A CZ in 10mm?


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agtman
February 12, 2005, 09:57 AM
Interested? :) Check it out:

http://www.1911forum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107641&highlight=10

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Marcus
February 12, 2005, 11:44 AM
It sounds like it actually could,maybe,possibly happen,sometime,eventually... We can only hope!!! Build it and they will come. :) Marcus

SouthpawShootr
February 12, 2005, 02:58 PM
I'd be interested as long as the gun went for the same price or maybe a little more than the Tangfolio Witness in 10mm. If it ends up being real expensive, forget it.

agtman
February 12, 2005, 06:34 PM
"If it ends up being real expensive, forget it."


Southpaw: Although it's a bit early for speculation, if indeed CZ produces a 97B in 10mm, then it shouldn't be priced (retail) for any more than the same gun in .45acp.

And from what I've seen, the .45 97B is pretty affordable. While retail varies, dealer price is about $475-$480.

Personally, I don't think that's bad at all for what your getting: an extremely accurate and reliable big-bore autoloader.

The reputation of CZ's autoloaders generally is that they're more reliable and more nicely finished than Tanfoglio's clones, which mimic the CZ-style without CZ's attention to detail or unit-to-unit reliability (i.e., less quality control).

If Glock's large-frame models 21 (45acp) & 20 (10mm) are any indication of industry pricing, the fixed white-dot sight units are both running the same: about $480 dealer price (again, end-user retail will vary a bit from locale to locale).

But I would expect a 97B in 10mm to be priced within a few dollars, either way, of it's .45 counterpart.

Stay tuned. :cool:

Langenator
February 12, 2005, 09:14 PM
If they make it, I will buy it...

The CZ-97 has been on my 10mm Wish List for a long time, along with the Sig 220 and HK USP...

Are any of you silly European gunmakers listening?!

Kamicosmos
February 12, 2005, 09:44 PM
Are any of you silly European gunmakers listening?!

CZ has said many times they will not build a 10mm CZ.

Now that DW is involved, the rumor mill is running Overtime cranking out various speculation on what/when/how/and what color the 10mm CZWhatever will be made.

I just hope it's not another 1911 clone....

raz-0
February 13, 2005, 01:21 AM
I've been wanting a 97b in 10mm for a few years now. It's a pretty gun, and I don't havea 10mm yet. I'd snap it up in a heartbeat at anything under about $700.

gunfan
February 14, 2005, 02:16 AM
Bob Serva really want's to do this If he can get the "lady" president (and a nice one she is) to sign off on the expenditures, I can make at least two recommendations that will make this a resounding success;

a) Make it of the finest stainless steel available,

b) make absolutely certain that the barrel bushing does NOT wear out prematurely, or crack (as some of their 97B Models are wont to do!)

c) Purchase the Bren Ten name from Richard Voit of Peregrine Falcon industries so that shooters wil realize that they are obtaining the real, high quality "Bren Ten" they've always wanted!

Works for me!

Scott

C-Note
February 14, 2005, 06:23 AM
I would immediately purchase two 10mm CZs...and I don't own two of ANY firearm.

1911 TERRY
February 14, 2005, 08:38 AM
Don't want it if they only make it in stainless steel.

Grayrider
February 14, 2005, 08:56 AM
The stainless suggestion would also make me nervous as it creates an opening for DW to try and make it a "limited run" like they did the original RZ, thus charging way too much for it. I don't want a limited run. I want simply what is already out there: a quality CZ97 except in 10mm. Don't give DW any ideas they can gouge us like they did those that bought the "1 of 150" RZs. The 97 is priced right as-is. As for finish, offer the same ones as the 97. CZ does a very nice range of finishes that should offer something for everyone.

GR

raz-0
February 14, 2005, 12:32 PM
I'll second the no stainless steel. If it cost the same, I'd still buy it, but in general, I don't like it.

Personally, the point of a 97b in 10mm would be to get something that LOOKS LIKE A97B. If it looks like a rben ten, I'd avoid it like the plague.

Obiwan
February 14, 2005, 04:46 PM
Personally, I would be happy if I just saw a DW Global Hunter at my local shop

In the case with the CZ's

C-Note
May 15, 2005, 11:18 PM
Just wanted to bump this thread back to the top in case anyone at CZ/Dan Wesson is browsing the forum.

If you build it, we will buy it.

nvrquit
May 15, 2005, 11:45 PM
...I'd purchase at least two(though more than two would require a slightly longer time line).

In fact, it doesn't matter to me if the material is stainless of not. If stainless, okay, actually preferred. If carbon steel, it can always be sent to Tripp for the hard chrome treatment. One would be left in stock condition and one would be sent for a work over, trigger job, dehorned, night sights and anything else to make it just that much more.

CZ USA, if you are listening, please don't make a second mistake. The first was allowing the CZ40B to not continue production. The second would be to again turn a deaf ear to the resurgence in 10mm. This resurgence is building slow, but it is building.

BTW, in todays local IDPA match, I found some nice shinny 10mm brass, definitely from one of todays shooters.... and it wasn't from me. This just wasn't happening in previous years.

hcker2000
May 15, 2005, 11:56 PM
This would be a fun gun. Some one also needs to start on a .454 casull auto loader.

Sean Smith
May 16, 2005, 09:18 AM
I'd love one myself. :D

Langenator
May 16, 2005, 10:59 AM
I'm not currently looking to buy a new pistol, what with C&Rs and EBRs eating my gun budget, but if CZ were to announce that they'd be making on, I'd start saving my pennies.

Ditto goes for HK and Sig, but my safe is currently lacking a CZ platform, which would put them at the front of the line.

armoredman
May 16, 2005, 11:09 AM
We could only hope....that DW factory right here in the US might make things a little eaiser.... :cool:

Clean97GTI
May 16, 2005, 05:11 PM
Is the CZ97 burly enough to handle full house 10mm loads? I know springs can be changed, but will the frame and slide take the punishment?

I'd buy a 10mm CZ

Peter M. Eick
May 16, 2005, 06:49 PM
You obviously have never handled a 97b then. These guns are huge. Big, beefy, heavy and probably the best platform I have seen for the 10mm in an autoloader. I had a 97b in 45 and it was so overbuilt it was funny. I finally sold it to a buddy and he loves it.

If it had been a 10mm I would not have sold it!

George Hill
May 16, 2005, 07:21 PM
Can a CZ97B handle 10MM?
Yes.
If you put in proper spring weights, then it can handle anything.

W Turner
May 18, 2005, 02:52 PM
A CZ97 in 10mm you say?

I'd hop on one foot naked down the highway while singing " I'm a Little Teapot" to get one.....


I would like to apologize for the mental image I just created.....


W

GreenFurniture
May 18, 2005, 02:59 PM
I've been lusting after a 97 for a long time, and if they came out with it in 10mm the lust would turn to love and I'd have to get a couple.

Kalrog
May 18, 2005, 05:52 PM
I picked up my 97 yesterday and I would LOVE to pick up a conversion kit and make it a .45ACP / 10mm dual gun. Talk about being the ideal gun combo and platform for a 10mm full size.

Clean97GTI
May 18, 2005, 09:44 PM
Nope, I've never handled a 97.

Like i said, fi CZ came out with a 10mm weapon, I'd buy one.

Gary G23
May 18, 2005, 10:10 PM
I want a CZ-75 in 357sig.

TODD3465
May 19, 2005, 03:03 PM
I'd be very interested in buying at least one of them, maybe two. :)

nvrquit
May 19, 2005, 08:17 PM
Gary G23,

Try this link to Bar-Sto, where you can order a .357Sig barrel for a CZ75:

http://www.barsto.com/category_main.cfm?ID=CZP

Berg01
May 20, 2005, 09:15 AM
I'll tell you what, I think a 10mm 97B and a compact version of the 97B in 10mm or .45ACP (similar to the Witness Compact), would both go over like gangbusters. I'm definitely ready for the Compact 97B, but I'd probably rather have it in .45ACP

nvrquit
May 21, 2005, 03:22 PM
BergO1,

I'll lobby as well for your choice, sholud you do same for mine. Quid pro quo?


Besides, I'd probably like a CZ97B compact 10mm so much, that I'd have to have one in .45 ACP just for the comaprative value! :D

C-Note
July 13, 2005, 03:25 AM
Any updates from CZ/Dan Wesson?

I may just have to pick up a full-size 10mm Witness now and a 10mm CZ down the road if it ever becomes a reality. Anyone have a good source for 15-round Witness mags?

Grayrider
July 13, 2005, 10:35 AM
EAA will sell you mags for $25 each if you buy 2 or more. They should have inventory as they are stocking up in anticipation of new models arriving.

GR

C-Note
January 13, 2006, 11:22 PM
Just floating this thread back to the top. Anyone hear any news/rumors? Get on the ball CZ!

agtman
January 14, 2006, 04:19 PM
What do vampires, Joan Rivers, and the 10mm itself have in common?

Well, much like this thread, they just won't die. :D ;)

What a gift to 10mm fans this would be: just in time for the Miami Vice re-do movie this summer, CZ surprises us with the release of a high quality 10mm 97B, with fixed night sights as an option, and fed by dedicated 15-rd mags. :)

Perhaps it's time for a mass of e-mails to that 10mm-friendly guy at CZ, Bob Serva, reminding him politely to put that 10mm-97B project he's publically discussed before at the top of his "To Do in '06" list? Couldn't hurt.

:cool:

Peter M. Eick
January 14, 2006, 04:42 PM
After breaking the barrel lugs of my 45acp 97B, I think there may be engineering issues with upscaling the 97b to 10mm. My bet is that is what has stopped this in its tracks. It would be too easy otherwise.

agtman
January 14, 2006, 05:58 PM
Yeah, but if it was merely a bad run of .45 barrels, Peter, how hard would that be to correct? That might signal defective metallurgy, rather than an issue of engineering geometry.

Was the exact cause of the lug-shearing on your gun (or others) ever reliably determined?

McCall911
January 14, 2006, 06:05 PM
Bob Serva really want's to do this If he can get the "lady" president (and a nice one she is) to sign off on the expenditures, I can make at least two recommendations that will make this a resounding success;

a) Make it of the finest stainless steel available,

b) make absolutely certain that the barrel bushing does NOT wear out prematurely, or crack (as some of their 97B Models are wont to do!)

c) Purchase the Bren Ten name from Richard Voit of Peregrine Falcon industries so that shooters wil realize that they are obtaining the real, high quality "Bren Ten" they've always wanted!

Works for me!

Scott

Works for me too!

To borrow a quote from Nicole Richie from an episode of the The Simple Life: "Who have I got to <bleep!> to make this happen?"

:evil:
:D

Peter M. Eick
January 15, 2006, 08:10 AM
The barrel lug breakage was never determined reliably. In my opinion they should go to an enclosed lug like on the 75's instead of the exposed lugs like the 97b. I am not sure I am using that description well though.

Look at it pragmatically. If the lug shearing was a common problem, then they would have changed the engineering, if it was an occasional problem then they would leave it alone and accept the failure rate. Since this is what they appear to have done, I must conclude the engineering was on the ragged edge for 45 and thus would not have worked with the 10mm.

I liked my glossy 97b. Of all of the guns I have sold that is the one I wonder if I screwed up. If they brought out a 10mm 97b, that I would buy, just my 45 97b was cludged and I just could not trust it.

C-Note
March 12, 2006, 02:52 PM
Back to the top we go!

The Armalite CZ-clone thread reactivated my craving. Get on the stick, CZ!

panzermk2
March 12, 2006, 04:14 PM
BTT I need a CZ 10mm. All of my clone EAA Witness's in 10mm work great but they are ruff around the edges. The parent CZ in 10mm is a must have for me

agtman
March 12, 2006, 06:18 PM
Bumped again, ...

For 2006 CZ is offering the (formerly Dan Wesson) C-BOB 1911 in 10mm AUTO. The C-BOB, if you haven't seen one, is a commander slide atop a bobtail frame. CZ already offers a C-BOB in .45acp.

Supposedly, the 10mm C-BOB will also sport front-strap checkering, low profile Novak-type tritium sites, Greider slide stop, STI thumb safety, Ed Brown grip safety, and 4.25" match grade barrel, among other features.

Sounds great. :cool:

Gotta assume they're still at the drawing boards re-engineering the 97B to run with the 10mm. :scrutiny:

Maybe for '07? :confused:

:cool:

Curare
March 12, 2006, 06:25 PM
Would it be available with failure-prone, cast extractors?

agtman
March 13, 2006, 07:48 PM
"Would it be available with failure-prone, cast extractors?"

Are you talking about the 97B or the CZ/DW 1911s? :scrutiny:

perception
March 13, 2006, 10:35 PM
It would definetly be my first CZ. I have a LONG list of guns to buy before I think about CZ, but if they marketed a 10mm, that would jump to the top of my list immediately.

Rob1035
March 13, 2006, 11:09 PM
what's the 97B's grip like? Is it noticably larger like the full size Glock .45ACP and 10mm, or is it somewhat close to the regular CZ lineup?

trickyasafox
March 13, 2006, 11:18 PM
i can't believe this thread exists, i emailed CZ concerning a 10 mm on there 97 frame last week.

the response that they had was:

"dear mike

thanks for your interest! your not the first to request that, but at this time we have no plans for such a gun."

hartzpad
March 13, 2006, 11:49 PM
As much as I'd love a CZ-97 in 10mm, My Tanfoglio 10mm MATCH is probably better than a CZ-97 in 10mm, it shoots like a dream and was cheaper than any CZ-97.

http://images.snapfish.com/346554754%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2334%3D%3A25%3D%3A49%3DXROQDF%3E2324249828386ot1lsi

Grayrider
March 14, 2006, 09:18 AM
That is a very good point. Tanfoglio has a lot of guns in 10mm. CZ may just not see much point in trying to compete by offering a single model in the caliber. The Tanfoglios are also a lot more ergonomic than the 97. It is a bit too large for my tastes. I also wonder about durability after seeing some of the pictures of 97 failures.

GR

MachIVshooter
March 14, 2006, 10:52 PM
While I would certainly buy a 97 in 10mm if it became available, I think Grayrider has outlined a real issue with it's development. Tanfoglio has taken the 10mm and run with it. I mean really run. Currently, they offer models for every purpose, ranging in price from $300 to $1800

-Standard
-Polymer
-Compact
-P-carry
-Hunter
-Match
-Stock
-Stock Custom
-Limited
-Limited custom
-Gold Custom
-Gold Custom E

Of course, EAA doesn't import every model. But the gripes about Witness "roughness" pretty much end once you step out of the first four base models and into the $500 and up arena. The Gold Custom is a very nice pistol.

Ultimately, Tanfoglio really has the 10mm market cornered aside from Glock and 1911's.

antsi
March 15, 2006, 10:44 AM
-----quote--------------
Southpaw: Although it's a bit early for speculation, if indeed CZ produces a 97B in 10mm, then it shouldn't be priced (retail) for any more than the same gun in .45acp.

And from what I've seen, the .45 97B is pretty affordable. While retail varies, dealer price is about $475-$480.
-------------------------

I wouldn't be surprised if they are higher for the 10mm. There would be some development and retooling costs that have to be paid for, over and above their current costs of producing a 97.

agtman
March 15, 2006, 08:26 PM
Just wanted to say I agree with Grayrider, MachIVshooter and others about Tanfoglio's higher end Witness 10mm models being pretty refined for what you're paying.

The Match and the Stock are really nice looking. I've been considering the 10mm Stock gun, which I understand is a DA/SA. But what's a "Stock Custom"?

Grayrider
March 16, 2006, 09:05 AM
The Stock Custom is a double action version of the Limited. To my knowledge they have never been imported into the United States. However, one could special order or convert a Limited.

GR

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