FFL transfers


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Alex45ACP
June 8, 2005, 06:13 PM
How much do you usually pay for an FFL transfer? The local gun shop wants $50 :scrutiny:

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manofsteele
June 8, 2005, 06:19 PM
thats alot in my opinion, the most I see vary from 15-25 dollars.


Im a dealer, I charge 10 dollars. I got into dealing for two reasons: 1. to make a little money to cure my addiction. 2. To give people good deals on guns wheather it be from me or transferring.

Buying a gun and having it transferred shouldn't feel like a punishment, I know that particular dealers want you to buy from them but as a pro gun person you should do your duty to promote the hobby.

my two cents

Jason

Correia
June 8, 2005, 06:31 PM
$20 is pretty reasonable.

Check Shotgun New's webpage as that will have a list of dealers in your area that do transfers.

Polishrifleman
June 8, 2005, 06:35 PM
They also post a list at gunsamerica you just put in your zip code. $50 bucks is ridiculous. I pay $20 plus tax.

Spreadfire Arms
June 8, 2005, 06:42 PM
i normally charge $20 but if i like you it is $10 :D

Standing Wolf
June 8, 2005, 06:46 PM
$50 is incontrovertible evidence of greed.

Sir Aardvark
June 8, 2005, 07:02 PM
I would charge $20.00 when I was in business.

Rotty
June 8, 2005, 08:03 PM
Ive really been ripped before for transferes....up to about $35.
Now i am a dealer....for people here or my other "circles" i only charge $5, for all others $10.

grimjaw
June 8, 2005, 08:17 PM
I have a quote of $15 from the dealer I use, but haven't used him yet.

jmm

MudPuppy
June 8, 2005, 08:44 PM
I pay $5.50 in south austin.

It's $15 with CHL, $20 without in north austin. (and I'm assuming $10 from Steve, cuz I'm a heck of likable guy!)

SouthpawShootr
June 8, 2005, 08:50 PM
It's kind of variable. I only use one shop for these. It's variable b/c I know both the owners and if either one of them takes the transfer request, it's usually $15. If it's one of their employees, I end up paying $25. Plenty of other shops around here that will do it for $25. Never seen $50. :what:

Alex45ACP
June 8, 2005, 09:33 PM
Yeah, I really don't like that shop, everything there is ridiculously overpriced. For example: $190 for a case of Wolf 7.62X39 FMJ :what:

I'd rather spend $35 in gas to drive to another place that will do the transfer for $15.

Lennyjoe
June 8, 2005, 09:42 PM
$15 thru my FFL dealer.

Larry Ashcraft
June 8, 2005, 10:16 PM
I pay $20 plus tax.
Unless your tax laws are really different, there shouldn't be any sales tax on a transfer. It is a service, no goods have changed hands between the dealer and customer, legally speaking.

Alex45ACP
June 9, 2005, 12:14 AM
They also post a list at gunsamerica you just put in your zip code.

Interesting, one question though, how do you know it's safe to have your gun sent to these people if they're not a shop?

toivo
June 9, 2005, 02:53 AM
Interesting, one question though, how do you know it's safe to have your gun sent to these people if they're not a shop?You can check to see if their FFL is legit by going to:

https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/

You need their FFL number to run the check--you can find that on the signed form they give you to send to the seller. Some of them want to send the signed copy directly to the seller, but you can ask for their number or to see their FFL. Anyone who won't tell/show it to you is a bad risk anyway.

As far as whether their business practices are on the level, that is, they're not ripping off the guns that people send them, you're on your own. I'd say ask around your local area, get some idea of the person's character if you can--how long he's been in business, etc. Even if it's not a "shop", any gunsmith, pawnbroker, etc., is a business and has customers who can vouch for him. Also, ask the seller of the gun to send you some kind of bill of sale so that you can prove ownership of the gun in question if the transfer agent should turn out to be shady.

Around here (upstate New York) it's $20 to $30 dollars. One guy charges $15, but he's impossible to get ahold of.

Henry Bowman
June 9, 2005, 08:47 AM
$25 to $30 around here. Many states (including OH) now require tax to be collected on services as well as goods (with certain exemptions).

moredes
June 9, 2005, 09:02 AM
I pay $20 plus tax.

<<Unless your tax laws are really different, there shouldn't be any sales tax on a transfer. It is a service, no goods have changed hands between the dealer and customer, legally speaking.>>

All that's true, but when I lived in CA, there was ahn FFL I ran into who was so squirrelly about the ATF and CA gun laws that they charged tax. But even with the tax, it was generally cheaper than the standard $35 FFL fee, because they didn't charge the fee to gun club members, only the tax. CA Franchise Tax Board (and most other states' tax entities) mandate that an internet transaction falls under the 'luxury tax' laws, it's just that damn few businesses (FFLs) enforce it, and the states don't have the manpower to enforce it, either.

That said, even in San Francisco/Silicon Valley and Los Angeles, I've never heard of an FFL charging > $35 for a transfer fee. Glad I'm out of the PRK--here, it's $20 per visit--that is to say, if I transferred 3 guns on the same day, it'd be $20.

Tory
June 9, 2005, 09:24 AM
I pay $25 per gun.

Spreadfire Arms
June 9, 2005, 01:44 PM
mudpuppy wrote:

(and I'm assuming $10 from Steve, cuz I'm a heck of likable guy!)

:D

Alex45ACP
June 10, 2005, 07:21 PM
Thanks for the info.

CZ 75 BD
June 10, 2005, 07:29 PM
$15 at my gun range, but sometimes they forget.

larry starling
June 11, 2005, 11:24 PM
20-25 bucks in my area! one of the bigger stores in charlotte wants $40! There well know for there high prices though! so I tend to avoid them! :confused:

Alex45ACP
June 13, 2005, 11:52 PM
I found someone in the area who does it for $15 :D

trbon8r
June 14, 2005, 12:09 AM
I guess I'm living in the wrong part of the country. $70 including the California DROS fees is about average around here.

Beav
June 14, 2005, 10:26 AM
From what I've seen $25 seems to be the standard. When a shop asks for much more it tells me they don't like doing transfers.

dakotasin
June 14, 2005, 10:46 AM
i pay $10 per order... that may be for one gun, or 5.

the local shop gets $30, so on principle, i drive 25 miles out of my way to get the lower rate. amazing what else i find to buy when i am in there... because of that $10 x-fer, he probably makes an additional $100... the other place, i paid the $30 rip-off fee and left, no additional purchases.

when are gunshops gonna get it?

Spreadfire Arms
June 14, 2005, 12:14 PM
dakotasin wrote:

when are gunshops gonna get it?

gun shops (retail storefronts) have bills to pay, including rent, electricity, an alarm system, telephone, A/C, and in this day and age, high speed internet as well.

they also have to keep your 4473 for over 20 years. i would not consider $30 a "rip off" fee.

if you don't like it then go get your own FFL and do your own transfers for free and then extend your transfers for $10 per order (regardless of quantity) or as low as $5.50 on here by a local Austin FFL. then warehouse your 4473's for 20+ years and wonder how you can possibly make a profit doing this?

oh yeah, gun dealers who make a profit are evil..... :evil:

xdoctor
June 14, 2005, 12:19 PM
My FFL is a good friend, does it for $10.

dakotasin
June 14, 2005, 12:32 PM
i don't care if they make a profit - that's their job. but, they don't have to try to pay all their overhead on just my one transaction.

and, yeah, i know that those 4473's take up an inane amount of space, require high maintenance and constant attention so they should charge $30 per gun. :rolleyes:

i don't mind paying a little extra to support the little guys... but, the local shop prices his stuff higher than cabela's. eg, i don't mind paying up to $30-33 for a box of barnes xlc's (cabela's has 'em on the shelf for $27). so, in the spirit of helping the little guy, i ordered 2 boxes, (stupidly) thinking it would be around $30/box. imagine my surprise when i got charged $50/box after waiting 10 days, just so i could support the little guy. i tried to buy a gun at the 'little guy', and he wanted $750 to order it (meaning i wait 11 days for it). i walked into cabela's and walked out w/ my stick for $630.

let him go under. he's not entitled to my business. and what irritates me the most is all the guns and components i bought from him in the last year! i bought a 700 vls from him for $585... 2 months later, i went back to get another one, and it was $630 (both prices higher than cabela's at the time - the second one quite a bit higher), and went ahead and paid for priviledge of waiting to support the little guy... 2 700 lvsf's, same story.

life goes on...

Spreadfire Arms
June 14, 2005, 12:39 PM
i don't care if they make a profit - that's their job. but, they don't have to try to pay all their overhead on just my one transaction.

trust me they aren't paying their day's worth of operating costs on your $30 transfer.

and, yeah, i know that those 4473's take up an inane amount of space, require high maintenance and constant attention so they should charge $30 per gun.
they do take up alot of space over time, and they do require some amount of attention, and you have to keep them for 20 years. ATF requires you to keep track of them and if you misplace the one they are looking for you are in deep ????. have you ever had to keep up with a single piece of paper for 20 years? probably. your birth certificate is probably one of them, but you only have one. you don't have hundreds or even thousands to store, but only track, assign a number to, and also be able to pull them at a moment's notice upon request of the ATF to run a trace.

it's not as easy as you think. big gun dealers probably have an entire room full of filing cabinets just for this. even small potatoes guys have a file cabinet dedicated to just this.

don't knock it till you try it. would you like the phone number to the ATF Licensing Center? :confused:

dakotasin
June 14, 2005, 01:30 PM
nope, i don't want an ffl. never did, was never an issue. what does me having an ffl have to do w/ anything anyway?

the point i was trying to make was that i buy a ton of gun-related stuff. guns, component pieces to load, dies, shellholders, scopes, rings, bases, triggers, stocks, etc etc etc.

when i walk into the gun dealer, and he charges me $30 to transfer one gun, i don't feel good about the transaction. so i pay the $30 and leave. when i go to the other place and pay $10 to transfer 3 ar receivers, i also pick up 500 hornady 60 grain v-max's, 250 noslers in 40, 200 pieces of 7 rum brass, dies, a shellholder, and 2 or 3 pounds of powder. to further that, since i don't feel like i'm being gouged everytime i turn around, i'll be back next week for a similiar process.

now, you tell me - since you're a dealer and know profit margins on gun-stuff better than i... who made money? so... is that $30 x-fer fee worth it? or is the $10 x-fer and the shopping cart of crap i just bought the better money maker?

i guess if the $30 fee is worth more, fine, make your money. that's the point i was making, that's all.

Zrex
June 14, 2005, 01:44 PM
i normally charge $20 but if i like you it is $10

What do you charge for NFA transfers?

Spreadfire Arms
June 14, 2005, 01:53 PM
im not sure who made more money since you are purchasing inventory, you'd have to see how much he paid vs. how much he sold it for. it is true you may have spent more money in his shop buying things, but you also may not be rule but the exception. how many people can you guarantee will come into his shop and buy as much as you did because the transfer cost $20 less? or how many people will continue to use him at $10 per pop for unlimited amounts of firearms and not buy anything from his store? you can't guarantee it will go either way.

having an FFL would give you an understanding as to how much paperwork is involved with the care and feeding of a completed 4473. you may not understand things like ATF Traces, ATF inspections, how nitpicky they can be on how a 4473 is filled out (no mistakes or abbreviations), the filing system, acquistion and disposition, not to mention state sales tax and IRS revenue paperwork can impact a single transfer. it can all be a huge paperwork trail that you are accountable for over the next 20 years.

NFA transfers are $50....Zrex asked.

and if you think $30 is outrageous take a look at this thread:
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=1744122#post1744122

a post from Cpileri:
"The local guy up here charges 25 bucks plus tax PLUS 10% of the cost of the weapon!" [Belton, Texas which is about 50 miles north of Austin]

dakotasin
June 14, 2005, 02:12 PM
i don't know what it cost the dealer to stock the items... a wild guess, here:
the 700 lss to me was $630. i'd imagine dealer price on it to be around $575.
the hornadys to me were $11/100 (*5 boxes), and would guess dealer price at around $10/100.
noslers, i really don't recall, i believe they were $24.50/250, so i'd guess dealer price to be about $21.
powders $19/pound, and i would guess dealer price to be about $15/pound.
talleys were were $43/each, and i'd imagine dealer price was $41/ea, but am clueless there, because talley sells direct, if you want (outstanding people, btw).
rifle basix lv-1 was $100, dealer is what? $90?? no idea.

as you might imagine, i keep no receipts. i don't keep receipts for the same reason i don't count my guns/scopes, and start the numbering at an odd number on the excel files (which i don't know what the start # is): i don't want to actually know, and i'd rather my wife not know every gritty detail. she knows, and she knows enough, but she doesn't need to know all.

all that was brought on by the $10 x-fer fee. anyway, not a retailer, so no, i really don't know what he paid for his inventory, and don't know what the acceptable mark-up was.

hell w/ it... doesn't matter. the market will eventually correct deficiencies, regardless of who it is, either by running one out of business, or forcing the other to change prices.

as far as the paperwork, no, i don't know what really goes into it - though i have a rudimentary understanding... but, i do pay $10 to x-fer, and i see others claiming anywhere from $5 on up to 50 or more (non-nfa). so, if some are doing it for $5-10, maybe they are making up for it w/ inventory sales, if $5-10 is a losing proposition.

edit: my mistake... the lss came from cabela's, not the 10-dollar dealer... hell, now i'm all flustered... and, to answer your question, no i don't know if i am the exception or the norm... i see people spending a lot more than i, and see folks looking for the $50 mauser special, and nothing more... dunno. not in the business, just a gun-junkie that gets off on burning powder and feeling a little kick...

Spreadfire Arms
June 14, 2005, 02:25 PM
dakotasin,

just be glad you don't live in Belton, Texas...that guy is charging $25 + tax + 10% of the cost of the firearm transferred.

i would agree that is totally out of line!

Spreadfire Arms
August 24, 2006, 02:53 PM
due to having to wait a ridiculous amount of time at the local post office to pick up USPS packages, i have amended my transfer policy as follows:

normal Title I transfers are $10 for THR members if your seller ships via another carrier besdies USPS. if your seller ships via USPS i will not offer the THR discount and it will remain $20 because i am waiting up to 30-40 minutes in line to pick up your package.

i apologize in advance if i inconvenience anybody for this policy change, however, i still feel that $20 is a fair price for a Title I transfer.

eastwood44mag
August 24, 2006, 03:17 PM
Shops near me (15 min or less) are $50 and $100.

Needless to say, I drive another 15 minutes to find a guy who isn't a complete scumbag.

1 old 0311
August 24, 2006, 05:01 PM
$10.00:neener:

skydelta34
August 24, 2006, 05:11 PM
$10 for me also, Kevin and I must use the same ffl.

gezzer
August 24, 2006, 08:12 PM
$10 in our shop. However if you are a regular customer at our discretion FREE. Even then some Customers insist on paying us the $10 as we are the cheapest around.

LiquidTension
August 24, 2006, 11:07 PM
$25 at the pawn shop I use, $40 at the nearest shop.

The gunsmith that used to be over in W. Columbia checked his records. He did over 500 transfers one year, so he raised his price by $10. $35 is a bit high, but I didn't have a problem with it since he always cut me a break on work and he was a friend.

Those guys that want 10% of the cost of the gun are just begging to go out of business.

Tejas Gunwerks
August 25, 2006, 12:24 PM
"$25 at the pawn shop I use, $40 at the nearest shop.

The gunsmith that used to be over in W. Columbia checked his records. He did over 500 transfers one year, so he raised his price by $10. $35 is a bit high, but I didn't have a problem with it since he always cut me a break on work and he was a friend.

Those guys that want 10% of the cost of the gun are just begging to go out of business."

$35.00 may be more than you are willing to pay, but it is not high. FFL's who want 10% of the cost of the gun are not begging to go out of business, they are begging you to take your transfers elsewhere. They really don't want to do them. I assume transfers are an insignificant part of any Dealer's business unless they are a kitchen table FFL. And if they want to get rich $5.00 per transfer, more power to them. They will change their tune with the first audit they have. Transfers are a high risk transaction which $35.00 does not cover the risk of fines, lose of FFL or prision. We have to keep the paperwork for 20 years and they even recommend we keep if we are in business for over 20 years. It is a papertrail that can come back to bite us on the ass.

RustyShackelford
August 25, 2006, 01:33 PM
Hello
In my area I can pay $25.00 for an FFL transfer. :D

If I were you, check GunsAmerica's website; www.GunsAmerica.com go to the contact information for a gun dealer in your zip code and look for the lowest fee, ;) .

It's free and a great time saver.

Many FFL/gunshop dealers charge around $50.00. Why I have no idea. A well run shop can do FFL transfers for $20/25.00 plus any state/local background check fees and still get a profit. Some gun shops list themselves on firearm sites then act like it's a big hassle when you contact them, :rolleyes: . If you can find a good FFL holder/gun shop stay with them and pass it on to other shooting sports/gun owners in your area. Avoid the scam artists and BSers, too :banghead: .

All the best;
RS

RobW
August 25, 2006, 02:27 PM
...that guy is charging $25 + tax + 10% of the cost of the firearm transferred.


I knew one shop with an neglectible inventory that tried the same thing. Was gone within 1 year.

It is not enough to be a gun afficionado to run a gun shop, you have to have marketing skills. Arrogance (especially in dealing with female customers), incompetence (yes, witnessed it in quite a lot of gun shops), and the competition of web companies will result in fast deaths of such enterprises.

Tejas Gunwerks
August 25, 2006, 04:27 PM
"Many FFL/gunshop dealers charge around $50.00. Why I have no idea. A well run shop can do FFL transfers for $20/25.00 plus any state/local background check fees and still get a profit. Some gun shops list themselves on firearm sites then act like it's a big hassle when you contact them, ."

You don't understand because you won't listen to the Dealer's that are telling you why. It can get us put in prison. It is a hassle. We are only doing it for our customers, not as a profit making enterprise. Why don't you go through the "hassle" to get your own FFL. You can do $5.00 transfers to your heart's content.

Alex45ACP
August 25, 2006, 04:36 PM
Another local shop here charges $65 to do transfers. They also sell cases of .223 for $500 :rolleyes:

MudPuppy
August 25, 2006, 06:40 PM
Steve,

How's the best way to request your services, a PM? (as in, getting the mfg a copy of your FFL)

I'm looking at the noDak Spud www.nodakspud.com AK stuff.

Thanks!


PS, why do they even need a hardcopy anymore? (well, other than that's the law, as in shouldn't that be updated...) Can't they just access the database and send it to the listed address?

bamawrx
August 25, 2006, 06:41 PM
Gunbroker has a link to check for FFL's that will do a transfer for you, and they normally show the fee. Try that out. www.gunbroker.com

I think you'll find one close by at a much better rate. I used to pay $10-20, until I found one that did it for free!

MudPuppy
August 25, 2006, 11:59 PM
Well, Steve is here in town, is a THR member, has a great rate, and is a heck of nice guy--can't beat that! :D

duck_god1982
August 26, 2006, 12:24 AM
usually bewteen 25 to 30 dollars. thats in socal

Big Mike
August 26, 2006, 06:03 PM
It seems like all that I called in my town are between $25-40. $50 seems too high. I guess it depends on how far you want to drive to a less expensive FFL and how bad you want whatever you're getting. :o

Spreadfire Arms
January 2, 2007, 02:00 AM
effective immediately i am rescinding the THR member discount for transfers, they will go back up to $20 (instead of $10) for a Title I transfer and $50 (instead of $40) for a Title II transfer.

my apologies for any inconvenience. feel free to PM me as to my reasons why i am discontinuing this discount to THR members. i may go back and re-establish it in the future but as of now this THR member discount is null and void.

there is another discount available if you are a member of another discussion website. that one still stands.

mrcpu
January 2, 2007, 03:12 AM
Well, it's still a good deal for me at least, Local Good GUys here wants 45 for an FFL... Grrrrrr.

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