"Dummy" Soldier Saves Lives In Iraq


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David
March 30, 2005, 05:38 PM
This sounds like a great idea.

A company that makes law enforcement training dummies has donated a realistic looking dummy to the US troops in Iraq.

They dressed the dummy as a US soldier so that it draws enemy sniper fire.

Then "real" US troops are able to determine the origin of the enemy sniper fire, and take "real" action!

:D :scrutiny: :D

Has this tactic of using a "dummy" soldier to draw enemy gunfire ever been used before in any other war?

(I read about this in a friend's LEO magazine.)

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DigMe
March 30, 2005, 11:40 PM
Most definitely. In World War I some of the soldiers (maybe it was the French?) had a paper mache dummy head made up that even smoked (with help from a tube) and they'd stick it up above the trench line and see if anyone took a shot.

brad cook

Number 6
March 31, 2005, 12:28 AM
In World War I some of the soldiers (maybe it was the French?) had a paper mache dummy head made up that even smoked (with help from a tube) and they'd stick it up above the trench line and see if anyone took a shot.

It was the British, and if you have ever seen videos of their dummy heads they look remarkably real.

VARifleman
March 31, 2005, 12:32 AM
While they are novels, they are based on real events: read War of the Rats and Enemy at the Gates and you'll find out that it's a very common trick. They used helmets on a stick in those.

SMLE
March 31, 2005, 01:18 AM
Look for a book called "Sniping in France" by a Major H. Hesketh-Pritchard. He goes into some detail about the use of dummy heads to bait German snipers. They went to great pains to make the dummies as life like as possible.

http://www.fylde.demon.co.uk/reviewsniping.htm

Crosshair
March 31, 2005, 02:32 AM
Note to self: When picking off enemy troops, don't shoot at the guy that stands straight up and stands there like a gopher. Relay that position to the mortar team. :neener:

This is actualy a tactic that I have used in BF1942 Desert Combat. Send a guy out in the open, then wait for him to be sniped. Sure his kill count goes up quickly, but there is nothing as satisfying as figuring out where he is and sending a TOW Missile through his scope. :cool:

Joejojoba111
March 31, 2005, 12:54 PM
One problems with baiting WW1 snipers would be that they aren't usually going to be concealed. Often as soon as lines stabilized they would bring up great steel sheets with loopholes cut in them and snipe from armored positions. The Germans had the advantage because they had more better trained snipers with an older support network behind them, as well as mass production of armor-piercing bullets, and their rifles had optics mounted above the barrel, while British optics were mounted offset to the left - making shooting through a small hole almost impossible! Furthermore you could camoflage the entire position quite quickly to make it appear part of a sandbad wall or whatnot, and if they enclosed the area behind the steel plate with blankets or some such then it was darkened sniping room, hard to spot, deadly to try to spot.

Essentially you didn't need to test, you knew snipers were watching, and more often than not the head that peeked up for a look at no-mans land was a new replacement who couldn't resist.

IIRC only the Brits (minus Canadian) used offset scopes, because the generals insisted snipers would need to be able to maintain a high rof just in case they had to repel advancing hordes all alone.

TechBrute
March 31, 2005, 01:02 PM
Why use a fake? I've got a list of anti-american weenies that could volunteer for the job as a way of protesting the war. :evil:

svtruth
March 31, 2005, 01:21 PM
Sticking your hat up on a stick was a staple in the cowboy shows of my youth.

Bear Gulch
March 31, 2005, 01:25 PM
VArifleman hit it. You find that these stories indicate that they work in detecting "younger" snipers. The more experienced sniper is more apt to figure the trick out. Which may actually be why he is an "older" sniper.

Joejojoba111
March 31, 2005, 01:59 PM
There's a good photo of WWII Marine snipers using the helmet-on-stick trick, also gives a good view of the tools they worked with, that's one clumbsy scope.

Bear Gulch
March 31, 2005, 08:29 PM
The Ruskies used a 4 power on the 91-30 MN rifle. It was mounted so high, it looks like you'd set you chin on the stock for proper cheek to stock weld.

Joejojoba111
April 1, 2005, 12:11 AM
Lol, crazy stuff.

Warbow
April 1, 2005, 12:33 AM
Helmet on a stick in Iraq:

http://home.comcast.net/~werbwerb/iraq_sniper_decoy.jpg

This was published last year sometime -- I think by the AP. I don't remember exactly, just that it was somewhere in Iraq.

medmo
April 1, 2005, 01:46 AM
The ol'e helmet on the stick act as shown in this photo works great.... until you draw an RPG round to your position.

yorec
April 1, 2005, 02:56 AM
...until you draw an RPG round to your position. :what:

Yikes - that why he's lying on the ground and reaching up as far as he can - to get the dummy/target away form him? Wouldn't make much difference if the RPG gets through the window...

Joejojoba111
April 1, 2005, 12:07 PM
The thing is that new large calibre rifles are being marketed as anti-sniper as well as anti-materiel. The Russian models especially only use standard military HMG ammunition, and lack great accuracy. Thus the large rifles are designed to shoot through walls, and those particular bricks in that particular wall wouldn't stop a small calibre rifle round!

...And then when you get into their man-portable thermobaric launchers...

TheDutchman
April 1, 2005, 01:29 PM
I am the Master Sniper in Desert Combat and the dummies i use are my teammates

Rockstar
April 1, 2005, 01:50 PM
Electing a dummy as Sheriff of Fulton County, GA recently resulted in the murder of four innocent citizens.

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