Funky shootout in Pasadena


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HI express
April 7, 2005, 10:15 AM
The other day in Pasadena, California, I was talking to one of the officers in the PD Helicopter Service when they got a call out on shots fired.

On the news a little later, turned out there was a car filled with suspected gang bangers cruising the neighborhood. Undercover officers followed the suspects car. They didn't even get a chance to light up the suspect car when the car stopped and several BGs stepped out and fired at the undercover car. The undercover officers returned fire and a full on shoootout was in progress.

The area where the BGs stopped is about 10 blocks from the police station so the cavalry arrived shortly and cordoned off the area. The police rounded up six suspects. Several were found hiding in some bushes...no firearms yet, but I heard that a lot of shots were exchanged.

Yikes. I know a few years back a lot of the beat cops carried Sigs...not sure what caliber. :what:

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sturmruger
April 7, 2005, 11:30 AM
Wow that sounds like something out of a movie! If you see any news articles please post.

Andrew Rothman
April 7, 2005, 02:36 PM
I loves me my Google.

http://www.sgvtribune.com/Stories/0,1413,205~12220~2802849,00.html

Police, suspect trade fire

Four men arrested following shooting in residential area

By Marshall Allen, Staff Writer

PASADENA -- Four alleged gang members were arrested after one of them exchanged gunfire with undercover police officers following a high-speed chase through neighborhood streets, authorities said Wednesday.

No one was hurt in the volley of shots, which occurred at about 8:45 p.m. Tuesday at the intersection of Buckeye Street and Madison Avenue, behind Madison Elementary School. The school is now on spring break.

The preliminary investigation into the incident showed the officers fired 22 shots between them, police said Wednesday. The gun fired by the suspect was not recovered.

It's fortunate that no officers, suspects or residents were hit by gunfire, said Lt. Randell Taylor of the Pasadena Police Department's detectives section. "When you have shootings like this in a residential neighborhood, where there's homes all around, clearly the possibility for somebody getting hurt is just immense," Taylor said.

Two of the suspects were arrested within an hour of the incident. The alleged gunman is Angel Martinez, 23, of Altadena, police said. The second suspect was identified as Rogelio Quezada, 28, of Pasadena.

The two other men, David Lopez Jr., 19, and Jorge Alpuche, 23, both of Pasadena, were arrested at about 10 a.m. Wednesday after an extensive manhunt, police said.

All four were booked on suspicion of attempted homicide of a police officer and are being held without bail at the Pasadena jail, police said. Martinez is also being held on a parole violation.

The incident started at about 8:40 p.m. when undercover and uniformed police officers were involved in a gang-suppression operation, Taylor said.

The two officers involved in the shooting were at the Argentina Market at 1272 Villa St., where they saw several gang members, he said.

The officers were watching the market when a gold Chevy Impala came "flying out of the parking lot at a high rate of speed," Taylor said.

The car, which had four male occupants, drove erratically west on Villa Street, he said. The officers gave chase in an undercover car, a Toyota sedan. The cars were speeding westbound on Buckeye Street when the Impala came to an abrupt halt after passing through the Madison Avenue intersection, Taylor said. The Toyota stopped a short distance behind it.

The driver, allegedly Martinez, stepped out of the car, opened the trunk and pulled out a handgun, Taylor said. The suspect then walked to the street corner about 30-35 yards from the officers and started firing, Taylor said. The officers jumped from the car, identified themselves and fired back, police said.

One round hit the windshield of the car and others hit nearby buildings, including the Cornerstone Cottage, a building adjacent to the elementary school that provides resources for families.

The gunman ran north on Madison Avenue. The officers did not chase him but heard one more shot after he ran away, Taylor said.

The other three suspects ran east and north through yards. A manhunt began and resulted in the arrest of the three other suspects, Taylor said.

The streets near the incident were blocked off until about 10 a.m. Wednesday, when the investigation was complete.

Resident Roger Sanchez, who was walking down the street the morning after the shooting, lives about a block away from the shooting. He said his mother-in-law heard the gunshots. The neighborhood is not known for gang activity and the shooting had people concerned, Sanchez said.

"I hope it's safe for us to walk," said Sanchez, whose family does not own a car. "We have a daughter who's 4 years old."

According to an employee from Argentina Market, anti-police graffiti was spray-painted on the side of the building sometime after the store closed at 8 p.m. Tuesday night. The graffiti was removed Wednesday morning.

Taylor said the graffiti shows the conflict between the city's gang members and the police. The department takes a proactive approach to gang enforcement, which includes things like parole searches and Tuesday's gang-suppression operation.

"We don't tolerate gang-banging in our city," Taylor said. "We have zero tolerance for it."

-- Marshall Allen can be reached at (626) 578-6300, Ext. 4461, or by e-mail at marshall.allen@sgvn.com

Andrew Rothman
April 7, 2005, 02:42 PM
The preliminary investigation into the incident showed the officers fired 22 shots between them, police said Wednesday.

...

It's fortunate that no officers, suspects or residents were hit by gunfire, said Lt. Randell Taylor

Um, two things occur to me.

1. Twenty-two shots, no hits?
2. Why exactly is it fortunate that no suspects were hit by gunfire? Isn't that kind of the point in shooting at bad guys?

I imagine that the reporter took a little more liberty with paraphrasing than he should have. No cop could really be that, um, clueless?

Bear Gulch
April 7, 2005, 02:54 PM
Further proof that spray and pray doesn't work!

WilderBill
April 7, 2005, 03:30 PM
OK, I guess that proves that the local PD firearms training its every bit as effective as 'hold it sideways and just keep pulling the trigger.'
It is fortunate for the officers ...and the suspects that no one was hit.
Ya gotta wonder just where all those shots did go. :scrutiny:
When you have to shot, no matter who you are, there are two things to think about;
1. hitting your target
2. not hitting someone else
Looks like all involved failed on both counts.

q102josh
April 7, 2005, 03:57 PM
wow california's usurpation of law-abiding citizens' second ammendment rights really showed those thugs

Joejojoba111
April 7, 2005, 04:45 PM
People mock the old volley-fire warfare, but really we should appreciate just how impressive it was. There are even lessons that could be converted to game theory.

A redcoat would have hit with a musket, and with a modern weapon they would have hit more than once.

Hardtarget
April 7, 2005, 05:44 PM
What I see is when we're involved in a "shoot" we might thinking more about not getting shot than actually shooting our attacker. That may not enhance our chances of surviving the attack. I've never been shot at, so I probably won't do any better. Wonder how we can really practice for this?
Mark.

surr
April 7, 2005, 05:55 PM
poor light. Under fire, you will probably fire just as fast as you can, so learn what you can and can't hit at such speeds. If you are fast enough, you may get a shot or two at a stationary target. If you are too slow, you for sure going to have to hit either a mover or the head of a cover user.

scout26
April 7, 2005, 06:41 PM
Hardtarget said,
Wonder how we can really practice for this?

Ever try paintball ??? A little imagination (and the right safety gear) and you could come up with some realistic scenario's.....and losing is somewhat painful.

No_Brakes23
April 7, 2005, 07:30 PM
I just went P-balling for the first time 3 weeks ago. While it is somewhat tactical, (You learn about cover real quick.) it isn't a great simulation for the casual player. A lot of guns have sights that are a joke, and they shoot all over the place. A couple of the guys had Full Auto Tippmann A-5s, (The MP-5 of the paintball world,) and those were pretty accurate.

We played PAINball instead, where you don't call yourself out until it hurts too much. Not realistic, but a much easier learning curve.

Lots of fun...

ajkurp
April 7, 2005, 08:29 PM
Doubting Thomas, but is there any physical evidence that the banger punks had or fired a weapon? There is just too much police malfeasance in this USA for me to immediately buy their version without reservation or physical evidence.

Yea, my flame suit is on.

Standing Wolf
April 7, 2005, 09:23 PM
"We don't tolerate gang-banging in our city," Taylor said. "We have zero tolerance for it."

Wow. Settles that, I guess.

MN_Strelok
April 7, 2005, 09:24 PM
Call me Doubting Thomas, but is there any physical evidence that the banger punks had or fired a weapon? There is just too much police malfeasance in this USA for me to immediately buy their version without reservation or physical evidence.

So your theory is the cops fired 22 rounds at four unarmed persons - hitting none - then let them run away to be arrested later? You're gonna have to do better than that if you want to compete with some of the other conspiracy theories posted here. :D

Returning to the topic...

What I see is when we're involved in a "shoot" we might thinking more about not getting shot than actually shooting our attacker. That may not enhance our chances of surviving the attack. I've never been shot at, so I probably won't do any better. Wonder how we can really practice for this?

How available are Simunitions to the general public? And what kind of cost is involved? I've skimmed their website, but couldn't spot any answers...

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