[Monkeyleg]

Yesterday I got to shoot a CZ 85 for the first time. (Yeah, I don't get out much). The pistol felt good in my hands, shot well, but I couldn't get over the trigger. Why so much takeup before you can feel the sear beginning to engage? I kept pulling the trigger back, waiting for some resistance. It felt like an inch or more.

Can somebody 'splain this to me?

[MoNsTeR]

??? is all I can say. I've laid hands on about a dozen CZ's, all of which have had similar triggers. They all have a very normal amount of takeup, plus a heavy dose of creep. Now Berettas, there's a ridiculous amount of takeup.

[firestar]

I have only shot the CZ-40 but it has plenty of creep and is rather bad. I was told that the CZ-85 was better better because it didn't have a firing pin safty. All I can say is, if you think the CZ-85 is bad, try a CZ-40 or CZ-75!

[Mylhouse]

I have found that most of the time, the DA pull on various CZs are not too bad at all. However, the SA pull leaves something to be desired. What really buggifies me about the SA pull is that you can feel the hammer retract ever so slightly just before the shot breaks. That, and the overtravel (I think) of the trigger causes the front sight to bounce ever so slightly unless you use unreal concentration (you'll really notice this dry firing).

[PCRCCW]

I agree...relatively speaking the DA/SA triggers on CZ's are very good. You can get an adjustable trigger (the Combat already has one....) and adjust it the way you want. The only thing I really dont like about them but have gotten used to it is the camming action of the hammer just before it breaks...da and sa are the same....Firing pin blocks dont effect this..the 83's and 85's do it without the Block in place.....
I still think its a great trigger in the scheme of things...
Shoot well

[MoNsTeR]

On the contrary, I think CZ fans need to start fessing up to how bad CZ triggers are "in the grand scheme of things". SIGs, Berettas, Brownings, Walthers, and S&W autos all come from the factory with acceptably crisp SA pulls, at varying degrees of "too heavy". Plus, you've got 1911's as the gold standard. Heck, even my wife's Ruger P90 has a trigger that should embarass any CZ.

For defensive or action shooting I don't think it really matters. But for punching paper, it's a serious handicap.

[bpisler]

The D/A pull on my CZ-75B was real heavy,on the order of 14lbs.I was surprised cause my buddy's had a pull of less than 10lbs.

[PCRCCW]

Monster,
Ok...lets look.
Sig triggers by far and away...wonderful, light short and smooth being typical in my experience....da and sa.....

Beretta triggers...d/a pull is long and hard..the s/a pull stacks so bad just before breaking you gotta get used to it to stop the flyers....but some guys get used to it and love it.

Browning...s/a HP trigger is OK/SO SO until you pull the mag safety..then they get pretty good.....BDM trigger is pretty hard, a tad gritty but shorter than most other d/a pulls out there...s/a is pretty good.

Walthers triggers (PP and PPK's Ive shot) d/a triggers are an absolute joke....s/a isnt bad.

S&W d/a trigger pull can be gritty...but fairly light and med in length...s/a triggers are ok...fairly vague at times.

CZ triggers...depends on the Gun...Ill put the 83's Ive had against anything out there....smooth, short and just light enough without being overly so. PCR's almost as good....d/a pull is consistant, med pull lgth and around 9-10 lbs..s/a is less than 4 and very very smooth....just pull and they break.
My SA is very nice...the plastic trigger sucks but have a better alloy on the way....it cams the hammer back a tad and breaks cleanly at around 3-3.5 lbs.....

Ive shot these guns quite abit over the years...and I honestly think the CZ triggers are pretty damn good....

Let the fun begin....and shoot well
:evil:

[MoNsTeR]

First let me say that I generally don't care about DA triggers on autos, so that particular aspect of a gun's trigger character never enters my mind when describing it.

Beretta triggers...d/a pull is long and hard..the s/a pull stacks so bad just before breaking you gotta get used to it to stop the flyers....but some guys get used to it and love it.

Need a little clarification on terminology. Stacking is when a trigger pull gets stiffer as the trigger travels rearward. It is impossible for a crisp SA trigger to exhibit stacking, because a crisp trigger by definition has no rearward movement before the break. In light of that, I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.


Walthers triggers (PP and PPK's Ive shot) d/a triggers are an absolute joke....s/a isnt bad.

I should have specified, I was thinking of the P99, which has such an excellent out-of-the-box SA pull, if it weren't for the full-caps being $80+ I would certainly own one by now.


S&W d/a trigger pull can be gritty...but fairly light and med in length...s/a triggers are ok...fairly vague at times.

The relatively few S&W autos I've played with have had very crisp breaks, though with an unpleasant springy, clanky, gritty takeup.


CZ triggers...depends on the Gun...Ill put the 83's Ive had against anything out there....smooth, short and just light enough without being overly so.

This I'll definitely go along with, the 83's SA pull is pretty excellent, though different from most other guns. It's definitely not crisp, but it's is extraordinarily smooth and quite light.


PCR's almost as good....d/a pull is consistant, med pull lgth and around 9-10 lbs..s/a is less than 4 and very very smooth....just pull and they break.

Never got to pull the trigger on a PCR, but the P01 I handled was just about par for the CZ course (ie: creep city). I do like the shape of the P01 trigger though, I might put one in my 85C.


My SA is very nice...the plastic trigger sucks but have a better alloy on the way....it cams the hammer back a tad and breaks cleanly at around 3-3.5 lbs.....

See, you just contradicted yourself :D Hammer-camming is one of the manifestations of creep. Any trigger that cams the hammer back doesn't "break cleanly" in my book.

IMHO, crispness of break is far more important than weight of pull. My first trip out with my new BHP (minus mag. disconnect) I could print better groups than with my CZ85C. Even though the CZ has much better sights, a lighter trigger (care of a Wolff 15lb mainspring), and much more practice time invested, the Browning's crisper trigger gave it the edge. I shot one of the best groups of my life with a box-stock DW 1911, helped by its perfectly crisp, though weighty (~6lbs) pull.

My purpose isn't to badmouth the CZ. It's a great design with a lot going for it, including its now-legendary ergonomics. But I'm left scratching my head when I see its trigger praised. I've pulled the triggers on a dozen or more CZ's, with and without the firing pin block, stock and 'smithed, vintages from '91 to '02, and they all sucked. Then someone else says they've handled a bunch of 'em and they've all had glass-rod breaks. I come away from it wondering if the universe has it in for me, or if one of us is just full of it (and I know it's not me! ;)).

The bottom line though, is to use what works for you.

[Tom C.]

The d/a trigger isn't too bad, but not as good as my S&W 1006. The single action trigger is now pretty good, not as good as a really good 1911, but pretty good. Mine also has Bomar sights. Sights and trigger work courtesy of EGW. You can still see and feel the slight additional cocking motion given to the hammer, but all in all, it is pretty good now. I have had it long enough that I don't remember how it was from the box.

[PCRCCW]

Monster...clarification time...:D

Yep...stacking is stacking...pull weight increase...
Crisp trigger....has no way of letting you know its gonna break...
I/E an old smith in s/a.....perfect crisp trigger also tuned 1911
Vague to me means there isnt much "transferred feel"...even on a crisp trigger...you have a certain amount of feel to it...a vague trigger analogy would be like a 70 Ford with powersteering...you have no feel through the steering wheel..the only way you know what the car is doing/steering is by seeing what the s/wheel imput does to your direction....my 98 Dodge 4x has great feel...it tells you what its doing thru the wheel......feel.

On Beretta's its very noticeable...at least on the ones I shot alot.
s/a pull is good but stacks thru the roof just before breaking....
Anything but crisp....

P99...would love to shoot/maybe own one...but cant comment

S&W trad d/a triggers in s/a...not crisp but not bad...just vague in feel....a good vague analogy is a Glock....

CZ's do have some take up and overtravel...I dont mind a slight amount of take up...as long as its quality (smooth and light) travel...s/a pull is pretty good...my PCR, which is smithed in the trigger, has a better trigger in s/a than my SA 75..the PCR doesnt stack hardly and cams the hammer very slightly...has slight takeup and NO overtravel...
Its very "crisp" for a CZ...
***note because of the geometery used in CZ's trigger/sear/hammer design, you really cant get rid of the camming effect of the hammer without putting unsafe angles on the sear/hammer contact points...the PCR is as far as Ive seen any triggers taken and still be safe for a CCW....not the same as a Comp/Target/Range gun trigger.......
This information was passed on to me by my CZ smith....he seems to know what hes talking about.....

I understand your like for "crisp" triggers...my tuned M60 LS was a "sneeze trigger"...my buddy was staging a target and sneezed...the gun went off...thus the term was born. For a defensive gun...I prefer a little more effort be put forth to fire the gun.

CZ's IMO have very poor spring consistancy...the mains are very inconsistant just like the recoil and mag springs...some may come with lighter mains and thus helps the pull feel lighter/somewhat smoother than other similar guns...
If there was a weak point to CZ guns....CZUB needs a better/more consistant spring maker.....CZUSA thinks so also.

I agree and agree....:D :rolleyes:

Shoot well

[stretcharmstrong]

I certainly wouldn't say that the CZ triggers are the greatest in the world but when comparing with many other DA/SA designs, I think they fair quite well. Is it going to compete w/a strictly SA gun, in most cases no way. However, I feel that the SA trigger of a broken in 75B is above average overall to other DA/SA gun makers especially (but not necessarily) if you consider price into the equation. Every person is entitled to each own's opinion and if you just don't care for CZ triggers than you just don't care for CZ triggers. Many will disagree with you.

edit: The springs are FAR below par in my opinion and should be CZ's #1 priority in making improvements. Not just recoil spring, but mag springs, slide stop spring, mainspring...all of them. At any price, I think it is poor that CZ puts those junky springs in there. No excuse.

[caz223]

I have 2 Z75b's, a year apart, and one trigger is ok.
Better than ok. Its good. Not excellent, just good.
The other is rotten.
I mean really rotten.
After some break-in, I suspect it will become acceptable, but not until.
Sometime this year, prolly both will go through a full-blown action job, and replace springs with wolff springs, some plating, maybe NP3 or electroless nickel, and barrels from bar-sto, as well as some guts from a witness, like the better slide stop, aftermarket hammer, and trigger etc.
The point is CZs can be made really sweet, or they can be left alone.
But you have to admit, they shoot pretty well (As is) for the price.

[Zak Smith]

The CZ 85 has lots of take-up because it is also a DA trigger.

If you do not care about retaining the DA pull, and using it as an SA-only pistol, much of the take-up can be removed by adding a pre-travel (take-up) screw to the CZ85 trigger, or by putting in an SA-only "Champion" trigger which has the take-up screw already there.

For the SA pull, take-up serves as clearance between the transfer bar/disconnector (the bars on both sides of the mag that moves as you waggle the trigger) and the bottom front edge of the sear. If there is negative clearance, the sear will ride on the top of the transfer bar/disconnector and the sear will not operate properly.

It is possible to get a "1911"-like trigger pull on a CZ using the Champion hammer/trigger/sear, but IMO this configuration will not be safe for carry due to extremely small hammer/sear overlap.

-z

[BevrFevr]

For a combat pistol with a range trigger.

As a standard combat pistol I feel the cz trigger is excellent. For a range pistol the cz trigger is just ok. The real decision you have to make is about yourself not about the gun. What do you really want?

The cz is not a 1911 and never will be. On the flip side a 1911 is no cz and probably never will be.

As a combat pistol I have never seen or shot a 1911 that I can trust even close to as much as I trust My cz. And as far as 1911's go I've shot some good ones and some rare ones. As a range pistol I have never found a cz that has a really good 1911 trigger.

I have seen the cz compared to some pretty high dollar pistols on this thread and others. I think that testifies as to just how good that $325 dollar trigger really is.

What I have found is that I can shoot my cz better than more expensive guns with better triggers. We are talking Colts, Kimbers, Springfields, SIGS, S&W etc. Got to say I've never shot an HK thought just dry fired a few.

So I don't think us cz fans have anything to fess up. It's not perfect but I'm picky enough that none of em are. I will say it is probably one of the best blends of da/sa out there.

-bevr

[Hamonrye]

I just purchased a CZ40 today and I am very pleased. Trigger had some travel but pull was steady at 6 lbs. The other thing I loved about the gun is at 25 yards it is dead accurate. I just finished a set of brazillian rosewood grips for it and it looks fantastic. Also before shooting it I striped it, cleaned it and tetra lubed it. Smooth as silk.

Just my 2 cents

Steve