOne]

http://media.darrylworley.com/hyf01.asx

Verse 1
I HEAR PEOPLE SAYING WE DON¹T NEED THIS WAR
I SAY THERE'S SOME THINGS WORTH FIGHTING FOR
WHAT ABOUT OUR FREEDOM AND THIS PIECE OF GROUND
WE DIDN'T GET TO KEEP 'EM BY BACKING DOWN
THEY SAY WE DON'T REALIZE THE MESS WE'RE GETTING IN
BEFORE YOU START YOUR PREACHING LET ME ASK YOU THIS MY FRIEND

Chorus 1
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN HOW IT FELT THAT DAY
TO SEE YOUR HOMELAND UNDER FIRE
AND HER PEOPLE BLOWN AWAY
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN WHEN THOSE TOWERS FELL
WE HAD NEIGHBORS STILL INSIDE GOING THRU A LIVING HELL
AND YOU SAY WE SHOULDN¹T WORRY ABOUT BIN LADEN
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN

Verse 2
THEY TOOK ALL THE FOOTAGE OFF MY T.V.
SAID IT'S TOO DISTURBING FOR YOU AND ME
IT'LL JUST BREED ANGER THAT'S WHAT THE EXPERTS SAY
IF IT WAS UP TO ME I'D SHOW IT EVERYDAY SOME SAY THIS COUNTRY'S JUST OUT LOOKING FOR A FIGHT
AFTER 9/11 MAN I'D HAVE TO SAY THAT'S RIGHT

REPEAT CHORUS

Bridge
I'VE BEEN THERE WITH THE SOLDIERS
WHO'VE GONE AWAY TO WAR
AND YOU CAN BET THAT THEY REMEMBER
JUST WHAT THEY'RE FIGHTING FOR

Chorus 3
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN ALL THE PEOPLE KILLED
SOME WENT DOWN LIKE HEROES IN THAT PENNSYLVANIA FIELD
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN ABOUT OUR PENTAGON
ALL THE LOVED ONES THAT WE LOST AND THOSE LEFT TO CARRY ON DON'T YOU TELL ME NOT TO WORRY ABOUT BIN LADEN
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN

Tag
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN
HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN

Darryl Worley/Wynn Varble, 2003 EMI Blackwood Music Inc./Hatley Creek
Music/Warner-Tamerlane, Publishing Corp. (BMI)

[Blackhawk]

Nope.... :fire:

[jmbg29]

NEVER!:fire: :cuss: :fire:

[Azrael256]

I first heard this song while parking my car in front of the Oklahoma City National Memorial. I looked at the memorial to my right, and quite confidently stated "No."

[twoblink]

The only thing I forgot was how yellow-bellied France is.

If I send my 6th grade cousin into France with a BB gun, they'd surrender! Wait, they'd surrender to the threat of sending my cousin!

[Sir Galahad]

I love that song! You know, here's people like Sheryl Crow protesting. But leave it to country to mean exactly what the genre says: COUNTRY. I know whose CDs I buy.

[DeltaElite]

I will never forget or forgive.

[sonny]

This thread deserves a return to the top......no I haven't forgotten

[DeltaElite]

Sonny,
From the distinct lack of responses, I think some people have forgotten. :(

[pax]

Catchy tune.

Lousy poetry, barely rises above doggerel.

Great sentiment.

And no, I haven't forgotten.

pax

There is sobbing of the strong,
And a pall upon the land;
But the People in their weeping
Bare the iron hand;
Beware the People weeping
When they bare the iron hand. -- Herman Melville

[Study Butte]

No, I haven't forgotten.

[sonny]

Pax,

You said....

Catchy tune.

Lousy poetry, barely rises above doggerel.

Great sentiment.

And no, I haven't forgotten.

We're all very impressed with your vocabulary......Is it so hard for you to just leave something alone.....must you be so critical of such simple and honest sentiment?

I believe you haven't forgotten ......I also believe you never knew.
:mad:

[DeltaElite]

I believe you haven't forgotten ......I also believe you never knew.

Ouch, that's gonna leave a mark. :D

[Don Gwinn]

Sonny, you're way out of line.

1. You have no idea what Pax knew or knows. There's no reason to get all emotional and no reason to resort to personal insults. You know that's not how it works here.

2. The song is badly written. I'm sorry if that offends you, or if it has somehow become unpatriotic to criticize the musical genius of Darrel Worley, but it's true. "Where Were You When the World Stopped Turning?" was brilliant. "The Rising" is great. This song is not. If you want a detailed analysis to back that up, I can provide it. Hint: ask yourself how many people protesting the war with Iraq have said that it's a bad idea because we should forget about Bin Laden. . . . :rolleyes:

3. It's bad to have a large vocabulary? In what universe? I suppose you're referring to Pax's use of the word "doggerel." Well, doggerel is the correct term in this case and another would not have expressed the correct idea. Don't try to shame people for doing something right. It's silly.

4. Of course it's "so hard to leave something alone." Someone posted the song on a discussion board! What exactly did anyone expect to happen? That there would be no discussion?
Honestly, if TheeBadOne didn't want to hear honest opinions of the song, he wouldn't have posted it on a forum with 4,000 members. At least, I wouldn't. It's common sense.

[Nightfall]

Never forget. Never forgive.

Some people may forget as they go about their day to day lives. The rest of us know better. It's a long list of people to put in caskets or jails. We're still at the top of that list.

We're coming! :fire:

[DeltaElite]

I thought the thread was about "Have you forgotten" about 9/11, not music appreciation or literary brillance.
Guess I was wrong. ;)

[sonny]

Sorry,
I don't think I am out of line......What happened to all this HIGH ROAD talk.....I guess moderator status allows you all to decide how high, high is and how low, low is.Check youselves once in a while.
I think Pax's critique of the song was arrogant.

[Don Gwinn]

Well, I suppose we differ there, Delta. In my mind, if you post a song, then it's a thread about that song. If you want to create a thread about whether people have forgotten 9/11, but you don't want to hear criticism of a song about forgetting 9/11, then it would seem only reasonable to post about 9/11 and not post the song. Perhaps I'm missing something.

Sonny, your invocation of "The High Road" is puzzling. Neither Pax nor I ever stepped off it. Pax simply gave her opinion of the song. I know I keep saying this, but it does seem that in a thread about a song, opinions on that song would be perfectly on topic and reasonable to post. Even if disagreeing with you on the importance of remembering 9/11 were somehow off the High Road (and it's not) Pax didn't do that, either. She said she likes the sentiment behind the song. In other words, she agreed with you in principle, and in response you chose to castigate her as arrogant, elitist, unpatriotic and uncaring about her fellow Americans--all because she had the temerity to state an opinion different from yours about a song. A bit of pop music.

That's not the High Road, and it is out of line. Being moderators has absolutely nothing to do with it. Pax wasn't a moderator until yesterday, and if you'd said that to her the day before you'd still have been out of line. If you'd said it to Delta Elite you'd still be out of line. Personal attacks and flaming will not be tolerated at The High Road. Ever. Period. That's all I was saying, and I tried to say it nicely. Now, feel free to take the last word--remembering to stick closely to The High Road in word and deed--and we can get on with more important things.

[DeltaElite]

I guess we do view it differently Don.
Isn't criticizing the song akin to attacking a members poor grammar or spelling?
Isn't the point of the post or the song more important than the verbage under which it is done?

I think it is, I don't think a critique of the lyrics was appropriate or the purpose of the thread.
Of course, most threads get sidetracked onto something unrelated or irrelevant to the purpose of the thread, so why should this one be significantly different than the norm. :)

[SIC TRANSIT GLORIA MUNDI]

I completely agree with you Sonny. While I think most of the moderators here do a good job, I have lately noticed a kind of arrogant "I have spoken" attitude from a few of the moderators here. I will not commit such a gross breach of ettiquette as to mention names. The opinions of the moderators on this board are in point of fact no more valid or important than those of any other member here - whether they agree with that sentiment or not. Of course, if a moderator wants to chime in, that's their right - but then they should expect to take the same amount of public heat as the rest of us who express opinions that others disagree with. Putting it another way, don't expect to be handled with kid gloves.

[sonny]

The majority of the early responses to this thread answered to the spirit of the song ....not the specifics of the musical arrangement and poetic-lyrical content.......those that did comment on the SONG did so in a possitive way.....If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all..... thats the way I feel on such a touchy subject .....you know ...like the death of thousands of americans.
You say I'm wrong and throw in a few riduculous things like....

3. It's bad to have a large vocabulary? In what universe? I suppose you're referring to Pax's use of the word "doggerel." Well, doggerel is the correct term in this case and another would not have expressed the correct idea. Don't try to shame people for doing something right. It's silly.

Well I agree with the last part...... Don't try to shame people for doing something right. It's silly.

[DeltaElite]

Since this thread is now hopelessly off track, I will chime in again.

What is being observed of moderators here is not unique to THR.
It is the same at most every board I have ever been a member of.
It seems that the line between member and moderator becomes blurred when you are both.

What were once posts of opinion, can become sermons from the mount, if the moderators are not careful.
Some are better at remaining seperated, some are not.

Fortunately for all, I have no say in this board, so all of my posts are opinion, since I can't be trusted with any authority. ;)

[pax]

Sonny,

I'm sorry you didn't like the words I use. When I was in kindergarten, my teacher asked my mom, "Does she always use those big words?" My mom blinked a few times and said, "What big words?" -- just to show, I come by it honestly. I truly don't mean to offend.

I don't like that song. I agree with what it says, but I don't like the way it says it. I'm sorry you thought it sounded arrogant for me to say so, but I won't take back what I said. It is bad poetry, and it bothers me that it is so bad because the message is such a good and important one.

I like country western music most the time, but some of it is bad. Some of it is really bad. Some of it is so bad, it's good! :D But the words to that song aren't bad enough to be good -- and what it is talking about is too important to be laughed at the way that people laugh at bad music.

Now, what I've got to ask you: why did you take it so personally when I said it was bad poetry? Did you write it or something?

pax

There's nothing I like less than bad arguments for a view that I hold dear. -- Daniel Dennett

[sonny]

No Pax....I didn't write it and I didn't go to college and BIG words don't scare me ....nice dig ..... but my friends family and I DID build those 2 towers that crashed to the ground on 9/11.

So the answer to your question about why I took it personally should be obvious .....Should I mention some of the other horrors that I wittnesed that day? or will you dismiss them as mere words on a computer monitor instead of trying to understand them in the spirit in which they were written.

Moderate that.

[DeltaElite]

Sonny,
You are doing this, :banghead:

Try doing this, :neener:
It is much more more rewarding. :D

[pax]

Sonny,

It wasn't a dig -- it was an honest question. I thought maybe you might have written it, or know the person who did or something.

I understand that you are angry about 9/11. So am I. We agree on that. Which was why I thought you must have had something to do with the song itself -- because why else would you get so upset when I said the message was good, but the song was bad?

When the towers fell, I was sitting on the living room couch at a friend's house. It was about 6 in the morning on the west coast, and I was on my way to work. Instead of going to work, we all sat down and cried together -- for our country, for the people who were dying before our eyes, for anger at our enemies. One of my friends kept pacing back and forth behind the couch, saying over and over, "we're going to kill them. Oh God are we going to kill them." He said lots more, most of it profane and all of it deadly serious. Me, I was too angry for words. Still am.

Where were you when it happened?

pax

Hompu'wIj ghorlaH 'oy'naQpu' je naghpu' 'ach jiH mu'oy'laHbe' pongpu.' -- Klingon phrase: roughly translated as 'sticks and stones may break my bones, but names can never hurt me.'

[DeltaElite]

Where were you when it happened?

That question might make an excellent thread of its own.

[sonny]

:neener: ....aaaaaahhhhhhhhhh!...that feels better!

[Zander]

I will never forget or forgive. -- DECall me old-fashioned, but doesn't forgiveness imply the asking of same?

...doggerel... -- paxHuh?!?

Congratulations on your elevation to 'moderator'...

[sonny]

About 1/2 mile away on a constuction site.......first thought ?.....accident .....plane 2 hits....first thought....war.

[DeltaElite]

Call me old-fashioned, but doesn't forgiveness imply the asking of same?

I didn't think it did, but then again I am kinda dense sometimes. :D

[Beorn]

I am a music teacher. I have written music and poetry that has been published, and not in some penny dreadful novellas either...

The writing is sub-standard, the emotion is not.

The melodic progression is simplistic, as most C&W is, because it is designed to remain in the short-term memory longer, thereby becoming embedded in the long-term memory.

Pax had a right. I felt it may have been somewhat short, but waxing rhapsodic about something you do not appreciate is hypocritical, don't you think?

Sonny, your point is also well taken.

Some of the most stirring songs have had, from a musicological standpoint, the least gripping melodic line/harmonic progression/lyrical continuity.

Case in point: have you ever heard the verses following the first in the Star Spangled Banner? Let's just say that it's obvious neither Francis Scott Key (a lawyer), nor the friend he went to the British Frigate to "rescue" (a Medical doctor named Beane) were good poets. But can you deny the sentiment when you hear that song? Even if it IS set to the tune of a British drinking song? I know I can't. Every time I conduct a choir, every time I sing it, every time I write an arrangement of the work for a specific instrumental or vocal group, I'm not thinking, "This was a British drinking song!" But rather, how can I make this stay as beautiful as possible, without sounding like Maria Carey getting caught in a Bear Trap?!?

Critiques can and do hurt. Some are meant to, others are not. But all critiques are based upon opinion and the facts as seen from that person(s) point of view. None are wrong, none are right; they just are.

[sonny]

Interesting Beorn....thanks for the analogy...it made sense to me.

[faustulus]

I wonder why it is alright to use emotional arguments for or agaisnt the war and not for or agaisnt 2nd amendment rights. If we cannot dicuss topics without falling into name calling and bashing our fellow forum members we are no better than the antis who call us "gun nuts" because they cannot think of a flaw in our argument.
More and more there has been people on the board who have the idea that because another forum member disagrees with him or her that they are stupid or uninformed. We can all take that attitude but it does not help, it only weakens our arguments.
I personally think the song is weak and unimaginative, it will be forgotten in a year. But I think that of most country music. I agree with the sentiments, but I am trying to work toward forgiveness of the people who commited these atrocities.

[Pendragon]

I like the song. It makes me tremble every time I hear it - especially the part about "yes some went down like heroes in that Pensylvania field..."

Its a heart felt song by someone who probably has more love for this country than skill at song craft.

I did not like it because it was technically or artistically superior. I liked it because it churns my emotions and stokes the fires.

The past year or so, I listen mostly to country music where before I almost never did. The music is often a notch or even two below what you hear from pop, rock and alternative acts, but it resonates with me far more that other music. There are more songs about how great our country is and how great family is, etc.

Anyway, my two cents...

[4570Rick]

The song is meant to evoke memories, that is its purpose and it seems to accomplish this.
The question at the very top of this thread is “Have you forgotten?”

I have not forgotten!!!

I will never forget!!!

[Ala Dan]

Not only those brave soul's who died on 09-11; but
the 58,000 young warrior's who so gallanty gave
their lives to defend our FREEDOMS; in that terrible
place called Viet-Nam. I will forever remember those
men and women; as well as those that possibily still
remain in captivity! No offense Son, as I know you
are one helle'va warrior yourself.

REMEMBER THE POW'S/MIA'S FROM THE VIET-NAM WAR

HELL NO- I WILL NEVER FORGET ANY OF THE THESE FINE PEOPLE!


Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

[Missouri Mule]

Hell NO I have NOT forgotten, nor will I EVER forget!

I don't know who Darrel Worley is But that is one damn good song.