[DontBurnMyFlag]

My buddy bought a mossberg 12 gauge legally from a gun show. I saw him with my own eyes, I was right there. A few months later he wanted to sell it, so I decided to buy it off him, but said I couldnt take it home until I got my FID. So now I got my FID, I payed my buddy the money, and now I am in the process of buying his mossberg. I gave him the money, he will give me the gun once we get this all legal.

He is from PA, and I am from NJ. Is there any paperwork I have to fill out? Neither states register shotguns, and while it was basically illegal for him to sell me the rifle because I wasnt a PA resident, is there anything else I need to do? Any help would be appreciated

[slaphappy]

What's a FID? And a PA resident can't sell a gun to a non PA resident? How the hell do you people in commie states not accidentally break the law all the time?

[DontBurnMyFlag]

a FID stands for Firearms purchaser ID card. Basically saying that I am of sound state of mind and that I can legally purchase firearms in NJ. Im not allowed to purchase any weapon off of a PA resident unless it goes through a gun shop. However, no one would ever know because we dont register long arms in NJ....yet :cuss: But anyway, yea, its hard living in a state that wont let you have an AK... :mad:

[itgoesboom]

Slaphappy, (BTW, is that in refrence to the happy slapping fad going on in the UK?)

Peer-to-peer sales are only legal when both parties live in the same state. Doesn't matter what state. I live in Oregon, and can buy or sell to/from a private party in Oregon, but I can't cross the state lines and purchase a firearm from a private party....but I can go across state lines and buy a rifle or shotgun from an FFL, but not a pistol.

Has nothing to do with "free states"....it's federal law.

Don't burn my flag....

So you just admitted to a Federal Firearms Felony on a public web forum :banghead:

I.G.B.

[mrhuckins]

As a non-LEO, I absolve him of any wrongdoing in this matter. Please continue on about your business citizens. Nothing to see here, keep moving.....

[SIOP]

it was basically illegal for him to sell me the rifle because I wasnt a PA resident,

Not only was it illegal for him to sell it to you, it was illegal for YOU to accept possession. Both of you violated the Gun Control Act. If I were you I'd find an FFL to do the paperwork and make it legal.

[armoredman]

Bub, I work in a prison - you DON'T want to live here! get it back, get it legal, and do it right, or do some time, with NO chance of ever owning a firearm legally again! Then get the heck out of NJ and move back into the United States!!

[MikeIsaj]

This is an easily avoided problem in Pa. The private sale is legal as long as the transfer is documented. You go to the local gun shop and ask them to do the paperwork for you for a reasonable fee. Next time you buy ammo, remember Dicks or Walmart won't do this for you. Or you can go to the county courthouse and the Sheriffs office will do this for you. This is an easy and instant process because in the free commonwealth of Pa., you don't need government permission to buy a weapon.

[SIOP]

Or you can go to the county courthouse and the Sheriffs office will do this for you.

Federal law requires that this deal, because it is an interstate firearms transfer, be accomplished through a licensed dealer. Private interstate transfers are illegal. I don't understand how going to the courthouse or the sheriff's office is going somehow make an illegal interstate firearms transfer legal. It's a federal law, now a state statute.

[MikeIsaj]

In Pa. the Sheriff can do the instacheck and the paperwork for the transfer, but now that I think about it I am not sure if the interstate nature of the sale is allowed in this manner.

[slaphappy]

Slaphappy, (BTW, is that in refrence to the happy slapping fad going on in the UK?)

LOL, no. I have been using this handle for quite a while on other boards. I'm not sure where I got it from. I did notice that though ;)

[Tory]

"I payed [sic] my buddy the money, and now I have his mossberg. He is from PA, and I am from NJ. ... while it was basically illegal for him to sell me the rifle [sic = "12 gauge"] because I wasnt a PA resident, is there anything else I need to do?"

Get a clue as to just HOW "basically illegal" your actions were?

Learn to punctuate and spell?

Fabricate a way to justify your wilfully illegal purchase as part of your self-styled "militia?" :rolleyes:

There are fundamental flaws so serious as to render your trolling an internet chat room for competent legal counsel for an act which you already committed while congnizant of its illegality wholly and utterly absurd. :scrutiny:

[Dave Markowitz]

There is some bad advice in this thread. Do not attempt to do an interstate transfer through a law enforcement officer or county courthouse.

Interstate transfers of firearms (rifles, shotguns, or handguns) must go through an FFL (Federal Firearms License) holder. This is Federal law -- the Gun Control Act of 1968 -- which preempts any otherwise-relevant state laws.

(Yes, I am a lawyer.)

[JohnBT]

You admit you both broke the law in a post on a public forum to ask for advice on what paperwork to fill out? I'm nearly speechless. Nearly. I do have a question though concerning the following quote.

"and while it was basically illegal for him to sell me the rifle"

Rifle or shotgun?

John

[bbrins]

However, no one would ever know because we dont register long arms in NJ....yet

Uuuhhh... everyone on the internet knows now, even the ATF and FBI. Better re-do this legally before they figure out who you are and where you live.

[MikeIsaj]

Dave Markowitz;

Thanks for the legal opinion. Even though I should know better, I made an assumption based on partial knowledge and no direct experience. Assuming the seller is legally able to sell, and the buyer is a legally qualified buyer, can this be corrected by going through the process after the fact? Is there some room to consider good intentions and ignorance of the law as long as every effort is made to comply now that all is understood?

[Tory]

"Is there some room to consider good intentions and ignorance of the law?"

You posit a question which is not merely unsupported, but actually contradicted by the poster's own assertions:

"...it was basically illegal for him to sell me the rifle because I wasnt a PA resident..."

The correct answer has already been given: Transfer the gun through an FFL. :uhoh:

[MikeIsaj]

My question regarding "good intentions" is inspired by several posts that encourage correcting the mistake to resolve the issue. The question is once the law is broken, can correcting the mistake mitigate the offense? The purpose of law is to maintain a standard of order in a society. It is not a snare to entrap the unwary.

Threads are dynamic, like conversation. A posting should be viewed in light of all the previous posts, not just the origional.

[DontBurnMyFlag]

CLARIFICATION TIME the gun is still at his house, i should have made it clear that it is not in my possesion. whew, i bet i scared alot of u guys.

the gun is at his house and I WAS planning on picking it up on my way home...however, its clear I need to go to an FFL.

I am sorry I caused so much confusion and utter disbelief that i would do something so stupid. thanks for all your Info.


ive fired guns for many years, and i know alot about them....its owning them thats new to me. NJ laws and all gun laws were new to me. Im only recently find out about them. I am a new gun owner. I dont have the shotgun in my possession, just making that clear again.


and I realize my action was stupid, and I should have gone somewhere else for legal advice. But Tory, there is no need to be crass and condescending. I am new to this and I attempted to rectify my stupidty. There is no need to be a pompous ass. I am clearly in the wrong here, I am stupid for this mistake, however there is no need for you to be so uncivil.

[DMF]

needless to say, the gun is still at his house, i should have made it clear that it is not in my possesion. (sic)

Actually it did needed to be said, because when it comes to making things clear your first post clearly said the shotgun is in your possession.

From your first post:
So now I got my FID, I payed my buddy the money, and now I have his mossberg.(sic)(emphasis added)

[2nd Amendment]

Hmm, it would seem he needs to return the Mossy to the original owner who then needs to physically transfer it to him via an FFL. It's a private sale, there's no paperwork so once it is done through an FFL there is no crime since there is no trail. A piece of advice might be to delete the post, though. Tracking someone down and making a charge stick via a post on a forum is not exactly a simple matter from beginning to end but there's no reason to leave the advertisemnt up and beg for someone to try.

[DMF]

What's also bugging me is why you are bringing up essentially the same topic (interstate transfers) you have asked about two other times this month: http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=134152

http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=133113

Also curious that you come back later to say you don't have the Mossberg, yet in this thread it sure sounds like you do: http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=134268

[DontBurnMyFlag]

ever post in which ive talked about that mossberg, im basically lying. I dont have it yet. I have in the past taken it out shooting with my friend in PA, but Ive never owned it yet. Anything about taking it across state or in a trunk is all meant to be in the future. I am merely trying to figure ways to do what is right. Even though I managed to F**K that up. But besides, there is no gun in my possession. Thats why I asked these questions, to try to avoid breaking any laws. When I should have just looked them up, asked a gun shop or something along those lines. . I never had that shotgun in my car, house, dorm etc. Thats the truth. Every post asked questions on "can I do this" "should I do that" "is this right". To reitterate, I do not own the gun yet.

[arcticap]

What is written here on this site is open speech. It can be truth or fictitious. Who knows who types what and what is responsibly written or not. You are safe and really needn't worry I believe. You have mentioned that you are a student in PA etc...I don't believe that you have made any actual transfer at all, just a promise of delivery in exchange for holding the money. How long have you been living in PA now anyway? You must feel more at home there now than in New Jersey. Since shotguns aren't registered in PA, maybe it's entirely legal to use one to shoot while you're in PA until you go back home to New Jersey. Please don't feel like a criminal. Sometimes people will quickly jump to conclusions. :neener:

[2nd Amendment]

OK, since we now know you haven't broken any laws and are solely concerned with how to be certain you do NOT break any of these mightily important regulations can we ask you to do us one other favor?

Use spell check and practice your punctuation. OK?

[DontBurnMyFlag]

:D I promise that I will use proper grammar from now on. In a situation of such high stress, such as what I just experienced, I had no time for grammar and proper punctuation. I apologize. Thanks to the people who didn't jump to conclusions and villify me.

[Dave Markowitz]

Thanks for the legal opinion. Even though I should know better, I made an assumption based on partial knowledge and no direct experience. Assuming the seller is legally able to sell, and the buyer is a legally qualified buyer, can this be corrected by going through the process after the fact? Is there some room to consider good intentions and ignorance of the law as long as every effort is made to comply now that all is understood?

My original reply in this thread was designed to edjucate readers on what the requirements of the law are. Answering the question quoted above would be more like giving legal advice, which could create an attorney-client relationship, something I'm not about to do on an Internet forum.

[Tory]

" In a situation of such high stress, such as what I just experienced, I had no time for grammar and proper punctuation. I apologize. Thanks to the people who didn't jump to conclusions and villify [sic] me."

1. The only "stress" was that you created by purchasing a firearm in a real/proposed/whatever your present excuse is interstate transfer without an FFL.

2. As you've posted on this subject TWICE before, had you bothered to pay attention to the answers, you should now have a clue as to the process. That you didn't/don't shows you ignore advice you solicited.

3. No-one jumped to conclusions; they took you at your (worthless) word; i.e., that you TOOK THE FIREARM ACROSS STATE LINES. You know, the scenario you now admit lying about. :uhoh:

Given that you have:

a. Posted on this subject twice before,

b. Changed your story about the transfer, and

c. Can't distinguish between a rifle and a shotgun,

my conclusion from all this is that you are terminally obtuse or a troll.

Which is it? :scrutiny:

[cidirkona]

Man, I love Arizona.

-Colin

[R.H. Lee]

dUH. I don't get it. Does the transaction have to go thru an FFL only because the buyer and seller are residents of two different states? I can't sell a long gun directly to another CA resident? :confused:

[itgoesboom]

Riley,

Thats because you don't live in a free state.

Go North young man, (or east, either way works). Most states allow you to do private party transactions, no paper work required as long as the seller and buyer are both residents of the same state.

I.G.B.

[cidirkona]

Most states allow you to do private party transactions, no paper work required

All the good ones do at least!! :D
-Colin