How To Avoid Being Murdered


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Waitone
July 3, 2005, 09:58 AM
<Poster's Comments--Interesting perspective even if over-the-top in rhetoric>

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/douggiles/dg20050702.shtml

How to avoid being murdered by a Dutch hedonist
Doug Giles (archive)

The Aruban incident ticks me off on three levels:

1. The total obfuscation coming from the pencil neck geek Aruban teens, from the Frankenstein-like Dutch punk and from his lawless lawyer father. As macabre and irreparably dented as the BTK killer is, at least when he was caught, he came clean. Not so with these palm pilots.

2. The incredibly decrepit Aruban Keystone cops and their banana republic judicial system who have handled this case like MC Hammer handled his finances during the 90’s and . . .

3. The fact that this could have been avoided if . . . if . . . Natalee would have simply run away from with these little horn dogs.

What the heck is a good-looking blonde girl doing leaving her friends at midnight to go off with the Netherlands’ version of Lurch and the local Mango brothers? With all due respect to Natalee and her parents, what was she thinking? She was asking for disaster. Now, because of one bad decision, because of over-riding her common sense and probably everything her parents have told her not to do, she has, almost certainly, been murdered by these three stooges. What a shame. What a loss. And again—what an avoidable tragedy.

Of the 157 missing kids in Florida, 120 are girls, i.e. 75% of the kidnapped or murdered victims are little ladies. In addition, one out of every five teen girls will experience some form of dating violence by the time she finishes high school. The reality is, ladies, Happy Days are over and the girls have got to wise up if they want to avoid being duct taped and stuck in the trunk of some loser’s Trans Am.

The answer is not isolation. There really aren’t any Mayberry RFD’s to move to any more, as weird guys seem to be everywhere today. Therefore, it is up to you, my little chicas bonitas, to become sharper than a bag of wet mice when you party, travel and date. Yes, even blondes must cease to be “blonde” in their deductions of most dudes.

In order to be safe and still have a good time I’ve concocted a helpful list of pointers—some borrowed from Safety Chick, Kathleen Baty, some from www.familyeducation.com and some from my own ridiculously distrusting, overprotective, don’t-mess-with-my-daughters-or-I’ll-kill-you brain. If followed, you stand a pretty good chance of avoiding the Van der Sluts—I mean—Sloots that are out there. Here we go . . .

1. Whet your BS detector. Girls, if ‘red flags’ start going off in your head, your skin begins to crawl up your arm and your gut revolts against your eyes and ears, then you might want to pay attention to what your body/ intuition is telling you. Yes, Gavin de Becker’s Gift of Fear (that we all have and often to our detriment, override) is trying to tell you there is a lot wrong with Mr. Rico Suave—no matter how he looks or what he says. Yes, your sixth sense is trying to tell you there is something awry with Mr. Nice Guy. Don’t blow this in-house salvo off, but rather get well acquainted with your internal ticker; it’ll help you see through the veil of crap most bad guys live behind.

2. Party Smart. When out partying, lame guys with hackneyed existences have found ways around getting a life before they get a girl. It is called, as you all know, date rape drugs. With the advent of roofies and ecstasy, losers are able to work around your brain and body (if they can lace your drink) by getting you so smashed that you throw off any inhibitions (or go unconscious) so they can try their ham-fisted moves on you. So, to avoid being French kissed, raped, impregnated, kidnapped or murdered by these slugs:

• Don’t take a drink from a stranger. Receive your drink, only, only from the bartender; watch him make it, and then have him hand it directly to you.

• Don’t leave your drink lying around where Goofy can drop a roofie in it.

• Don’t party with brain-dead buddies. Hang out with friends who aren’t like Gary Busey or Tara Reid, who keep their wits about them when they’re having a good time, who will not let you leave with three local peons or get ridiculously wasted, who have a well honed BS detector and who will not let you get behind the wheel of your 330I if you’ve had seven shots of Cabo Wabo.

3. Learn to Kick Butt. A good defense is a strong offense, and ladies, I’m a big advocate of your learning how to dissemble a man, should the need arise, with your own hands, feet and weapon. If I were you, my dear, I would take martial arts, learn how to use a knife, buy a gun and get a concealed weapons permit. I’m talking getting packed, stacked and ready to whack.

Yes, you would do well to follow hard in the path of Lara Croft, Charlie’s Angels, Annie Oakley and Wonder Woman in learning how to wail on any would-be perpetrator. Can you imagine if one of those Aruban rubes made some ill advance on Natalee, and she were able to go Jackie Chan on them? The May 31st Aruba Diario headlines would have been somewhat different. They would have read, “Dutch dill weed admitted to ER last night to have proctologist remove driftwood from his backside put there by young blonde who told him ‘no’ and meant it.”

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migoi
July 3, 2005, 01:33 PM
you might consider becoming an instructor for NRA's "Refuse To Be A Victim" program.

migoi

Pawcatch
July 3, 2005, 02:15 PM
and the local mango brothers.

What does that mean?The Kalpoe brothers are sons of a Surinamese business man who is of east Indian descent.In Suriname they call that "hindustani".
Where does this mango reference come from?

To keep this gun related,it depends on a number of circumstances to know if a gun would have helped or not.If she was sober and didn't fully trust the boys a gun would have possibly saved her life,but I think that she wasn't sober enough to defend herself and she probably trusted them too.

Vernal45
July 3, 2005, 02:24 PM
BAD things happen to stupid people. Natalie had no business being out that late, drunk, in a foreign country. She had no business leaving with people she did not know. I am not placing blame on Natalie, I feel for her family, but Natalie was a contrubiting factor in this, her stupidity.

Waitone
July 3, 2005, 02:28 PM
White slave?

Destination Hong Kong or the Far East arabic kinda countries. Thriving trade without much public knowledge>

Rabbi
July 3, 2005, 02:38 PM
Pawcatch,

Lighten up, man. He wrote a cogent, well phrased thread.

Kalpoe DOES sound like a tropical fruit, sort of.

I'm glad we have at least one expert on Surinam. Are these guys indigines or just Surinamese wannabes? Is Aruba more tropical fruit friendly than Surinam?

horge
July 3, 2005, 03:36 PM
Too easy for the criminals to have slipped the poor girl a date-rape drug.

Let's see how smart you are when you're under the influence of one of those mickeys, Vernal.
It's not like Natalee and those guys only met there and then: those guys had been
insinuating themselves into Natalee's group, making all friendly, for DAYS.

Oh, but I'm sure you've never been conned or fooled, or been overly trusting



h.

Standing Wolf
July 3, 2005, 03:46 PM
Send a teen-aged daughter of mine to some foreign country? Not much before the 37th of March!

Vernal45
July 3, 2005, 03:56 PM
Let's see how smart you are when you're under the influence of one of those mickeys, Vernal.


Nope, never been fooled like that. Face it, Natalie was not being responsible, like most kids now days, and there is a price to pay. Never had a mickey slipped to me either, I dont accept drinks from someone I dont know, or have only know a short while, I buy my own. Yes, its a bad thing that happened, a young woman is probably dead, but dont forget, and dont twist it around, she COULD have made a difference, and she is/has paid the ultimate price for her inactions. All those things you mentioned, with venom attacking me, can be negated from happening with a little situational awareness, that is what was Natalies down fall.


Dont ya just love it, when Its a child (albiet a 17 to 18 year old child) is missing/dead, and the "its for the children folks come out of the wood works.

Sistema1927
July 3, 2005, 06:51 PM
What is the attraction of Aruba as a High School graduation destination?

The fact that you can get smashed without anyone asking to see ID.

I don't know why:

a) this story hasn't been repeated many times in the past, or
b) why parents would allow kids to go on such trips.

Heck, the "chaperones" were only there to help with "passport problems", so it appears that everyone knew the facts of life before arrival. Too bad that Natalee didn't have any "passport problems" so that she could receive some chaperone assistance.

Azrael256
July 3, 2005, 07:15 PM
Nope, never been fooled like that. Face it, Natalie was not being responsible, like most kids now days, and there is a price to pay. This is very true. Let's be careful not to blame the victim here, as her (probable) murder was not her fault.

Oh, but I'm sure you've never been conned or fooled, or been overly trusting Never when it really counts. If a situation looks funny, a quick tactical withdrawl of myself and my friends is called for. Dionysusigma has seen me do this on more than one occasion. Actually, he has called it a few times. It's just good judgement.

That said, the author of the article is exactly right. Most of these types of situations are completely avoidable if the potential victim exercises a little good sense. I have known a good number of date-rape victims, and all of them simply played dumb the whole time. I have known exactly one person who was sexually assaulted while being in a relatively safe place during daylight hours. That's about a one in a million shot. All the rest of them took a drink from some wacky dude at a party, went over to his house to watch a movie or somesuch, or engaged in some similar type of idiotic behavior. Date-rape victoms almost always agree to every step that leads up to the assault.

I'll be sending my kids along with Standing Wolf's.

bogie
July 3, 2005, 07:22 PM
Do we even really know that the "suspects" did it? Or if they're getting confessions beaten out of 'em in an Aruban jail? Face it - this ain't the USA... And there was a LOT of pressure to arrest _someone_.

For all we know, she's been doing a steady diet of roofs and horse for the past week or three in some middle eastern country...

walking arsenal
July 3, 2005, 07:38 PM
Heres a revelation for you. If your daughter, sister whatever is seen with an obvious loser and you have any suspision that he might have "ideas" pull him aside, give him "the talk" and if he doesn't listen take him out back and pummel the twerp until he gets it.

I've done it to several of my sisters boyfriends it works well.

Educating the ladies in defense is also a good idea.

But

Guys, protect the gals not all of them can protect themselves.

Peter M. Eick
July 3, 2005, 07:50 PM
I have to say as a father of a young girl I have followed the whole thing with more then idle curiousity.

To me, what parent would let their child go to a foreign country at 17/18 where it is obviously a drinking binge. As someone who works a lot internationally (heck I am writing this while riding around on a ship at sea), I have seen a bunch of the less then tourist hot spots. Why in heck would you let your kid go there?

Everytime I land in the States (even if it is California) I am always happy to be back home. There is so much of the US to see, why go to a foreign country except to work?

Sorry I really feel for the family but I have to side with situational awareness. What was she doing out after midnight, alone, in a 3rd world country (ok maybe second world), drunk?

I just don't get it.

Hook686
July 3, 2005, 08:32 PM
Today, 06:50 PM #14
Peter M. Eick

wrote:

Sorry I really feel for the family but I have to side with situational awareness. What was she doing out after midnight, alone, in a 3rd world country (ok maybe second world), drunk?

hmmmmm having been to South America when I was a teen I can offer some insight into the "Why ?". Essentially I was a young English (American Engish) speaking kid, trying to act like a grown up, in new and strange, but enticing, situations ... from the Copacabana in Rio, to the Punta del Estes in Uruguay, it was all new and exciting. To find someone that spoke English, be they from England, Australia, the states, France, Paraguay, or wherever did not matter, for this was an immediate friend ... someone who could translate and offer tips on customs.

I can certainly understand the why ... but then my experience was 40 years ago, and I'm not a blonde ... but I admit to "hitting" on a blonde, or two during those travels ... ahhhhh the memories of youth,

It is a crappy situation when one is put in a situation of being advised to carry, even in one's dreams.

Hook686

LawDog
July 3, 2005, 08:43 PM
Maybe I'm just old-fashioned, or maybe it's just my own experiences over-seas speaking, but I can't for the life of me understand why a couple of parents would let their teenage, blonde, daughter visit a Third World country without going along.

School field trips are fine, as long as they're inside of 200 miles (yes, I'm over-protective), but going to a Third World country with a bunch of your school-chums who are planning on getting snot-slinging, commode-hugging drunk and staying that way for the duration of the trip strikes me as a Very Bad Idea.

Especially for a teenage girl.

LawDog

Cesiumsponge
July 3, 2005, 08:56 PM
I've heard my share of horror stories where teens going to Mexico to get pissed drunk get beaten, raped, their belongings stolen, etc.

Teenagers visiting a 3rd world nation with a group of peers their own age are vulnerable to a lot of bad stuff; I don't know why that isn't common sense. Hell, even adults can get into deep trouble.

Rabbi
July 3, 2005, 09:02 PM
Dog's right ................ the parents allowed this to happen. They even encouraged it. Eighteen or not, "adult" or not, I still had influence in my kids' lives when they were that age. They still look up to me and ask my advice on occasion and the youngest is 35. My daughter is safe and sound.

captain obvious
July 3, 2005, 09:48 PM
I see this kind of thing, sadly, all too often in morgantown, and while the the male perpetrator is always, for lack of better words, some form of degenerate scum, usually the girl involved is all too willing to just go along with whatever happens up until something bad happens. I know the ladies here are not at fault, but I can only keep quiet when some of these victims are described after the fact as completely innocent angels, subject to a sudden and deliberate surprise attack.

Really, the way some girls dress and act in Morgantown - I'd never thought that a girl in such clothing could be such a turn off, but it is hard not to think that some of them just don't respect themselves.

DontBurnMyFlag
July 3, 2005, 11:41 PM
im sure theres a few THR members that could get those 3 kids talking alot faster than all the Aruban authorities put together. As much as I like what little personal liberty is left from the government, I would enjoy a good ole fashioned interrogation of those little bastards.

TarpleyG
July 4, 2005, 09:10 AM
I didn't read all the replies but wanted to comment on this:
Now, because of one bad decision, because of over-riding her common sense and probably everything her parents have told her not to do, she has, almost certainly, been murdered by these three stooges
Well, unless you are wired dramitically different than most 18 year olds, this makes perfect sense. She is in Aruba and away from any authority she knows, drinking and possibly doing drugs, she meets a couple of cute guys who sweet talk her into doing whatever and she goes with them. I don't think they had any evil intentions outside taking advantage of a drunk chick. We guys have all done it, tried to do it, or thought about doing it so we are no different. I think things got out of hand and she sobered up enough to realize she didn't want to be there doing whatever and tried to put a stop to it and was accidentally killed.

Bottom line is the girl was doing what teenage girls do--rebelling a little and that got her into a lot of trouble. People make bad decisions everyday. Doesn't make it right. I just hope these POS guys spill the beans so the girl's family can put all this behind them.

Greg

Onmilo
July 4, 2005, 10:09 AM
Walk in the valley in the shadow of death and you will stand a good chance of meeting him.
Unless we all decide to lock our children in hermetically sealed boxes and only allow them out for supervised walks they all will walk in the same valley we walked through during our formative years.
You can't teach a child common sense, they have to learn it through experience.
All we can do is educate them and hope and pray some of the advice sank in.

Mannlicher
July 4, 2005, 11:17 AM
let's put a little of the responsibility on her parents. If I recall, they are divorced. Sounds like neither of them taught the girl any common sense. I would certainly not let my daughter, at that age, head off to some party paradise without my supervision.

Beren
July 4, 2005, 11:51 AM
What does this have to do with general gun discussions?

Vitamin G
July 4, 2005, 01:05 PM
What does this have to do with general gun discussions?

If we had INTERnational reciprocity, she might still be alive?
:)








Mental note : Work on international reciprocity right after I can carry anywhere in the US...

Sam
July 4, 2005, 01:26 PM
Bad choices :uhoh: on top of bad choices :uhoh: on top of bad choices :uhoh: .
Defective thought patterns in process. :uhoh:

Child does not learn correct thought processes for whatever reason =bad life choices=chlorine in the gene pool.

Sorry that it had to happen, glad that my kids learned.
Evolution in action for Natalee :eek:

Sam

patent
July 4, 2005, 03:21 PM
Let's see how smart you are when you're under the influence of one of those mickeys, Vernal.

I had someone slip me a little something extra once. It took me abit, but I realized it wasn't the alcohol I was feeling. I had friends take me home. I was 18 at the time, so maybe I was just born boring, but it is possible to still have enough common sense to realize you are in trouble and get out.

When I read about these things I typically have the impression that what happened wasn't fair, but when you put yourself in a bad spot, bad things happen to you. Again, not fair, not right, but when you take risks, sometimes you get hurt.

patent

patent
July 4, 2005, 03:24 PM
I don't think they had any evil intentions outside taking advantage of a drunk chick. We guys have all done it, tried to do it, or thought about doing it so we are no different. I think things got out of hand and she sobered up enough to realize she didn't want to be there doing whatever and tried to put a stop to it and was accidentally killed.

There's a whole world of difference between looking af a drunk chick and wanting to take her home, and when that drunk chick realizes she doen'st want to be there, killing her. Intentional killing or not, they had to try to stop her from leaving or something to have killed her. And no, most of us have not done that.

patent

TarpleyG
July 4, 2005, 04:14 PM
And no, most of us have not done that
You're telling me that you think that most guys have not had the thought of taking advantage of a drunk chick? Man, you must've grown up in a bubble or a convent. Oh, and don't bother with some holier-than-thou diatribe either if you do.

Greg

Barbara
July 4, 2005, 04:33 PM
Sounds to me like some morons may not have beat it into their kid's head that killing people was unacceptable.

patent
July 5, 2005, 12:11 AM
Quote: And no, most of us have not done that

You're telling me that you think that most guys have not had the thought of taking advantage of a drunk chick?

Read all of what I said, instead of snipping a small portion out of context. The part you quoted came immediately after I referred to trying to stop her from leaving:

Intentional killing or not, they had to try to stop her from leaving or something to have killed her. And no, most of us have not done that.

That's what I'm referring to, your post seemed to equate much of what happened with what most guys do, and though I tend to disagree with some of your line of thought, I think its obvious that the last part of what they did is hardly the same thing, and hardly accidental.


Out of curiousity, do you think the insults in your post made your point stronger or something?

patent

Justin
July 5, 2005, 12:22 AM
This one's done, for obvious reasons.

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