Cop Stabbed During Dunkin' Donuts Heist


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TechBrute
June 29, 2005, 04:32 PM
No one will disagree that the cop is a hero, but I'm surprised that there is no mention of him having a piece. I don't know if NY cops can carry off duty or what the whole story is.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160923,00.html

BROOKLYN, New York — A heroic off-duty cop was slashed yesterday in a fierce struggle with a vicious punk who was holding up a Brooklyn Dunkin' Donuts (search), cops said.

Officer Vincent Schiavelli, 24, who has made 64 collars in his two years in the NYPD, walked into the shop just as the heist was going down, cops said.

Dramatic surveillance photos show the robber — who wore a Yankee cap and was later identified by cops as 22-year-old Shron Killings — jumped on top of the counter and lunged at the clerk, trying to slash him with a folding knife.

The robber was reaching into the cash register when Schiavelli — wearing a white T-shirt — grabbed him from behind and the two began struggling. The punk, a suspect in two other Dunkin' Donuts robberies with two prior arrests, lunged at the hero cop with his knife but missed.

Schiavelli then got the thug in a bear hug and tried to subdue him. That's when Killings slashed the hero cop in the left side and ran outside, police said. He drove off in a red Kia SUV and was being sought yesterday.

Schiavelli, unaware of his wounds, ran outside and gave chase, but collapsed in pain. He rushed back into the store and called for help.

Schiavelli, who suffered a cut about an inch long where the chest meets the abdomen, was taken to Kings County Hospital, where he was in stable condition. He was kept overnight for observation.

Schiavelli was visited by his parents, Paul and Kathy, and by a steady stream of fellow officers.

"I've been proud of my son since the day he was born," said Kathy as she left the hospital.

Police Commissioner Ray Kelly was effusive in his praise of the brave officer. Schiavelli "did a terrific job. We're proud of him. He took immediate action without concern for his own safety," Kelly said.

His actions "represent the finest traditions of the NYPD. If he wasn't there, the clerk may very well have been wounded."

Mayor Bloomberg said, "Although we have come to expect this kind of heroism from our police officers, what makes Officer Schiavelli's actions so exceptional is that he was off duty at the time.

"This young officer, out of uniform and without a partner, didn't hesitate to put himself in harm's way to protect a fellow New Yorker."

The drama at the store at 40 Empire Blvd. in the Prospect Lefferts Gardens (search) section unfolded at 6:40 a.m. as Schiavelli was heading to work at the nearby 71st Precinct in Crown Heights (search).

The surveillance video showed the robber walking into the shop carrying a dollar in his left hand and ordering a French cruller. No one else was there.

When the clerk turned to get the doughnut, Killings took the folding knife out of his right pocket but held it under the counter.

He gave the dollar to the clerk, who opened the register. At that point, he lunged at the clerk and Schiavelli grabbed him.

As the suspect fled, a witness copied the license plate of the SUV and cops traced it to Killings' mother, who said she lent it to her son.

Cops said Killings was a suspect in a $300 stickup at the same store on May 17 and a $400 holdup at a Dunkin' Donuts on Utica Avenue on May 25.

An accomplice, Jims Medy, 18, was arrested on June 11 in connection with the first robbery.

Killings' prior arrests are for criminal possession of a weapon and unlicensed operation of a motor vehicle.

Shalha Khairkhah, the manager of the Prospect Lefferts Gardens shop, said: "We were very lucky the officer was there. Otherwise I don't know what would have happened."

Demetrius Hinson, 23, who works at a Wendy's next door to the doughnut shop, said he moved to Brooklyn two weeks ago from Charlotte, N.C.

"This is all shocking to me," he said. "This doesn't make me want to stay in New York City. It makes me want to grab my things and get out."

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garyk/nm
June 29, 2005, 04:44 PM
Saw the video of this on Fox last night. No hesitation on the officer's part, just jumped in knee-deep and tried to get things under control. I wonder if Officer Schiavelli "clanks" when he walks?
(Big...made of brass...never mind).

Officer, I salute you!

Henry Bowman
June 29, 2005, 04:45 PM
Appears that the off-duty cop LEO was unarmed. :(

I like the way Fox News added some "balance" by calling the "suspect" both a "punk" and a "thug"! :D


Dramatic surveillance photos show the robber — who wore a Yankee cap Those Yankee fans! :rolleyes:

rhubarb
June 29, 2005, 04:58 PM
Imagine that! A cop whose desire to protect the public and stop a bad guy is more important than his own safety.

Imagine that! A post on THR about a cop that refers to him as a hero.

Thank you, Officer Schiavelli.

Imagine that! A cop walks into a donut shop...sorry

TechBrute
June 29, 2005, 05:03 PM
Imagine that! A post on THR about a cop that refers to him as a hero. :rolleyes:

MechAg94
June 29, 2005, 05:04 PM
Good work officer!

I guess a comment about the location would be inappropriate. :) ....no hesitation..... :)

Vernal45
June 29, 2005, 05:05 PM
Imagine that! A cop whose desire to protect the public and stop a bad guy is more important than his own safety.


A real cop. Hats off to the officer.

Drizzt
June 29, 2005, 05:24 PM
I saw that on the news earlier today. I made the comment at the time that it had to be running through the officer's mind how much of a cliche his being there would be.... You know that after the congrats and slaps on the back when he gets back to work, there's going to be a little bit of razzing going on.

DorGunR
June 29, 2005, 09:50 PM
Never get between a cop and his donuts. :)






Sorry I couldn't help myself...........actually I think the cop is a brave man and I hope he gets a promotion out of this.

nico
June 29, 2005, 10:08 PM
All jokes aside, I know one place where that cop will never have to pay for a donut and coffee again :)

Standing Wolf
June 29, 2005, 11:29 PM
The punk, a suspect in two other Dunkin' Donuts robberies with two prior arrests...

Yet another parole and probation poster boy.

dinosaur
June 30, 2005, 06:23 AM
He was unarmed which if you knew the neighborhood you'd think he was nuts. :what: He's a heavy hitter with about 46 arrests in a 2 year period.

There are pics from a surveillance camera out there on the net that show the whole thing.

Now that the starting pay in the NYPD is $25,000 you'll be seeing much more of these heroics. :rolleyes:

slowworm
June 30, 2005, 06:37 AM
Never get between a cop and his donuts.

Thank you, I needed a good laugh this morning :)

As someone else said, a real cop and hats off to him.

Lennyjoe
June 30, 2005, 11:17 AM
Wonder why he wasn't carrying a weapon while off duty. Is it that maybe he can't carry one being in NY? What's the laws there for CCW and off duty cops?

AF_INT1N0
June 30, 2005, 11:28 AM
I believe he is allowed to carry off duty. Kahr K-40/K-9 I think. He may just not have had it on him. Or had it in the car. "I won't need it I'm just going to the donut shop..

Bet ya $10 he'll have it on him from now on though.

Either way...Damn good job..

peacefuljeffrey
June 30, 2005, 11:34 AM
When an unarmed cop attempts to subdue an armed assailant, gets slashed (injury to be cared for at taxpayer expense, I assume, as well as time off work), and the assailant gets away after the unarmed cop is unable to apprehend him, I question whether there was any need for his intervention at all. The story says that they know the assailant's identity, and he is as yet not in custody.

Please tell me how the cop's actions helped any, and why the result of his actions are worth his injury. My own feeling is that if he did not have a gun on him, he should not have intervened. Or are we now of the opinion on THR that it's wise for anyone, cop or otherwise, to engage in hand-to-hand combat against a blade-wielding opponent? I thought it was well and thoroughly settled that if you go hand-to-knife, or even knife-to-knife, you are very likely to be cut even if you otherwise triumph.

I don't mean to diminish the officer's heroism -- it does take courage to go after the knife-wielder -- it's just that the reasoning behind it seems a bit off, to me.

-Jeffrey

Steve in PA
June 30, 2005, 12:05 PM
Ask the clerk in the donut shop what he/she thinks of the actions of the cop.

peacefuljeffrey
June 30, 2005, 12:21 PM
It seemed to me that the attempt to stab the donut clerk had already been made, and failed, by the time the cop intervened.

It is just bad cop-sense for an NYC cop, off-duty or not, to not have a firearm on him -- and this would have been the ideal situation where it would have come in handy.

We really can't say whether the cop's actions prevented injury to the clerk. I presume that once the money was obtained, the thug would have gone off on his way. (He did so on the other occasions when he robbed the place. Oh, I'm sorry... allegedly robbed the place.)

My problem is with the idea of a cop being unarmed. Talk about squandering the right to carry. :banghead:


-Jeffrey

TechBrute
June 30, 2005, 12:23 PM
Please tell me how the cop's actions helped any, and why the result of his actions are worth his injury. Uh... because he acted when the perp began to assault the clerk. This is what a cop is SUPPOSED to do.

peacefuljeffrey
June 30, 2005, 12:24 PM
Yes, and what was that about bringing bare hands to a knife fight?

Or one poster's admonition: "Have a gun!" :uhoh:

While I grant that the comparison is differentially weighted, I would not want a cop to simply jump into the water with me if I had fallen off the Maid of the Mist. :rolleyes:

Isn't there something to be said for the expectation that a cop, on duty or off, would apply judgment to his decision of how to render assistance?

If an off-duty fireman ran into a burning building to rescue babies and succumbed to smoke because (and he should know this) he is not immune to asphyxiation, and he cost himself his life or his health, I would not be calling him a hero so much as I would be saying he was brash, and his training had failed him somehow. These are all guys who have been trained how to approach a situation, and rule number one, I would imagine, would be BE PREPARED.

Going off half-cocked and ill-prepared is not heroic. It's reckless. Doesn't seem to do much good for anyone, either. It was someone else who got the license plate, after all. Now we have an injured cop. Why? Primo reason: he didn't have a GUN to use, or if he did, he didn't choose to use it.


-Jeffrey

Steve in PA
June 30, 2005, 01:03 PM
Some cops carry off-duty, some don't. It looks like in this instance, he wasn't.

He saw something taking place and reacted. The same way a fireman driving down the street will probably run into a burning house (not fully engulfed) to save someone's life. Its what they do.

Yes, being prepared would be a good thing, although I don't know too many fireman that carry bunker gear and air packs in thier pov. Last winter, two on duty cops here in PA ran into a burning house to save a family. I guess according to you they should have just stood by and watched them burn since they "weren't prepared"?

Matt G
June 30, 2005, 01:23 PM
First rule of a gunfight: Have a gun.

This probably should have been an easy gunfight. Unfortunately, this officer was unarmed. Okay. So he shoulda grabbed his piece when he left the house to feed his donut habit ( :D ) that morning. But he didn't. Should have had the gun. Got it.

Now, he enters the store and sees a bad guy attempting to stab a clerk. What should this unarmed cop do? The Bad Guy is still up on the counter, posing an immediate threat to the clerk, and doesn't yet know that the cop is there. What should the unarmed cop do? Run back outside the store and call for backup? (Shrug) I guess he could very well have done that, and he would have been within policy. Only problem with that, is that by doing so, he's left the knife-wielder in there with the clerk, threatening to cut the clerk. Suppose someone else walks in, and a hostage situation develops? No, a brave man who weighs his chances might well sieze the opportunity and grab the guy. Is it the very best option for all concerned? I don't know. I wasn't there and neither were you. But the fact is, it was a quick response that took guts, and it effectively rendered the robber incapable of harming the clerk. The officer stopped the threat to a citizen, while risking only (ONLY) his own skin. Would it have been better if the cop had managed to bring the guy into custody, and not get hurt? You bet. Too bad he couldn't. It wasn't for lack of trying, though.

I'm utterly fascinated at how someone could find a way to criticize the cop in the way he handled this, based entirely upon that story. :scrutiny:

Here's to Officer Schiavelli-- a good cop who serves his public.


Oh, and nowhere did it say that they had the identity of the perp. They just said that he was suspected in two other Duncan Donut robberies.

(What kind of moron holds up a Duncan Donuts? Might as well attempt to rob a FOP convention...)

Khaotic
June 30, 2005, 02:17 PM
What kind of moron holds up a Duncan Donuts? Might as well attempt to rob a FOP convention...

Damn, ya beat me to the punchline!

+1 Cop - he made the best he could out of the situation, really.

It probably happened fairly quick, and out of sheer protective reflex he acted immediately without concern for himself, and gave it his best shot at not only protecting the clerk, but trying to apprehend the suspect.

For mine own I am of the opinion that everyone should pack iron 24-7, including LE folks, on or off duty, cause it's like packing a condom in your shirt pocket... you may never need it, but the one time you do, man it's nice to have one handy, ehe ? :D

-K

roo_ster
June 30, 2005, 02:39 PM
In an ideal world, Schiavelli and other patrons of the donut shop would have CCWs. Well, it ain't an ideal world, its New York. Schiavelli saw an attack on somebody & did his best to prevent it.

He did what he could with what he had at the time, succeeds in foiling the attack, and gets off with a moderately serious knife wound. The BG gets picked up later.

That seems like a pretty good outcome, with the exception of the officer's wound.

bytor94
June 30, 2005, 03:28 PM
The 'alleged' robber was arrested just down the road from me. He had come to VA to hide out at his brother’s apartment.



All content © Copyright 2000 - 2005 WorldNow and WAVY. All Rights Reserved.

A suspect wanted in New York City for allegedly stabbing an off-duty police officer who intervened as officials say the man was trying to rob a donut shop was apprehended Tuesday afternoon in Newport News.

Shron Lamont Killings was arrested around 4:45pm at an apartment in the 400 block of Turlington Road. Newport News police say the apartment was being rented by Killings' brother. According to authorities, when they arrived at the apartment, Killings tried to flee - but he was apprehended as he tried to escape through a window.

The robbery attempt at a Brooklyn Dunkin' Donuts Monday was replayed across the country and on cable news outlets after the incident was recorded by store surveillance cameras.

In the video, the knife-wielding suspect tries to jump the counter in an apparent robbery attempt.

An off-duty NYC police officer who was also in line at the donut shop is seen in the video grabbing the suspect during his jump attempt, then wrestling with the suspect until he eventually flees from the location.

During the encounter, the suspect appears to swing his knife towards the officer.

The New York Daily News reports the officer was released Tuesday from the hospital where had been receiving treatment for his wound.

Killings remains in custody in Newport News awaiting extradition to New York City.

You New Yorkers can have him back. :D

MilsurpShooter
June 30, 2005, 05:07 PM
LEO's are allowed to carry while off duty in NY, however I know several who choose not too. Perpetrator was arrested in Virginia I believe today after trying to escape out the back window of his brothers apartment. The perp in question was actually using his mothers car and the NY Daily News reported that he had robbed this Dunkin Dounuts before, and robbed it this time to try to get money to fill the gas tank of the car so he could go to his sentencing for the previous robbery.

As far as what the cop doing not being necessary, well from the security tape it looks like the guy had tried to stab the clerk in the eye allready. Granted if the guy who intervened was a cop or not, I'd hope someone would help me out and not stand behind with hands in pockets saying it's not my job if someone pulled a knife on me at work.

I give those NYPD guys all the credit that they deserve and then some, pay for rookies has recently been lowered to $25,000, quite a low amount for asking a guy to strap on a gun, a vest and go out there and stop violent criminals.

I thank all the good cops I can when I can do it safely. Actually brought a cup of coffee to one cop who was just coming off traffic duty due to the latest flooding on my local parkway, would have brought him a doughnut but told him that would have probably been to cliche lol.

dhoomonyou
June 30, 2005, 05:36 PM
had he shot this POS, I'm sure SHARPTON would have been marching, complaining that a "good son" had been shot and killed when ALL he had was a knife.

Matt G
June 30, 2005, 06:01 PM
Does anyone have a link to video footage of the incident?

jcoiii
June 30, 2005, 06:37 PM
Jeffrey, I'm glad you're not a cop

peacefuljeffrey
July 1, 2005, 01:19 AM
Dude, you don't know jack s#it about me, and your comment is taken as it was intended -- as a personal ad hominem attack.

Nothing about my posts in this thread indicates, or should be taken to indicate, that I myself am not capable of or willing to commit heroic acts. Quite the opposite is true. I once was summoned to kayak out into rough surf to rescue a failing swimmer when no other rescue was available. I remain willing to help others even at risk to myself.

The difference, I suspect, between me and this cop would be that I would not be the kind of dolt cop who opts to not carry a firearm in his off-duty moments.

Obviously, cop thinks of himself as a cop 24/7. Why, then, would he not carry a weapon 24/7 as well? Does he randomly show up for his work shifts and say, "Meh. Don't figure I'll be needing the gun today"?

Meanwhile, keep your personal attacks to yourself.

-Jeffrey

peacefuljeffrey
July 1, 2005, 01:22 AM
LEO's are allowed to carry while off duty in NY, however I know several who choose not to.


Any cop, especially a NYC cop, who decides to not carry a firearm while off duty is not a cop through-and-through. I believe it is to the point of shirking his responsibility.

That just strikes me as a very injudicious decision.


-Jeffrey

AK-74me
July 1, 2005, 02:15 AM
Cops get worn out about the doughnut thing, but honestly .... who dosen't like doughnuts?

They're so good once they hit your lips (sorry old school reference)


If I was a cop my local doughnut shop would be extra secure too.

Mr. Loud Guns
July 1, 2005, 02:44 AM
That is why it is better to be armed :D Anyhow how could someone not be bad if they had a last name of Killings. Mmmmmmmmm, doghnuts!

Steve in PA
July 1, 2005, 03:49 AM
The cop/donut thing has been going on forever.

However, what people fail to realize is that the donut shops usually make the best coffee. This is what cops are addicted to, coffee :D

Elmer
July 1, 2005, 04:16 AM
Any cop, especially a NYC cop, who decides to not carry a firearm while off duty is not a cop through-and-through. I believe it is to the point of shirking his responsibility.

I usually try and stay off this part of THR because of all the cop-bashing. This thread catches my eye, so I think, hey, nobody can bad mouth this cop.

I was wrong.

"peaceful" jeffery, you complain about personal attacks on yourself, yet call this brave cop a "dolt", for not having a gun with him. Maybe he normally carries, maybe he was going jogging, who knows? Maybe he just made a mistake. But it's you that doesn't know "jack s#it" about this cop, or what happened. Despite your weak hero kayak story, I doubt you have the stones this kid has.

I think you're the dolt. I would call you an a**hole, but it's The High Road, and I'm not supposed to.

dinosaur
July 1, 2005, 05:32 AM
The difference, I suspect, between me and this cop would be that I would not be the kind of dolt cop who opts to not carry a firearm in his off-duty moments.

There's an easy way to find out, take the test. Here's a link to the recruitment page. http://www.nypd2.org/html/recruit/policeofficer.html

280PLUS
July 1, 2005, 05:50 AM
Uncle "Pete" , as a rookie, apprehended 2 shoplifting suspects off duty and unarmed. He took them both outside to wait for the on duty guys and somehow one of them managed to cave his skull in with a piece of debris picked up off of the ground. He was lucky to survive, it almost killed him. Needless to say, he was never off duty and unarmed again. I suspect the same will hold true for Officer Schiavelli after this incident. Young cops WILL make this mistake but most usually learn from it. Providing they survive.

Other than that +1 for the officer's bravery and sense of duty! I'm glad he's ok.

Urban Werewolf
July 1, 2005, 06:05 AM
While it may have been a mistake to be unarmed in his position, it's nice to see that someone was willing to take the risk and do the right, brave thing in the situation. I can only hope that a few people out there that aren't even LEO's would be willing to do the same to try and save a fellow human being's life. Personally I think the society as a whole could use a few more sets of big brass ones like this guy.

Matt G
July 1, 2005, 08:31 AM
Found the video myself.
Go to this story (http://www.officer.com/article/article.jsp?id=24418&siteSection=1), click on "Launch Video", and then click on the little window with the screen capture from the security camera on it.

I'll say this: the incident took place FAST!

The knife wielder was still a serious threat to the clerk. His first swipe with the knife I really believe was an attempt to cut her. :mad:

The officer's situational awareness was not particularly good to begin with. (hands in pockets, took a second to realize what was going on.)

The officer never managed to get a bearhug on the guy-- he just dragged him off the counter and got swiped across the abdomen for his trouble. (ow!) At no point did he ever have control of Shron Killings' hands. Killings was QUICK with that knife, too.

For all his being human, the officer was a hero, without any doubt.

TechBrute
July 1, 2005, 09:38 AM
I don't expect a cop to carry 24/7, as I don't expect him to be a cop 24/7. Personally, I don't see a hero cop in this store, I see a hero citizen.

Being a cop is just a job. Just like any other job you're entitiled to your time off.

Regardless of whether you are a cop or not, if you have the ability to legally carry, you should seriously consider it.

Elmer
July 1, 2005, 02:56 PM
Taking action in these kind of situations is not human nature, and it is not the norm. Despite what most armchair hero's think they'll do, mostly people freeze.

At the McDonalds massacre in San Diego, the people in the restaurant mainly sat still while Huberty walked around methodically shooting people.

I have a feeling if this kid were there, even unarmed, he would have taken his best shot at stopping him.

He's a hero in my book.

Ryder
July 2, 2005, 07:43 AM
An off-duty NYC police officer who was also in line at the donut shop is seen in the video grabbing the suspect

That's what I saw in the video. He actually grabs the robber from behind.

Why didn't he coldcock the guy in the head? The knifer didn't even know he was back there. It is good that the officer did something but he didn't have to get cut IMO.

rudolf
July 2, 2005, 07:10 PM
Even an ASP would have come handy in this case.

CAPTAIN MIKE
July 3, 2005, 12:24 PM
The young officer jumped right in and deserves our thanks and respect.

But, hey, I hope when he gets back to the station-house, and all the backslapping and thank-yous are all done, that his boss takes him quietly into the office and says "Dude, where the heck was your piece - and why wasn't it pulled out to SHOOT the bad guy?"

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