What about a lowspeed gun story?


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Checkman
July 9, 2005, 06:08 PM
What the heck am I talking about? :confused:

Well how about a story where the good guys are equipped with more "realistic" firearms. Ruger revolvers or semi-autos, 30-30 lever actions, Taurus handguns, single shot shotguns made by NEF, Remington 7400's, Astra and Star handguns, Hi-Points and all types of 22 caliber handguns and rifles. Most of the calibers would be .38's, 32, .357, 410, 12g, etc.
The guns wouldn't be high-speed, uber tactical SWAT/Special Forces firearms. Instead the guns would be ones that have been sitting in closets or up in attics. Other names that come to mind is Stevens, all the models made for Sears and Great Western etc. Oh and let us not forget the war trophy gun which hasn't seen use since 1945, but might still go bang. And there are still alot of them that haven't fallen into the grip of collectors.

What about the story and why would it involve such mundane and very unsexy firearms? Well heck I don't know. You make it up.

It's just over the past several years I've come into contact with alot of gunowners. While there are many(I include myself in this category) who own Sigs, H&K's, S&W magnums,Berettas, Glocks, Steyrs,Brownings,Winchesters, Colts, Bushmasters, and spend much time and money shooting them and having them refined there are many more folks who own two or three pieces. They might have a nice Ruger Model 77 in 30-06, a well used Marlin 22LR semi-auto rifle and an Astra 38 caliber snubbie.
Others might have a couple hunting shotguns made by Ithaca or Mossberg and a 22 Hi-Standard. Their knowledge of firearms is adequate, but they don't read ballistic tables nor do they visit these forums. They might shoot two or three times a year - if that, but they are law abiding gunowners.

For these folks Ruger (I own two .357 Ruger revolvers), NEF,Savage,FEG, Hi-Point, Llama,Charter Arms and Bersa serve their purposes and don't break their wallets. Wouldn't it be interesting where these solid,unspectacular and very "ordinary" firearms play a decisive role? I should also stress that it would be nice to see their owners be the ones using them. Of course there would be a couple hi-speed low drag tactical guys in there as well. They would be the ones who would help the brave intrepid heros and give them a few pointers, but the day would be saved by our "ordinary people".

Anyway just a thought. Clint Smith at Thunder Ranch says that it isn't the weapon but the person using it who makes the difference. A single shot tip up NEF 12 guage being used to save the day. Cool. :D

DISCLAIMER: All the above mentioned firearms are fine guns and my post is in no way an attempt to ridicule or denigrate either the above named brands or anyone who owns any of the above named brands. So please no flames. :neener:

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El Tejon
July 9, 2005, 06:11 PM
You mean where software would trump hardware?

No way! Would never sell because it just couldn't happen. :D

Checkman
July 9, 2005, 06:20 PM
Well it still strikes me as a neat story with some potential. Maybe one day.

Soap
July 9, 2005, 06:25 PM
I once shot 12 raccoons in one night for my in-laws...11 of them were in the same tree. Gear used:

-NEF Pardner 12ga single shot w/ modifed choke
-Federal bulk pack 7.5 shot, 2 3/4 (which is what I happened to have in my car at the time)
-Surefire E2E
-Plastic grain shovel to pick up the bodies
-John Deere backhoe (for the mass grave that ensued)

Warren
July 9, 2005, 06:34 PM
I don't recall where I read it, maybe here, but there was an anecdote of a Texas liquor store owner who shot a robber six times with a Walker Colt.

After the first shot I'm not sure how he could see to hit with the next five.

MikeB
July 9, 2005, 06:41 PM
It wouldn't work cause as we all know it's those mean nasty black tactical guns that are dangerous. Those old hunting guns are likely bb guns by comparison. Heck the VPC even says so.

greg700
July 9, 2005, 07:07 PM
Backwoods Home magazine has just such a story.

It is a continuation to a long running story written by several members, and is a fantastic read. I can't find the original post, but there should be plenty to keep anyone interested in this sort of thing busy for many long hours.

Enjoy:
New Urban Survival Story (Tangent) (http://www.backwoodshome.com/forum/yabb/forum.pl?board=fiction&action=display&num=1049807321)

gbelleh
July 9, 2005, 07:44 PM
Way of the Gun??

The old bag man won the fight with nothing but a .38 snub. Even the 2 main characters used only Colt 1911s (until the very end).

Malamute
July 9, 2005, 09:30 PM
No particular stories to relate, but my "protection guns" are not high speed EBR's They are a rather OLD Winchester 94, a scoped 1903 sporter, a Browning 86 carbine, a Model 12 Winchester shotgun made in '35, Smith DA revolvers with much of the blue worn off (model 29 and K-22), and Ruger SA's with much of the blue worn. They are my "protection" guns because they are what I always have with me, day in, day out, in the truck, in the house, in the hills, on the mountain. I seem to shoot them well, and they kill game well, large and small, rattlesnakes and other varmints without much fuss, and always, and I do mean always, work when needed. Some of my guns live in the truck for months on end with no attention whatsoever, get shot regularly, and get very dusty and have dog hair on and in them, and they still work. Never had a malfunction with the guns listed from leaving them in the truck in those conditions.

I figure if I can hit running small game and moving targets with them, they should do for "protection".

I see a few similar plain vanilla guns in racks in trucks, or with guys that are hunting. Too bad some of these guns cant talk, as some have been around as working guns for far longer than I've been around (one of my 94's was made in 1927).

Soap
July 9, 2005, 10:03 PM
Okay so I didn't engage Tangoes with my NEF but come 'on ELEVEN IN ONE TREE! :D

CB900F
July 9, 2005, 10:10 PM
Fella's;

If memory serves me correctly, I believe that David Brin's "The Postman" meets the criteria.

900F

det.pat
July 9, 2005, 10:16 PM
i don't know about eleven in one, but when i was a kid in WV we hunted coon with dogs, and when we didn't have money for .22's we used a hammer and a welding glove. it's amazing how a coon can really focus on a few dogs.
is that low speed enough for ya.
pat

Kamicosmos
July 9, 2005, 10:53 PM
I don't quite get the point of this thread.

The vast majority of books and movies that have guns, it's usually just 'a gun', some kind of generic looking revolver or automatic, or a pump shotgun. Often times, outside of a few seconds of screen time, it's not even mentioned. Tons of crime stories out there where it's 'Taking the Safety off a .38 Special automatic revolver' type crap too.

Outside of Clancy and other Black-Ops cutting edge Spycraft books/big budget action flicks, most stories have relatively mundane weaponry in them.

Maybe I'm just missing your point... :confused:

greg700
July 9, 2005, 11:27 PM
I almost forgot the mention:

The Matt Helm Series by Donald Hamilton. A fantastic series whose main character dislikes "hand cannons" and fancy weapons when a small, simple pistol or a shotgun will suffice.

rhubarb
July 9, 2005, 11:28 PM
My favorite was the convenience store robber shot by the woman behind the counter. Her comment: "I was trying to blow his head off is what I was trying to do." I don't remember the weapon used, but one would be safe to assume that she was low speed high drag by her chosen occupation but she had Mindset.

See here for and endless supply of such wonderful true stories:
http://www.claytoncramer.com/gundefenseblog/blogger.html

Moonclip
July 10, 2005, 03:32 AM
I am aware of cases where a NAA mini or a Raven was used to fend off a criminal attack, with fatal results. I know of a case where a derringer was used to take out two armed robbers in a hold up at a barbershop in the South, it was national news.

Due to circumstances I have used some less than glamarous firearms for personal defense, one that comes to mind was a Remington nylon 66.

1911 guy
July 10, 2005, 08:57 AM
We won the revolution with the majority of our "farmers" bringing along weapons from home to augment what arms were provided. Those were likely not .69 cal. (EBR of the day)
The battle of New Orleans was very decisively won by some less than honest folks who jumped at the chance for a pardon and threw in with us. I'm fairly sure piracy didn't lend itself to the acquisiton of high speed low drag weapons, most of these guys were barely surviving. Anybody remember the line "We held our fire 'till we seen their faces well, then we opened up our squirrel guns and really gave 'em hell."
The Texas Rangers held our border with Mexico for a long time, stopping everything from anthrax and hoof and mouth to the occassional raiding party with mostly lever guns and revolvers well into the latter half of the twentieth century.

shermacman
July 10, 2005, 09:15 AM
Great theme for a movie! Old, worn-out gun saves the day in the hands of an old, worn-out guy.

I could star in that movie!

BHPshooter
July 10, 2005, 01:42 PM
Isn't "Quigley Down Under" a low-speed gun story, in movie form?

Wes

Matt G
July 10, 2005, 06:49 PM
On more than one occasion, I've seen a certain law enforcement officer, who's now known as a gun writer, wearing a single action revolver strongside as his main (and probably only) carry gun.

Honestly? I wouldn't screw with him...

Checkman
July 11, 2005, 10:25 AM
Kamicosmos-

My point is that in those stories where the weapon is described they are often some type of high speed tactical wonder gun. Many of the writers describe them as being customized and just "gee whiz" type shooters. Apparently I failed to describe in enough detail that the shooters would also be average people. That's the point of this thread. I'm tired of novels in which the heros are always so extraordinary. I know there is a very long tradition in literature in which the hero is supposed to be above the rest of us,which includes his/her's weapon, but it's worn thin.

Thefumegator-

Actually, considering the time period that Quigley Down Under takes place, I would argue that his Sharps is a super duper rifle. Remember the villian describing it as an experimental rifle shooting an experimental round? Now I really like that movie, but I think the weapons the bad guys use in that movie are more your garden variety cap and ball revolvers and of course they really don't do all that well. The exception would be the villain's 1860 Colt revolvers. Very nice and high speed for the time.

Once again I like the James Bond movies and Magnum P.I., but I like the idea of seeing average people using average guns at least once in awhile. Often in moves or books when that happens the average people are way outgunned and somewhat incompetent. The only two movies that I can think of where that wasn't the case would have to be Cross Fire Trail and Open Range.

mfree
July 11, 2005, 10:41 AM
Hollywood did one... Look at Sin City when Bruce shoots the yaller guy with... I think it was a Ruger. Even makes a speech about it.

Old Fuff
July 11, 2005, 10:47 AM
I have a number of friends that have given up on gun magazines (the kind you read, not the kind you load) because the articles don't relate to the kind of guns they buy and own. Their guns are tools, not toys, and the only "enhancements" they are interested in is possibly a new scope - in other words, something that is practical. Only a relatively few fun owners are gun enthusiasts - of the kind found on this and other firearms forums.

Malamute
July 11, 2005, 10:47 AM
I recall reading a true story af a rancher on the American side of the Mexican border that held off a party of Mexican raiders with two Winchester 1894 carbines. Holed up in his adobe house, with his housekeepr loading for him, he managed to kill several, wound others, and kill several horses of the raiders, before they pulled out. This from my vague recollection of reading it perhaps 20 years ago. I guess when this happened the 30-30 cartridge, and 1894 Winchester were fairly new, but not all that high speed for the situation described.

Anyone know this guys name? I'd like to read the story again, I think I read it in a magazine.

griz
July 11, 2005, 10:55 AM
I guess I'll have to check out Sin City. I was thinking more along the lines of one of the thrillers where the bad guy cuts the phone line, starts banging on the door, yelling about how is going to kill everybody and then cut them in little pieces just as soon as he breaks in. In my version you wouldn't even get to finish your popcorn before he forces the door open and is greeted with buckshot from an old Ithaca deerslayer. Happy ending, roll credits :)

Checkman
May 19, 2011, 12:45 AM
Okay six years after starting this thread I have finally gotten around to reading a few of the Matt Helm novels. They're pretty good actually. And while he is the hero Helm isn't flawless and he makes mistakes.

He also uses a S&W Model 49 or Model 40 more than anything else. Once in awhile he'll grab a plain jane scoped bolt action hunting rifle or a 12 gauge pump action riot-gun. He does not have a limitless supply of hi-tech firearms. I'm sure that this is more of a reflection of the time that the books were written, but it is refreshing.

Thanks for the heads up. Now I'm looking for others at the local second-hand stores. They're fun.

Indifferent
May 19, 2011, 01:36 AM
Faster. The rock uses a revolver, killer has semi autos.

relentlessknives.com
May 19, 2011, 06:07 PM
Yea a Great movie. Regular Metro sexual guys with old guns attempt to save the day but lose because the opposition has modern high efficiency weapons.

The winners enslave the losers in re education camps were they learn how silly they were for not keeping up with modern technology.
The classes show how the American Indians were perhaps far better at war than the Europeans, but, their bow and arrows just didn't have the stopping power of a .69 cal musket.
The above slaves escape, and use their new found knowledge to acquire new weapons.....but when they requested NEF guns from their under ground contact they got Nerf guns. Not realizing the difference they again engaged the enemy and were again defeated.
No prison camps this time, in fact these guys were put in charge of the re education camp.

One-Time
May 19, 2011, 06:49 PM
IDK in these parts I see far more 'tactical' firearms than ordinary ones, here you're more likely to see a AK, AR or other 'black rifle' than an ol 30-06 or a savage and stevens etc. Most shotgun are 'tactical' too here

country boy marksman
May 19, 2011, 09:48 PM
they're not set in the 21st century, and most are set in the 19th, but, one of my favorites: Lois L'Amour!

pikid89
May 19, 2011, 09:54 PM
Alas, Babylon by Pat Frank meets the criteria for sure
its about a post apocalyptic semi rural community in Central Florida, that bands together to survive after a nuclear war
has the low key gun usage to satisfy your requirements (young boy uses a 20 ga to defend thier crops, neighborhood militia armed with war bringbacks M16 and Krag rifle, home cut down shotties, and old pistols etc...)

even without the guns, its a killer read

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