Preparing to move to California. How?


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fulloflead
July 3, 2005, 03:52 PM
I may be moving to California inside the next year or two.

I guess the BIG question is, do I need to do anything special in order to bring my guns with me?

Mostly, what I have are revolvers and most of those are about 1989 manufacturer or older.
I have a few autopistols: Kimber, Browning Hi-Power, Glock 17, Ruger MkII
One bolt-action rifle and a single-shot shotgun - which are pretty old.
I've got two handfuls of hi-caps for the Glock & Hi-Power and that's about it.

So, what do you think will give me the least headache and keep me within the law? I'm thinkin' I just need to trade those hi-caps for 10-rounders and just put everything in the moving van and go. Am I right?

Thanks.

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50 Shooter
July 3, 2005, 04:05 PM
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/

nico
July 3, 2005, 04:15 PM
I'm not trying to give you crap or anything, but why are you moving to California?

edit: just for the record, I prefaced my post to prevent it from being interpreted like the two that followed it.

TMM
July 3, 2005, 04:38 PM
yes, WHY, WHY are you moving TO the People's Soviet Republik of **********, while all the Kali gunnies are bitching about that hell hole and how they want to get out???

stay where you are.

~TMM

peacefuljeffrey
July 3, 2005, 05:06 PM
There is nothing you can do to try to "keep within the law" in ***********.

They keep changing the law to try to make whatever it is you are currently doing/owning illegal. :barf:

A decision to move to CA, in my opinion, is about as stupid a decision as looking down your barrel to see if you can figure out what's causing a hang-fire.

-Jeffrey

peacefuljeffrey
July 3, 2005, 05:12 PM
So, what do you think will give me the least headache and keep me within the law? I'm thinkin' I just need to trade those hi-caps for 10-rounders and just put everything in the moving van and go. Am I right?

I suppose the Jews thought the same thing: "They won't bother me as long as I agree to wear this yellow star arm band...right? ...Right?"



The idea that you seem fully okay with trading in your "HI-caps" (they are NORMAL caps, dude) for 10-rounders almost makes me want to vomit. :barf:

A little supposition on my part, here:

- You don't mind having a 5- or 15-day waiting period, since it's "no skin off my nose."
- You don't mind having to keep your guns 1000 feet or more away from any school, or anything that could remotely be called a school -- "it might save children's lives..."
- You don't mind not having those silly flash suppressors on the barrels of rifles. Only Rambo-wannabes have those, so it was okay when they were banned.
- You don't mind the fact that only the rich and/or famous are allowed to carry -- after all, what does a common street criminal want with you, anyway?


How many other useless restrictions on your rights are you okay with, besides the 10-round limit?


-Jeffrey

Gunsnrovers
July 3, 2005, 05:14 PM
If you come, welcome.

The above like will provide you with the information you need.

Your long guns sound fine. No issues.

You will have 60 days to register your handguns (plus $19 each).

As for your hi-caps, it is legal to have them in state prior to 2001. Magazines possessed in the PRK prior to that are grandfather. It is illegal to buy, sell, or import hi-caps after that. How that effects you is your call.

nico
July 3, 2005, 05:15 PM
peacefulljeffrey, maybe you should wait for the original poster to reply before you start ASSuming things and attacking him. Some people have these things called "jobs" and "families" that sometimes necessitate doing things such as moving to an area that a person would otherwise stay away from.

Mannlicher
July 3, 2005, 07:32 PM
Spoken like a true Marylander. Another second class citizenship.

But you are right to a point, Peacefuljeffery does not sound all that peaceful. :)

Mauserguy
July 3, 2005, 07:43 PM
Welcome to the PRC. As a native of the Peoples' Republic, I can attest to just how wierd it is out here. Having visited other states, I feel like I need a passport to come home.

It is not just the gun laws that are screwy here. Wait till you start paying the taxes, have to deal with HOA condo commandos, city councils that behave like workers' soviets (my city council banned washing your car), and a legal system that is from another planet.

If you have kids, be careful about sending them to public schools. My sister was able to hand pick the school her kids would go to. Apparently the principal at the closest school was a politically correct loony, so they had to take the kids to a school that was farther away, but where they actually teach the kids to read and write, not indoctrinate them. Home schooling and private schools have become a huge industry here, since the teachers' union is out of control, only Arnold has had the cajones to stand up to them, and it is looking like he will be burned at the stake with the next election.

Having said all of the above, you will love the weather and the close proximity of some great natural features. In two hours you can go to some decent mountains, arid deserts, or watch the Huntington bikini team play volley ball. My plan is to stay here, building my career, but by real estate in Nevada, Colorado or Utah, preparing for an eventual escape.

Also, be careful of the real estate market out here. It's going to collapse. It has fallen before, and buying right now may not be wise, especially since the economy here is not as strong as it used to be.
Good luck,
Mauserguy

PS: Did I mention that we have great weather?

Bufford t. Justice
July 3, 2005, 07:47 PM
I was going to ask the poster why on Gods green earth move there but since that's been covered I'll just interject a bit here...a job is a choice. There are plenty more in gun friendly states. Nothing on earth could force me to move to a communist run state. Nothing.
Do yourself a favor and just say no.

Selfdfenz
July 3, 2005, 08:09 PM
fullof lead

You're not planning to take an auto with you are you?

Cali auto taxes are pretty high from what I understand.

S-

AlaskaErik
July 3, 2005, 08:31 PM
Just check your rights in at the border as you cross into the PRC.

nico
July 3, 2005, 08:50 PM
Spoken like a true Marylander. Another second class citizenship.

But you are right to a point, Peacefuljeffery does not sound all that peaceful.

yeah, because if you live in an area full of antigun jerks you must agree with all gun control huh? :rolleyes:

Gunsnrovers
July 3, 2005, 09:06 PM
The peanut gallery is out in force today.

nico
July 3, 2005, 09:16 PM
Gunsrovers, I agree. If I wanted to be treated with condesention and arrogance by people who have never met me I'd go to DU

jojosdad
July 3, 2005, 09:25 PM
peacefuljeffery wrote:
A little supposition on my part, here:
You don't mind having to keep your guns 1000 feet or more away from any school, or anything that could remotely be called a school -- "it might save children's lives..."
You don't mind the fact that only the rich and/or famous are allowed to carry -- after all, what does a common street criminal want with you, anyway:

Well, yeah, these are suppositions.
I have a CCW - if I'm rich or famous nobody's told me yet, and oddly enough CA is one of the few states that I know of where you can legally carry in schools.

Sure we have problems with the blissninnies and antis here, but there are a lot of us still here trying to fight for our rights, and we welcome anyone who wants to come and join us.
That said - Fullof lead, if you end up in the northern sacramento valley, feel free to contact me.

fulloflead
July 3, 2005, 09:35 PM
"The peanut gallery is out in force today."

"Gunsrovers, I agree. If I wanted to be treated with condesention and arrogance by people who have never met me..."

You ain't kidding! I understand and share the fustration about freedoms but the SAME people who voiced their fustration think I need to justify to THEM why I'm planning to move? :rolleyes: Frankly, that's MY business.

(And PeacefulJeffery can go jump in a pond with his nastiness and assumptions. I'm not going to dignify him with an answer.)

Thanks for those who helped and provided some info, for the link and the info about the hi-caps and registration in 60 days info. Is the registration fee per year or just once?

When you say tax on Autos, you mean regular auto pistols like a Glock? How often do you have to pay that?

R.H. Lee
July 3, 2005, 09:35 PM
Welcome to Californa, fulloflead (when ya get here). Pay no attention to the peanut gallery, most of whom have probably never even been here. We've got lots of guns and lots of shooters, plenty of ranges and back country. :)

Hook686
July 3, 2005, 09:44 PM
Today, 10:52 AM #1
fulloflead
Senior Member


wrote:

I may be moving to California inside the next year or two.

I guess the BIG question is, do I need to do anything special in order to bring my guns with me?

...

Thanks.





My advise is to go to http://www.packing.org/ and select California ... read all the stuff, especially the Dept. of Justice material. It really is a big variable depending upon the county and your need. It is possible, but not a sure thing. Read and be forewarned.

Hook686

Mauserguy
July 3, 2005, 09:45 PM
fulloflead, sorry if I was offensive.
Mauserguy

Desertdog
July 3, 2005, 09:58 PM
Where will you be moving to in CA? The reason I ask is that there should be about 2500 being tranferred here (Ridgecrest CA) in the BRAC process.
If transferring here, buy you a house now.

Librarian
July 3, 2005, 10:09 PM
I think 'autos' refers to 'automobiles'.

So far, registering your handguns is a one-time event.

But gosh, be prepared for the housing prices! I was out of CA for a decade or so, but I was back pretty regularly so I followed the prices. We sold our out of state house, and used the entire proceeds for a down payment on a 45 year old house. It's worse now. That same house, 12 years older, would sell for nearly 2 and a half times what we bought it for, and neither the neighborhood nor the house have changed.

Gewehr98
July 3, 2005, 10:30 PM
That some of us exodused that state when either Roberti-Roos or SB-23 became law, so that we didn't have to deed our semiauto rifles to the state and lease them back. So this particular member of the peanut gallery does know what goes on there, after being stationed at McClellan AFB for 10 years. I still remember Sports Authority trying to get me to register my ammunition purchases in their Citrus Heights store. Yeah, right.

Fulloflead, I left Sacramento in August of 1999 because several dozen of my personal firearms would have to be registered there. Registration is a misnomer, as I said before, a more accurate description is they're deeded to the state and leased back. That's exactly what it is, because you are not authorized to will or give the firearm to friends or family members - they belong to the state unless you sell them to a non-********** buyer. Upon your demise the state gets them for destruction. Period.

Now, the one thing that stuck out in my mind most vividly was when I visited the DMV office for vehicle registration. There on the wall was one very large poster reminding the good citizens to register their handguns. As far as I remember, registration was just a one-time thing, unless you changed addresses. They want to know exactly where those handguns are at all times. It's $19.00 for each handgun being registered. Here's the form:

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/ab991frm.pdf

When the police showed up at my residence for an accident I had called in, they asked me where X and X and X guns were. It turns out, once the registration is filed, it comes up on the police cruiser's computer as a gun-owning residence. :eek:

Since leaving, I've had contact with friends who weren't able to leave, due to jobs, family, etc. Many have chosen to simply disobey the ********** gun laws. I feel sorry for them, because they're now ex-post-facto criminals. But something tells me that the ********** DOJ will NEVER get a handle on how many verboten firearms are in their territory. Just like the bullet-serialization and cartridge-marking legislature pending out there, folks will simply ignore it.
(And I'll set up shop in Reno selling unmarked bullets, myself. :evil: )

Your autoloader magazines of greater than 10 rounds capacity have to stay at the border. You're not allowed to import them, under penalty of DOJ prosecution.

Good luck, there are indeed some beautiful ranges out there. And my wife is bugging me to move back after I retire next year. I keep reminding her she's Wife #2 when she does that. About the only gun I'd trust the DOJ to leave me alone about would be a Shiloh-Sharps or Rolling Block. And I'd have to make sure they didn't have bayonet lugs... :scrutiny:

FNFiveSeven
July 4, 2005, 12:14 AM
Just remember, *possession* of high capacity magazines is not restricted in California. Only transfer, sale, trade, loan and importation. Importation of a high capacity magazine is a misdemeanor.

R.H. Lee
July 4, 2005, 12:26 AM
Upon your demise the state gets them for destruction. Period.
OK, if you say so. :rolleyes: How is that enforced, btw?

Oh yeah......it isn't. :p California can't enforce half the crap they've got on the books, yet they add more all the time.

Whatever.

fulloflead
July 4, 2005, 12:50 AM
blackrazor,
Would me driving a moving van into the state with 7 in a box in the back count as "importation" if I didn't plan on selling them?

.

Gewehr98
July 4, 2005, 01:30 AM
If so, that's importation. The PRK law doesn't state whether it's importation for the purpose of resale, or personal use. It references importation, period.

Now, as RileyMC pointed out, enforcement of said law is an interesting proposition at best, just like a lot of the other gun laws out there. So if there's nobody checking out your vehicle at the border, like at the Agriculture Inspection Stations (you know about those, right?), chances are you'll make it to your destination with those hicap magazines unnoticed. Same goes for those handguns and the mandatory registration. It just depends on how "good" a ********** citizen you want to be. ;)

50 Shooter
July 4, 2005, 01:41 AM
FOL,
Stop by Cal Guns when you get here and let us know where you're at.

www.calguns.net

No_Brakes23
July 4, 2005, 02:22 AM
how they want to get out??? Uh, not me. I've always maintained that California will be a lot better when all the @ssholes finally leave.

I love the Geography, Climate, and Income, but that comes at the price of Draconian gun laws and expensive housing.

The one silver lining on our difficulty of CCW is that there is no length limit on folding knives carried concealed. Not a replacement for a snubbie by any means, but good to know, never the less.

Like someone else pointed out, look at packing.org for laws and such.

And don't forget about wonderful towns like Yuma, Parker, Quartzsite, Carson City, Tahoe and Reno. They can be a Californian's friend.

Selfdfenz
July 4, 2005, 04:08 AM
fulloflead

Auto=automobile

I have an associate at work that just relocated from Cali.
He made it sound like automobile taxes are very high out there. Not sure why that would be the case but it is apparently so.

Anywho.
The parts of Cali I have been to (coast around Laguna Beach and south) were beautiful. In one place were were driving up a pretty steep grade and oranges were rolling down hill the other direction. Not something you see everyday. :D

Best of luck to you and yours on the move.

S-

seed
July 4, 2005, 09:04 AM
Blackrazor wrote:

Just remember, *possession* of high capacity magazines is not restricted in California. Only transfer, sale, trade, loan and importation. Importation of a high capacity magazine is a misdemeanor.

So, what about newer model guns which were created after the AWB? If you possess a CZ P01 or FN five-seven with standard capacity mags in **********, would you go down if you were found possessing them...or is the letter of the law so ambiguous that you could actually own them without fear of punishment? Or is it something in between?

FNFiveSeven
July 4, 2005, 03:23 PM
Effective January 1, 2000, the manufacture, importation, sale, or transfer of any large capacity firearms magazine, except to specifically designated parties and under specified conditions, will be prohibited by law. Possession of large capacity magazines is not restricted by this law.

OK, so let's say that you have a high cap for an FN five-seven. Clearly you must have manufactured, imported, bought/sold or transfered the mags after Jan 1st, 2000. Therefore, if they really wanted to, they might be able to prove that you must have violated the law. However, keep in mind that this is a misdemeanor offense and as such is subject to a relatively short statute of limitations. I don't know what the default statute of limitations is here in CA for misdemeanors, but I'm pretty sure it's not more than 3 years. Therefore, even if the DOJ can prove that you brought the mags into CA after 2000, they would actually have to prove that you imported them after 2002 (or perhaps even later) to beat the statute of limitations.

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, but this is my best interpretation of how the law works in this case.

P.S. Maybe a lawyer could chime in here and let us know what the statute of limitations is for a misdemeanor in CA.

thatguy
July 4, 2005, 10:21 PM
You cannot legally bring with you any magazine over 10 rounds.

You cannot bring with you any gun listed as an assualt weapon.

All handguns must be registered (so they'll know where to come in 5 years when the outright confiscation starts) and there is a fee.

Most used pistols are not for sale in CA due to the drop test requirement. If there is any pistol you even think you might like to own someday buy it now.

If you are serious about the shooting sports and exercising your 2nd Amd rights is important to you then you will be very frustrated and angry living in CA. It's likely that by Jan 1 you won't be able to buy bullets or ammo in CA.

1911_sfca
July 5, 2005, 03:42 AM
However, keep in mind that this is a misdemeanor offense and as such is subject to a relatively short statute of limitations.

The statute of limitations starts after someone finds out you committed the crime. So if you are caught with mags clearly manufactured after the ban, you are still screwed.

SoCalGeek
July 5, 2005, 04:04 AM
Legally, you`ll have to let the hi-caps go. All the guns you listed are fine, but you have to fill out a registration form and submit the fee to the DOJ within a certain time period- i think 60 days. Now, that said, I don`t know anybody who has ever been asked about the manufacture date of their standard capacity magazines. ;)

Oh, by the way, if there are any handguns you`ve always wanted to buy, do so before you move. Prices are rather high here, and guns go off-and-on the approved list all the time. Custom 1911`s, etc. are especially difficult here.

Skunkabilly
July 5, 2005, 11:39 AM
fulloflead, what area will you be moving to?

FNFiveSeven
July 5, 2005, 12:03 PM
"Time period after an incident occurs during which a lawsuit may be filed regarding the incident."
-www.thelawencyclopedia.com

Sounds to me like it's not when they discover you commit the crime, but when the crime was committed. Claiming you commited any misdemeanor more than 3 years ago should be a valid defense. I think the "discovery" part only works in certain types of civil cases, such as fraud claims, which may go unnoticed for years.

Cornell's law website also seems to agree on the definition of the statute of limitations:

"A statute applying to both civil and criminal cases which requires suit or prosecution within a prescribed period of time following the civil injury or the date of the crime. See, e.g. U.S. v. Brockamp, Administrator of the Estate of Mcgill, Deceased, 519 U.S. 347 (1997)."

R.H. Lee
July 5, 2005, 12:47 PM
The law can mean little or nothing, especially if it works in your favor. Without going into a lot of detail, I once asked for a dismissal on a speeding ticket based on the ‘rules of evidence’; ‘no writing, except the original writing can be admitted as evidence’. The prosecution had not brought the original writing of the traffic & engineering survey into court. Nonetheless, the judge took ‘judicial notice’ that it existed down at city hall, smiled and congratulated me for being ‘exactly correct’, and found me guilty. :scrutiny:

seed
July 6, 2005, 07:30 AM
Riley MC, traffic court is an absolute joke when it comes to judges following the letter of the law. It's like they will excuse just about every cop screw up in the world, no matter what. I have myself and helped others to get out of tickets, but in each case it was something that was an oversight by the cop, in terms of evidence (brought by you) which would explain why you did what you did. If the cop made a judgement call and did not know something which would negate your guilt somehow and you present it in court, then you can win. Short of that, forget it. The judges in traffic court are totally biased. My brother even had a case where the cop out-right lied about something in court...so it was his word against my brother's. Guess who the judge believed.

As for the statute of limitations, it is definitely from the time of the commitment of the crime and not discovery. I am positive about that. I had a friend years ago who was molested for a long period of time before I knew him. He somehow locked it away in his head after it stopped (the pervert a*****e moved away). Years later, something reminded him of it and he totally lost his mind. It was made worse by the fact that he could not press charges because of the statute of limitations. I will never forget that whole episode. My friend was changed forever...he pretty much went off the deep end, which was traumatic not just for him, but also for all who knew him--to a much lesser degree of course...And I will never forget the first time I heard of something called the statute of limitations.

Mornard
July 6, 2005, 02:12 PM
Not How... Why?

Farnham
July 6, 2005, 10:52 PM
fulloflead, I lived in California for ten years, and loved it for about 5. Then we got the Cali AWB, 10 round magazines only, 10 day waiting periods for EVERYTHING, mandatory pistol registration, Gay Davis' automobile value registration tax (some people drove around with "I just paid $800 to register this minivan" soaped on their windows), bi-annual re-assessment of property tax (hey, your house jumped up in value $5000 since January, please cut us a check for the difference in taxes), and (my favorite) the "if you own an SKS, you're a felon" law. Register them in 2000, and then "turn them in" in 2001.

Just since I left in October of last year, they now have outlawed .50 caliber rifles and will soon require serialized ammunition (which pretty much means they've outlawed ammunition, if nobody wants to add that step to the manufacturing process). You will not be able to order ammo over the Internet, no surplus ammo, just the "good stuff" they'll be logging in at the local gun shop...err...wait, the local gun shops have been getting zoned out of business or just going bankrupt for years.

My home in the Inland Empire was purchased for $149,000 in 2001, I sold it for $330,000 in 2004. If that's not evidence of an absolutely out of control housing market, I don't know what is. If you buy a house out there now, you will absolutely NOT be able to move away in a few years. You will have to keep paying on your $300,000 mortgage for a house that is suddenly only worth $150,000. Go ahead and stay for ten, twenty years, maybe the market will turn around.

I'm not going to call you names for moving to California, and if you do, feel free to call on me in Free America when you need unmarked ammo or normal capacity magazines, I know what it was like being behind "the Orange Curtain". BUT, I would caution you to think long and hard, and remember that $60,000 a year in Cali is about equal to $35,000 a year in a lot of places.

To you Californians that hate it when everyone runs down your state, remember I was one of you not long ago, and you have my deepest sympathies, just not my tax dollars and sunny disposition :neener: .

S/F

Farnham

No_Brakes23
July 6, 2005, 11:00 PM
To you Californians that hate it when everyone runs down your state, remember I was one of you not long ago, and you have my deepest sympathies, just not my tax dollars and sunny disposition. Nothing wrong with comments from people who have lived here. It is the people who don't know much about Cali and still talk trash, (sometimes from states with worse laws,) that irk me.

Sometimes I think if OC, the IE, Imperial county and San Diego became their own state, we would have very different laws.

R.H. Lee
July 6, 2005, 11:40 PM
Ya know Farnham you're awfully smug thinking that somehow you're exempt from this one. I don't think you know all the facts. IF this becomes law (and that by no means is a forgone conclusion), and IF the ammomakers roll over and re-tool (and given that California is a HUGE market for ammo, and ammunition manufacturers are on record saying they cannot take the drop in sales, they just might)..........

...........lemme take a breath............

and given that the Dems WILL control congress again.........

just how long do you think before this becomes FEDERAL law and even y'all down in Texas are included?

The ammomakers are between a rock and a hard place. If they don't re-tool, they lose California sales. If they re-tool, it costs maybe hundred of millions of dollars and you can bet they'll lobby the fed. gov to make serialization nationwide to justify price increases that will recover the cost.

:neener: that, cowboy.

Gunsnrovers
July 7, 2005, 12:05 AM
I'm still trying to figure out where you came up with "bi-annual re-assessment of property tax". You would also know, having only left last October, that the vehicle registration hike went away.

Gripe and critique to your hearts content, but get the facts straight.

Gewehr98
July 7, 2005, 01:06 AM
The ammomakers are between a rock and a hard place. If they don't re-tool, they lose California sales. If they re-tool, it costs maybe hundred of millions of dollars and you can bet they'll lobby the fed. gov to make serialization nationwide to justify price increases that will recover the cost.

It appears Remington has already stated for the record they will not comply with the new PRK ammo legislation if it becomes law:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=144616

That represents a sizable chunk of business for Remington, both to PRK commercial and law enforcement sales, that they'd rather not retool for. Bravo, Big Green!

I'll never move back to **********, but I do have a friend who owns a house in Reno. I wouldn't mind setting up a small business to sell unmarked bulk bullets, cast, jacketed, or plated, to the reloaders on the other side of the border. Just helpin' out those who couldn't get them otherwise, ya know? :evil:

Farnham
July 7, 2005, 01:31 AM
Sorry, Gunsnrovers, but the last registration notice I saw (interestingly enough, mailed to Texas) was ridiculous. $225 for a Harley Davidson older than I am. $135 for a Planned Non Operation??? Maybe they figured since I was out of state I hadn't heard about the repeal of the tax hike? And the re-assessment thing came from Riverside County, I'd get two (and once, three) pink notices a year, extorting me for more money. You work off your facts, I've already worked off mine.

Well, Riley, I guess I am awfully smug.

IF this becomes law

Do you mean that you think the Governator might veto this? Or that the legislature might not pass it? Sounds a lot like the .50 bill...

I'm praying that Remington, Winchester, Federal, and everyone else pulls a Ronnie Barrett and cuts the Cali .gov loose if it passes, but maybe they won't. If they don't, I'm not sure how much "lobbying" power those evil ammo manufacturers have, Congress might tell them to get lost on that nationwide thing, eh? So now they can't recoup the losses suffered from retooling to satisfy California, and the guys from the power company don't get paid, so the machines stop moving, and we're all screwed...of course, if they do retool, they don't have to lobby anyone, they just raise the price of ammo. So once again, we're all screwed. Thanks, California.

Anyway, my point to fulloflead was that California was tough on gunowners and tough on property owners. Gotta get the money to educate all the illegals, you know.

S/F

Farnham

P.S. Now that I think about it, Gunsnrovers, of all the bad things I listed in my post, you take exception to the least important one, and accept all the other bad things like they're nothing important? Dude....c'mon...

Skunkabilly
July 7, 2005, 11:46 AM
Where is fulloflead?

R.H. Lee
July 7, 2005, 12:25 PM
I'm not sure how much "lobbying" power those evil ammo manufacturers have, Congress might tell them to get lost on that nationwide thing, eh? I understand what you're saying, Farnham, but considering that Congress is comprised of re-election whores and money talks, I'm sure the 'evil' ammo makers can get their attention.

Look, the Republicans have been in control of the Congress and the Whitehouse for what, 5 years now? All they (we) have to show for it is bigger more intrusive government and deficit spending. Not to mention serious trade imbalances and job outsourcing increasing exponentially. They're relegating themselves into obscurity. The modern Democrats are hardcore socialists, and they WILL regain power. When they do, they will legislate with a vengeance in an all out effort to impose a statist agenda. You can bet that something like this bullet serialization scheme will appeal to them. If enacted on a Federal level, it makes not a whit of difference whether it succeeds or fails in California, the ammo makers will comply. You summed up the consequences for the rest of us pretty well.

magsnubby
July 7, 2005, 06:27 PM
Isn't it amazing how people seem to think California is the only state that has anti gun politicians?

California only serves as the test bed. You all seem to forget that Dubya stated he would sign a new AWB if it reached his desk. Let me see now...what state is he from...? Tennesse keeps putting one of the biggest anti gunners back into office. How about Missiouri? How many states are trying to get they're own version of the AWB passed?

When the Democrats regain power, AND THEY WILL REGAIN POWER, the whole country is going to be in for a real $&%# storm of anti gun legislation.

You all need to get your heads out of the sand and realize it can (and will if you're not very careful) happen to you.

happy old sailor
July 7, 2005, 07:15 PM
i attempted to formulate a reasonable response, but all i came up with is NOT ME. i lived there, San Diego, for seven years and have been out to visit relatives numerous times since. social situations are worse every visit. now they come here to visit me and some have moved here, they cannot believe the trees, grass, and uncrowded lakes.

i was a newcomer here in 1973 so i cannot complain of others moving here even if it seems to be getting crowded to me. common labor gets paid common wages, but ppl with skills do quite well. it does not take a whole lot to get by here. from what i hear of Calif, housing and taxes are out of sight. that cute little 3 BR bungalow i paid 15, 500 for sold this spring for near a half million. unbelievable. and, taxes went up accordingly as the property price (not value) escalated. i can easily believe there will be a property bust happen there soon. it is sad for California is such a beautiful state. i think it superior to Hawaii where i lived for three years. but, I AINT GONNA MOVE BACK THERE for whatever.

i planned a short post, now look at it. my mouth has been outrunning my fingers - again.

Commissar Gribb
July 7, 2005, 07:56 PM
It keeps surprising me that my home state (maine) keeps shooting down (no pun intended) anti-gun legislation such as laws that illegalise sales between non-licensed residents and EBR bans.

AFAIK maine only has on the books a restriction on full autos. I wonder how long a blue state like that can hold out?

wdlsguy
July 7, 2005, 08:36 PM
AFAIK maine only has on the books a restriction on full autos.

Chapter 43. Weapons
1051. Possession of machine gun.
1. A person is guilty of possession of a machine gun if, without authority to do so, he knowingly possesses a machine gun.
2. As used in this chapter, "machine gun" means a weapon of any description, by whatever name known, loaded or unloaded, which is capable of discharging a number of projectiles in rapid succession by one manual or mechanical action on the trigger or firing mechanism.
3. Possession of a machine gun is a Class D crime.
1052. Right to possess, carry or transport machine gun.
Any law enforcement officer of the State of Maine, any law enforcement officer of another state or a territory of the United States, members of the Armed Forces, Maine National Guard and Maine State Guard may possess a machine gun if the possession or carrying of such weapon is in the discharge of his official duties and has been authorized by his appointing authority.
Machine guns manufactured, acquired, transferred or possessed in accordance with the National Firearms Act, as amended, shall be exempt from this chapter.

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/statelaws/25thedition/maine.pdf

Maine sounds like a great place! :D

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