Help reinstate Minnesota's MPPA
Havegunjoe
April 13, 2005, 11:51 AM
A "fix-it" bill is being intorduced today, 4-13. No number assigned yet. Call Rep. Steve Sviggum - 651-296-2273 and Senator Dean Johnson - 651-296-3826 and tell them to pass the "MPPA Fix-It Bill".
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Brian Dale
April 13, 2005, 12:18 PM
I work in Minnesota but live in Wisconsin. Is there any provision in the new bill for non-resident permits?
dmallind
April 13, 2005, 12:23 PM
No HB sorry there isn't - MN BCA website states only residents can apply for MN permits under old/current law and no reciprocity accepted any more.
EDIT - sorry I think you may be asking about the new bill introduced today now I re-read your post. However I'll let the above stand just in case anyone wants to know about the current law.
I have no knowledge yet of the details of the new proposed bill.
Brian Dale
April 13, 2005, 12:31 PM
Thanks; I'll do some broader research. :)
Big_R
April 13, 2005, 12:59 PM
That's actually a little disheartening. I was hoping the injunction would be overturned, but it was upheld by an appeals court. I'm sure it's headed to the supreme court, but this tells me the legislators are pretty sure the CCW law will be stricken down, bummer.
Unfortunately, this thing barely made it through the Senate last time, I think the chances are less likely now.
Ryan
dmallind
April 13, 2005, 01:20 PM
Well big R I don't want to be polyannaish here but I'm a bit more optimistic in the long term at least (I will be extremely surprised if we can get anything doen this session).
The advantage is that we have a couple years worth of no problems caused by shall-issue. We have a few more states that have gone that way with the same results. We have precedent on what parts of the bill cause legal problems and where challenges will come from. Sure the senate committees will be an obstacle but there are other ways to get floor votes and other bills which could be more challenge-resistant to attach MPPA II to even if a single issue bill stalls completely.
Lobotomy Boy has already posted one vote which may very well have changed and this from a suburban DFLer. I think with the evidence we have and with another concerted push from gunowners (who will be even more energized than in 03 - people get more annoyed at something which is taken away than something which they don't have) we'll at least get a slightly different shall issue law passed.
Yes halvey is right - it will probably cost more for permits. It will probably allow more private property restrictions like parking lost. It will probably allow more varied forms of posting or banning guns. It may have more restrictions on public places or alcohol consumption. Those are all losses, but they are minor losses comared to the central issue which is the ability to carry per se.
patent
April 13, 2005, 01:39 PM
Yes halvey is right - it will probably cost more for permits. It will probably allow more private property restrictions like parking lost. It will probably allow more varied forms of posting or banning guns. It may have more restrictions on public places or alcohol consumption. Those are all losses, but they are minor losses comared to the central issue which is the ability to carry per se.
I agree, calls made.
patent
April 13, 2005, 01:49 PM
P.S., I also contacted my rep and my senator. You can find phone numbers for them here: Senate: http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/members/info/alpha.htm#header
House: http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/members/housemembers.asp
ralphie98
April 13, 2005, 11:31 PM
While we're in the mood to contact our reps, it looks like there is a bill in committee right now for a MN state AWB. Click here for the bill (http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/bills/billnum.asp?Billnumber=HF2271&Go.x=14&Go.y=10&Go=Search&ls_year=84&session_number=0&session_year=2005) If that doesn't work, go to http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/ and in the left hand frame, search for HF2271
I will be contacting my elected officials tomorrow
ckyllo
April 14, 2005, 07:21 AM
HF2271 wow
a aw ban a 50bmg ban and a fn five seven ban all rolled up into one. :what: i think a big fear is that some metrocrats may try to strike a deal and yeah we will pass the MPPA but HF2271 would have to be attached to it. :barf: I hope this steaming pile of :cuss: dies in committee,time to re call my rep.
halvey
April 14, 2005, 07:55 AM
Yeah, didn't Washington state get a carry law, but a 15 day waiting period for a handgun purchase or something like that?
You know what I like about that bill? Basic shotguns and rifles are now 'assault weapons', so the deer hunters and duck hunters can finally get off their as$es and help out for once.
halvey
April 14, 2005, 09:07 AM
http://www.startribune.com/stories/563/5346803-2.html
Safer without the law
As a graduate student in public health, I was relieved to read in the April 13 Star Tribune that the Minnesota Appeals Court upheld a district court ruling to throw out the conceal and carry law.
In public health, our mission is to prevent illness, injury and death. This mission encompasses preventing injury and death from firearms. Current research by M.R. Rosengart and others report that shall-issue permit laws such as the one passed here in 2003 do not decrease the risk of homicides in our communities and may actually increase the risk. Minnesota is a safer place because of this ruling.
Penny Sinner, Minneapolis.
-------------------------------------
My response. I hope they print it, I just had a letter published last week on an unrelated issue.
“Safer With the Law”
Penny Sinner is asking everyone to believe Minnesota is a safer place because the courts deemed the carry law unconstitutional. Yet history tells us differently.
There are now 25,000 permit holders in Minnesota, yet where are the shootouts as they predicted? Where is the increase in crime? Actually, crime decreased since the law went into affect.
How can you say the man who thwarted the carjacking or the man who confronted an intruder is now safer? There are two examples of lives saved because of the carry law, something a medical professional should welcome.
Andrew Rothman
April 14, 2005, 10:47 AM
From Joel Rosenberg's blog. He's a guy to listen to. (Grammatically, he's a guy to whom you should listen, but that just sounds funny!)
http://www.livejournal.com/users/joelrosenberg/
We have a bill...
...in the Senate -- which is going to be the tough nut to crack -- it's SF2221, written by Pat Pariseau. The only change is on posting; it changes the "reasonable request" from proper posting AND an individual notification to an OR.
We have enough votes to pass it on the floor; the problem is going to be getting it to the floor. You can help.
What to do?
1. Call your State Senator; say that you want SF2221, "the MCPPA FixIt bill", passed this session. You'll find his or her phone number here (http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/members/info/alpha.htm#header). Call him or her even if you think you know what his or her position is. Call again, even if you called yesterday.
Say something like, "I'm one of Senator XXX's constituents, and I very much want the Senator's support for SF 2221, the MCPPA FixIt Bill, which needs a floor vote this session."
* If the assistant waffles -- they may or may not; depends -- ask that the Senator or an aide call you back with a commitment to vote both for the bill and on all procedural votes. Add "Even if the Senator doesn't support the bill, I hope he/she will agree that it deserves an open and honest vote."
* If you get a positive answer add, "I hope that the Senator will speak with Senator Johnson on this," whether or not the Senator is a DFLer or Republican.
2. Email me with your results, or post them here. Name of senator, time of call, what was said. Don't be afraid to keep this short; I'll understand.
3. Call Dean Johnson, the DFL Majority leader, at (651) 296-3826. Say something like "While I'm not one of Senator Johnson's constituents, he is the Majority Leader, and I want him to know that it's important that he help bring SF 2221, the MCPPA FixIt Bill, to the floor for a vote this session."
4. Email me (joelrosenberg[at}gtmail.com) with your results there, too.
As always: be polite, but firm. Don't yell or argue, but if there's any waffling, do politely insist that you're entitled to a commitment -- "the Senator needs to be on the record, what with elections coming up next fall." Phone calls are best; faxes are great; emails aren't nearly as good.
Go to it, please. Now will be fine. If you get the answering machine, leave your name, number and a brief message in support of SF 2221, the MCPPA Fixit Bill.
halvey
April 14, 2005, 10:54 AM
And from CCRN:
Speaker Sviggum still needs to hear from your today. He indicated that
repassage "was not a priority" and that is not an acceptable answer.
We have put in front of the house leasdership several ideas on making
repassage as simple and low key as possible. We don't feel this needs to
be a big stink either. WE have earned this and it derserves to more
that "Not a priority".
Call Steve Sviggum - 651-296-2273
Call him today and tell him that telling his supporter that they are
"not a priority" is not a very smart thing to do.
Also. one of the chief staff people in the house is a fellow named Greg
Pepin. Greg is very smart and has a lot of influence.
Call Greg at 651-296-5508.
BigRedBowtie
April 14, 2005, 11:29 AM
I called the office of my senator, Chris Gerlach, and was informed that he has "signed on" to the bill, and will be supporting it at all levels.
BlackCat
April 14, 2005, 03:34 PM
I e-mailed my Representative and Senator. I hope they listen to me, after all, I did help get them into office.
doberman
April 14, 2005, 04:56 PM
I would really like to call my district Senator (Sharon Marko (DFL) District 57).
To be honest I really don't know what to say??
Please excuse me for not being a very good speaker. :(
Help?
dmallind
April 14, 2005, 05:17 PM
How about keeping it simple - just read this to them after you get "hello can I help you":
"I'd like to give some constituent input on a pending bill. Am I speaking to the right person?"
Either you get a yes or you'll be transferred to someone who is the right person, or more likely a voicemail.
"Hi I'd like to read from my notes to make sure I cover what I need to say. I am a constituent of Senator Marko and I'd like to ask for her support for the quick passage of SF2221 - the MCPPA Fixit Bill. The shall-issue permits have made Minnesota safer and none of the bad things predicted two years ago have happened. I'd like the Senator to support this bill and even if she cannot do that, I at least hope she'll allow the democratic process to work as intended and work to allow a speedy floor vote on this bill this session. Thanks for listening and I'd welcome any response to (insert your phone number and/or email here)"
Edit as you see fit but seems to cover the basics.
doberman
April 14, 2005, 05:55 PM
Done!! I feel better now!! :)
Andrew Rothman
April 14, 2005, 06:12 PM
BlackCat, please CALL YOUR REPS on the telephone. It's really true that...
Phone calls are best; faxes are great; emails aren't nearly as good.
Please call.
patent
April 14, 2005, 06:24 PM
My rep was nice enough to respond to my inquiry. He indicated that the bill didn't make the deadlines, and while it could be heard, its not likely.
He said that the first deadline for bills was April 5th for policy committees. The
next deadline was for Finance committees which was April 12th. It
missed both of them. It could be heard by rules committee and have the
deadline waived but it may be too short for that as well.
All things are possible, but it sounds like its an uphill battle to get it heard.
patent
dmallind
April 14, 2005, 06:41 PM
Nice you heard back and no great surprise. While it's possible to waive the rules this bill won't have the consensus support to do that most likely so we'll have to make all these calls again next session unless SC takes and rapidly decides the case (which is also unlikely but hey)
Andrew Rothman
April 14, 2005, 06:58 PM
He said that the first deadline for bills was April 5th for policy committees. The next deadline was for Finance committees which was April 12th. It missed both of them. It could be heard by rules committee and have the deadline waived but it may be too short for that as well.
The deadlines are arbitrary and may be (and often are) exceeded.
Keep pushing.
Captain Ron
April 14, 2005, 07:45 PM
Lets not give up before we get started
Captain Ron
April 14, 2005, 10:01 PM
It appears we have votes lets keep the pressure on don't give up yet http://www.livejournal.com/users/joelrosenberg/
halvey
April 15, 2005, 11:50 AM
According to Joel's Live Journal, Dean Johnson is saying he's for it now!
Interesting. After the law was a success, now the anti's only argument will be "it was attached to an unreleated bill."
Andrew Rothman
April 24, 2005, 10:10 PM
(As I said in Genenral Gun Discussions, but it's worth repeating:)
If you're on The High Road, and in Minnesota, and you haven't PHONED your representative, your senator, and Sen. Johnson, YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM!
Faxes are okay too. Emails, though easiest, are the least effective.
If you don't know who they are, go here, and type your address to find the names and numbers.
http://geo.commissions.leg.state.mn.us/districts/start.html
And if you haven't made the calls in a week or so, it's time to make them again!
As always, Joel Rosenberg's blog has all the latest:
http://www.livejournal.com/userpic/11301520/2175413
http://www.livejournal.com/users/joelrosenberg/ (http://www.livejournal.com/users/joelrosenberg/)
Byron Quick
April 24, 2005, 11:28 PM
I hope y'all's CCW organization is not just working with the legislature to ensure CCW. The sheriffs who have been refusing to sign off on permits under the old discretionary statute...need to be targeted and defeated. Their noses need to be rubbed in exactly why they are searching for a new job. Any of them who ever try to run for any office in Minnesota need face organized opposition from all gun owners.
The parties have pretty much realized that gun control is a loser's platform plank on the national level. It's time to teach that to them on the state, county, and local levels, too. Never pass up the chance to toss sand into the gears of an anti politician's machine.
They can be taught. Here in Georgia, a Democratic sheriff just signed my ATF forms for me to get a suppressor.
The church groups that protested the law...any Minnesotan gun owners members of one of the churches? Organize, get more gun owners to join your church, and then fire the pastor and replace the deacons.
One thing these critters understand and don't care for is being without a ticket at the public trough. Taking away their ticket will change the minds of their fellow travelers faster than any amount of debate.
halvey
April 25, 2005, 08:01 AM
From CCRN-----
GOCRA Members and CCRN Supporters
This message has several items of importance
MCPPA Re-passage 1st Hearing
The MCPPA will have its first re-passage hearing on Wednesday April
27th at 9AM in the basement hearing room of the State Office Building.
The Committee is Civil Law
Please take a minute to e-mail the Republicans on the committee
requesting their support. The Dems on this committee are all Metrocrats. If
you are a constituent of any of these representatives be sure to let
them know and request a written reply. If you call - the area code is
651.
Chair: Jeff Johnson (R) 296-5511 rep.jeff.johnson@house.mn
Vice Chair: Chris DeLaForest (R) 296-4231
rep.chris.delaforest@house.mn
Laura Brod (R) 296-4229 rep.laura.brod@house.mn
Matt Dean (R) 296-3018 rep.matt.dean@house.mn
Tom Emmer (R) 296-4336 rep.tom.emmer@house.mn
Peter Nelson (R) 296-5377 rep.peter.nelson@house.mn
Torrey Westrom (R) 296-4929 rep.torrey.westrom@house.mn
Lead-DFL: Nora Slawik (DFL) 296-7807 rep.nora.slawik@house.mn
Keith Ellison (DFL) 296-8659 rep.keith.ellison@house.mn
Bill Hilty (DFL) 296-4308 rep.bill.hilty@house.mn
John Lesch (DFL) 296-4224 rep.john.lesch@house.mn
Steve Simon (DFL) 296-9889 rep.steve.simon@house.mn
CCRN leadership wants to encourage you to come to the hearing. Bring
or wear an American flag to indicate your support for re-passage. We
will also have “It’s About Liberty” bumper stickers for you outside the
hearing room.
Remember – Victory goes to those who show
up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Armored Fire Shooting Range
Armored Fire Shooting range has a new owner - John Munson. John also
owns Bills Gun Shop and Range and has been a breath of fresh air. He
has a strong customer service ethic and has really improved Bill’s. We
expect he will do the same for Armored Fire. Stop in and take a few
shots.
Minnesota Gun Rights Rally
Make Saturday May 7th on your calendar and join us at the Capitol for
the Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance rally. We will rally in support or
re-passage of the Minnesota Citizens Personal Protection Act and Range
Protection.
If your Gun Club, Shooting Range or Game Preserve wants to set up a
table – please reply to this message. We will get you a table and provide
set-up information.
I would expect that their will be hundreds of permit holders carrying
at the Capitol without incident or issue. What a wonderful lesson for
those who just don’t get it! If you decide to carry be sure to make the
proper notification (http://www.mnccrn.org/ccrn_old/ccrn.html).
Once again – Victory goes to those who show up.
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