Carrying In An 18 Wheeler


PDA






magsnubby
May 8, 2005, 06:49 PM
My son drives an 18 wheeler. He also carries an older Charter Arms .38. He knows the laws in Kally but he also delivers to Oregon, Washington, Arizona, Neveda and Utah. He only loads it up at night while at truck stops. He's also looking at carrying some type of OC.

Anybody have any links to gun law web sites for any of these states? What about oc?

If you enjoyed reading about "Carrying In An 18 Wheeler" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
RRTX
May 8, 2005, 06:50 PM
www.packing.org should be able to find everything you need there

Texian Pistolero
May 8, 2005, 07:16 PM
\\
this is a violation of the rules for virtually all trucking companies.

Sad, but them be the rules.

12-34hom
May 8, 2005, 07:29 PM
Also violates ICC and DOT laws concerning transportation of firearms across state lines.

12-34hom.

WT
May 8, 2005, 07:31 PM
I would hope that Homeland Security would start a program to train and arm those with CDL's, especially those who drive tankers.

Last year a 5,000 gallon chemical tanker truck disappeared in NJ. Homeland Security went ape trying to find it. They feared that terrorists had hijacked it. We went to orange alert in northern NJ-NYC. Eventually, the truck was found hidden under a bridge.

I have no problem with truckers carrying firearms for defense of themselves and their cargo, especially the hazardous stuff. I know that some of my state trooper friends are in agreement.

thorn726
May 8, 2005, 07:42 PM
I have no problem with truckers carrying firearms for defense of themselves and their cargo, especially the hazardous stuff. I know that some of my state trooper friends are in agreement.


totally, especially seeing how we keep hearing that's what the terrorists want to use next, last thing we need is a tanker getting hijacked

AZTOY
May 8, 2005, 07:44 PM
Sorry magsnubby

If your son has a CDL and drives 18 wheeler, he can't have a gun in the truck in any states. :banghead:

DOT BITES :cuss:

Moondoggie
May 8, 2005, 07:49 PM
Sorry to disagree, 12-34, but the consensus within the trucking community is that it is not a violation of DOT regs. This is considered an urban legend amongst truckers. The "Green Book" is silent on the issue.

It is true that virtually every trucking company prohibits carrying "weapons", not just firearms.

I have carried, but don't presently since I travel to Chicago every week and also because I no longer have a CCW.

BTW, the SCOTUS has ruled that the 4th Ammendment doesn't apply to truckers insofar as searches of truck cab/sleepers by LEO. "A heavily regulated industry such as interstate trucking has to expect some invasion of privacy in the course of business", or words to that effect. In MY 6 yrs/750,000 miles of trucking, I've been inspected many times but never searched.

steelhauler
May 8, 2005, 07:49 PM
Where in the icc rules that say you cannot carry a gun!!!I have seach for long time for it.State rule are differine in every state.That What you have go by.and yes most trucking companys will fire you for carrying.But is not better to be judge by tweve insheld of being carry by six

Moondoggie
May 8, 2005, 07:59 PM
I just wanted to throw this in....

Being fired by a trucking company is no big deal (although it's never happened to me). As long as you haven't been in an accident, tested positive for substance abuse, or abandoned equipment under a load any driver can go to work within a week for dozens of companies. It's a driver's market.

patentnonsense
May 8, 2005, 08:18 PM
Given that drivers are often targeted, I think you'd be crazy not to think about self protection. However, if you're doing anything illegal, DON'T SAY SO HERE.

Some like to carry black powder revolvers (or derringers or shotguns), on the theory that this is at least arguably compliant with the laws in pro-crime states - the Feds give black powder a lot of slack, but I kinda doubt that every state does - check packing.org.

The old "tire tester" is some comfort, even against a knife, but I'd feel a little naked against a gun or a gang.

DJJ
May 8, 2005, 08:23 PM
BTW, the SCOTUS has ruled that the 4th Ammendment doesn't apply to truckers insofar as searches of truck cab/sleepers by LEO. "A heavily regulated industry such as interstate trucking has to expect some invasion of privacy in the course of business", or words to that effect.


Preaching to the choir here, but does this bother anyone else? "Because gov't already has its hand so deeply in your cookie jar, you should expect us to push deeper."

"Because the right to keep and bear arms is so heavily regulated, increased scrutiny is normal, and you should expect some invasion of privacy, if you choose to participate in it."

Notwithstanding the "driving is a privelege" argument, it's the circular reasoning that's wrong.

magsnubby
May 8, 2005, 08:27 PM
Yes he knows it's against company rules but he can always find another job. A good driver with a clean record can find another job very easily. He drove a 10 wheeler hauling oil for almost 10 years. He's a level headed kid. I'm not worried about him playing cowboy with a gun. He would rather walk away from a fight if that's an option. But he belives he has a right to defend his self if it comes down to it. He made the choice to carry. And i have to respect that choice.

Texian Pistolero
May 8, 2005, 09:24 PM
Well, since that's all understood,

I suggest he trade that Charter Arms POS in on a reliable Ruger SP101 with a three inch barrell.

Beyond that,

I recall that the Department of Homeland Security is hoping to utilize truckers as anti-terrorist eyes and ears. They are generally patriotic, and cover a LOT of ground.

In that context, I think the envorinment is right to push for a FEDERAL LAW to allow truckers to carry. Given the fig leaf of a FEDERAL law, obviously required since truckers are hijack targets by terrorists, I think that trucking companies would fold, given a FEDERAL mandate. It's worth a try, contact your congressional rep.

What do we have to lose, beyond a postage stamp?

Moondoggie
May 8, 2005, 09:40 PM
Don't want to hijack the thread, and will refrain from going into detail, but the average person has absolutely zero idea what goes on in the trucking industry.

My wife & I are totally independent owner/operators...we have our own S-type corporation and our own DOT authority. We own 1 trk/trlr.

The taxes, regulations, and the way the laws are slanted would make your blood boil if you took the time to comprehend them. The fines for non-compliance start out at heart-stopping and go up from there. It's very similar to gun ownership, we even have our own "anti's" sticking their nose in our business in the name of public safety. We also have the equlivalant of the NRA, OOIDA, which lobbies and files lawsuits on our collective behalf. The expenses are ridiculous, and the shippers want us to haul for the same rate they paid in the mid-80's..nevermind inflation. However, if you mind your P's & Q's, buy your equipment "smart" and stand your ground in rate negotiations, there is a decent living to be made.

I apologize for the off-topic post, but there's really no place to mention this on THR since it's not gun-related.

zahc
May 8, 2005, 09:59 PM
My parents also own their own LLC, Leatherwood Valley Transport BTW (plug) ahem. My dad owns and drives a truck and they lease an OO or two.

TTBOMK it is in no way legally possible to (legally) carry a gun in a big rig.

Note the (legally) part.

RRTX
May 8, 2005, 10:18 PM
They actually talked about this on the GunTalk radio program this afternoon. There is nowhere in the DOT regs that prohibits carrying a weapon in a truck. I have a copy of the FMCSR right here and I have never been able to find anything in it regarding this issue. I think this rumor comes from trucking companies not wanting their drivers carrying (insurance reasons is my best guess) so they just say it's against DOT regulations. The part that would be hardest of carrying for most drivers would be trying to stay in compliance for every single area that you drive into, and a lot of these companies go into Canada and Mexico so that makes it an even bigger problem. I used to drive and couldn't carry mainly due to the Canada reason, but I always had a tire thumper or large maglight right next to me because a lot of the places you deliver aren't exactly the nicest parts of town :uhoh: .

Onmilo
May 8, 2005, 10:28 PM
Tractor portion of the combination vehicle is considered the home and castle of the occupant especially if it is used as a place of abode, i.e. a sleeper box or addition is present.

A concealed carry permit will indeed legally allow one to carry firearms in the cab of the vehicle, most states will honor and accept the carry permit.

Most Contracting Carrier Companies have regulations against carry in Company vehicles but they really have no say on Owner Operators unless a restriction is stipulated in the acceptance of employment contract.
It is the Owner Operators responsibility to insure there is no stipulation against carrying of personal weapons stipulated in the acceptance of employment contract.

If the Contracting Carrier Company refuses to remove the restriction of carry stipulation the Owner Operator doesn't need to be driving for them anyway.

No Contracting Carrier Company will accept responsibility for your use or misuse of the weapons carried in your vehicle, I.E. you screw up, or you are forced to use the weapon in a defensive shooting incident you are on your own.

Stay out of Illinois, New Jersey, and Massachusetts with your personal weapons.
Lock them up in storage facilities outside of these states and pick them up on the way back out.

I have been driving Tractor Trailer combinations, on and off, for the last 22 years, I work in the firearms industry when I am not driving, I know what I say is true and packing.org can provide even more information on the legalities. HTH

hardhead
May 8, 2005, 10:39 PM
to: ALL

I've been trucking about 20 years, and it used to be illegal, under federal rules, for truckers to carry firearms in the cab/sleeper. About 5 or 6 years ago however, this part of the regs was quietly deleted.

I don't have one of the old books around anymore, so I can't cite the old rule but I went just now and looked at the new reg book, and there is still no mention of firearms carry one way or the other. It's just possible that Part 49 may in someway address this issue, but it mostly deals with Hazmat regs so I doubt it...I'll have a look.

Bear in mind that these are FEDERAL rules, not state laws. State laws may be different although many of the states pretty much adopted the federal laws.

I would consult a lawyer, but the federal rules (Part 355) mandate that states follow them while a truck is on any part of the federal highway system or within a certain distance from it, or while engaged in activities such a getting fuel, repairs, sleeping and delivery.

Like one of the other posters, I have carried for years (even when it wasn't legal) and always will. I have twice been in the unfortunate position of having to defend myself with a firearm while trucking, and the firearms presence quickly defused the situation and allowed me to escape unharmed.

If in doubt, call the 800 number for a particular state DOT office and ask them to cite the rule for you.

mnrivrat
May 8, 2005, 10:55 PM
Not being all the familier with this subject my comment refers to this quote :
Tractor portion of the combination vehicle is considered the home and castle of the occupant especially if it is used as a place of abode, i.e. a sleeper box or addition is present.

I was once told that recreational vehicles (campers & motorhomes) fell into this typing when stopped and a loaded firearm was then allowable.

Not 100% sure but I think that having a loaded firearm in a sleeper cab while stopped for resting may be legal. Whereas having it loaded and available during travel may not be.

Something to look into.

EOD Guy
May 9, 2005, 12:52 PM
I asked a DOT inspector at the DOT Training Center in Oklahoma City about this and he stated that he could cite a driver for transporting a loaded firearm in violation of 49CFR 173.54(f). If the firearm was unloaded, there would be no violation.

He noted that the intent of that part of the regulation concerned transportation as part of the cargo, but that the regulation, as written, did not state that. He said he had never heard of a citation being written for that but it could be done. It would be up to the driver, or his company, to appeal the citation.

He said that he thought it would be a BS citation but that he also knew some BS inspectors. He gave an example of one who wrote a minor violation on the Lighthouse for the Blind.

possenti
May 9, 2005, 10:00 PM
The military policy of "don't ask, don't tell" should apply here...

Of course, 99.9% of trucking companies have the "no weapons in trucks" policy to cover their posteriors legally, but how many actually enforce it? VERY few. The rule is in place in case a driver does shoot someone, the company can't be held liable.

Most companies have "no gambling" rules in their employee handbooks, but how many football/NASCAR/March Madness/etc pools do you have going on at your place of employment? This policy is in place for the same reason as above - If someone loses their money and gets p!ssed off about it, they can't sue the employer.

If you enjoyed reading about "Carrying In An 18 Wheeler" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!