"Happy slapping"


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Alex45ACP
April 28, 2005, 08:29 PM
'Happy Slapping' Craze Worries British Officials
WCAU-TV

Cell phones with cameras are all the rage these days. In fact, you may very well have one yourself.

But now there's a disturbing new trend emerging with the way some teens overseas are using these phones to videotape themselves slapping innocent bystanders.

The pictures may be a little fuzzy, but the pain is real in a disturbing and bizarre violent craze that's gripping many British teenagers.

"Happy slapping is essentially a violent crime caught on camera," says Andrew Buckingham, from a victim support group.

Indications that "happy-slapping" may be spreading. British transport police investigating 200 incidents in the last six months.

Most, they say, go unreported.

And because more teenagers are using phones with video capacity, and more can use phones to videotape their victims.

The attackers then upload the video straight from the phone and onto the web, where there are dozens of images of slap-hapless victims.

"They want to capture the immediate effect, the immediate reactions of the victims of crime, the shock, the surprise," Buckingham says.

Authorities say the craze was born in the club music scene, before catching on in school playgrounds.

Police were hoping to capture teens on closed circuit tv as they do other violent criminals, but the offenders are using public spaces, public transportation, like London's famed double-decker buses.

Now with half of 7 to 16 year olds owning phones, parents and authorities are hoping the new craze stops before the violence evolves into something even worse.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/7668074/

The UK has roving bands of criminals going around attacking innocent people at random, and they also have very strict gun control. Coincidence? I think not.

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boofus
April 28, 2005, 08:35 PM
Those idiots were considering banning picture phones as a remedy to happy slapping.

Only in Europe can thugs brazenly assault people in broad daylight and take photographic evidence of their commission of the crime and get away with relative impunity. Coming soon to America if the self defense banners have their way.

Sactown
April 28, 2005, 08:36 PM
I think too many people are taking Charlie Murphy's Hollywood Stories too seriously. Everyone is trying to be like Rick James, but there's only one Rick James. What did the 5 fingers say to the face?...SLAP!

Seriously though, these ID10ts try this in the US, someone's gonna get double tapped.

Alex45ACP
April 28, 2005, 08:40 PM
Definitely. If this happens to me I will shoot first and deal with the legal proceedings later. I remember a few years ago people were doing this in LA and DC, but for some reason I have the feeling this fad won't be coming to Florida :D

Stevie-Ray
April 28, 2005, 08:42 PM
Sounds like a good reason to cuff some punk across the chops and put him on his butt. It probably won't go over here too well, because of just that.

rick_reno
April 28, 2005, 08:48 PM
Happy slapping should be followed by Happy Drawing of Weapon.

Texian Pistolero
April 28, 2005, 08:52 PM
It would be some time before this dweeb would slap anybody else,

with two broken forearms.

one-shot-one
April 28, 2005, 09:15 PM
say it; so i'm not to sure shooting someone for a slap, unless they are much larger than yourself will go over to well.
that said because of work i am "downtown" often without a firearm so the happy slapper better be able to out run me or i'll set on them, grab their ears and pound their head into the sidewalk untill they are no longer a threat or the cops show up.

Alex45ACP
April 28, 2005, 09:19 PM
I think it's perfectly morally justifiable to shoot someone(s) who is attacking you to death. I know I wouldn't feel a shred of remorse. That would put a quick end to this nonsense :fire: Unfortunately, morality and legality are not always the same thing :(

one-shot-one
April 28, 2005, 09:32 PM
have you ever had a 250lb. guy set on your chest and slam the back of your head into the concrete? it don't take long to make it look like you where hit with a .45! and it will probably be easier to defend in court.

Texian Pistolero
April 28, 2005, 09:36 PM
As an alternative exploration of reality,

perhaps the cell phone might be crammed,

(Efficiently, of course)

in their rectal orifice?

Farnham
April 28, 2005, 10:28 PM
Give 'em a hug, the poor misguided lambs...

A 260 pound, fence post hauling, hay bale heaving, shovel running, wood cutting hug...

Least, that's what I'd do. For the children, after all. ;)

And if that don't work, give 'em a busted jaw, I hear idiots are best taught with negative reinforcement.

S/F

Farnham

Legionnaire
April 28, 2005, 11:07 PM
Happy slap, meet leather slap.

zahc
April 29, 2005, 12:05 AM
I hear idiots are best taught with negative reinforcement.

Negative reinforcement is the removal of an aversive stimulus to reward a behavior.

CleverName
April 29, 2005, 12:20 AM
Exactly what I'm thinking. Negative reenforcement means taking away something that's unplesant.

Farnham, I think you mean positive punishment. It's not just some hippy PC term, it means when somebody does something bad you punish them.

Cosmoline
April 29, 2005, 12:29 AM
No need to shoot them. Just take their cell phone away and bring it to the police. Then press charges for felony assault and bring a lawsuit.

We had a paintball incident in Anchorage a few years back where the shooters videotaped the whole thing. The only reason they didn't get shot is because they targeted drunk natives. Even so they were pushing it. If I saw someone appear to shoot a man in a driveby, complete with what appeared to be red blood coming out of them, I'd kill everyone in the car.

Missourigunner
April 29, 2005, 07:24 AM
"Mr Happy Slap, Meet Mr PR 24"

Seawolf
April 29, 2005, 07:56 AM
If you feel justified in drawing your weapon after being slapped in the face, you really need to re-examine whether or not you should be carrying a firearm.

Alex45ACP
April 29, 2005, 07:57 AM
^ Look up some of these videos. These people are not simply being "slapped in the face". Many times they are attacked by a large group of individuals and kicked etc.

Jacobus Rex
April 29, 2005, 08:08 AM
I think the primary problem here is that you wouldn't know that it was a "happy slap" thing. You are just minding your business and say 1 to 6 people attack you. You've got no way of knowing it is "just a slap". Somebody will get shot if idiots try this much in the US.

foghornl
April 29, 2005, 08:25 AM
"Mr Happy Slap, Meet Mr PR 24"

Mr. Happy Slap, meet:

Messrs. Smith & Wesson

Messrs. Sturm, Ruger & Company

Mr. Dan Wesson

Mr. "Raging Bull" Taurus

Ms. Lady Smith

Mr. Colt Trooper

I'm sure we can find many others to play along. . .

spartacus2002
April 29, 2005, 08:38 AM
"Tonight: Happy Slapping immediately followed by Happy Hydrashocking. Film at 11pm"

spartacus2002
April 29, 2005, 08:39 AM
Look up some of these videos. These people are not simply being "slapped in the face". Many times they are attacked by a large group of individuals and kicked etc.


Agreed; it's more than a light slap to the face. I saw one long video on Arfcom that was beating after beating -- some mild, but still a beating.

DarkKnight01
April 29, 2005, 09:14 AM
He would first have to be fast enough to land the slap... (ive been a martial artist for nearly 20 years.. im pretty quick) After landing the punk on his back side, Id kindly smash his phone on the cement... then give him a swift kick in the face as I go about my business... Maybe toss In a comment something to the effect of... "something your daddy shoulda done a long time ago"

mwithers72
April 29, 2005, 09:48 AM
I saw that report on the news. The thing of it is that the people dont know what is going on. the slapper as i saw it would walk up from behind or other direction while the prospect is being distracted by the one with the phone. So just remember that and if your awareness is like it should be you should be able to avoid it completely.


A 260 pound, fence post hauling, hay bale heaving, shovel running, wood cutting hug...

Farnham... I dont think that they would target someone of your size anyway ;) It would make there videos have the impact it might if the person beat the crap out of them. I would love to see one try to slap you.. I would bring the popcorn and my pa-pa's lether razor strap. That always hurt :evil:

Sistema1927
April 29, 2005, 09:56 AM
One of the reasons why these punks can get away with this is due to the fact that there are too many victims who wander thru life without situational awareness.

I doubt that they pull this on anyone who is situationally aware, and who looks prepared to defend themselves.

LiquidTension
April 29, 2005, 12:36 PM
Even if they do pull it on someone that is aware, I doubt the video would ever make it to the web. Funny how that works, eh? That would be something to see though....

Alex45ACP
April 29, 2005, 12:40 PM
Good point on being aware. From now on if I see any kids walking around with video cameras/camera phones I'll steer clear of the area :cool:

CAPTAIN MIKE
April 29, 2005, 01:15 PM
Lethal force in the face of an unarmed slap is not appropriate. No need to get all macho about this stupid trend. It is a simple Assaut & Battery and should be responded to appropriately.

A citizen's arrest on the spot, a response in like kind, or taking appropriate information down for a police arrest are all appropriate to the situation.

Correia
April 29, 2005, 03:39 PM
I was slapped once. So it does happen, even to big, intimidating looking guys.

I was young. If I recall correctly I was probably about fifteen or sixteen. Some thug wannabe came up and slapped me. No reason. I don't know, trying to look tough or something. Beats me.

But even as a teenager, I was probably around 250, and hoisting cows every day after school. :p I hit him. It was just an instant surprise kind of thing. And the funny thing was that I hit him open handed, just like he hit me. The slap was heard across the room. It put him down. He bounced off the ground, with a great big imprint on his face. Tears streaming out of his eyes, crying for his mommy, he scurried off. I hit him so hard my hand stung for days.

Man, that brings back memories. I never did find out what that was about either. :)

MudPuppy
April 29, 2005, 08:01 PM
With limited information available, I should refrain from commenting, but...I am the mudpuppy, so here goes...

If it was a single person that randomly just slapped you, then blowing a big hole in them is going to create a big problem for you. Your life was not in danger--or so it will likely appear to the jury. Or heck, maybe you do get off. And your lawyer has 50k of your money--yay.

Or, as it likely appears, there's a plenty of them its much more of a slap and you are in fear of your life and you feel you have to get to shooting--and then you get to go through what Bernard Goetz (NY subway mugging "victim").

Doesn't sound like much fun either way. Regardless, I don't much see that fad taking off in stats with CCW permits.

Faithless
April 29, 2005, 08:04 PM
You know when you've been tango'd.

boofus
April 29, 2005, 09:03 PM
In many cases it isn't a 'slap'. There is a video of one of these beatings, the perp clocked the victim upside the head with a balled up fist. After he went down he beat him with a skateboard, all the while people were recording the video.

If someone smashing you with a wheeled 2x4 while you are lying on your side is not reason enough to smoke him, then nothing is.

trickyasafox
April 29, 2005, 09:14 PM
i agree this isnt happy slapping its gang beating. that being said, i really doubt it will catch on in here stateside. im suprised by a lot of these reactions (from videos) i think if someone was slapped it would go over like a fart in church and an all out fist fight would ensue. where im from slapping is far more degrading then punching, and will definatly warrent a pretty quick response. would i shoot someone for just a slap? definately not. but i'd do my darndest to put a whoopin on him. not gonna say ill win em all, but i doubt its worth finding out which one you are for 5 seconds of cell phone parody :p

Hardtarget
April 29, 2005, 09:56 PM
No doubt...these punks will NOT slap the 260 pounder...they'll walk on till they come upon a meek victim. They want to victimize, not be beaten into the pavement, so they'll pick and choose carefully. I'm 55 with grey hair but I'm six feet tall.but there are much bigger teenagers. I'll do my best to watch for this.They will not like my reaction 'cause I don't like being hit!
Mark.

DRZinn
April 30, 2005, 12:25 AM
"Tonight: Happy Slapping immediately followed by Happy Hydrashocking. Film at 11pm"Very rarely do I laugh out loud - but that did it!

No_Brakes23
April 30, 2005, 12:31 AM
That was pretty common practice among my circle of friends in the Corps. Just, juvenile BS male posturing. :D
<edit> I should clarify, it was Jarheads slapping other Jarheads within the same circle of friends, not a bunch of idiot Marines attacking civilians. It was mutual, and no one cried if they caught a beating from it, (I pestered one of my friends for a month until I caught the painful end of a closed hand.) It stopped for awhile, and then the Rick James skit got the whole ball rolling again. It was stupid, but it sure didn't involve anyone outside the group.

On the street it merits a beat down, fo sho.

Are electric cattle prods illegal in Britain?

cracked butt
April 30, 2005, 12:37 AM
I noticed a distinct lack of 300 lb bikers and truck drivers being slapped in those photos.

It seems that the Europeans are way ahead of Americans in other interesting uses of cell phones. I just read an article in a magazine (Maxim maybe?) that Europeans use their phones to troll for anonomous sex partners in public places.

CGofMP
April 30, 2005, 12:48 AM
Tonight: Happy Slapping immediately followed by UNhappy OC-spray-induced crying. Film at 11pm

A bullet for this is way overboard in my opinion.

Chrontius
April 30, 2005, 01:04 AM
Those idiots were considering banning picture phones as a remedy to happy slapping.

Only in Europe can thugs brazenly assault people in broad daylight and take photographic evidence of their commission of the crime and get away with relative impunity. Coming soon to America if the self defense banners have their way.

Boofus, you've not been to a public high school lately, have you?

A few years ago, they were doing that with Polaroids. And passing them around. Unfortunately, they knew judo and I didn't at the time.

What's my point? This isn't new, and it may get Britons interested in protecting themselves. Sure as hell worked on me.

Byron Quick
April 30, 2005, 07:24 AM
I doubt that they pull this on anyone who is situationally aware, and who looks prepared to defend themselves.

There are British people who fit this description? I though they were all waiting for the police to arrive?


There's slaps and then there are other slaps, folks. I know a man who in his younger days was in a lot of fights. I've seen people get up after taking his punch...everyone he slapped spun 180 degrees, fell on their face, and stayed there.

Shoot someone for slappng me? Yeah, I would. I'm a big guy and have trained for years in unarmed combat. But I'lve had three concussions already and the effects of concussion are cumulative, i.e., the more concussions you sustaing the worse the complications get. I've got an open laminectomy from vertebra C5 in my neck down to T4, the verterbra about the level of the bottom of your shoulder blades. So I'm missing about 1/3 of seven vertabra.
I have no desire to find out if those vertabra can withstand a blow to my head without dislocating. I had a stroke in 2004 which affects my balance. I don't believe that I could engage someone succssfully in unarmed combat...I'd fall on my butt and then probably get stomped.

So I will quite complacently shoot someone who is trying to slap me not only someone who has. And I'll take my medical records and my neurosurgeon's testimony to court with me to present to the jury.

The self defense law authorizes the use of force if a reasonable man would have fear of his life or of grave bodily injury. Given my medical status; I have fear of sustaining grave bodily injury from a vigorous slap That it could be a teenager slapping me does not move me at all. If someone assaults me...anyone, anywhere...and I can draw a firearm...then I will shoot them until they decide to stop assaulting me. We'll let the courts decide. That's not going to do my teenaged assailant a lot of good, though. The integrity of my spinal column means more to me than some punk's life. Imagine that.

spartacus2002
April 30, 2005, 07:32 AM
A bullet for this is way overboard in my opinion.

And how do you know the difference between a happyslapping and a good old-fashioned asswhupping?

Answer: YOU DON'T. You don't know if you will get smacked once or 10 times. And it is too much to ask someone to keep standing there waiting for the next blow NOT to fall.

Brett Bellmore
April 30, 2005, 09:33 AM
Try that with me, and you'd better keep "slapping" until you finish the job, or when I get back up I'll do my damnedest to "happy larnyx dislocate" you. And claim I was just aiming for your chin, and missed...

Spartacus is right; Wait until you see whether they're going to KEEP beating on you, and you're going to be in a world of trouble if it's just an old fashioned "assault". If somebody lands a blow on you without warning or provocation, you're entitled to assume that they'll keep it up unless you stop them.

p35
April 30, 2005, 02:20 PM
Once, in high school, I was sitting around a table with some friends when some kid I didn't even know came up from behind and dope-slapped me. I got up, turned, and said "What the hell are you doing?" He immediately started apologizing profusely, saying he thought I was someone else. I let it go at that- honest mistake and no harm done.

Point is, an immediate violent reaction would have led to a lot of unnecessary trouble for all concerned. Same goes for all the talk here about going for a gun- IMHO there's something to be said for giving the other guy one chance to back away before getting violent. Trouble most often comes to those who are looking for it.

SolaScriptura139
April 30, 2005, 06:15 PM
"Happy slapping is essentially a violent crime caught on camera," says Andrew Buckingham, from a victim support group.

They have a victim support group for this? I know this is a unexcusable crime, but are there people being traumatized by this?

But then again, this just reminds me of the fish slapping Ninevites from Jonah: a Veggietales movie :D

LooseGrouper
April 30, 2005, 07:10 PM
If it happened to be a few punk jr high kids, I think I'd prefer an ASP to something that goes boom.

Or maybe an ax handle. Like Clint said, "there's nothin' like a good piece of hickory."

On the other hand, if it's a bunch of older high-school age kids, they're pretty much indestinguishable from adults. They'd definately be risking perforation.

Monkeyleg
May 1, 2005, 12:22 AM
Lots of replies from people in good health here.

I watched the videos. And they're not harmless and fun like the "Slap Hillary" online game. These are assaults, pure and simple.

For people with even short-term medical problems, a "mere" slap to the face can result in bleeding that can be fatal. Didn't realize this until this week.

It's ironic that the public reaction to punks assaulting innocents is about the same as the reaction to the kid bringing a burrito to school.

[crotchey old voice]In my day, we would have eaten the burrito, and beaten the punk. [/crotchety old voice]

XLMiguel
May 1, 2005, 09:15 PM
My wife would qualify (two brain tumors, three surgeries) in terms of fragility, and as a target, since she is slow and 'in the way'. Some dweebster on a skateboard almost knocked her over going into Tyson's Galleria (skating prohibited there, BTW) a while back. Dum***** was stupid enough to tell her to watch where she's going :eek:

I decked him, broke his board in half, and told him I'd be back to stomp him and his buddies to tomato paste after I reported them to mall security. Funny thing, no one could be found minutes later. 'Mall security', of course, is an oxymoron, its members being regular morons.

Byron Quick
May 4, 2005, 04:37 AM
Trouble most often comes for those who are looking for it.

Sorry, you taught the guy who slapped you that it was acceptable behavior to slap people without even being sure of target identification. I hope that was not your intent.

I don't excuse that type of behavior. My answer to that idiot who slapped you would have been,"Well, I'm the right person now."

Sorry, but I've suffered injuries that lingered for years from physical assaults. If I get a chance to retaliate...I retaliate. If they're looking for trouble...I hope I'll be able to give them a hearty helping...I'll certainly be trying. I've done pretty well so far...none of the people I've fought have come back for a second serving except for one...and he brought a friend the second time. His friend hasn't ever come back.

mtnbkr
May 4, 2005, 07:44 AM
I decked him, broke his board in half, and told him I'd be back to stomp him and his buddies to tomato paste after I reported them to mall security. Funny thing, no one could be found minutes later. 'Mall security', of course, is an oxymoron, its members being regular morons.

You're my new hero. :D

Chris

ckyllo
May 4, 2005, 09:15 AM
if I was attacked by a happy slapper, the situation could get ugly and shooting could be a clean shoot. now if I never drew my firearm during the slapping, it is possible that if knocked to ground and kicked the firearm could be exposed and taken from me and used against me. now in mn an articulated(sp) threat ( being attacked by a group ) is justable to draw a weapon (not to shoot). now even not shooting a 2 pound handgun hurts when you smack someone up side the head with it, pistol whipping is out dated but still works. now if the slapper looses all common sense and advances to the handgun, does not run away. could one be reasionable that the only intent is that the slapper is trying to disarm me? someone trying to disarm me I can only assume that they are trying to get the firearm and use it on me? now I is impossible to say that I would shoot since that would not be decided by me but the attacker.

but things could get out of control in a hurry.

crt360
May 4, 2005, 08:17 PM
I got popped pretty good once when I was in college. I was leaving a party with my date, walking to the car, and some guy comes up behind me with a casual greeting ("what's up?" or something similar). Thinking it was someone I knew, I turned around and immediately caught a loaded fist to the face. After spinning my head back around and preparing to fight him, I heard someone from the group he was running (like a chicken) back to yell "that's the wrong guy, I know him." I was a smaller, but much fitter 230 back then and even with a few busted teeth, lip, and cut up face, I would have severely beaten his ass. I still remember the huge adrenalin rush and how fast the whole event took place. It would have really gotten exciting if I'd had a handgun, because I'm pretty sure legal consequences had temporarily vacated my mind. It made me even madder to find out I was targeted by mistake. If anything good came out of this, it is that I have become extremely aware of those around me at all times.

When a stranger surprises you by knocking you silly, you will not hesitate and respond in a reasonable, thought out manner. If you do, you were not surprised or hit hard enough. Instinct will take over and what you have conditioned yourself to do will try to happen. I have no doubt that some of you would put a few rounds through Mr. Slappy, before you even realized what was happening and others might make a really good face for his camera.

Sharps Shooter
May 4, 2005, 09:31 PM
crt360, I fear you're right. I'm afraid if this moronic fad catches on over here, someone is going to get shot and that will give the antis one more thing to whine about. I'll bet the fad would be brought to a quick halt though.

XLMiguel
May 4, 2005, 10:19 PM
I've embarrased myself by popping a couple of [sort of] undeserving folks because 'reflexes got the better of me' when they grabbed me from behind. :what: At least I was able to pull my punch (more or less). I've had a couple of bad experiences, so I tend to react rather than think about it, and I'm still here.

Shame on me, I didn't hear them coming. OTOH, they all know better now. :evil:

p35
May 4, 2005, 10:48 PM
Byron-

When I was in high school, everyone had already learned that it was a seriously bad idea to strike someone else without provocation. That's why the guy started apologizing so quickly- he knew he was about to get smacked down. I don't think actually smacking him would have taught him anything he didn't already know.

I respect your different perspective on it- in fact, some of the guys I was with at the time said that they would have punched the kid. Young men engage in horseplay all the time, as someone else observed about their Marine Corps time. Why get into a full-on fight where (as I said originally) no harm was done and the doofus apologized at once?

dustind
May 5, 2005, 03:06 AM
I hate to be a knuckle dragging mouth breather, but I would shoot if it was legal to do so.

In Britain I am not sure what I would do for self defense. Other than carry the best weapons that I legally could or improvise something, and be aware of my surroundings.

Ridge
May 5, 2005, 07:19 AM
I was smoking outside during a dance,when a guy walked up next to me,I figured he was just going to lightup or something,then when I turned to ask him if he needed a light the guy belted me in the mouth,My head hit against the wall,then I came back up with a treat of my own,and knocked him on his ass,then I followed him to the ground,a bounced his head off the pavement,when I turned to walk away I noticed he was trying to push himself back up I then decided to rush back and planted my right foot firmly under his chin,and left him outside,I then propmtly left the dance with a split lower lip.

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