[mattw]

I was thumbing through the new issue of Shooting Times at the store (Wal-Mart #5079 a.k.a. Stalag Luft 3 to employees) And i saw an article that was touting the quality and reliability of Hi-Point handguns, specifically the .40 and .45 full size models. It was my opinion that they were just cheap junk like jennings and firestorm, they've always crappy to me. What do you guys think?

[thebucket]

My Hi Point 380 worked just fine. It never jammed on me, shot at least as well as I could. In the end, though, it was too bulky for my taste and I traded it in. I've thought about getting the cheap 9mm one for a knock around gun though. You won't care too much about scratching them up or dropping them in the mud (and it won't care either).

[clone]

i personlay like mine. i have a hi point jhp 45 that hasnt jammed in 1020 rounds and gets 2" groups at 15 yards. i cant complain its allways worked and eats most any ammo.

[mattw]

if i keep getting replies like those i guess i'll trust shooting times :eek:

[hksw]

When they first came out I was not impressed by them. Didn't hate them, but certainly didn't like them.

After reading all of opinions on line for a while it seemed to me that the folks who hated them were generally ones who have never owned or shot them, the ones who liked them either owned or shot them.

Being the curious and analytical type that I am, I decided to see for myself and went and got one at a gun show.

In short, not pretty, pretty bulky, a bit heavy with a very heavy recoil spring (but that's what you get for being a simple blowback with 9mm, .40SW, and .45ACP). Trigger isn't the best for sure but for $100-$130, what can you expect. One thing it does do well, though, is shoot (from my experience with my gun). My Hi-Point's failure rate is <0.05% including reloads (ammo related failures). Haven't had any failures since around the 2000 round mark.

[Bobby Lee]

There is no reason to buy a Highpoint.

For what you pay for one of these you can a good surplus handgun such as a Star BM, Makarov, or a few others.


You can also find a good old S&W revolver.

[Crosshair]

Don't know about their pistols, but their carbines are superb.

[boofus]

Get one and find out if it's really half decent or a total POS throw away crime gun.

[chris in va]

HiPoint is not what you think. Ugly, but they work. When the gun wears out, send it in and they replace all the worn parts...for life.

My carbine has shot flawlessly after they sent it back to me. Very fun to shoot.

[TimboKhan]

Actually, I sort of want one of the hi-point carbines. They regularly receive good reviews. As for their handguns.... hmm... I have seen them, obviously, and I was unimpressed. That said, I am consistently surprised with how many people I talk to that love them. Maybe there is something to be said for that, but I gotta say that I have no intention of buying a hi-point pistol now or ever. I can save a little bit longer and buy a used Ruger, save a little bit longer than that and buy a new Ruger or Taurus and have about a million times the quality (both real and percieved) that a Hi-Point has. Now, I actually read an interview somewhere with the owner of Hi-Point, and his is a fascinating story of what amounts to mom-and-pop gun manufacturing. he was baking frames in a oven, and talked at length about how he did NOT like the fact that Hi-Point had developed a reputation of being nothing more than a saturday night special. He also impressed me with his dedication to customer service, as he did say that he guaranteed his guns for life, which is nice. Still and all, I personally will never own one of his pistols.

Timbo

[blackdragon]

Quote:
There is no reason to buy a Highpoint.
For what you pay for one of these you can a good surplus handgun such as a Star BM, Makarov, or a few others.

Sure there is. Warranty, and support. Your Star throws a firing pin, you need to find one, or someone who can fix it. Yout hipoint breaks, you send it for warranty work. HUGE difference.

Yeah, they are ugly, and maybe have 'bad' triggers. But *I* think Glocks are ugly, and don't like SIG triggers either.

Do they work? yes, and from what I hear, as reliable (or more so) than guns 10x their price. And for some, that is all that matters.

(personally, I like stylish guns. no hipoints, but 92fsbrig, 1911s, storm, even 3x star bms. But that's me, and I'd never talk someone out of buying a reliable firearm just because I don't like it's appearance....)

keith

[hksw]

Let me correct myself. I did get one misfeed (round missed the hole and lodged nose first into the corner between the chamber and slide) and one eject failure with factory ammo. The rest were reloads.

[Ash]

Hey Bobby, they might not be pretty, they might not be sexy, but as long as they work, right? I mean, a polymer striker-fired pistol with a lifetime warranty, must be indestructible. Who cares if they are ugly? Who cares if they lack soul? They're a tool, right? :D

Ash

[RoyG]

There is no reason to buy a Highpoint.
For what you pay for one of these you can a good surplus handgun such as a Star BM, Makarov, or a few others.

Found one today at a pawn shop. A 45acp. It was tagged $119.99, Ask him what the lowest I could get it for. $50 plus tax... It will be a few days before I get to the range with it. I'll let you all know how it is.

BTW... Stars and Maks go for $160 and up around here. And I do mean up. I know where there was a "REAL RUSSIAN GUN" (that's what the dealer had written on the tag) for $500. Believe it or not someone bought it.

[albanian]

"There is no reason to buy a Highpoint.

For what you pay for one of these you can a good surplus handgun such as a Star BM, Makarov, or a few others.


You can also find a good old S&W revolver."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wish people would stop saying things like this! You are only going to drive up the prices on Star BMs and S&W M&Ps if you keep it up! :cuss: If someone wnat to buy a new Hi-Point 9mm clunker for $140, let them! That is one less Star BM off the market for us savy gun buyers! :D

[Ash]

My jests aside, I agree with Bobby. A BM would make a far better side arm.

Ash

[CajunBass]

Well, I saw my first Hi-Point today. I thought I'd see what all the fuss was about so I bought it. A C9, 9mm. It's sort of heavy. It's sort of ugly. But it was cheap.

I got the gun, and a box of 115 gr, American Eagle, FMJ and went around back to the range. A few minutes later I had 50 empty cases on the ground. It didn't miss a beat, literally out of the box. I didn't measure the groups, but they were pretty darn good at the 7 yard line.

So far, so good. :)

Actually, I like this thing.

[denfoote]

They MAY have gotten better over the years, but the one I had, admittedly, almost a decade ago, was dangerous to a fault!! :what:

It jammed almost continuously and the slam fire was the last straw!! I buried it somewhere in the vast Sonoran desert!! :evil:

So, for me, it becomes a "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me!!!" thing!!!! ;)

[SLCDave]

I got my copy of the magazine too. If I could find them for around $100 and if they are as reliable as the article made them out to be, I can see keeping them in a toolbox or in the truck console.

The same magazine has a good article on the Taurus PT1911.

[RoyG]

He threw in a box of ammo also...

Don't expect a lot from it but if it works I'm happy... If it doesn't $25 bucks to ship it in for a rebuild...

[RoyG]

You can also find a good old S&W revolver.

I bought one of those the other day also. Like new Smith Model 36 for $180.

[albanian]

I will say one thing for the Hi-Point, they do give you a lifetime warrenty. I don't know how much of that is gimmick but not very many gun companies give that kind of warrenty. If it does break, make them fix it. It is too bad that it costs $30-40 to ship a handgun. :cuss:

[larry starling]

Poor Quality... I would avoid Hi-points. :evil:

[armoredman]

I have told people for years to avoid Hi-Point, and everyone who buys one keeps telling me, hey, they work. I haven't shot one since it was the horrible JS Maverick, but the lifetime warrentee means the company really believes in the product, and they DON'T want to go broke rebuilding everyone's gun over and over again. This fact alone sparks interest in the company. Did Jennings/Bryco/Davis/Raven/Phoenix ever offer a 5 minute warentee, much less lifetime?
No, I won't buy one right now, now would I ever trade my beloved CZ 75 PO1 on one, but if a Hi-Point was the ONLY thing I could get, maybe that wouldn't be such a bad thing. A 45 for $150? Works? Lifetime guarentee? Hmmm...

[JohnKSa]

There's more to quality than simply function.

And a lifetime guarantee is not necessarily an indicator of product fitness. Only that the manufacturer knows they can make enough on the people who don't shoot their firearms to compensate for the ones that do. Saying a guarantee implies a quality product would be the same as saying that a person who has car insurance won't have an accident...

[clone]

actully Phoenix does have a lifetime warrenty and i own one in 22. the Phoenix isnt half the gun of the hi point though. iv had to send the Phoenix back twice for a broken frame and a lose 5" barrel in 7000 rounds. also the hi point's trigger lossened up after about 500 rounds and now is quite good. i think the older hi point's where as bad as people say but the latest ones are good guns and well worth the little bit of money that they cost.

[Golddog]

Heavy, ugly, crappy triggers, high recoiling blowback system, awkward ergonomics, questionable reliabilty - unless someone's so poverty stricken that he can't afford a knife or baseball bat, what reason is there to buy one of these things?

Why trust your life to so graceless a piece of junk?

[Ridge]

How about instead of bashing the Hi-Point and praising a larger namebrand firearm,how about you elitist try one out for yourselves.

I've said the Hi-Point was a poor man's Glock for awhile,the reason is simple.

It is just as tough as a Glock and in some cases more accurate.

I've owned both the 9mm. carbine and the C9 both have never failed me.

Now which would you rather have, a nice looking weapon that you can't hit the side of a barn with or a not so good looking weapon that you can hit almost anything you want with at normal handgun range?

[JohnKSa]

How about instead of bashing the Hi-Point and praising a larger namebrand firearm,how about you elitist try one out for yourselves.Not a flipping chance--it's easy to tell that an egg is rotten without eating it.

Besides, the fact that it works means very little. Function is only one part of what makes something a quality product.

[Ridge]

So what you're saying is if it has a high price tag and looks good that means it will work no matter what,because you paid more for it?

In that case you should be in line to pick up a Remington 710 they look nice and have a price tag to boot,yeah that must be a really good rifle by your reasoning.

[plevniak]

I picked up a Hi-point to shoot some old WWII 45 surplus ammo. I couldn't bear the thought of running that junk through my other guns. The gun has worked perfectly right out of the box with any ammo I've fed it. I've only used FMJ as that is the cheap stuff. Warrantee is great. Now, why would I want to get rid of it?

1) Disassembly for cleaning requires a pin to be punched out. A real pain in the rear when my other guns disasemble without tools. Getting the pin out is the easy part...

2) The fit and finish is crude to say the least.

3) The gun's balance is horrible but I do have to say the grip is very comfortable for my large hands.

4) Accuracy is questionable because of the poor slide to frame fit. I could send it back for warrantee service, but I've not really checked the gun from a benchrest to be sure of the problem. The shipping cost is holding me back too.

5) The trigger feel is the worst of any gun I have.

6) The gun is ugly. I don't know of anyone that likes it.

If you want a cheap gun for plinking when no one is around to see you. This may be the gun for you. :)

[armoredman]

Saying a guarantee implies a quality product would be the same as saying that a person who has car insurance won't have an accident...
Car insurance is nothing more than a company stating, "If you do something stupid, or someone else does something to you, or you car is stolen or vandalized, we'll pay for part of it". This is provided through a contracted vendor, to whom you pay a monthly fee.
A warentee comes from the manufacturer, which states, "We believe in the quality of our work, and stand ready to fix it free of charge, should it break." Kinda big differance.
I say again, I will not carry a Hi-Point as long as I can afford my CZs, but for someone on an extreme budget, a Hi-Point and Fed EFMJ ammo might make a life saving combination.

[Bobby Lee]

That warranty won't do you much good if you are lying on the street dying because your stupid choice of a handgun broke and you were not able to use it when you needed it.

When you are lying in the ER with several stab wounds in your belly will you feel better about the whole thing knowing that Highpoint will fix your gun. That is IF the junkie that cut you up did not take it with him. If so then he can get it fixed.

[armoredman]

You weren't listening - I will not carry a Hi-Point as long as I can afford my CZs, but for someone on an extreme budget, a Hi-Point and Fed EFMJ ammo might make a life saving combination.
I'd rather take the chance with a cheap gun than with no gun! Since I don't have to carry a discount pistol, I don't do it, and do carry a very high quality sidearm. Some people cannot afford the best, nor can they afford the second or third best, anything but $100 for a gun show Hi-Point. Yes, I'd rather carry a Star BM, but I know if the 50 year old Star breaks, I have a CZ to use while trying to find Numrichs' stash of rare spare parts.
As for cheap revolvers, lately they have been over $200 around here.

[Bobby Lee]

If I only had $100 to spend I could still find something better to carry than a Highpoint.

If I needed a home defense gun I could still find something better for $100 than a Highpoint.

If I wanted a plinking gun I could find something better than a Highpoint for $100.

As I said before there is no reason that anyone that knows a little about firearms to have to buy a HP.

[guy sajer]

...Besides, the fact that it works means very little. Function is only one part of what makes something a quality product.


I look forward to hearing the logic behind this statement . Please elaborate .

[larry starling]

"How about instead of bashing the Hi-Point and praising a larger namebrand firearm,how about you elitist try one out for yourselves."

I don't need to try somthing to know its crap. I buy what I like, And I dont like Hi-points. There cheap crude and horrible. I can never figure out why someone would trust there life to a gun made out of pot metal. If you chooses to trust your life to a P.O.S, then so be it,I choose not to! :eek:

[armoredman]

Then why do you buy Colt? Every one I shot had something fall off.... 3 1911s, 1 Detective Special, and a Trooper MKIII.
Ah, never mind. I have what I like, you have what you like, and we are satisfied. Leave it at that.

[larry starling]

I own over 25 colt 1911's and a few of there revolvers and I have never had any issues with any of them. I feel people in general over generalize problems they have with firearms. :cool:

[guy sajer]

... I feel people in general over generalize problems they have with firearms.
Like making blanket POS statements about several THR members choice in a pistol without having firsthand experience ?
They're happy with their HP . Why insult their choice ?

[Walt Sherrill]

I don't need to try somthing to know its crap. I buy what I like, And I dont like Hi-points. There cheap crude and horrible. I can never figure out why someone would trust there life to a gun made out of pot metal. If you chooses to trust your life to a P.O.S, then so be it,I choose not to!

Most of the guys here aren't using the Hi-Points to protect their lives, but it seems that most of the OWNERS (who have direct experience with the guns) think it might not be THAT big of a risk.

The rest of your rant, above, sounds exactly like what folks said when the first polymer guns came out. (I suspect its not greatly dissimilar with what was said about the first horseless carriages.)

Just because YOU don't see utility in a particular device doesn't mean that other must look at it the same way.

[clone]

heh some of these people make me laugh. :rolleyes: there not happy unless they over pay for a gun that "looks" better. they dont even try the gun but they r sure that its a POS. :rolleyes: all i can say is some of these people r just ignorent and being child-like, u people know who u r. but hey keep it up i need a good laugh. :neener:

oh as of this weekend i have now put 1140 rounds of CCI blazer and other +P ammo through my Hi-Point JHP 45acp without one FTF or FTE. so sense u guys know this pistol better then me when is this POS pistol suppost to go bad? :p

[Pietro Beretta]

First of all I am going to try to spell everything correctly, since I can barely understand the other posts in this section.

I first saw and handled a hi-point a year ago.

Specifically the Hi-Point 9mm Compact

My first impression was that it was bulky, did not fit in the hand well, a bit heavy, horrible creep and trigger pull, and the machining was to say not smooth at all. You look at the gun, and you do not see quality at all.

This was brand-new Just taken out of the box.

Then I fired the gun.

Surprisingly the first clip fired/fed flawlessly.

However I switched to hollow points and that was a different story. The first 5 shots jammed, then the next 3 cycled.

I then kept cycling (with ought firing) hollow point rounds through it to see if the feeding ramp would smooth itself out. Indeed after 2 more clips of just cycling the hollow point ammo, it fed fine.

Finally at the end of the day I fired 200 rounds through it. With a total of 11 jams
(that’s too many in my book)

As for accuracy...I was shooting cans and bottles at about 25 feet and hit what I was aiming at 9 out of 10 times.

I was then told the price of the gun, and that it came with a Lifetime no questions asked warranty. That made me surprised.

I WOULD NOT under any circumstance recommend this gun for a personal protection gun.

However for $140 out the door, with a lifetime warranty I would consider it for recreational plinking. ONLY

[JohnKSa]

Car insurance is nothing more than a company stating, "If you do something stupid, or someone else does something to you, or you car is stolen or vandalized, we'll pay for part of it". This is provided through a contracted vendor, to whom you pay a monthly fee. Car insurance is a company saying that if you pay us this much, we'll pay for your accident expenses even if they're more than what you paid us. Clearly there's a gamble because you could wipe out all the premiums you paid them and more in a single accident. They can do it because on average they know they'll take in more than they pay out. NOT because they're guaranteeing you're not going to have an accident.

A gun warranty is a company saying that if you pay us this much, we'll provide you a gun and replace/repair it as often as necessary. Clearly there's a gamble because you might need several replacements in a lifetime if you shoot a lot. They can do it because on average they know they'll make more than they pay out. NOT because they're guaranteeing that the product will never break or wear out.

The similarity is clear. Both are playing the odds that they'll be able to make enough money on the large number of people who pay premiums or buy guns but don't have accidents or break the guns to cover the people who do have accidents or break guns. Neither is implying that the negative outcome can't or won't happen, they're just saying that they can cover the loss and still make money. there not happy unless they over pay for a gun that "looks" betterI'm far from being a price/appearance groupie when it comes to guns. I own several Glocks (need I say more?) and at least two centerfire rifles that I paid less than $100 each for ($65 & $75). And while I haven't shot an HP, I've definitely examined several. In the same way I was able to determine that the two rifles were good quality (though cheap) and the Glocks were good quality (though not particularly aesthetic) I am able to determine that the HP is poor quality. I look forward to hearing the logic behind this statement . Please elaborate .Come on--REALLY? Are you REALLY saying that you believe the only measure of quality that matters in a firearm is function? So when you read a gun review the ONLY parts you read about are the tests to see if it fires and feeds reliably? You care nothing about ergonomics, fit, finish, materials, sights, maintainability, size, weight, trigger weight, trigger quality, durability, etc?I'd rather take the chance with a cheap gun than with no gun! Sure, but I don't have to, I can afford a good quality gun. (Which, by the way, would be true even if I had much less to spend than I typically do.) You can bet that if the day comes that I REALLY need a firearm and I can't find anything but an HP for the money I can spend, that's what I'll buy. It won't make me happy, but that's life sometimes. Happily, that's not something I have to worry about right now.

[guy sajer]

Come on--REALLY? Are you REALLY saying that you believe the only measure of quality that matters in a firearm is function? So when you read a gun review the ONLY parts you read about are the tests to see if it fires and feeds reliably? You care nothing about ergonomics, fit, finish, materials, sights, maintainability, size, weight, trigger weight, trigger quality, durability, etc?

We're referencing a $100 9mm pistol , not a $1600 Les Baer . For $100 I don't think most are too concerned with fit and finish . They want it to work . They're not expecting a Gold Cup . If ergonomics, fit, finish, materials, sights, maintainability, size, weight, trigger weight, trigger quality were that important to the $100 customer , Hi Point wouldn't be selling thousands upon thousands every year . Customers are buying a gun that works . As for durability, I've seen more than a few take some pretty good abuse and keep working . If by chance they quit working , warranty turn around is about a week and they throw in a free mag for your trouble .

As for reviews , who really takes any gun rag reviews at face value . It's purely for entertaiment .

I'm not telling anyone to buy or not to buy . It's none of my business . I do get tired of people dogging others for making their own decisions .

[JohnKSa]

Yes really. ...We're referencing a $100 9mm pistolQuality is quality. A lower price doesn't make something higher quality than it would be if the price were higher.I don't think most are too concerned with fit and finishThey may not be able to afford it, but that doesn't make them blind. They may not be able to afford the trigger pull that comes on a $1600 gun, but that doesn't mean they can't feel that the trigger on their $100 gun is gritty, creepy and heavy.If ergonomics, fit, finish, materials, sights, maintainability, size, weight, trigger weight, trigger quality were that important to the $100 customer Not being able to afford something doesn't mean it's not important. It just means it's out of reach. Affordability is also not a measure of quality, nor does it raise the quality of a product. It merely puts it within reach of the less well off.I'm not telling anyone to buy or not to buy . It's none of my business . I do get tired of people dogging others for making their own decisions .Neither am I! Where in the heck did you get the idea that I was??? The question was whether HP made quality firearms or not. They don't. Am I telling people not to buy them? No! Why would I care what people buy?

And as far as gun reviews, there are more gun reviews than just what you read in gun magazines. Some of the more informative reviews I've read have been on this very forum.

[Jim101]

I Bought a Hi-Poine 9mm abjout 1 1/2 yrs ago, so did my friend...We were at a Gun Show and before taxes they were $98 each..I fire it every time I go the the Range, about once a week, 50 rounds each visit no problems after the first 250 rounds..My friend had a problem with his FTF, 2 rounds per clip, the called Hi-Point, talked to a tech and they sent him a new firing pin and spring, the spring fixed his problem....ugly? yes, but it is a good truck gun and still fun to fire and have people ask, "What is THAT??"

Jim

[Bobby Lee]

I have seen several Jennings, Bryco, Davis and a few more 100% junk guns that were reliable.

They were very reliable untill something broke and the POS came apart in their hand because of the poor quality materials the junk is made from.

The HP is only one small step above the Jennings and Bryco.

They sell well because of all the ignorant people that just don't know they can buy something better for the same amount of money. :banghead:

[guy sajer]

I guess we will agree to disagree .

I'll leave you with this .

I don't think the latest ATF stats have become available yet , but in 2001 only Ruger , S&W , Beretta and Bryco made more pistols than Hi Point (50,878) . I can guarantee they didn't sell those pistols because of their sleek lines and polished appearance :)
We sell a couple hundred each year . I know first hand from speaking to the customers buying them that most are sold because of price or recommendation from a friend or relative . For many it's a starter gun . For $100-125 , they don't expect too much . But after firing it , they buy a second . I've seen it happen .

I've known their sales manager for many years as he lives/works near our store . Had their production capacity been greater , they would've been possibly the #2 mfg behind only Ruger . Demand is greater than supply .

Have a safe 4th .

[KLR]

There is an old adage that you can put enough thrust behind anything and get it to fly. Same goes for the Hi-Point guns. Heavy slide and heavy springs.

I have had two very bad experiences with Kel-Tec (another of the more inexpensive brands) yet a lot of people swear by them.

My general impression is that for the most part Hi-Points go "bang" when called on. I also think that MKS is counting on the fact that most owners will fire a box or two of ammunition and put the gun away.

My range time is extremely limited. Even though they would probably work, I cannot see spending my limited range time shooting a Hi-Point. I would much rather shoot one of my neglected safe queens.

That said, I would not recommend one of the Hi-Points for ccw. As a house gun for someone on a small budget - maybe. I would probably recommend a CZ-52 over a Hi-Point.

[Bobby Lee]

That said, I would not recommend one of the Hi-Points for ccw. As a house gun for someone on a small budget - maybe.

For what you pay for a HP you can find several different types of good used pump shotguns and possibly a new single shot.

That makes much more sense for anyone that needs something for home defense.

The type of person that would buy a HP for home defense is not going to be able to handle and shoot the gun good enough to be able to use it correctly.

Anyone can cock the hammer on a single shot shotgun and point it at the bad guy and pull the trigger IF they have to.

Many times just seeing a shotgun is enough to make them change their minds and leave without getting shot.

As I said before no one has to buy a HP.

[guy sajer]

The type of person that would buy a HP for home defense is not going to be able to handle and shoot the gun good enough to be able to use it correctly.

That's a pretty broad statement . What type of person is a HP customer ?


I agree , a shotgun is superior to a handgun .

[larry starling]

guy sajer;Like making blanket POS statements about several THR members choice in a pistol without having firsthand experience ?
They're happy with their HP . Why insult their choice ?

Im not insulting anyones choice. As far as not having firsthand expierience this isn't true either. I have been working with firearms for well over 17+ years. As both a hobby and a job! my experience with hipoints come from the fact my brother owns one and it wouldn't feed and jammed every time he could get it to chamber a round. 2nd In several issues of gun test's magazines Hi-points havent faired well in testing! for those uninformed gun test magazine is considered the consumer test magazine in the gun world. they(highpoints) allways get the following ratings quote:Hipoint model c "DONT BUY! Inexpensive/top heavy,hard to shot,and not reliable." :evil: p.s BTW for a few more bucks you could buy a used Springfield GI model or a used Smith. :D

[clone]

Bobby lee,

woops u let it slip. gun snobs cant help but put other people down to make them selves feel better and my last post was ment for u gun snob "types".

im a bersa "type" and a rossi "type" and a Pheonix "type" and yes the dreaded hi point "type". but i guess the hi point type is the worst of the bunch, huh? well the hi point has yet to jam even once in 1140 rounds. the bersa was a real jam-o-matic the first 500 rounds but still jams about once every 50 rounds or so. i would trust the hi point with my life way before i would trust the bersa. i bought it because most of the people that have actully owned one have nothin but good things to say about them. other than the occasional limon and the gun snob types bashin them iv not heard many bad things about them, none that have exploded or that have injured the owner in any way. i did my homework before i bought a hi point so i knew what i was buying. so if im ignorant then so be it, ignorance is bliss i guess because i enjoy my purchase every weekend at the range.

think before u speak people, hi point people r people to. :p just because i bought a hi point doesnt make me the scum of the earth. :( i work 9 to 5 like most everyone else and to make fun or put down someone elses choice is "ignorant".

oh i also plan on get a HP 9mm compensated soon and ill be happy to be a "ignorent" two time HP "type".

this post wasnt ment for all of u, but just for gun snobs (u know who u r) that dont test a gun before they label it a POS and put down others who do not see in there same narrow minded way.

[JohnKSa]

gun snobs cant help but put other people down to make them selves feel better and my last post was ment for u gun snob "types" if im ignorant then so be it, ignorance is bliss i guess hi point people r people toput down others who do not see in there same narrow minded wayI do get tired of people dogging others for making their own decisions .all i can say is some of these people r just ignorent and being child-likeNot going to list any more, but it's clear that there is a major disconnect here.

By what twisted and febrile logic does it follow that a negative comment about a firearm equates to a personal insult against every person who owns or has EVER owned that particular firearm? Or that it's an attempt to "dog someone" for their decisions?

Hi-Point firearms may work, they may have a good guarantee, but they are still poor quality. I haven't said anything negative about Hi-Point OWNERS, but any person who has so hopelessly confused his ego with his firearms to the point that the two are no longer separate in his mind has far deeper problems than what kind of firearms he chooses to buy or sell.

[Bobby Lee]

That's a pretty broad statement . What type of person is a HP customer ?

It has been my experience that most HP people buy one because they can't afford a decent gun. They assume the HP is their only choice in that price range.

If they can't afford a decent gun then they also can't afford to buy much practice ammo.

If they can't afford to shoot it then they will not be able to use it well if they need it for self defense.

That is why I said a cheap shotgun is better for home defense for a HP type person.

[Walt Sherrill]

I did that, early on. And believe it or not, you've still got to practice with a shotgun, and that ammo is even MORE expensive than revolver ammo.

There aren't as many places where you can practice with a shotgun, at the distances you'd use in a house, such that you can really become confident.

And then, depending in the shotgun, you've got to learn to clean it. Pumps are the most frequently recommended, and that can be a challenge, for a beginner, if you want to clean it right.

[Bobby Lee]

woops u let it slip. gun snobs cant help but put other people down to make them selves feel better and my last post was ment for u gun snob "types".

I am not a "gun snob".

I just refuse to pay good money for a POS when I can spend the same amount of money and buy something better.

If HP ever makes a pistol that is quality I would have no problem buying one.

I am not the type that assumes that a gun has to be expensive to be good quality.

I know I can spend $100 on an old Chinese SKS and have a quality rifle that will last me a lifetime.

I can spend $100 to $150 on several good surplus handguns such as a Makarov or Star BM and have a weapon that is better in every possible way than any HP.

I just bought a good S&W Mod 10 for $125. It does not have a nice finish but it is in perfect working order. I can shoot this gun for the rest of my life and pass it along to my kids and they can use it for a lifetime. I can even spend a little time with $5 worth of cold blueing and make it "look" nice.

I have a Turk Mauser that is one of my favorite rifles. I paid $35 for it. It sits in my safe next to five other rifles that are worth more than $1,000 each.

I shoot the old Mauser all the time and when I am done I spend just as much time cleaning and maintaining it as I do my $1,500 match rifle.

[Bobby Lee]

I did that, early on. And believe it or not, you've still got to practice with a shotgun, and that ammo is even MORE expensive than revolver ammo.

Look at lt like this.

Who has the best chance of defending their life in their home.

A person with a HP who has no experience with a handgun or someone with a single shot shotgun who also has no experience?

I would bet on the novince with the shotgun anyday.

[Pietro Beretta]

Someone with no experence.

I believe the bad guy would win in that situation.

I would take a 12g loaded with 00buckshot, over ANY handgun.

[clone]

the fact that it works means very little

because your stupid choice of a handgun

there is no reason that anyone that knows a little about firearms to have to buy a HP.

don't need to try somthing to know its crap.

They sell well because of all the ignorant people

The type of person that would buy a HP for home defense is not going to be able to handle and shoot the gun good enough to be able to use it correctly

HP type person

i can also take quotes out of context and twist it around to fit my point. on that note if your going to quote me pls use my entire point. other-wise this is how points are lost and aurguements become pointless.

im not trying to twist anyones titty and make them buy a HP, im saying dont look down on me (and other HP type's) and say it was stupid or ignorant for me to choose HP for a plinking gun.

on another note if someone doesnt have first hand knowage of the firearm in question then he should not post on a tread of someone asking for first hand knowledge. handling one doesnt equate to knowledge of a guns quality. mine is alot differant from when i first pulled it outa the box (broken in).

anyways happy 4th to everyone and im glade we live in a country where we can argue out opinions. (including john and bobby :) )

[larry starling]

quote:this post wasnt ment for all of u, but just for gun snobs (u know who u r) that dont test a gun before they label it a POS and put down others who do not see in there same narrow minded way.

I guess because I choose to collect and purchase quality firearms, You can label me a snob!
I have to agree with JohnKSa ,The original question of this thread was Hi-point quality. Nowhere in any of the post's did anyone attack the owners of hipoints just the make of gun. If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck. its a duck! :scrutiny:

[Pietro Beretta]

You still have to AIM when using a shotgun, Trust me. The spread of the shot is only about 2 - 3 inch spread at about 10-15 feet.

[clone]

I guess because I choose to collect and purchase quality firearms, You can label me a snob!

not as long as u dont call people stupid and ignorant for there choice of gun. see poeple hear "gun snob" and think because they have a colt or some other name brand gun there a snob. no a snob is one who makes it a point to "type" people and make fun of someone and call them "stupid" and "ignorant". all over something as simple and pointless as a gun choice.

[Bobby Lee]

You still have to AIM when using a shotgun, Trust me. The spread of the shot is only about 2 - 3 inch spread at about 10-15 feet

OK who do you assume can "aim" better. A novince with a long gun or a novince with a handgun?

Who is more likely to hit the bad guy at 10-15 feet in the dark?

[Pietro Beretta]

The shotgun no doubt.

But this has nothing to do with hi-points, but with a handgun vs shotgun for Home Def.

(im assuming you ment shotgun). Specifically one with an 18" barrel.

[paul45]

After carefully reading and pondering the 3 pages of posts in this thread ....it is my unasked for opinion that the several people who suggest that purchasing a used Smith and Wesson or Ruger revolver, or for a little more money and some good shopping a used SA or S&W auto .....are CORRECT!! For the price of a hi-point, I can find a used Smith model 10 in good shape that I would be proud to own. I will say that I do not buy the cheapest, most horrible looking car....house...tools...jewelry for the wife...or clothes. I work hard and strive to buy the best for my money...Hi-point does not fill that expectation. Last, allow me to say that having friends in LEO roles, I have heard several stories of Hi-points being a cheap gang type weapon that have been used in thug gangster type shootings in my area. I would prefer not to associate myself with those type of weapons. I respect all of you Hi-point owners but would heartily suggest that you could find much better weapons with a much better history and reputation.... ;)

[larry starling]

Excellent post Paul45! :D

[Pietro Beretta]

Most of the "gangsters" in my area, dont buy their own guns. they are often stolen.... I guess I have no proof of this, but that would be my guess.

What gangster wants to come in to a store, fill out information where he lives, where he was born, Take the Handgun Saftey test Come back 10 days later with 2 forms of ID, and take another saftey test with the gun you just bought?...

I have a retired sheriff in my neighbor hood. I asked him what brand and caliber of guns were often confiscated of "gangster" type people. His response was anything and everything, and he seemed to re-call a high amount of confiscated glocks and sawed off pistol grip 12 gauges.
(In ********** of course)

[guy sajer]

I respect all of you Hi-point owners but would heartily suggest that you could find much better weapons with a much better history and reputation....

Using this logic , you would recommend against buying a Walther PPK because they were used by Nazis to murder Jewish people ?

It's not the tool that's bad , it's the user .

[paul45]

I'm sorry Guy...my point is a little unclear. By stating history and reputation, I was thinking of "history" of a company such as S&W...a long history of quality firearms. And "reputation" , meaning reputation of a pistol as a good dependable piece with the ability of having a resale value. And yes...I dont like gangbanger cars or style of dress or talk....including their choice of firearms

[White Horseradish]

All of you that say that for the price of a Hi-Point you can find a used S&W, WHERE? I have not seen anything for that price that an average person that is not a gun enthusiast would be able to find.

Model 10's at local shops start at $210. I have yet to see a gun shop in town carry a Makarov or a Star BM. The last time I was at a gun show, the only revolvers I saw for less than $250 were some hideous H&R or something in .30-something calibers.

An average person likely to buy a HP will not know about AIM or SOG, and will have a hard time finding a gun show. Should they find one, they will buy it because to a typical consumer it looks like a better value being American-made and having a warranty as opposed to something from a country, let alone a factory, that does not exist any more.

[RoyG]

By stating history and reputation, I was thinking of "history" of a company such as S&W...a long history of quality firearms.

Well during the '20s and '30s "gangster guns" were Colts, Smiths, Tommy Guns and Whippets. I do beleive someone even carried a BAR.

Just remember every gun you have has had a bad guy used that style/model of gun in a crime sometime in history.

Model 10's at local shops start at $210.

Model 10s start at $259 around here. I did find a Model 36 for under $200 though.

[clone]

how can a gun compainy obtain a history if we dont buy there guns and make the history? i mean if eveyone went by your logic no one would buy HP's and would gain no history? so far i bought one and am makeing a good history for HP so that kinda makes me a pioneer ;) and without pioneers there is no history.

[JohnKSa]

i can also take quotes out of context and twist it around to fit my pointEspecially if they're not quotes from my posts... There's only one in there from me, and it has nothing to do with HP owners, only the firearms themselves.lets just get rid of all guns that cost under $300 Roughly a quarter of the guns I own cost less than $300.only the rich can afford the right to bare armsSo clearly I don't agree with this quote. And furthermore, none of the guns I own are poor quality so one doesn't have to accept poor quality to get a good price. My cheapest firearm cost me $65 (tax & all fees included) and is an excellent quality firearm--possibly one of the highest quality firearms I own.*o well if a gang member uses it, it must be POS and should be done away with* what kinda logic is that?No kind of logic--I agree that this argument has little bearing on the topic. Criminals use the firearms they can get their hands on--one might end up with an HP they bought, another might have an H&K that their friend stole.

As far as I can see, paul45's comments about reputation and history had absolutely nothing to do with WHO uses them for WHAT and everything to do with the reputation and history of the company for making quality firearms.

And while it's true that a company has to start somewhere, until they use quality materials and quality designs, they're not going to have a reputation for making quality products--regardless of who buys and uses them. I'm not in the business of building a reputation for a company that won't take the first steps required to start the process.

There will always be a market for very cheap, low quality items that work (for awhile anyway) because there will always be people who can't or won't pay more. Those people deserve to have a very low cost option available to them, but they shouldn't be fooled into thinking that what they bought was as good as anything else on the market. Cheap? Yup. Functional? Perhaps--at least for awhile. Quality? Nope, not by a long shot.

It's interesting to hear that a lot of people have had relatively good luck with these firearms--that's useful information. If a stranger asked me for advice and told me that an HP was all they could afford, I'd pass along the information from this thread. But if one of my friends needed a firearm and all they could afford was an HP, I'd sell them a good quality gun for the cost of an HP and eat the difference or let them pay it out over as long as they needed.

[Bobby Lee]

Should they find one, they will buy it because to a typical consumer it looks like a better value being American-made and having a warranty as opposed to something from a country, let alone a factory, that does not exist any more.

Once again a HP is bought because someone just don't know any better.

HP counts on this kind of ignorance of the general public to be able to sell their guns.

[Bobby Lee]

only the rich can afford the right to bare arms

Anyone has the right to "bare arms". I don't know of any laws telling us we have to keep out arms covered.

[CajunBass]

Man. It's amazing how this thing gets beat up. :eek:

[Walt Sherrill]

In a lot of states, if you don't conceal your weapons, you can get in trouble. Here in NC, it can be considered a misdemeanor offense -- if you "terrorize" the public with your bared weapon.

And while its legal to openly carry, you better have a permit if you conceal your weapon. The right to bare arms, here, requires a special permit, training course, and background check.

(There's more than one way to have a play on words with this one... <grin>)

[Bobby Lee]

But if one of my friends needed a firearm and all they could afford was an HP, I'd sell them a good quality gun for the cost of an HP and eat the difference or let them pay it out over as long as they needed.

I don't have a lot of work to do today so I intend to go to two of our local gun shops and see what kind of quality guns I can buy for the price of a new HP. One of these gun shops has a new HP and I go by what he wants for his new HP to compare the price.

I will report back with a list later on today.

[DT Guy]

I'm not jumping into the whole High Point thing...


But I second the previous poster-where on earth do you guy find Model 10's for $125? I'd LOVE to pick one up for that, but it seems that gun shops around here know what they're worth....



Larry

[Javelin Man]

After reading this thread, I decided to register and voice my opinion on Hi-Points, and the people who bash them.

It seems there are a couple people on this thread preaching to two different choirs; one whom says Hi-Points are an inexpensive (not cheap) form of self-defence, not necessarily CC, and the other says a blanket statement that all Hi-Points are junk and he'd sell a friend his Colt 1911 for the price of a Hi-Point.

The last gun I purchased was a .45 acp Hi-Point. I just wanted a .45 and at $150, I wasn't going to break the bank, or waste my daughter's college fund. Conceal carry, no, because the thing is too large. Heavy? No, my Heritage Arms .22 weighs the same. Sure the slide is bucky and therein lies the weight, but it also helps cushion the recoil of the mighty .45 for these old, arthritic wrists. The gun is ugly, but so are Glocks, and Steyers. To each his own.

I also own a couple Kel-tecs and my .32 slips in my pocket daily and my 9mm on my side. A little polishing and they're very good. Everybody should be able to disassemble their guns and polish a feed ramp if they can clean a gun. As my monicker indicates, I drive a 1973 Javelin. I enjoy tinkering with things to get them running well.

As for expensive guns, I also own a S&W mod 36. The cylinder locked up on me yesterday. I thought it was supposed to be reliable. Wheelguns never let you down! Maybe it was jealous I've been playing with the automatics.

Back to the Hi-Point, It has never failed to go bang and to load the next round. At 27 paces, I knocked out the X on the bullseye. The other three shots were within a couple inches.

What more could anybody ask? I've heard many times of Kahrs and Glocks malfunctioning. My guess is the rate of failure of perfect performance for those higher price guns is higher than Hi-Points. Mind you, it's only a guess, but I don't think I'm wrong. I've heard very few stories of failures of Hi-Points, and many stories of the others.

I also owned a Lorcin .380. It also went bang everytime and loaded perfectly. I kick myself for selling it. My .25 Lorcin, well, as accurate as it is, can't quite be relied on to feed correctly.

As for those who bash the Hi-Points, grow up. Not everyone can afford to waste their money on guns that do the same thing. Go out and buy a Hi-Point. Plink with it. Sell it after a while and you won't be out any money but will have gained a valuable experience. It serves a valuable purpose. Many people will buy a hi-Point and get into shooting, and then move up in the firearm hierarchy. Others may just spend the last of their Social Security check and be able to defend themselves. I'd rather defend my family with my Hi-Point .45 than with my Kel-tec 9mm or .32, but it's kind of hard to carry it around, even with a shoulder harness.

Certainly anyone who would spend money on an old Mauser sees the value in purchasing any firearm. If Hi-Points are junk, let's get rid of Mausers, SKS's and AK-47's. You see how rediculous this statement is; that's how foolish a blanket statement is about bashing Hi-Points. If a Mak, Mauser, SKS etc., breaks, can you send it to the factory for a free fix? Like I stated before, please go out and buy a Hi-Point, or steal one from a gangstuh and shoot it. Then respond with experience, not prejudice.

[CajunBass]

If anyone has a Colt they'd like to sell for the price of a Hi-Point, please feel free to contact me. CajunBass@AOL.com.

[clone]

very well said Javelin.

but i think they r just to hard headed to listen to reason, and i have elected to ignor the gun snobs and enjoy my hi point. :neener:

lol cajunbass, ill second that. ;)

[Bobby Lee]

If anyone has a Colt they'd like to sell for the price of a Hi-Point, please feel free to contact me

If someone I really cared about was in danger and needed a handgun for self defense I would give him a gun before I would let him buy a HP.

[Bobby Lee]

I also owned a Lorcin .380. It also went bang everytime and loaded perfectly. I kick myself for selling it

Selling that POS is one of the best things you ever done.

[SLCDave]

p.s BTW for a few more bucks you could buy a used Springfield GI model or a used Smith.

Where are you finding used Springfield GI's in the same area code as a Hi-Point? I never see the Smith's this low either, but I've never heard about a sub $200 GI model.

I was in a shop over the weekend, and saw the Hi-Piont lineup. The .45 was the only one over $100 (at $129), and would have made a decent club if it jammed. I asked the counter guy if he had ever shot one, and he made the same "Life's too short to shoot THOSE"-type comments. Then, he did mention that he's never had one come back with a problem, and had many people come back and buy more of them.

I can see where they might fill a niche, maybe as a truck gun or a tackle box gun. Something you wouldn't cry over if it were scratched, damaged or stolen. It was heavy, the safety was crude, but effective (I wouldn't want to have to fumble with it in a SD situation), and it wasn't pretty. For someone that NEEDED a gun YESTERDAY, and had a tight budget, I'm sure it would work for them. If they had time, and a knowledge of the Mak or a Star, and where to find one, this might be a better choice. If they had one of the mythical local shops where the Smiths and Springer GI's were $150, I'd go there.

[Bobby Lee]

I just got back fro two of our local gun shops.

They has used HP's for $100 and new ones for $150.

In that price range and even less there were several much better choices for those of us that know guns.

For home defense there were at least 8 good used Mossberg pump shotguns I could have bought for $150. There were several good single shot shotguns I could have bought for $100 or less.

For defense for those of us that do not live in the city there were plenty of good SKS rifles and plenty of surplus Mausers and Enfields. All for less than $150 and some for less than $100. There were also several quality .22 rifles for less than the price of a HP. I would even rather have a good quality .22 rifle for defense than a HP.

In the carry gun line I found a good solid used Bersa .380 that they were asking $165 for. $150 would most likely buy it. A well used but sound Charter Arms .38 for about $150. It was not pretty but it sure beats trying to stuff a POS HP in your pocket.

I found a Makarov that I could buy for about $150. A PA-63 for $140.

For plinking and fun I found a good old H&R .22 revolver for $120.

Again I saw no reason to waste money on a HP.

[Javelin Man]

I would never let a friend shoot a Mauser. I would rather give a friend a Marlin lever action 30-30. A Mauser is such a POS.

I would never let a friend drive a Chevy, either. I'd rather give him my Mercedes. A Chevy is such a POS. A friend of mine sold his Chevy. It was the best thing he ever did. For a few more dollars, you could buy a Cadillac.

A single shot shotgun for defense? Right. Hold still, whilst I reload. Now where did I drop that shell? Pardon me, I was holding a flashlight with my spare hand.

You can see how rediculous some people make themselves look by making prejudice statements.

I make my claims by experience. It's obvious you only have opinions of others and did not bother to gain the experience. Your loss. :banghead:

Never argue with an idiot; some people might not know which one you are.

[Pietro Beretta]

Hey BOBBY.

Out of all those guns, If one decides to break... What company is going to replace it, FREE? FOR LIFE? Withought giving you any hassle?

Hi-Point.

Also I earlier I stated for 140$ out the door (in **********) this is a great plinking gun.

However I would not trust it with my life.

[mattw]

An average person likely to buy a HP will not know about AIM or SOG, and will have a hard time finding a gun show. Should they find one, they will buy it because to a typical consumer it looks like a better value being American-made and having a warranty as opposed to something from a country, let alone a factory, that does not exist any more.

just my opinion, but if you were going to spend $100+ on ANYTHING, wouldn't the "average" person (by saying average i am assuming they are in possession of a brain) do a little bit of research first? That being said, they would find the Star BMs and Makarovs and used Smiths.

[Bobby Lee]

Out of all those guns, If one decides to break... What company is going to replace it, FREE? FOR LIFE? Withought giving you any hassle?

I don't need a warranty on any of my guns. I don't buy junk that is sure to break like a HP or Lorcin.

If something does go wrong with anything I own I can fix it myself. I am not a helpless idiot that has to send stuff back to the factory for a simple repair.

[middy]

BobbyLee and JohnKSa have convinced me...

I'm going to go buy a Hi-Point. :D

[Cavalry]

Out of all those guns, If one decides to break... What company is going to replace it, FREE? FOR LIFE? Withought giving you any hassle?

Hi-Point.

yea thats because it would only coast them about $5 to fix anything on the gun

[Bobby Lee]

A single shot shotgun for defense? Right. Hold still, whilst I reload. Now where did I drop that shell? Pardon me, I was holding a flashlight with my spare hand.

I can reload a single shot shotgun faster than you can clear a jam or fix a broken part in your HP.

That is IF I have to reload the shotgun. Most of the time one round of OO buck is enough at close range.

[Bobby Lee]

Posted by Pietro Beretta,

"Also I earlier I stated for 140$ out the door (in **********) this is a great plinking gun.

However I would not trust it with my life."
........................................................................................................


Why do you not trust it with your life? Could it be that you KNOW it is not a quality gun?

If so what is your point in all of this?

[Pietro Beretta]

I would not Trust it with my life since in the total of 200 rounds I fired through it, 11 jammed (hollow points). Thats 11 out of 200 that someone could have shot me first.

However most guns have a break in period of a few hundred rounds....

However I stated that now (seemingly anyway) I have fixed that problem...Although I wouldnt want to test that in a real life fire-fight situation.

(in my original posts about my testing of a hi-point I made it seem like it wasnt my own, when infact it was. Since I dont see anything wrong with my hi-point I came out of the closet so to speak)

I would trust my SKS over the hi-point... WHY? I have put over 1000 rounds through my Yugo SKS, withought a mis-fire. I would trust my .22lr beretta over my hp I have put over 1000 rounds through this beretta withought a misfire. I would trust my 30-30 over my hi-point... Why? Ive shot over 300 rounds through it, with out a misfeed-fire....

I would take my hi-point over my 10/22, not because its a 9mm but because that damn 10/22 jams once or twice every 10 rounds, unless im using expensive CCI's.

However my 10/22 is a great cost effective plinking gun.
My Hi-point is a great plinking gun, and no its not going to piss me off If it gets stolen from my car when I have it in their.
When i get my SA XD... if that got stolen I would be PISSED 550 is too much to get stolen 140 isnt. imo

[Javelin Man]

Well, if we're going to use single shots, I'll borrow my Dad's 1841 Ames 6 pounder. That will take care of multiple BG's. And the house. Kinda hard to conceal a 814 pound barrel plus the #2 carriage. Thankfully, I have a Mossburg 500 loaded with 00 buckshot nearby. It's the only gun not in a safe. Above it in the closet is my electronic safe with my carry pieces. My SKS, Saiga, Hi-Point, Ruger, H&R, Marlin, etc. are in other safes in the basement.

As for sounding like an idiot, imitation kind of made me look like one, didn't it? I did make a foolish statement about a Mauser, and a Chevy. They get the job done, and reliably besides. Why would one rail against a Hi-Point, a firearm that is reliable, no matter what YOU think. If you do believe it is worthless, please find a gangbanger that owns one and dare him to pull the trigger so you can hear it 'click'. I doubt that you will hear the click. Or anything else, ever.

There are obvious other better choices to conceal carry. There are other choices to plink. There are other choices for home defense. I'm not advocating everyone sell off their arsenal and purchase just one Hi-Point. However, nobody should be telling others that buying a Hi-Point is Wrong. This is the U.S.A. and we can have choices. I believe the original poster asked for educated opinions, not attacks on the gun. Sure, if you have experience with the gun, do tell your story, good or bad. If not, allow someone else with experience on the topic give a more qualified opinion than yourself.

Even someone in ************ can purchase these handguns which, as hard as it is to say, is an endorsement right there.

[Cavalry]

Having a High Point is like riding a bike, its cool until your friends see you doing it, buy a Beretta

[Javelin Man]

Cavalry, you're right about it not being cool. :p I had to chuckle when I read your post. If there's one gun of mine I'd keep concealed, it's the Hi-Point. Unfortunately, mine's the .45 and concealing it on my small frame is not an option. The small 9mm's might work to conceal, but again, like a Glock, it's not pretty. Of course, both have that utilitarian kind of look to them.

If there's one major design flaw that hampers the high point's performance, I'd blame the magazine. I think just a little more material could make a big difference in the performance of the gun. Mine hasn't yet failed to load, but in playing just the mag, I can see where it could hang up and be the cause of a problem.

Of course, ALL of my other gun's magazine's are perfect. :rolleyes:

Yup, a Hi-Point is like a work car that has rust and dents; it still works, but you wouldn't show it off to brag.

[CajunBass]

I'm going to go buy a Hi-Point.

It was posts like this one that convinced me to buy one. But what do I know? I dive a Kia. (Best car I ever owned too.)

[Walt Sherrill]

Its interesting.

With maybe one exception, the folks condemning the Hi-Points have never shot one.

While most of the folks affirming their use own and shoot them and say they're OK.

The first group seems to be saying that their superior gun experience and THEORETICAL KNOWLEDGE clearly trump hands-on experience.

Wonder what that first group thinks of Wolf ammo. <grin>

[mattw]

This thread has gotten pretty far off topic, alot of opinions that are unsupported have surfaced.

Bottom line: no one ever said a high-point is as reliable and pleasing as a 1911 or a glock but, it does only cost about $130. If you got some cash burning a hole in your pocket and are curious.. I say go for it. If you think its good enough for CCW, thats your opinion. There is no reason to bash others opinions and stay they are stupid just because they have had a bad experience with a mauser or another good name that left a bad taste in their mouth. I don't own a hi-point and don't plan on buying one because i think that they are ugly, that doesn't affect anyone else and neither does the fact that someone might choose it for a CCW gun. Just because it is not a wise choice in your eyes does not give you the right to question another man. My father always told me never to give anyone advice unless they asked for it, i believe this holds true for firearms.

[Javelin Man]

Golly Matt, we've been so used to fighting for our 2nd amendment rights that we forgot everyone has 1st amendment rights, too. You spoke true words in your summation. BTW, I didn't want to bash any Mauser, Chevy, or anything, just tried some imitation to show how bigoted some opinions can be. I apologize to all Chevy's, Mausers, and bigoted opinions.

One thing we also forgot is the right to remain silent. Some people ought to try that. I know I will. Right after I say...well, nevermind.

Walt sums things up pretty well, too.

Play nice, everyone, and keep those bullets flying.

[JohnKSa]

the other says a blanket statement that all Hi-Points are junk and he'd sell a friend his Colt 1911 for the price of a Hi-Point. No, that's not at all what I said. I said I'd sell them a GOOD QUALITY firearm for the price of an HP. What I didn't say was that it would probably be a Mak and I'd break even on the deal or come very close since neither of my Maks cost me about $150 which is close to what someone said a new HP goes for. I also didn't say "I would never let a friend shoot an HP". If they wanted to buy after I told them what the HP owners from this thread said, I'd let them go ahead.Wonder what that first group thinks of Wolf ammo.I think there is better ammo on the market for about the same price.THEORETICAL KNOWLEDGE Walt, have you ever SEEN an HP, held it in your hand, dryfired it? There's theory and then there's theory. It's going to take a heck of a lot more than a good warranty and a few testimonials to convince me that a gun with a potmetal slide is a quality weapon. What does your "theoretical knowledge" say about the durability of a cast zinc slide?Yup, a Hi-Point is like a work car that has rust and dents; it still works, but you wouldn't show it off to brag.Except that a car doesn't come from the factory with rust and dents. And if it did, you wouldn't even dream of calling it a quality automobile.

This is really pretty simple, even the HP owners are saying that they don't want to show them off, comparing them to rusted dented cars. I'm sorry, but these kind of comments and testimonials that basically say "they work most of the time but what can you expect for that price and anyway the manufacturer will fix it if it fails" just don't sound like the endorsements one would expect for a quality product.

Anyone who's undecided, re-read the thread and ONLY read the comments by the HP owners. I think they make the case better than anyone else could.Mine hasn't yet failed to load, but in playing just the mag, I can see where it could hang up and be the cause of a problem.a Hi-Point is like a work car that has rust and dentsI would not Trust it with my life since in the total of 200 rounds I fired through it, 11 jammed (hollow points). I have fixed that problem...Although I wouldnt want to test that in a real life fire-fight situation. would trust my SKS over the hi-point... I would trust my .22lr beretta over my hp ... I would trust my 30-30 over my hi-point...I would not trust it with my lifeA Mauser is such a POS.^^(I know, that's not really on topic, but it did come from an HP owner and I figure it has some bearing on what an HP owner thinks quality really is.) ;)my brother owns one and it wouldn't feed and jammed every time he could get it to chamber a round.^^Not from a HP owner, but definitely about one.1) Disassembly for cleaning requires a pin to be punched out. A real pain in the rear when my other guns disasemble without tools. Getting the pin out is the easy part...
2) The fit and finish is crude to say the least.
3) The gun's balance is horrible but I do have to say the grip is very comfortable for my large hands.
4) Accuracy is questionable because of the poor slide to frame fit. I could send it back for warrantee service, but I've not really checked the gun from a benchrest to be sure of the problem. The shipping cost is holding me back too.
5) The trigger feel is the worst of any gun I have.
6) The gun is ugly. I don't know of anyone that likes it.bulky, did not fit in the hand well, a bit heavy, horrible creep and trigger pull, and the machining was to say not smooth at all. You look at the gun, and you do not see quality at all.too bulky for my taste and I traded it inits allways worked and eats most any ammo^^I included this one because I don't understand it. If it always works then it would eat ANY ammo. If it only eats "most any" ammo that seem to imply that it doesn't always work... :confused:not pretty, pretty bulky, a bit heavy with a very heavy recoil spring (but that's what you get for being a simple blowback with 9mm, .40SW, and .45ACP). Trigger isn't the best for sure but for $100-$130, what can you expect.My carbine has shot flawlessly after they sent it back to me^^My emphasis added.one I had ... was dangerous to a fault!! It jammed almost continuously and the slam fire was the last straw!!

[Walt Sherrill]

Walt, have you ever SEEN an HP, held it in your hand, dryfired it? There's theory and then there's theory. Yes, to all of the above. Have you?

It's going to take a heck of a lot more than a good warranty and a few testimonials to convince me that a gun with a potmetal slide is a quality weapon. What does your "theoretical knowledge" say about the durability of a cast zinc slide? Seems as though the new SIG Mosquito has a pot metal slide. Clearly SIG doesn't know what its doing.

Will you tell people not to buy SIGs, now?

The two gunshops where I do most of my business -- one is a high volume dealer -- say that HPs are the only low-end guns he'll sell, because they're the only ones that don't come back.

Somebody here also advocated selling a single-shot shotgun as a home-defense weapon, too. (Why else mention it as a HP alternative?) That's not my idea of a good home defense gun...

I've seen high dollar guns go back to the factory for adjustments or repair. How do you think Ruger gets the GREAT reputation for service? (Hint: its not from never having guns sent back for repair.) As recently as last year a friend sent his mid-priced SIG P228 back to the factory; had a trigger that felt like a washboard.. I've also seen Glocks go back, and S&W guns, too. Even Kimbers go back. So its no surprise if a HP carbine goes back, now and then.

By your standards, the carbines ought to be pieces of crap, too. But, surprisingly, they're pretty good, too.

None of this is just theory...

[JohnKSa]

Have you?Yes, I have. Once after a guy brought one in and basically gave it to the gun store owner. Another time after a fellow brought one into a shop while I was there and said it jammed every time he tried to shoot it.the new SIG Mosquito has a pot metal slide. Clearly SIG doesn't know what its doing.I don't know about that, but I'd sure tell a potential Mosquito buyer to check out the internet reviews by the people that own them. So far I've not seen a lot encouraging about them from the owners. Here's a thread from one...

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=142310&highlight=mosquito

Pot metal slides have been tried and the results are not particularly encouraging (remember the Sigma .380s?) . Even on rimfires, they tend to have durability issues. On centerfires one would expect any such issues to be magnified.

I have heard better things about the carbines than the pistols, in fact there's a thread on them in the rifle section right now. Comments are generally positive.I've seen high dollar guns go back to the factory for adjustments or repair.So have I. It happens. I just listed that quote because it was a comment from an owner and pertinent to the discussion. Anyway, there are another 15-20 comments in there to choose from if you think that one's out of line. ;)

[Bobby Lee]

I was thumbing through the new issue of Shooting Times at the store (Wal-Mart #5079 a.k.a. Stalag Luft 3 to employees) And i saw an article that was touting the quality and reliability of Hi-Point handguns, specifically the .40 and .45 full size models. It was my opinion that they were just cheap junk like jennings and firestorm, they've always crappy to me. What do you guys think

This was from the origional poster that started this thread.

He asked about the quality of the HP pistol.

He was correctly told that the HP is not a quality pistol but I think he already knew this.

He was also told of the MUCH better choices he can buy for the same amount of money a HP costs.

It seems to me that this thread should be allowed to end because everything worth saying has already been said.

[Walt Sherrill]

JohnKsa wrote:

but I'd sure tell a potential Mosquito buyer to check out the internet reviews by the people that own them.Good idea. But why won't you do that, here, with an HP? They tell you, here, that they're pretty good, and you tell they're nuts... Is it because SIG's name is more magical?

Bobby Lee wrote:

He was also told of the MUCH better choices he can buy for the same amount of money a HP costs.Nearly everything cited as a "MUCH better choice" was $50-$200 more costly, and many of them can't be found in most markets.

Some of those "MUCH better choices" suggested earlier included things like a single-shot shotgun. "Better choice" is clearly a subjective thing.

That better choices exist is probably true. But whether most shooters can find those "better choices" is probably open to question.

If you can't find one of those better choices where you live, its not really a better choice.

I go to gunshops all the time, and I can't remember when I last saw ANYTHING with a recognizable "brand name" for less than $100. (I saw a rusty S&W revolver about two years ago in a pawn shop for $75, but I wasn't tempted -- even though I really like S&W revolvers.)

Military surplus rifles aren't what your average (unsophisticated, inexperienced with guns) guy would pick up as a home defense weapon. Most wouldn't pick one up for just plinking, either. Many, like me, have to drive 50-100 miles to find a place to safely shoot a long gun, so becoming proficient with one of the milsurp guns might be an issue, if you went that route.

Its just not as simple as you and others make it out to be.

The MAK is a good choice, if you believe in the efficacy of the .380 or 9x18 round. (I don't.) But even the Bulgie Maks sell for a lot more than $100...

[Bobby Lee]

I would much rather have a 9-18 Makarov that I can safely and eaisly carry and know it will work than a junk .45 that is made from pot metal and is just too big to carry.

Also tell me once more just why a junk handgun is better for home defense than a quality shotgun because I don't think anyone has explained this to me yet.

[clone]

What issue of "Shooting Times" was the article posted in? i wouldnt mind reading it.

[Walt Sherrill]

Also tell me once more just why a junk handgun is better for home defense than a quality shotgun because I don't think anyone has explained this to me yet.And you have yet to explain to us where you're going to find a quality shotgun for $100...

The single-shot shotgun, one of the the "quality" weapons mentioned as an alternative, is not my idea of a good home-defense weapon. Its sure not a fun "plinking" weapon, and its not worth a damn as a truck gun.

You said there were quality weapons available for the same price (under $100) but now you're comparing "quality shotguns" to a $100 HP. Moving up in the world. I'm still waiting for a realistic list of the $100 QUALITY alternatives.

That was your claim, wasn't it?

We also haven't established that the HP is a junk handgun. You assume that because its inexpensive and made in part of pot metal, it must be junk. (If you take a course in debate or logic, you'll see that your argument is a perfect example of the logical fallacy known as "begging the question": you use your conclusion as your starting assumption.)

I think you can find very good, well-made, quality, serviceable weapons for around $225-$250. If you're lucky, you might find something for around $200. (A new Ruger P95 went for that not too long ago.) But there aren't a lot of those guns floating around in that price range -- and its still $100 - $150 too much!

[Javelin Man]

I don't think anyone has said a junk .45 is better than a shotgun for home defense. I think what's been said is a Hi-Point is good for home defense. I don't think anyone is going to argue that ANY handgun is better than a shotgun for home defense. I would, however use my .32 against multiple BG's with guns than a single shot shotgun. Even the most dense person would have to agree multple shots are better than one shot against more than one target, unless you're going to talk so much about how great your single shot is that they fall asleep and you can put them back to back to save ammo.

That said, I would gladly take my Mossburg and pump multiple shots, yes more than a single shot, at more than one target.

I have been to all my local gun shops and gun shows and have not even seen a Mak much less had a chance to hold one. If I had, I might've considered purchasing one, but it didn't happen. Besides, everyone knows that 9X18 or .380 isn't worth putting into a pistol to shoot. You need something that starts with a .4! Go ahead and jump on that argument.

I'm still wonderng how a Mauser is good for home defense? Sure, sweep the living room and kitchen in darkness with a long rifle. Put a bayonet on it! Hold still whilst I get the cross hairs on you. Darn it, I left the variable scope at 9 power! If a truck load of yahoos are coming up the drive in a pickup truck, I suppose I'd grab my SKS or Saiga along with a collection of handguns. Your Mauser would fit right in that scenario and would do a darn good job.

I also wish I knew how to use that darn quote button so I could take people's quotes out of context and use it against them. :barf:

Well, this thread seems to have run itself down to just a few people reading, and some not listening, but having nearly 25% of the posts by one anti-. I guess unless he wishes to sell us Colts, Maks, or lead us to a local gunshop where they are available, nothing more needs to be said.

[mattw]

And you have yet to explain to us where you're going to find a quality shotgun for $100...

NEF single shot 12 guage is $90 brand new.

What issue of "Shooting Times" was the article posted in? i wouldnt mind reading it.

I guess its the july issue.

[clone]

Javelin Man,

to get the guotes to work u have to have copy the text u want to quote into your new post and then just highlight the part u want to quote and click the quote button.

[clone]

thx mattw,

im a subcriber to shooting times so ill have the issue soon enough i guess. :)

[Walt Sherrill]

A well-made single-shot shotgun is not my idea of a good home defense gun, a good truck gun, or a good plinking weapon.

So finding a $90 single-barrel, single-shot shotgun doesn't really address the initial definition of need.

Given the choice of a HP 9mm or HP .45 and a single-shot shotgun, I'd take the HP if home defense were my concern.

[Bobby Lee]

I have been to all my local gun shops and gun shows and have not even seen a Mak much less had a chance to hold one. If I had, I might've considered purchasing one, but it didn't happen. Besides, everyone knows that 9X18 or .380 isn't worth putting into a pistol to shoot. You need something that starts with a .4! Go ahead and jump on that argument.

So you KNOW your HP is better than a Mak but you have never even held one. :scrutiny:

Also there are plenty of people that were put six feet under with calibers that don't "start with a .4.

If you know how to shoot a .22 is just as deadly as a 50AE.

[Bobby Lee]

I'm still wonderng how a Mauser is good for home defense?

It sure beats a junk pistol for those of us that don't live in the city.

There are times we could use the extra range of a rifle.

[Pietro Beretta]

... have you ever SEEN an HP, held it in your hand, dry fired it? There's theory and then there's theory. Yes, to all of the above. Have you?
Yes, I Have.

ALSO if your going to use the Quote tags, Please Accurately quote that person... Someone quoted me, and took out a few key words... here is the entire quote...: This is the reason I gave for not trusting a Hi-Point with my life, but Trusting one of my other guns...
I would trust my SKS over the hi-point... WHY? I have put over 1000 rounds through my Yugo SKS, withought a miss-fire. I would trust my .22lr Beretta over my hp I have put over 1000 rounds through this Beretta withought a misfire. I would trust my 30-30 over my hi-point... Why? I’ve shot over 300 rounds through it, with out a misfeed-fire....

I would take my hi-point over my 10/22, not because its a 9mm but because that damn 10/22 jams once or twice every 10 rounds, unless I’m using expensive CCI's.

However my 10/22 is a great cost effective plinking gun.
My Hi-point is a great plinking gun, and no its not going to piss me off If it gets stolen from my car when I have it in their.


Yup, a Hi-Point is like a work car that has rust and dents; it still works, but you wouldn't show it off to brag.

...this led to this response....

Except that a car doesn't come from the factory with rust and dents. And if it did, you wouldn't even dream of calling it a quality automobile.

Come from the factory with rust and dents!, bullsh*t. Their is no rust, their are no dents. I doubt anyone’s came from the factory this way.

bulky, did not fit in the hand well, a bit heavy, horrible creep and trigger pull, and the machining was to say not smooth at all. You look at the gun, and you do not see quality at all.

That’s EXACTLY what I thought of it, and still do. It Doesn’t fit in the hand Well, It IS bulky, IT HAS a HORRIBLE trigger pull, and when you look at it, you dont see quality....

And again, the only problem is with hollow points. And Again I said for 140$ out the door its a great plinking gun

ALSO .. ive never had a problem with wolf ammo, no im not shooting for accuracy with it, but its the cheapest price I could find for 7.62X39mm, Ive shot over a case thru my sks withought a mis-feed, miss-fire..... if that means quality, then wolf is quality ammo :what: Again affordable plinking is the name of the game, for me...

[Javelin Man]

So you KNOW your HP is better than a Mak but you have never even held one.

How do you get that from my quote? :confused:

I have been to all my local gun shops and gun shows and have not even seen a Mak much less had a chance to hold one. If I had, I might've considered purchasing one, but it didn't happen.

You might not be able to read too fast, but I know I typed it slow enough for you. I don't think I've bashed Makarovs at all. I haven't had a chance to hold one, examine one, or shoot one, so I'm not going to be a bigot and bash one just because I'm ignorant about them. I'd like to have a chance to add one to my collection someday. I don't think anywhere that indicates that my Hi-Point is better than a Mak.

Please, if you think they are so bad, go bet your life on one. Stand in front of one. According to you, you're safe. After you've done that, please send your next post on this subject.

[mattw]

Clone,

Sorry I was wrong, I saw it at the News Stand today and its the August 2005 issue of Shooting Times.

I suggest that everyone go read the article for yourselves and keep your opinions that have no real-world backing to yourselves. I've PMed a moderator and asked that this thread be closed. I think its gotten to far off topic and out of hand :)

[Johnny Guest]

Standards seem to have slipped somewhat lately. The rule is, NO PERSONAL ATTACKS. You may attack another member's argument, or his idea, but there is to be no name calling or reflections on the mental state of other members.

Some people seem to think that everyone is entitled to a couple of warnings before strong action is taken. Not so. Read the forum rules. But, for the benefit of those who think they're due a warning, here it is:

ANY personal atack on another member gets the attacker banned. No discussion, no begging off. Banned, permanently.

mattw, the one who started this thread, has asked me to close it because of the deterioration of the discussion. I agree, this thread has about run its course. I have gone through and deleted several posts. I'll leave it open for a bit longer. Perhaps someone has something constructive to say. Or, maybe, I just want to see if anyone wants to toe the line a bit and see if he will REALLY be banned. There are several other firearms interest boards out there, so go for it, if you must.

Very sincerely,
Johnny Guest
THR Moderator

[JohnKSa]

But why won't you do that, here, with an HP?Actually, Walt, if you read my posts you will see that I said "If they wanted to buy after I told them what the HP owners from this thread said, I'd let them go ahead."They tell you, here, that they're pretty good, and you tell they're nuts...Since I just went back through the entire thread yesterday and even pulled out a bunch of quotes ONLY from HP OWNERS or previous owners, I think I have a pretty good idea what they're saying. If you can read through the thread and get the idea that the CONSENSUS among HP owner is that they're "pretty good" it's only because you have already made up your mind. There was even one HP owner who went so far as to bury his HP to prevent anyone else from being afflicted with it.

Pietro Beretta,

You said in at least 3 different posts that you wouldn't trust your life to your HP or that you wouldn't recommend it for self-defense. I'll try again and be more complete this time.Also I earlier I stated for 140$ out the door (in **********) this is a great plinking gun. However I would not trust it with my life.I would not Trust it with my life since in the total of 200 rounds I fired through it, 11 jammed (hollow points). Thats 11 out of 200 that someone could have shot me first. However most guns have a break in period of a few hundred rounds.... However I stated that now (seemingly anyway) I have fixed that problem...Although I wouldnt want to test that in a real life fire-fight situation.Surprisingly the first clip fired/fed flawlessly.

However I switched to hollow points and that was a different story. The first 5 shots jammed, then the next 3 cycled.

I then kept cycling (with ought firing) hollow point rounds through it to see if the feeding ramp would smooth itself out. Indeed after 2 more clips of just cycling the hollow point ammo, it fed fine.

Finally at the end of the day I fired 200 rounds through it. With a total of 11 jams
(that’s too many in my book)

As for accuracy...I was shooting cans and bottles at about 25 feet and hit what I was aiming at 9 out of 10 times.

I was then told the price of the gun, and that it came with a Lifetime no questions asked warranty. That made me surprised.

I WOULD NOT under any circumstance recommend this gun for a personal protection gun.

However for $140 out the door, with a lifetime warranty I would consider it for recreational plinking. ONLYAs for this comment: Come from the factory with rust and dents!, bullsh*t. Their is no rust, their are no dents. I doubt anyone’s came from the factory this way.I didn't say they had rust or dents. Javelin man said his HP was LIKE an old work car with rust and dents. I simply made the point that an old work car with rust and dents was one thing--on the other hand, one expects a NEW product to be better than an old work car with rust and dents.

[clone]

ill post one last post.

hi point r good guns, but they have lemons just like other compainy's. (colt, walther, glock, kel tec, les baer, kimber, etc.) they dont look nearly as good as a kimber 1911 but on the same note they dont cost nearly as much. after u get past there looks they really r reliable and accurate and worth the small price tag. i have personaly put 1140 (FMJ's, JHP's, and +p ammo) rounds through my JHP 45 without one FTF or FTE and i get 2" groups at 15 yards. all of the parts that rub and take abuse r made from of guality metal to cut down one ware. It is also rated for +p ammo from the factory so it has to be stout. iv shot my freinds 9mm compact and it seems to be just as reliable but it gets about 3" groups at 15yards.

i understand that some people dont like hi point's, just like some dont like 1911 style guns, and some dont like glocks. everyone has the right to shout your opinion from the roof-top's so ill not put anyone down for voiceing there opinion's. but im with the MOD., im not into that name calling stuff if u have an opinion to voice then have at it, but if your here to put people down and complain then im not listening.

this is just one hi point owners opinion so take it for what its worth.

[JohnKSa]

i understand that some people dont like hi point'sI don't like or dislike them, and that's not what the thread was about anyway. Preference is an odd and unpredictable thing. Quality is a bit more concrete. they really r reliable and accurateWell, clearly SOME are reliable and accurate, however, we've heard from a few HP owners on this thread who said theirs weren't. YOURS is accurate and reliable, but the guy who buried his in the desert certainly wouldn't agree. The ones that have crossed my path weren't reliable, I can't speak for their accuracy.

Again, I think the clearest answer can be had by reading through the thread and concentrating ONLY on posts from users. I've done it a couple of times, and the picture painted isn't one of a quality firearm.

If you've got one that works, that's great. If you've got one that you like, that's good too. Do I look down on you? Nope. Do I think you're stupid? No. But none of that makes HPs quality firearms.

[Bobby Lee]

I don't like or dislike them, and that's not what the thread was about anyway. Preference is an odd and unpredictable thing. Quality is a bit more concrete

If one uses logic and common sense and a good general knowledge of firearms to chose the guns you buy you would be a lot better off.

If one has good general knowledge of firearms you could see that the HP is a poorly made gun made from poor quality materials.

If you have the ability to use common sense and logic you would know that this type firearm is not what one needs for any serious purpose.

It has NOTHING to do with like or dislike or "feelings" or any other sort of BS.

You can like or dislike how the HP "feels" in your hand or how it "looks" but if you know guns you can't debate the quality issue because there is no quality there.

[Javelin Man]

I have never held or shot a Mak, but I won't say anything bad about them. Others are still trying to convince people they know more about Hi-Points even though they've never held or shot one. :confused: Some on this thread have taken just the Hi-Point owners statements which is a wise thing and reached their own conclusions. That's the way to read this thread. Good for those people.

As for my life depending on it, yes, I have. Last week I heard a noise upstairs as I was sleeping in the basement. I stumbled over to the safes and had my choice of Saiga, SKS, Hi-Point carbine, Marlin, etc, but reached for the Hi-Point .45. My shotgun and 9mm and .32 and .38 were upstairs in the safe in the closet. Yes, the shotgun would've been a better choice than ANY handgun, Glock, Walther, Sig, Hi-Point, HK, but it wasn't within reach.

Fortunately, nothing was upstairs, but, I was putting my life on the line with a Hi-Point. Just the experience of a Hi-Point owner.

It can be a weapon for someone on a fixed income, social security, etc that don't have another $50 to spend on a used S&W, Mak, etc. Some people, like myself, can't find one like that at a local gunshop. I found my S&W mod 36 for $250 at a gun show. Excellent gun, I took my CCW class with it and I carried it until I got my 9mm. I still carry the .38 occasionally, but the cylinder jammed the other day when I fired it. First time it ever happened on that gun, and that's a quality gun. My Hi-Point hasn't jammed. Which should I depend upon? Again, just the experience of a Hi-Point owner. YMMV

Please don't degrade someone for choosing a Hi-Point for home defense, or for a first handgun. It may be all they can afford to purchase, and still buy some ammo to practice with. In my case, I just wanted a .45 acp with some pocket change and this fit the bill. I needed a heavier gun to cushion my arthritic wrists, though my neighbor's 1911 is much heavier. He wasn't about to sell me his for $100. I find the grip anatomically pleasing to my hands and easy to hold. Others don't feel that way, but some also like the way a Glock feels in their hands. Many others, myself included, don't like the way a Glock feels, but I'm not going to insult them for not liking a Glock. I picked up a Firestorm at a gunshow and it hurt my hand even holding it. The grip found a pressure point in my hand that wasn't compatible with that gun. I was considering a Kahr last year, but after researching them, I found the particular model I was looking at had a recall on the barrel. Not particularly reassuring for a high priced handgun. If I'm going to hit or miss on quality, I'd like to gamble as little money as possible.

I wanted to do proper research firsthand on a Hi-Point. No matter what, I wasn't going to be out much money if I didn't like it, but I found I did like it. Others have had the same experience. Others still, especially long, long ago, had different experiences. Hi-Point started making firearms 18 years ago and is still owned and operated by the original owner. He is making an inexpensive firearm to fill the needs of many people.

I say, do your research firsthand, not the biased opinions of some, myself included, though my opinion has fact and experience to it.

[Jim101]

Javelin man,

Being a Hi-Point owner (9mm) I agree with you, in total.

Thanks,
Jim

[JohnKSa]

Others are still trying to convince people they know more about Hi-Points even though they've never held or shot one.I've said more than once that people should read through this thread ONLY looking at the comments posted by the HP owners and then make their own decision.

[CajunBass]

I'm not going to beat the dead horse about Hi-Points anymore. I like mine, and if you don't that's fine too.

But I was just looking through the "Trading Post" newspaper for this week. I'm sure your area has something similar. Apparently the used gun market here isn't what it is elsewhere. I admit there is a big difference between what people want and what they'll take if you start peeling off cash money.

I saw five guns for less than $200.00. A 12 ga Remington 870, for $185.00, A Marlin 22, for $150.00. A 410 Stevens for $100.00, A Japanese Arisaka 7.7 sporterized for $75.00 and a "45 Auto" (no brand listed, but I would guess a Hi-Point) for $50.00. I've got a call in to that guy. :)

[Walt Sherrill]

JohnKsa wrote:Anyone who's undecided, re-read the thread and ONLY read the comments by the HP owners. I think they make the case better than anyone else could.I took his advice and did just that.

Ten owners responded positively -- TheBucket, Clone, HKSW, Boofus, CajunBass, Ridge, Plevniak, Pietro Beretta, Jim101, and Javelin Man.

On prior HiPoint owner, DenFoote, responded negatively; he noted that he had owned his many years ago.

One of the current owners said he had experienced problems, possibly breakin issues -- and he said he fixed it/it fixed itself.

You do the math: 91% of those who have owned them like them, and 100% of those who have bought them in recent years like them.

The vast majority of the negative messages on this topic came from two people, JohnKsa and Bobby Lee, neither of whom have owned the guns and one of whom, Bobby Lee, has never even shot one.

Both of these guys also say there are better buys for the money,

I've yet to see anything selling in the $100 range that might be considered quality. The often mentioned used S&W revolvers touted as being in the same price range are never available around here for under $175 -- and those are often pretty rough. (And almost always .38 Special.)

The Stars mentioned previously are probably the closest to filling the bill, but not everyone can find them, locally -- which is needed to avoid transfer fees and shipping... and the ones I've seen were $150+.

One guy mentioned seeing Hi-Points for $200+ Right. I see overpriced stuff, too, but I don't buy it.

Is this a fair summary of the topic? If you think not, reread it, yourself...

[Bobby Lee]

The vast majority of the negative messages on this topic came from two people, JohnKsa and Bobby Lee, neither of whom have owned the guns and one of whom, Bobby Lee, has never even shot one.

Where did I write in this or any other thread that I have never shot a HP.

Where did I state I have no experience with them?

I do admit to being smart enough not to waste my hard earned money on junk guns and that does include a HP.

[Walt Sherrill]

My error. Sorry.

You don't say you that have NOT shot one. You also don't say that you HAVE shot one.

All your comments are about their obvious unsuitability, crappy quality, etc. But there are no real first-hand comments about their actual performance, handling, or anything else that would make the typical reader think you were speaking from experience. I guess I inferred too much. Given that, let me revise my comments above:

"The vast majority of the negative messages on this topic came from two people, JohnKsa and Bobby Lee, neither of whom have owned the guns and only one of whom even claims to have fired one."

Reminds me a lot of the comments I read about Glocks -- from people who have never owned them.

[larry starling]

Walt not to be funny, But I don't remember reading do you own any HI-points? Please im not trying to stir the pot with my question. thx :confused:

[Walt Sherrill]

Did you see my name among the owners, listed above? Nope.

No, I don't own one. I have shot several. If I ever get a chance to pick one up, cheaply, I'll do it -- just for its conversational value.

I visit pawnshops and guns shops whenever I get a chance. I've simply not seen the great bargains touted here. I did pick up a Star Firestar Plus, once, for $125 -- and the dealer later acknowledged that he had it mispriced. I've never seen such a bargain, anywhere, since. I look for them, all the time.

I've also seen a single-shot shotgun mentioned as a good home defense weapon. We'll, I personally, wouldn't consider that -- as I know that when the time comes to use a home defense gun, I'm not going to be the coolest cucumber in the world, and reloading a single-shot shotgun assumes I've got ammo in a pocket, will have the time to reload, etc. (Why am I reloading? It might be that the first shot didn't work -- perhaps I missed. If the first shot didn't work, I may be pressed for time...)

A good pump shotgun for under $200 would be great. I haven't seen many of those, either...

My original response, days ago, was that two gun shop owners I know both said they were OK. Hi-Points were the only inexpensive guns they'll sell -- because, after doing this for years, they've come to realize that HPs are the only ones that don't come back to the seller.

Many of the folks who buy HPs are unfamiliar with handguns, don't know how to find a good buy, and probably wouldn't know one if they saw it. If one of them came into either of the gunshops I mentioned, and said they had less than $150 to spend, I think both owners would steer them to the HI-POINT. Around here, you can get a 9mm or .45 HP for under $125, out the door. I'd rather have either of those rounds over a .38 special, if push came to shove.

But, as with any home defense gun, I wouldn't depend on it until I've shot it enough to be sure I had confidence in it.

Both dealers would probably sell them a HP, not because they liked HPs better than other guns, but because they felt the HPs were reasonable products for the money available. (In their business -- selling guns -- they're not going to give them a gun, out of the goodness of their heart, and they're not going to sell them something that's going to cause the dealers problems later. To do either would be a poor business practice.)

So. Read the comments of the owners and decide for yourself. Or you can spend two to three times as much and have something you like a lot better. Not everybody seems to have that option.

Or you can totally ignore the comments of all NON-OWNERS. That might be the wisest course of action, on this topic.

[JohnKSa]

Ten owners responded positively -- TheBucket, Clone, HKSW, Boofus, CajunBass, Ridge, Plevniak, Pietro Beretta, Jim101, and Javelin Man.

On prior HiPoint owner, DenFoote, responded negatively; he noted that he had owned his many years ago.

One of the current owners said he had experienced problems, possibly breakin issues -- and he said he fixed it/it fixed itself.

You do the math: 91% of those who have owned them like them, and 100% of those who have bought them in recent years like them.I"ll repeat my advice. Anyone who wants to know the truth can go back and read the OWNER comments on this thread. As you well know, Walt, a good number of the people who "responded positively" had important negative comments to go with their "positive response" and your post that tries to boil this thread down to a single number doesn't come close to telling the story.The vast majority of the negative messages on this topic came from two people, JohnKsa and Bobby Lee, neither of whom have owned the guns and one of whom, Bobby Lee, has never even shot one. My negative comments were not speculative, that is I did not comment on areas in which I have no experience. I didn't, for example, say that HP pistols were unreliable or inaccurate unless quoting an HP owner/shooter. So while your post may be technically accurate, it is also misleading. Furthermore, while I have made some negative comments, you are certainly aware that a good number of far more acerbic and pointed negative comments on this thread came from HP owners. Again, your comment while not untruthful is misleading.

I find it amusing, after some of the accusations of that have been tossed around on this thread, that I'm ending up as the one repeatedly saying that people should read the owner comments for themselves. :rolleyes:

[mattw]

Good God! Just let the thread die, people! I think the last 3 pages have been the same thing over and over again!

[JohnKSa]

Ok, that's funny coming from a guy who has a 9mm vs .45 comment as his sig line... ;)

[mattw]

I'm sorry, do you want to go on another 6 pages here about wether 9 or .45 is better? I just thought it was a cool quote so i used it as my signature. Stop looking for an argument.

edit: haha! looks like i'm the jackass now.. didn't see that smiley ;)

[dzimmerm]

I have bought two hi-point 9mm composite pistols.

One sits in a case by where my wife works at her computer. She also has a monitor to watch the front door.

The other sits where ever I have left it after either cleaning it or taking it to the range.

The gun by my wife has only had 50 rounds of FMJ through it.

The gun I shoot for target practice has had over 1400 rounds though it with this caviat. It broke it's firing pin after 1200 rounds. The firing pin and spring and collar were sent to me from hi-point after I called them about shipping the pistol in. No charge for that.

Then the slide broke after about 1300 rounds. The slide broke where the tab sticks down that retains the return spring. The return spring launched itself down range and since I was at an outdoor range it was never found. I sent the weapon in for repair. It cost about $4.00 for shipping via FedEx. I sent it as broken machine parts, which it was. I did not include the magazine so it was not capable of firing. This was at Hi-points, (beemillers) suggestion. It might have something to do with the fact I live in Ohio so the machine parts did not have to cross state lines.

The weapon came back from repair about a month after I sent it in. It came back with two magazines. I had to pick it up from FedEx as it had to be signed for.

The weapon shoots again.

I also have a Bulgarian Mak, a CZ52, and a Yugo SKS.

I like all of my weapons.

I got the Mak because I wanted something a little easier to conceal carry and thought it would fit the bill. I am still deciding.

The CZ is just fun to shot.

So is the Yugo.

The thing is, I would probably have never got started in owning firearms if someone had not tried to break into our house while I was away at work. Our sturdy door and alarm system foiled the would be intruder and to give them credit the police showed up in about 3 minutes. It was the Police that actually scared off the intruder.

I found I really liked target practice with pistols. I would never have found this out if I had not gotten the first hi-point.

My recommendation, from usage would be this. Use only jacketed bullets in your hi-point. The manufacturer also recommends this.

Inspect your hi-point for stress in the slide. As it has been stated. The slide is fairly bulky and heavy. Now I know what to look for I will pay close attention to my hi-point once it nears the 1000 round mark.

I may be jumping the gun, so to speak, because the failure of my second hi-point might have been caused by me not lubricating the slide retainer pin with grease for the first 500 rounds or so. I used gun oil. I think the slide needs grease to help reduce wear in the channel the slide retainer pin moves in. That increased wear could have led to the firing pin and the slide breakage I experienced. Hi-Point has also modified their slide retainer pin to reduce wear on the slide channel. The rebuilt weapon I received had this newer slide retainer pin.

All in all I like the hi-point for what it is. A decent low cost weapon that works if you take the time to find out what ammo it will feed and what it will not. Mine did not like Federal Hydroshocks. That was the only hollow point I tried in it. I have fed a few different winchester FMJ types though it. It worked ok on the truncated cone 147g and all of the standard FMJ target ammo I tried. I found that tapping the magazine so all rounds are seated to the back improves reliability of feeding. Tuning the magazines by bending them a little here and there also helps. I have 6 magazines now and they all feed correctly on target FMJ.

I have not tested other hollow points besides the federal hydroshocks but will do so in the future. I may take up handloading to enable me to fire my CZ52 and Mak more often. If I do take up handloading I am sure I can create some hornady tipped 9mm that would be a decent defensive round.

If I am at home the pistols are there to allow me to get to the Yugo SKS, :).

I hope this helps. If you want a little more history of my Hi-point you can look at this.

http://home.columbus.rr.com/dzimmerm/guns.html

dzimmerm

[mattw]

great post! thats what this thread was supposed to be..

[Johnny Guest]

At least this thread ENDS on a positive note.

CLOSED