NEED permit advice UPSTATE NY


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trickyasafox
May 6, 2005, 12:08 AM
So next week i turn the big 21 and for my birthday im applying for my concealed carry permit. I'll be applying out of Onondaga county, and Packing.org really did not have much information about my county for me. My father and one of my former employers both have their permits issued from there, but that was over 30 years ago for the both of them. does anyone have any tips or advice for this county? if your not totally familiar with the area, its the greater Syracuse area. midway between Buffalo and Albany. I have 3 references that are all carry members, so that should help, but any hints or tips when filling out my reasons is very much appreciated.

thanks in advance all

mike

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GRB
May 6, 2005, 12:27 AM
Why not contact the New York State Rifle and Pistol Association http://www.nysrpa.org/ They may be of some assistance, and while you are at it, if not yet a member, why not think about joining up.

RCL
May 6, 2005, 06:38 AM
Mike, it seems as if every county in NY has different rules and regs for their permits, and they can change at any time as they are controlled by that county's judge. You'll know more about what hoops you will have to jump through when you go in and get your application packet. Some counties require four references, and some require that one of them be your local politician. Your local permit clerk may be the best source of info for all you are going to need.
Good luck! :)

jobu07
May 6, 2005, 06:47 AM
it seems as if every county in NY has different rules and regs for their permits

Unfortunatly, that's true :uhoh: But, not to worry, that works to our advantage in some counties, like Steuben ;) But, alas, not to your advantage in the greater Syracuse area. The current Onandaga County judge is no friend to gun owners and, from what I understand, issues very few permits currently. You might try this, you can legally apply in the county you work in for a permit, if it is different from the one you live in. So, for instance, so you live in the suburbs of 'cuse, but work in.... Auburn, you could apply for a Cayuga county permit. Much better chances of getting one then. They limit you to only the county you live in and the one you work in though, to limit "judge shopping."

Whatever you do, take your time, research where you are applying, and gett'r done! Right now the average wait time about 4 months. So you'll be shooting by summers end :) Oh, make sure you get a concealed carry permit, as well, and not a hunting or target shooting or on premises only permit. Wouldn't want to go through all that hullabaloo and not be able to ccw would we?

mete
May 6, 2005, 08:15 AM
A bad judge ?Too bad. 30 years ago when I got mine there it was easy.

OF
May 6, 2005, 09:55 AM
...you can legally apply in the county you work in for a permit, if it is different from the one you live in. Do you have a source or reference for this? That's the first time I've heard of that. Or is there a cite for the law that says you have to apply in the county you live in at all?

- Gabe

Arcli9ht
May 6, 2005, 10:12 AM
Under the reason for the permit, I was told not to list actual purpose. Basically, don't write "for Hunting, Target shooting, wilderness protection, personal protection" and instead just write:

"For all lawful purposes."

Worked for me, I had my permit 11 days after my last reference was in. Of course, Otsego county is particularly gun friendly.

Having references that are pistol permit holders helps a lot, I had two NYC pistol permit holders as references.

trickyasafox
May 6, 2005, 11:14 AM
yea the county i work in would probably where i go to school, and i doubt the bronx will be of much help :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: i was intending to apply for concealed, but i hear our current judge will only issue transporting then after a year you can apply to upgrade it. really bothers me that i not only have to pay to be able to exercise my rights but that they can be denied to me because some guy didn't get his coffee right that morning :mad:

jobu07
May 6, 2005, 03:49 PM
Do you have a source or reference for this? That's the first time I've heard of that. Or is there a cite for the law that says you have to apply in the county you live in at all?

It's in there... Somewhere in those volumes of gun law... I'll look try to look it up for ya, but I can't promise how soon i'll find it :uhoh: Seriously, there are just volumes of gun law in this state. At least we can carry concealed at all... Anyway, I have a few friends who have applied in their county's of employment and have gotten around ruthless judges that way.

MilsurpShooter
May 6, 2005, 05:04 PM
I dread the day I have to go through the red tape of Westchester to get my permit. 9 months and counting

gcerbone
May 6, 2005, 05:16 PM
From NRAILA for NY State:
Handguns: A license is needed to possess a handgun in one's home or place of business. Application is made to the "licensing officer" of the city or county where the applicant resides, is principally employed or where his principal place of business as a merchant or store keeper is located. (The licensing officer in New York City and Nassau County is the Police Commissioner; in Suffolk County, the Police Commissioner or Sheriff; elsewhere in the state, a county judge or some other designated judge or justice.)

trickasafox, where do you go to school in the Bronx?

jobu07
May 6, 2005, 06:39 PM
gcerbone, first of all welcome to the board! Secondly, thank you for helping me find some citation of county/workplace law. Saved my lazy but some searching through the pistol law files. :)

gcerbone
May 7, 2005, 08:26 AM
Thanks, and no worries. :)

OF
May 7, 2005, 10:18 AM
Yeah, thanks for that :)

'May issue' is, IMO, the most egregious CCW infringement there is. I'd almost prefer no-issue to may-issue. At least with no-issue everyone is treated equally under the law and the real tyrants are identifiable. In a may-issue system corruption, racism and cronyism flourish and the bureaucracy is littered with petty tyrants from top to bottom feeling their oats and flexing their miniscule little tyrant muscles when they get the opportunities the system readily provides them.

As awful as denial of CCW is, I think the may-issue system is actually more of an affront to the principles of American republicanism.

It's one thing to have to meet a set of unreasonable demands spelled out in the law (high charges, classes, paperwork, documentation, waiting periods, etc.) but it's something else to have to grovel and beg for permission from some bureaucrat who can just decide to allow or not allow you to exercise your rights based solely on their whim. Makes me sick.

- Gabe

OF
May 7, 2005, 10:19 AM
I have a few friends who have applied in their county's of employment and have gotten around ruthless judges that wayThat bit of info right there is, I think, more important to know than the actual letter of the law in NY: that people have done that and it actually worked.

- Gabe

jobu07
May 7, 2005, 10:36 AM
I think your best option for getting a permit is to get a "summer" job in a county somewhere else. Heck, you might even be able to get a friend in another county to say you baby sit for them on a regular basis. It qualify as a job. Just use yer noggin and you'll be pistol packin' in no time! :p

Madison, Oneida, Cayuga, Seneca, Ontario, Wayne, Oswego, Cortland, Chenango... Anywhere but Onandaga. Man we have a lot of counties named after Indian tribes don't we? Wait wait... Native American tribes, i'm sorry bout that slip of tongue :rolleyes:

trickyasafox
May 7, 2005, 06:58 PM
i go to fordham U in the bronx. right by the zoo if you know the area. i might have to see what i can do about getting a summer job in another county. if i were just to have someone say i worked for them, what would i need to prove this? would the job have to be above or bellow the table (sounds kinda silly but im not sure cause babysitting is a cash only business as far as i've ever seen)

gcerbone
May 7, 2005, 09:25 PM
Go Rams! I'm Fordham College, class of '97. My wife is FC 1996, and Grad Ed, 03, and my brother is FC, '08.

Re where to apply, I'd say it really depends on the county. At the end of the day, it is up to the Judge who signs your permit, and the county official who takes it to the Judge to be signed. I used to live in Westchester (in CT now) but my parents had a house in Columbia county. I looked into trying to register there. I called the county clerk and found out how things worked. Basically it is pretty ad hoc. Each judge and county does things differently. Some require an interview, some don't, some want three references, some want more or less. I'd call the county clerks of the neighboring counties, tell them that you have a job there, and that you would like to apply and ask some questions. You don't have to give your name or anything, but feel them out. Tell them you work in their county, and that that you want to apply there, and ask them what you need to do.

Worst case scenario, when you go to put your stuff in, they will ask you why you are applying in XXX county and not in your county of residence. The county clerk will tell you what you have to do to prove your status. It may be enought to just offer an explanation, or they may want a letter of explanation, or they may want a notarized letter from your boss. DON'T LIE, because if they catch you making false statements then you can be denied a permit, and that makes it 100 times harder to get one later. Also, keep in mind they may not know the law very well. For example, one time I bought a new gun on Long Island, and when I went to have it added to my permit, they gave me a hard time saying that I couldn't carry in NYC, and thuc couldn't get it home. Not true. The law specifically states that you can carry through NYC as long as you don't stop.

You also might want to apply for an out-of-state CT permit once you get your NY permit. http://www.state.ct.us/dps/SLFU/PistolPermitsHome.htm It is way easier then NY. You can bring the fingerprint card with you when you get printed for NY. You can't actually apply until you have your NY permit, but you can get all of the paperwork done ahead of time. Then you can use ranges in CT if you like, and if you ever move this way, you can just keep your permit.

Good luck!

George

trickyasafox
May 8, 2005, 12:50 AM
thanks for the advice gcerbone :) i dont think any of the firearms will make it down to campus. no time to shoot down there with football anyway not to mention the bees nest of trouble i'd get in for living on campus and trying to find a place to store em.

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