Showing CCW to LEO's


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76240
March 23, 2005, 10:18 AM
While in New Mexico I rolled through a speed trap early one morning. I handed over DL and proof of Ins. I was not carrying so did not present CCW permit. The Officer did his thing in the car and return with my donation form for the State. He asked about the CCW permit and I informed that I was not carrying and we all went on our way. The question is; acceptable way to inform LEO of your carry status that does not ramp up their anxiety levels?

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Ukraine Train
March 23, 2005, 10:42 AM
I've been pulled over twice since getting my permit, not carrying either time. When asked for license I handed my CCW with it and said, "This is my CCW permit but I'm not carrying right now." I'd rather he found out at that point rather than when he runs my license in his car and can't see what I'm doing in my car.

SkyDaver
March 23, 2005, 10:43 AM
Here in NC, we're required to inform an LEO if we're carrying. What was suggested in my class, and what I've always done, is to tell the officer "I have a permit for a concealed handgun, and I'm carrying"

Get the word 'permit' in there first.

Sergeant Sabre
March 23, 2005, 10:44 AM
I've had to identify that fact three times to law officers. I always say "I'm legally obligated to notify you that I have a CPL and I'm carrying a pistol".

I would never, ever, ever, ever, say the words "gun", or "weapon". I just think that "pistol" sounds more benign.

Gunpacker
March 23, 2005, 10:46 AM
It is for certain that the LEO will find out that you have a carry permit when checking your license. My opinion is that it is best to state it immediately, and tell the officer of your carry situation. He is going to ramp up more if he suspects that you are trying to hide anything. Seems simple to say, "I have a concealed permit and I am carrying (or not carrying)" as the case may be. Let the officer be aware for his own peace of mind, and he won't have reason to be PO'ed. I have a friend that discovered to his chagrin that he was required to notify the officer in NC. Evidently he forgot or something.

akviper
March 23, 2005, 10:51 AM
What Ukraine Train said. Most dispatchers will tell the officer that you have a ccw as soon as they run your license. My state requires that you inform the officer if you are carrying only. It saves a little anxiety and time if you inform the officer up front when you are not.

Werewolf
March 23, 2005, 10:53 AM
It is for certain that the LEO will find out that you have a carry permit when checking your license

That depends on the state. In OK currently our CCW is not tied to our DL's and if stopped the officer will not know you have one. We are required to inform the officer that we have a CCW only if we are actually carrying at the time of the stop and/or official encounter.

That's all going to change soon as the posession of the CCW will go into what ever database LEO's pull up on a traffic stop and they will be informed. Supposed to happen soon or early next year (HECK might even be in effect now). In any event the law was changed last year and it's supposed to take effect this year.

thatguy
March 23, 2005, 10:55 AM
I did not know until recdently that having a carry permit shows up on W&W search. This is bad if it makes the cop nervous about you, but good in that it's better they find out that way than to happen to spot the gun and freak out. I would hope that cops would realize that permit holders are almost zero risk for violence.

Many states require by law that you inform a LEO. I think's a good idea whether you are packing or not at the moment. I want to do as little as possible to irritate or make the officer nervous.

I have been stopped while carrying and I simply handed over the permit along with other docs. He glanced at it and gave me a warning for going 10 over.

George S.
March 23, 2005, 10:59 AM
I don't beleive that all states have the ability to match CCW records to a drivers' license. In WA, you only have to present your CHL to an officer if you are carrying and he asks if you have a permit. You are not legally required to offer the information up front.

Although WA CHL's are issued at the city or county level, the database is administered by the WA Department of Licensing who also manages the driver's license database. There is no current direct link between the two. An LEO has to check the validity of a CHL as a separate request.

psyopspec
March 23, 2005, 11:10 AM
I've just handed my CHL over with my license. Return hands to the wheel and don't do anything else until asked.

George, North Dakota doesn't have such a link either. Not sure why though.

I rolled through a speed trap early one morning.

I love that term, "speed trap." As if your local officers sat scheming at Krispy Kreme to change the speed limits around places where it's easy to tuck a cruiser out of sight. It wasn't a speed trap my friend; you were speeding, you got caught. No entrapment of any kind involved.

answerguy
March 23, 2005, 11:14 AM
I would never, ever, ever, ever, say the words "gun", or "weapon". I just think that "pistol" sounds more benign.

If you want to use a benign word use 'sidearm' instead.

For those who want to go in the opposite direction try
'killing stick'. :p

txgho1911
March 23, 2005, 11:26 AM
My last stop for forgetting to pay up the ourageous property tax levied on vehicles as they refer to it as excise tax. I go to dig for non exsitent current registration so I then inform that I am moving my sidearm as I look for my papers.
Another note for Tx as one travels and with the states laws allowing for travelers to carry within a vehicle. I do not know if individuals who carry this way who do not have the TX chl are required to disclose. Again if circumstances call for digging around or under the sidearm I would definitely disclose.

20cows
March 23, 2005, 11:33 AM
Here, the LEO has already run his check and knows you have a permit before he approaches the car. You are required by law to show your permit right along with your DL, even if they don't ask at traffic stop, carrying or not.

Several years ago I was in a minor one-car accident on an interstate highway and a DPS trooper was on the scene almost immediately. I was not carrying at the time. I gave him my DL when he asked for it and after just a few seconds informed him I had a CHL, was not carrying and handed it to him. He looked at me and smiled and said," I was wondering when you were going to show me that." I am confident by his demeanor that he would not have been anxious had I been armed.

Now any time I am pulled over, I remain seated, hands on the wheel, with both liscenses in hand ready to turn them over. The few times this has occurred, the officer asked if I was carrying and when I said yes, he asked where. I would inform him where the weapon was and from that point on the weapon was a non-issue in our exchange. I ALWAYS pass the attitude test.

answerguy
March 23, 2005, 11:41 AM
20cows,

So in Texas the CHL info is connected to your vehicle registration?
That wouldn't seem to do them much good when you are driving someone elses car.

Shovelhead
March 23, 2005, 11:49 AM
In Virginia, I have been told that when they run your tag number, the LEO will get an indication on their In-Cruiser computer screen showing that the registered owner has a CHP.

cidirkona
March 23, 2005, 11:56 AM
We're not required to inform them unless they ask. If they ever ask for my ID / Driver's Licence, I just hand the card to them at the same time -- and I prefer the term "Glock"

I've only been pulled over twice, both times while carrying. The first time I left my hands on the wheel with my driver's licence and permit in one hand, registration and insurance in the other. He asked me to get out hands out the window and he took my gun and my knife. He put them in the trunk when the traffic stop was over.

The second time, I handed him my DL / permit, and he said "oh" and didn't think anything of it -- just let me keep my pistol, even though we were in a questionable part of town.

-Colin

ps :D For those who want to go in the opposite direction try 'killing stick'. I'll try that one out next time...

76240
March 23, 2005, 12:05 PM
Psyopspec
RE "speed trap" You are right it was not a trap per se, he was doing his job, & I was speeding...but first time in the area, speed change at the bottom of a steep grade around a curve, and at 0230 hrs. It was unexpected. No excuse, just the facts. I appreciate the points of view. :)

sturmruger
March 23, 2005, 12:15 PM
I carry whenever I am in the state of MN. While I am not required to disclose my carry status to an officer I usually volunteer the information by handing them my permit with my DL. If I were you I would make it a habit of always letting the officer know about your carry status. The last two times I have been pulled over for not going the posted speed limit I was given a written warning and told to slow it down. The one officer's atitude changed 180 degrees after I handed him my permit. Most officers know we are the good guys and tend to go a little easier on us permit holders.

keyhole
March 23, 2005, 12:30 PM
I was stopped on I-44 in OK a couple of weeks ago, for BS, ( as I reckon they were shopping for a reason). anyways, the trooper asks what I do, as he's writing out a warning. Told him I was a deputy, and had started in law enforcement on a local PD in '85. He asks if I'm carrying, and I tell him yes. He asks, "Now?", again yes, and asks, "On you, NOW?". again in the affirmative. He gets upset, mostly because he doesn't know how he missed it, ( HELLO, it's called concealed carry!). Anyway, I don't usually give up when stopped, unless they wanted to search me, as I do not want someone who is already nervous to prone me out on the highway, and be covered.
No matter, in the end, he let me go, telling me that if stopped again, I am to tell them right off that I am carrying. Seem to remember something about LEO's having the authority to carry anywhere across the US now..........
:banghead:
Anyway, I;ve been stopped before, and never had any problem, nor asked if I carried. I reckon that if I stop someone, and find out that they are a LEO, I reckon that they are carrying. Really makes no difference, as you should always figure that the person is armed, until they are searched. Not a problem as I figure, as the ones that obey the law, are the least of my worries. :D

Mark13
March 23, 2005, 12:58 PM
We don't have this requirement in Fl, but if we did, I wouldn't mind complying. But its like all those other pointless weapons laws we all comply with. Maybe they should pass a law requiring gun-carrying non-CCW holders to notify the officer during a traffic stop. Now that would be an effective law. What are our legislators thinking?

SMLE
March 23, 2005, 01:22 PM
I handed over DL and proof of Ins. I was not carrying so did not present CCW permit. He asked about the CCW permitSo you did not mention you had a CHL, but the Officer came back and asked you about it? If that was the case, he obviously had some way of finding out you had a CHL. Was it an NM State Police Officer or a local Officer? From your discription, his reaction was pretty mellow, as is typical of all the NM Cops I have encountered.

20cows
March 23, 2005, 01:40 PM
The CHL's are issued by the DPS, the same folks that just pulled you over if your on a highway, so sure, the info is tied to your DL, car tags and such. If you are driving someone else's car, he will quicky notice your DL does not match the one that came up when looked up the car tags. You will have committed an offense if you do not present the CHL with your DL. Trust me, when he gets a DL he didn't expect, you'll be asked to wait while he checks out your liscense number.

Remember to ALWAYS pass the attitude test.

MikeIsaj
March 23, 2005, 01:41 PM
Lots of people quoting the law in their state to justify their non-action. What happened to good manners and common sense? Do you really need a law to tell you it's good manners and wise to tell an Officer you are armed?

Put yourself in his/her place. They are stopping a car with an unknown occupant(s). They are tactically at a position of disadvantage and it's not unknown for LEO to be assaulted in this situation. You are worrying about ramping up the situation? I've got news for you, IT'S ALREADY TENSE! You tell the officer as a courtesy that you have a permit and are armed. Now if back up approaches from the other side of the car and sees the gun on your hip, they don't yell gun, they don't draw on you, you don't get drug out of the car and handcuffed. You don't spend any time face down on the asphalt. And all of this is justified and legal if you concealed the fact from the officer.

Telling most LEO will ramp the situation down. Having a permit to carry is a signal to the officer that you are probably a good guy and may even get you a warning. It's a tough job, give 'em a break!

AZLibertarian
March 23, 2005, 02:50 PM
I've never been stopped, but have taken an enlarged copy of both my driver's license and CCW permit. I keep this over my head on the clip over my visor. Should I be pulled over, I won't make any moves to my wallet or glovebox, but just to the visor. Once he is aware of who I am, I'll then take his direction as to how he'd like me to retrieve my driver's license, CCW, and registration.

Tom Servo
March 23, 2005, 03:50 PM
What Mikelsaj said. In Georgia, there's no database, and no obligation to inform. However, if I didn't inform and the officer found out later, it come come off as rude, and trust me, officers get enough of that already.

I have my documentation ready when he gets to the window. I keep both hands on the wheel and say, "Woo-hah! I'm packin' serious heat^H^H^H^My sidearm's on my right hip. Let me know how you want to proceed."

Every time but one, they've never even asked to see it. On one occasion, the officer asked to hold the weapon until he'd run my ID. No big deal. I've been repeatedly sent away with a warning to "slow it down," even though I wouldn't have argued the ticket.

Required or not, it's good form to go ahead and disclose, and it often generates alot of good will.

Standing Wolf
March 23, 2005, 05:48 PM
If I'm ever pulled over, I'll be carrying, since I don't drive inside my house.

I'm not obliged to inform a law enforcement officer I'm carrying in Colorado, but I imagine I would: it doesn't cost extra, and only the Denver police might feel inclined toward getting uppity about it.

Norm357
March 23, 2005, 05:49 PM
76240, How did a NM cop know that you had a CCW from Tennesee? This would not show up on his system.

TechBrute
March 23, 2005, 06:03 PM
20cows and answerguy,

In TX, your CHL is tied to your DL, not your car. It is possible for them to run the registration on your car, crosscheck for a possible matching DL, and then know, but it's somewhat Rube Goldberg since the info is actually only tied to your DL.

76240
March 24, 2005, 04:24 PM
Norm357
I was in a rental car. His system found it somehow. I did not ask.

answerguy
March 24, 2005, 06:09 PM
76240,
I was in a rental car. His system found it somehow. I did not ask.

That's one of those " I got to see it to believe it" things.

Any LEOs have an insight on this one?

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