[megatronrules]

I have a S&W model 19 2 1/2 barreled revolver(its a K-frame) and was wondering what a good .357 magnum load would be? I was thinking maybe a 125gr. jhp maybe from any of the major brand makers? Also is it true that out of a snubnose gun that the .357 only has a slight advantage over the .38special? If this were the case is it even worth carrying the magnum in your opinion? Any sugesstions would be great thanks all for any input.

[1911austin]

I personally carry the 145 grain Winchester Silvertip load in all my .357s. The heavier bullets are known to be easier on the gun than some of the really hot 125 and 110 grain loads. In addition, I like a bullet with a high sectional density for better penetration. The .38 special is not a bad round in some loadings but in not in the same class as a .357 mag from any barrel length.

[Stainz]

I still carry the Remington S38R12 158gr LHPSWC .38 Special +P so-called 'FBI Load' in both my 2" 10 and 3" 65. I have chrono-ed them at 834 fps SD +/- 5 fps and 912 fps SD +/- 16 fps respectively. They shouldn't be as dangerous to your neighbors as the lite weight high speed rounds. Additionally, they have a well respected 'One Shot Stop' rating. It is a comfortable load in either revolver, not quite so comfortable in a 642 with those small boot grips. Most gun stores don't carry old 'lead' rounds nowadays. Your dealer can order them for you ~$21/50.

Stainz

[Ohen Cepel]

I like the 125gr Semi Jack Hollow Point.

[Bob79]

Try some 125 grain Remington Golden Sabers. They have less recoil than any .357 round I've tried. Out of my 4" model 66, it wasn't too much more recoil than a .38 round in that gun. For about $15, I'd surely give it a try.

And yes .357 beats any .38 round any day of the week. The velocity is reduced with a shorter barrel (approx 50 FPS less per inch shorter), but the .357 is more powerful from the get go.

[thalo]

I like the Cor-bon 140 grain JHP, with the Winchester Silvertips coming in a close second.

[WT]

I don't think a snubnose and a magnum round were made for each other. I think one sacrifices control for an increase in power. I'd rather have good control of the weapon. Good control and good hits.

That said, I keep .38 special 158 gr lead SWC+P in my snubbies. Non-hollowpoints. Since most American males are fat or obese, I want deep penetration to reach the vital internals.

[Bronco45]

357 Winchester Silvertips at 145 grains, good penetration, excellent accuracy and expansion. Easily controllable in small snubs. This is what I carry and shoot in a Ruger SP 101 at 25 ozs. Easy on the weapon. This round has been around since the mid 70s and still going strong. Price is right too!

[Magnum88C]

158-gr Hydra-Shoks. Heavy, penetrate well, Hydra-Shok is designed with a wider velocity envelope in which it will expand. I also shoot them from an SP-101.

Can't speak to the Silvertips, as I have only seen one box of them, and that was in .44 Magnum, around here.

[logical]

they may have discontinued them but I have a few boxes of Cor-Bon "Medium Velocity" .357. they are 115 grains that go out at about 1300 fps. or so (printed spec, haven't tested) . I carry them in a 3" SP-101. They are a nice compromise. I am not willing to drop all the way down to a .38 if I'm going to the trouble of carrying a heavy .357 gun.

[Krag]

Black Hills offers the .357 with a 158 gr. lead SWC. It's not a hollow point but with its large flat nose it should work well out of a snubbie. Recoil is very moderate and it is super controllable. :D

I have my doubts about how well the various JHPs expand because of the loss of velocity when fired from shorter barrels. :confused:

[MICHAEL T]

I go with the silver tips also. Round may be old but, like that dam rabbitt on TV just keeps going and going.

[1911austin]

I have my doubts about how well the various JHPs expand because of the loss of velocity when fired from shorter barrels.

Check out this tread. Another member here clocked the 145 grain silvertips at over 1240fps from a 2.5 inch K frame. Winchester claims 1290 out of a 4 inch barrel. I think it will work as designed.

[Glock19Fan]

www.doubletapammo.com

I would recommend the 158 grain Gold Dot. I think he said that the 158 grain load is pushing around 1250 FPS from a 2 1/2 inch barrel. It is definatly THE hottest .357 load out there.

IMO, of the other loads from the larger companies, I think the 145 grain Winchester Silvertip is the best combination of penitration and expansion.

[grendelbane]

It has been several years since I chronographed the W-W Silvertip, but in the last decade of the last century my S&W 13 w/4" barrel clocked in at 1375 fps, and my 6" Security-Six made 1313 fps.

Like an idiot, I never tried any through my SP-101 when I had it.

It would be my first choice if I ever went back to carrying .357 wheelguns.

Short barrelled snubbies might lose some velocity, but then they will also be used mostly at close range. Some of the JHP bullets available might actually penetrate better with the reduced velocity.

[lbmii]

From my 2-inch Rossi 357 I chronoed Federal Classic 357 mag 125-grain Jacketed Hollow point at a 12 shot average of 1145 fps. There is considerable muzzle blast with this round. I think a lot of the powder is exploding after leaving the barrel. The advertised velocity I think is 1450 from a 4 inch vented barrel.

My new carry round is Spanish made Santa Barbara 38 Special 158-grain Jacketed Soft Point that leaves my 2 inch barrel at an average velocity of 876 fps.

[tbeb]

For what it's worth, not too long ago I wrote Remington and asked them for an ammo recommendation for a .357 magnum with a 2 3/4" barrel. The representative who replied said that the .38 special+P Remington Golden Saber 125 gr. is one of their best loads for short barrel magnum revolvers. I'm okay with that, because it's for my wife and she doesn't like a lot of recoil.

When I used a snub .357, it was loaded with .357 magnum Winchester 110 gr. JHP's.

[Pistol Toter]

For magnums, I would NOT fire any 110 gr regardless of power lever in a model 19 and limited numbers or 125 gr. Stay with 140 to 158 gr loads in your K frame Smith. Reduce your power level and lighten up on the bullet weight if you wish, but again not below 125 gr. My two cents. Some will say that I'm wrong but I err on the side of caution. If you wish to fire the full bore hotttt 125's go up in frame size to an L or N or of course a Ruger GP or SP. Regards P.T.

[megatronrules]

Pistol toter please explain what you mean by not using 110 or 125gr. ammo in my 19? Is this a bullet performance issue?

[thatguy]

He may be referring to concerns over "flame-cutting" with the high performance loads with light bullets. I have not experienced this but some say they have.

BTW, I happened to be at the range today doing some testing and chronographed my top 357 load from a 2.5" Model 19 and it clocked 1571 FPS for a max. This load is on the ragged edge for the K frame IMO and I would use them very sparingly. It gets about 1700 FPS from a 5" Model 27.

[lbmii]

Today I chronoed from my 2-inch Rossi 357, Federal American Eagle 357 mag 158-grain Jacketed Soft point at a 12 shot average of 1022 fps.

Stiff recoil and muzzle blast from the 357 rounds has me now switched to higher power 158 grain 38 specials. However, I am still debating this decision.

[Glock19Fan]

lbmii- Buffalobore has some 158 grain loads that you may be interested in. According to their website, their 158 grain LSWCHP +p is pushed 1000 FPS from a 2 inch J frame .38 revolver.

I dont have any experience with it, but IIRC, a THR member tried some of this out and posted his results several weeks ago.

[DHart]

I would suggest Winchester 145 gr. Silvertips or Speer 158 gr. Gold Dots. These rounds will be kind to your forcing cone and top strap and are more likely to penetrate the possible arm or two, thick clothing, and layer after layer of fat and muscle that might stand between you and the "vitals" of your adversary. Have no concern for losing power with a 2.5" .357 barrel. I have chronographed the Win 145 gr. Silvertip load at 1241 from a S&W 2.5" .357 barrel. (It's factory rated at 1290 fps from a 4" vented barrel). For use in K & L frame Smiths and Ruger GP's, these rounds will be quite controllable.

http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Guns/M19rf_1090e.jpg

For use in J-frame and SP- frame .357 magnum revolvers, I am using handloaded:

135 gr. Gold Dot bullet over 7.0 gr. of PowerPistol = 967 fps from my 640's 2.125" barrel. The .38 spl. +P version develops about 860 fps from a 2" barrel, so this loading pumps up the energy nicely without exceeding the speed limit for this bullet. This for summer use with the 640 and SP-101.

158 gr. Gold Dot bullet over 8.0 gr. of Power Pistol = 1053 fps from the 2.125" barrel. This is definitely in the range of .357 loadings, but still somewhat moderate. This for fall, winter, spring use with the 640 and SP-101.

I plan to also test out Winchester's 145 gr. Silvertip bullet over 8.0 gr. of PowerPistol... yielding a "lite" .357 magnum load. I estimate that it will make about 1100 fps from the 2.125" barrel on my S&W 640.

http://www.legendportraits.com/Images/Guns/640_LF2677.jpg

My intent here is not to make the hottest loads available, but to make loads with low end .357 power without the heavy recoil resulting from full-house mag loads in small frame revos. These handloads are quite justifiable for defense use as they are milder than full-house magnum factory loads, which makes them more controllable and accurate for me to shoot from a small frame .357 revolver.

[Can'thavenuthingood]

I just spent the last 15 minutes staring at, no, in awe of these two photos. I now must go and find then buy a 640-1 and a 19-5 for my very own.
Your photography is superb, I suspect you could make a can of Alpo irresistible.

I'm not coveting, I'm convinced.

Vick

[WT]

Great photos!

[Kamicosmos]

I use 158 grain Mags out of my SP101. The recoil isn't as sharp as the lighter bullet loads.
I currently use S&B 158 JSP factory stuff. They say 1350 out of a 4" barrel, I have chrono'ed them at just over 1150 out of my 2 1/4 inch barrel.

I also have Federal's Premium Defense HydroShock in 125. Wow...they Hurt. Website says 1450 out of a 4". I haven't chorno'ed these yet, but they should be doing around 1300-1350 out of the shorter barrel, and it definitely feels like it!

[megatronrules]

What is this "flame cutting" I saw mentioned with the lighter weight loads out of a K-frame gun,could someone please explain it to me as I've never heard of it before? So I take it the 125gr. golden sabers I have in the gun now are a bad thing then? last thing is should i got with something in the 145gr. to 158gr. range then? Thanks so far for all the help guys on this.

[Gary A]

Megatron - flame cutting refers to the erosion of both the top strap and the forcing cone by extremely hot and high speed ejecta. The hot 125's and hot 110's are the most often blamed culprits. The Remington Golden Saber, however, is loaded to a nominal 1220 fps from a 4 inch barrel versus the 1450 nominal speed of a full power 125. The 110s are a bit more confusing to me at least. I think the culprit of flame cutting among 110's are the really high speed loads like Cor-Bon and earlier versions of same (1500 fps or more from a 4 inch barrel). I find it hard to believe that the "average" 110 loaded to 1295 fps (4 inch) would be any harder on a gun than any other load. There are those who disagree but I have never found a definitive answer regarding the moderately powered 110s. Why a 145 grain Silvertip (1295 fps nominal) would be easier on a revolver than a 110 grain Winchester White Box (1295 fps) is lost on me. The 125's I can understand.

[megatronrules]

Thanks for the explanation gary i guess the goldensabers are ok to use then as i wanted to practice with them and don't want to damage my gun. I personally woulden't use a 110gr. load for a .357 but thats just me. I'am going to try some 145 gr. loads like the silver tip or even the 158gr. gold dots maybe even the hydra shocks in 145gr. or 158gr. variety.

[ddc]

Not a .357 but what about the new .38 Gold Dot 135 +P?

The marketing spin is that it was developed specifically for snubbies.

I have no experience with it but would like to hear from anybody who has.

Here is a link to one review I found: http://www.thegunzone.com/speer135jhp38sp.html

[megatronrules]

Thanks ddc but I figure if I'am going to tote a 2 1/2in. K-frame I'am gonna carry magnums in her,but those gold dots will be very nice for my either of my two colt cobras :) thanks again for reminding me of them.

[DHart]

Vick and WT... thank you. I'm glad you appreciate the photos and might be inspired to acquire a cool new gun or two from seeing them. I get inspired to buy guns when I see other cool pics of them myself. Enjoy the fun, you guys!