Encouraging News from New York


PDA






Vermont Guy
July 24, 2005, 12:20 PM
I've been in New York 6 months so the sheriff will accept an application to keep a pistol in my home. It is a rural county, population 50k.

I need 4 references.

There is a small group that gets together at the excellent local gun club range for trap. I've shot with them several times over the summer. Last time I asked three of them if they would sign as my reference.

Three of three said yes. I take that to mean that the gun owners here have a little sense left.

One did mention that he hadn't known me long but was only concerned as to whether the judge would accept it or not. We are content to leave that to the judge.

In other news, my wife has applied in the county where she works so we have paperwork in two counties. She reported they were very nice and she had no problems filing.

I'll keep you posted as this progresses.

If you enjoyed reading about "Encouraging News from New York" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Lone_Gunman
July 24, 2005, 12:26 PM
You consider this encouraging?

An application to keep a gun in your own home?

Letters of reference from 4 people?

boofus
July 24, 2005, 01:45 PM
You really need to move back to America. :what:

What on earth possessed you to move from legal concealed carry with no license to that wormhole straight to socialist hell? :confused:

It had to be a woman right?

armoredman
July 24, 2005, 01:55 PM
There is PLENTY of room in AZ for gun owners. You will think you dies and went to Paradise for firearms....unless you like snow, in which case both Vermont, (much closer) and Alaska have permitless carry, and few other restrictions.
Leave Schumerland now, come back to America....

RavenVT100
July 24, 2005, 02:00 PM
Heh. I'm getting the F out of NJ in the next couple of years. You need references here too--they even contact your employer. It's ridiculous.

dfaugh
July 24, 2005, 02:01 PM
Look at the paperwork..I think it either requires or recommends that your references have known you for 10 YEARS.

What county is it, if I may ask

beerslurpy
July 24, 2005, 02:21 PM
Holy crap, I didnt need 4 references for my current job. You need to move back to america before you give tax dollars to the communist beast of NY.

scubie02
July 24, 2005, 02:49 PM
I hear those sentiments alot, and to some degree I am the first to agree. But then I hear other rules/laws from other states, some of them supposedly "gun friendly" ones like Texas or whatever, where they have things that are worse than NY in some ways. I have a full carry permit in NY that I've had almost 20 years. Yes, I had to do all the paperwork and have references and such to start, but it doesn't expire and I don't have to renew it every couple years like many places, often paying a fairly decent fee. I didn't have to take some course as part of the requirement, not that perhaps in this day and age when people are less likely to have someone to show them the ropes thats so awful, perhaps, but it opens the door to abuses--"sorry, couldn't afford/pass the course, no permit". And as of yet they don't limit the number you can have or anything. And there's no "you "qualified" witha revolver, so thats all you can carry". You don't have to qualify, and you carry what you please.

So yeah, it sucks in many, many ways, but if you jump through the hoops then so far, anyway, at least in my county, you're ok.

makanut
July 24, 2005, 02:51 PM
I wouldn't be encouraged, but rather extremely distraught. As another poster suggested, you need to get out of Commieland and move to the United States of America ASAP. :(

To be required to ask permission for a constitutional right is unconscionable. Again, many in Commieland can't read and understand the constitution. It shouldn't be that difficult for an educated populace. :banghead:

RavenVT100
July 24, 2005, 03:56 PM
scubie, pray tell how could a state like Texas be any worse than NY?

I think you're living in fantasy land if you honestly think that. There's an ingrained, institutional bias against us on the East Coast. In TX there is not, and none of their policies come close to the restrictiveness and intrusiveness of NY, NJ, MA etc.

Lone_Gunman
July 24, 2005, 05:12 PM
Scubie, while you are answering RavenVT's question, how about also explain the relative difficulty of getting that permit initially in NY as compared to say a free state, like TX, GA, or FL?

Could the average Manhattanite saunter down to the courthouse and expect to successfully acquire a permit to carry?

RealGun
July 24, 2005, 05:22 PM
To be required to ask permission for a constitutional right is unconscionable. - makanut

I will always disagree, but I don't recall any lawyer type that would allow an argument that one had any such constitutional right claim in a State, unless the State constitution provided its recognition. My understanding is that NY has no RKBA, which is effectively voluntary on the part of States. Anyone who has a license in NY has been granted a state-regulated privilege.

Personally I rely upon the plain wording of the 14th amendment and don't want to hear all the baloney arguments why it doesn't mean what it says.

I agree with the advice to move to America. Check any red state/blue state map, and you will have a good idea of where not to live, Vermont possibly the lone exception, if the total package suits you.

El Rojo
July 24, 2005, 05:27 PM
Don't listen to these guys, they don't know what they are talking about. If you don't stay and fight for what is right in New York, they will keep electing liberals to our national government and screwing things up for the rest of Free America. Stay where you are and fight for what is right. Moving out is just a cop out. Somone has to do the dirty work and it might as well be us.

If Hillary gets re-elected next year, it is all of your faults for not encouraging good Americans to stay and oppose her. Think about that one.

El Rojo, PRK Freedom Fighter

RealGun
July 24, 2005, 06:22 PM
If you don't stay and fight for what is right in New York, they will keep electing liberals to our national government and screwing things up for the rest of Free America. - El Rojo

Should he be a martyr to serve someone else's needs? For centuries people have been coming to America to be free. Nowadays you need to be more specific. It's really an issue whether it's acceptable to live where self defense is illegal. We kind of get used to being abused, so it may be a lot more serious than it first might seem.

With all due respect, I can't imagine being represented by a Clinton and a Schumer and the big city politics that elected them. Those held by family ties have my sympathy, but it may be hypocritical on purely economic grounds. Then you sleep in the bed that you've made. The choice is there.

Moondoggie
July 24, 2005, 06:51 PM
Don't count on that Red State/Blue State idea as a reliable guideline. My wonderful state, Nebraska, is most definitely Red and has no CCW.

The City of Omaha has draconian gun restrictions to rival Chicago, NYC, or DC. :banghead:

Kurush
July 24, 2005, 06:58 PM
Pennsylvania went for Skerry and we have CCW with no fingerprints or references and no gun bans or licenses at all. We also are very welcoming of fed up Nyorkers who vote RKBA ;)

GRB
July 24, 2005, 07:16 PM
Don't listen to these guys, they don't know what they are talking about. If you don't stay and fight for what is right in New York, they will keep electing liberals to our national government and screwing things up for the rest of Free America. Stay where you are and fight for what is right. Moving out is just a cop out. Somone has to do the dirty work and it might as well be us.A truer really American type of sentiment I have never heard before. You are right about fighting for the right things even in places like NY. To abandon a state just because it is aminly antigun only allows a larger margin of victory for the anti gun people. I live in NY; I am a member of the NYRAPA, I am a member of the NRA, I vote regularly, I write my representatives every now and again, and I donate money to promote pro gun attitudes and so on. I give it the good fight.

Attitudes like this one below: Should he be a martyr to serve someone else's needs? For centuries people have been coming to America to be free. Nowadays you need to be more specific. It's really an issue whether it's acceptable to live where self defense is illegal. We kind of get used to being abused, so it may be a lot more serious than it first might seem.

With all due respect, I can't imagine being represented by a Clinton and a Schumer and the big city politics that elected them. Those held by family ties have my sympathy, but it may be hypocritical on purely economic grounds. Then you sleep in the bed that you've made. The choice is there. seem defeatist to me. I don't like to live with Schumer or Clinton at the helm either, that is why I stay in NY and try to vote them out. Not too long ago we had another senator you may recall, Alfonse Damato. As far as self defense goes in NY, since when is someonme not allowed to defend his/herself in NY? Sure gun laws need to be changed here and, certain politicains need to be booted out but, running aay does not help the issue. By the way, if you think obtaining a gun license, or living under clinton and Shumer, is equal to being a martyr, my bet is you have no clue as to the real meaning of the word.

best regards,
Glenn B

TimH
July 24, 2005, 07:19 PM
Your user name is Vermont Guy. Does that mean you came from Vermont ot NY? IF so ARE YOU NUTS :what: Anyways your lucky I live in Columbia County and most of my friends are leftists I have a snowballs chance in :fire: of getting a pistol permit

scubie02
July 24, 2005, 07:48 PM
see, the misconception of "being from NY" is that that means NYC. The state of NY is not NYC. There are lots of rural, conservative, areas of upstate NY. I grew up in a town with a population somewhere between 2 and 3 thousand people. There are towns here with populations in the hundreds. I understand that it is very difficult if not impossible to get a permit in NYC. However, there are counties in upstate which are virtually shall issue. As I stated, I have a full carry permit. I have heard lots of people from supposed "free states" that seem to have more restrictions than permit hoders have in NY. They are always talking about this or that business that puts up signs that say "no guns" which includes permit holders. I have NEVER seen that in NY. And to the best of my knowledge, if they DID put up a sign like that, all they could do was ask you to leave if it was private property and they somehow knew you were carrying--it wouldn't be against the law per se.

So, how is NY less restrictive than TX? Well, let's see:

Texas
Initial Application

The DPS supplies all Instructors with Application packets. Your Training Insturctor will supply you with the proper forms when you take the Training Class.
You can apply for a Renewal CHL on line at DPS Web Site.
Attend a 10-15 hour training course; lecture and firearms proficiency demonstration by approved DPS instructor
Processing may take less than 60 days, but up to 180 days if there are problems with application.
Many DPS approved handgun instructors provide one-stop package deal for applicant; photos, fingerprinting, lecture and firearms testing. Shop around.
Renewals

The renewal course is stipulated as a 4 hr. course, including range time. There is a quick review of changes in the law since the CHL was acquired, a review of child safety, and a review of non-violent dispute resolution. The renewal applicant then takes the same test as an original applicant. It is assumed that one who has a CHL knows the applicable law. The "proficiency demonstration" is the same for original licensees and renewal. The cost for renew is $70 for 4 years.


hmmm, so let's see---you still have to apply to get a permit to carry, just like someone from NY, BUT you get to go to classes (10-15 hours initial course!?)and "qualify", then you get the "privilege" of paying $70 EVERY four years to "renew" it (and get to take that same fun test as originally, but luckily only a four hour course this time...)? Yeah, that sounds good. What if they decide not to renew it? My permit's good for life. No classes. No renewals. No $70 every 4 years. Up to six months to get it, which, coincidentally seems to be the same length stated for TX.

Yes, we unfortunately have Schumer and Hillary in NY. As I recall, haven't there been some rather abrasive congresspeople from some of your "free" states as well? I guess I should blame you guys for that. :rolleyes:

RealGun
July 24, 2005, 07:52 PM
By the way, if you think obtaining a gun license, or living under clinton and Shumer, is equal to being a martyr, my bet is you have no clue as to the real meaning of the word.

Ah yes. Love me, love my State.

Lone_Gunman
July 24, 2005, 07:52 PM
Scubie, I know there are plenty of places in NY other than NYC.

I just think your permit is more limited than you are admitting. Also, the NY permit really is useless to residents of NYC, because I don't think it gives them to right to carry anyway.

Also, just FYI, we have no class requirements in GA.

RealGun
July 24, 2005, 09:07 PM
A few New York tidbits gleaned from packing.org:

"New York State requires a license for simple possession as well as for concealed carry. The Court Of Appeals ruled that restrictions on carry licenses, while administrative in nature, are allowable. Premise licenses as well as carry licenses restricted for sporting purposes are near shall issue, although difficult to obtain in certain counties (and the City of New York). Unrestricted carry licenses are easy to obtain or near impossible, depending on which county you apply in."

New York State Consolidated Laws
Civil Rights
ARTICLE 2 Bill of Rights S 4.
Right to keep and bear arms.

A well regulated militia being necessary to
the security of a free state, the right of the people to
keep and bear arms cannot be infringed.

Shall-issue Permit/License: no

Reciprocity - none (my interpretation of the map, not a quote)

Gun-friendly peaceable journey laws: no

All guns are registered with the police, either state or NYC.

[RealGun]

New York City has its own licensing laws and actual licenses. New York State licenses do not apply in New York City. Interesting to note that an NYC license lists every gun owned and reads "licensee authorized to possess the following firearms:" How nice of them. I believe that would mean an update every time you buy a gun, or does that have to be authorized too?

It's clear that the state constitution doesn't mean squat. Restrictions were even upheld by a district court...not that such treatment is unique to NY.

I would have to agree that living outside of New York City and never needing to go there wouldn't be too bad in relative terms, but with no reciprocity or peaceable journey laws, I wouldn't expect NY to get very high marks from those who live in other more gun-friendly States.

I see that I was mistaken in recalling NY as one of the States with no RKBA in its Constitution, but it doesn't look like it makes much difference. We are kind of all in the same boat. I wish you luck.

TimH
July 24, 2005, 09:11 PM
In Vermont, if I'm not mistaken, as long as you're a resident, you just go & buy a handgun Thats it. Jujst buy it. How do you beat that. In NY I have to find 4 people that will say TimH isn't going to go on a shooting spree. Yes some counties upstate are pretty much shall issue but I would much rather have Vermonts laws regarding pistol carry.

EghtySx
July 24, 2005, 09:19 PM
As far as Texas CCW laws are concerned there is a reason for them. It has to do with our proximity to an unprotected national border and the problems associated with it.

Standing Wolf
July 24, 2005, 09:23 PM
The founding fathers would weep.

scubie02
July 24, 2005, 09:38 PM
don't get me wrong, I am not happy with the way NY's laws work either, but I do think there are some misconceptions and its not as bad as several other states nearby. yes, I prefer VT or NH (used to live there for awhile) or PA. NY as with so many other things doesn't recognize anybody else's permit, so it doesn't get any reciprocal agreements because other states aren't likely to say "sure come on down" when yours isn't honored. I'd love to see that change. (I do have a PA permit as well, though, which also has reciprocity with a number of other states). I'd also like to see it mandated that a permit once obtained was also good in NYC, and I don't think anti-gun judges should be able to put restrictions on permits either. I do know that when they proposed putting new fees on permit holders and making them renewable every 5 years a year or so ago, it got put down hard, which was encouraging. It was interesting when reading about it in the paper they threw out some statistics and noted that just the city of Buffalo I believe it was had more permit holders than some whole states.

Anyway, all I'm saying is the fight isn't over in NY, at least not all of it. I'll bet I have written to my congressman more in one year than many of you have in your whole lives, and gun owners still have SOME clout here, and fight the good fight

chopinbloc
July 25, 2005, 12:15 AM
you don't need a permit to keep a handgun in your house or to carry one for that matter. you are a human being and as such, you have a right to procure whatever tools you deem necessary to defense of self and family. i have heard that there are totalitarian pockets bordering the u.s. that brutally opress free men and will imprison you for quite a while if you get caught exercising your rights. we are currently working on an underground railroad to spirit away the political refugees from such rogue nations as new yawk and **********. i have petitioned the president to put them on axis of evil list but i have gotten no reply i can only assume there's alot of paperwork involved.

seriously, pop smoke and move back to the u.s.

gunsmith
July 25, 2005, 02:55 AM
I was about to mention that your permit probably wasn't good for nycity but you just said it yerself.
I am a native new yorker and miss the fireflies and beautifull upstate camping
having been in the scouts in the 1960's and 70's I did some great camping there and learned alot of edible plants and stuff,I really love NY & miss it alot but I love my freedom more.
I can walk out of the gunshop in under a half hour with just about any rifle I want (even a machine gun if I had the cash).
i allways have a gun or two in the car no problem with permits or anything.
no tolls on any roads
a reference to keep a gun in your own house!,that is worse then CA!
next you'll need a license to own a Bible or write a letter to a newspaper.

scubie02
July 25, 2005, 09:02 AM
well, I'm tied to ny because my parents are here and not getting any younger, and mom has had some health scares the past couple years and being here, I see them very often. When I lived in NH, even though it wasn't THAT far, I started to realize I was only seeing them a couple times in a year. Eventually, down the road it is quite possible I will move--if not for family, I probably already would have. But I will miss NY in many ways--I lived in several states and to me it really is beautiful--the leaves in the fall, the rolling hills, a very large variety of game species, and as far as natural disasters go, much better IMO than most parts of the country--we pretty much have to deal with large amounts of snow, and thats about it (which I personally don't mind--I'll take snow over heat anyday). In my lifetime I can remember exactly 2 tornados that went through this area. No hurricanes or earthquakes or mudslides or scorpions or mosquitoes the size of bats. Lots to recommend it. If we could just recapture the government from the commies and kill some of the taxes, it'd be right up there in desirable places to live in the US IMO. Our local reps are decent--they know which side of their bread is buttered and support sportsmen and gun owners. Its just the bigshots like Hillary and Schumer and our governors that suck--alas NYC has too much power for us to overcome. Some day maybe...

Oh, and you don't need a permit to own a long gun, just handguns--I sort of get the impression some think thats the case. Actually if you have a pistol permit, you don't even have to go through the background (NICS) check for a long gun--you are exempted and walk out as quickly as you can fill out the paperwork. No so many day waiting period that some places have.

Vermont Guy
July 25, 2005, 11:00 AM
I wouldn't be encouraged, but rather extremely distraught.

It wasn't the need to apply for a permit to keep a pistol in my home that was encouraging--it was the three guys who without any second though agreed to vouch for me.

As long as there are such people, hope remains.

If you don't stay and fight for what is right

Bless you for the thought. But I'm not fighting now. We're just following the rules to see where they lead.

ARE YOU NUTS

Good question, TimH. Stay tuned.

And yeah, there was a woman. Her job opportunities are rather limited.

In Vermont, if I'm not mistaken, as long as you're a resident, you just go & buy a handgun Thats it.

Vermont is even better then that with regard to carrying. No need to be a resident. Just step across the state line. Been there, done that.

Vermont Guy
July 25, 2005, 11:14 AM
My county just posted a sign forbidding "weapons" in their buildings. Yes the sign probably encroach on the authority of the state assembly but there have been no signs of outrage either. It was one reason I was concerned about the reception my request for signatures would receive.

Several counties got all excited awhile back when that prisoner stole his guard's gun and shot several people.

I went to a meeting of the county council and spoke against adopting this policy. I was rather surprised they were even considering it because for a civilian to carry a gun would require the approval of a local county judge. It looked like the council members didn't trust their judge.

It became apparent during the discussion that these people weren't worried about pistols at all. That base is covered in New York. They actually mentioned baseball bats and knitting needles! You can imagine the carnage knitting needles could create.

Poke. Ouch. Poke. Ouch....

Their new office building will also have metal detectors and sheriff deputies to search people entering.

Vermont Guy
July 25, 2005, 09:28 PM
I live in Columbia County and most of my friends are leftists I have a snowballs chance in of getting a pistol permit

TimH, Columbia is listed at packing.org as being "Almost Shall Issue". Go ahead and ask your leftist friends for a reference. The forms states that they should be "character references who by their signature attest to your good moral character". Nothing about guns. Nothing about guns being good or you being fit to have or operate a gun. Just, are you a good person?

I did this back when I lived in St. Louis, Missouri. At the time the sheriff required two letters of reference for what they call the "Permit to Acquire". So I asked a woman I'd been friends with for years for a letter of reference. She was just an urban girl who hadn't grown up with guns and believed what they told her. When I told her why I needed the letter she said she hated that. But....as far as my character was concerned she had no complaints. She wrote that I was "an asset to the community".

Your friends might suprise you. Make 'em think.

Vermont Guy
July 25, 2005, 09:35 PM
I got the signatures tonight.

But as I examine the details I find that one of them lives in Broome county. That isn't going to work. All four have to live in Tioga county.

Even I know other people in New York. However many of them live in neighboring counties.

Back to the salt mines. Gotta hurry and scrape up another name, the four photos I had made today expire in 30 days.

scubie02
July 25, 2005, 10:16 PM
i wasn't talking about court houses and such banning guns--they are allowed to do that so far as I know. I was more thinking of all the threads I see where supermarket or convenience store chains ban them.

grampster
July 25, 2005, 10:28 PM
"The Founding Fathers would weep." And then gather up the militia and march on the county building, grab the pharisees, tar and feather them and ride them out of town on a rail.

TonyB
July 26, 2005, 02:11 PM
He could live in Mass. or DC.......of course I live in NY and have an unrestricted permit.....it can be done......although if I have to ,I'll move to Vermont :D

toivo
September 23, 2006, 02:34 AM
I live in NY. With gun laws, as with so many other things, we like to say...

"At least I don't live in New Jersey!"

(Apologies to Jersey folks.)

Prince Yamato
September 23, 2006, 02:49 AM
Having lived in both NY and Texas, let me clarify... there are NO NY gun laws that are better than those in Texas. Zero Zip Nada. Now, Upstate isn't as bad as many think. You can still get preban assault weapons and mags, but damn, that whole pistol registration thing stinks of communism.

Autolycus
September 23, 2006, 07:02 AM
Originally Posted by EghtySx:
As far as Texas CCW laws are concerned there is a reason for them. It has to do with our proximity to an unprotected national border and the problems associated with it. What about Alaska? They have a similar border length like Texas.

The border you are talking about, is it similar to the one that New York shares with Canada? Sorry I cant by that logic. By this reason then a few other states would have worse laws then Texas due to the border issue.

Some of the Texas laws are pretty crappy. NY has a better place of where you can carry however getting the permit is the problem.

Remember all of you guys are lucky simply that you can carry. I live in IL and CCW is a dream.

wuchak
September 23, 2006, 09:42 AM
I went through the process and got my NY permit when I was living there in Fulton County. It took about 4 months due to the required training class being delayed. My friend submitted his a couple of weeks before me and was able to get into a training class held during that time. It took less than 2 months for him to get his permit from time he started the process.

There is no requirement for how long you have known your references. The only restrictions on who can be a reference are they must not be judges, town or city justices, police officers, correction officers, persons to whom the applicant is related or any persons in the same household.

The people who will be references have to sign all three copies of your application. Once you submit your application the Sheriff dept will send a letter to them with some questions on it asking about you including length of time known, if they've ever known you to be violent, etc. Getting the letters returned is one thing that can really delay the process. Until all the reference letters are mailed back your permit will not move forward so you need to keep on the people to get them mailed back as quickly as possible.

Once the application is submitted the Sheriff’s office will schedule you in the next mandatory training session they are holding. In my county they only did this once a month. When I applied for mine I missed that month's training by a couple of days, the following month they canceled the class because the only instructor was sick, the month after that they canceled it because it was December and the instructor was on Christmas vacation. This was the only cause of delay in the entire process for me.

If you are a member of a gun club when you submit your application it looks good. It makes the issuing judge feel better about you having a safe place to practice and reinforces the claim that one of the reasons you want a handgun is for target shooting. If your references are members of the club that looks good also. It means that the people serving as a reference are comfortable with you handling firearms around them so they are confident you are a responsible individual.

The other part of the process that can cause a delay is the one-on-one meeting with the issuing judge. As you can imagine their calendars are usually packed and they only set aside certain times each month to meet with applicants.

In my county all the permits, unless you had a reason e.g. carried large amounts of cash or other valuables for work, were issued with restrictions for hunting (which included hiking and camping) and target shooting. Once you had your permit for a year and shown that you were responsible you could meet with the Judge and ask to have the restrictions removed. Everyone I know who went back and met with them had the restrictions lifted without any difficulty.

A note on the restrictions. Because NY is a may-issue state the courts have ruled that the issuing Judge has the authority to place restrictions on the time and place of carry since by issuing you the permit they are responsible for you. If you commit a crime with your handgun they will have to answer as to why the issued you the permit. The restrictions are only enforced by the issuing Judge as part of an agreement with the permit holder. If you violate the restrictions and the Judge finds out they can revoke your permit if they choose. You will get the opportunity to sit with the Judge and discuss this before they revoke it. However violation of the restrictions is not a crime, all you can do is lose your permit. If you are carrying and get stopped by the police anywhere outside of NYC all they care about is if you have a permit. Of course if they see restrictions listed on it you can be almost certain that word will get back to the Judge and you will be called in to meet with him/her.

All the serial numbers of your handguns will be typed on your permit. Every time you buy a new one you have to take a form into the Sheriff’s department to have it added to your permit before you can take possession of it. This usually takes about 15 minutes. If you sell one you have to go and get it removed. You can share handguns and have them listed on your permit and someone else’s. Normally they only do this for members of the same family that will be sharing but if there is a good reason they will do it for friends. Possessing a handgun that is not listed on your permit is the same as not having a permit and is a sure way to lose your permit for good and get arrested as well.

ctdonath
September 23, 2006, 10:06 AM
NY's gun laws suck, although once you actually manage to get a permit (and stay the heck out of that third-world country called New York City), it's pretty good as far as permits go: schools, gov't buildings, train stations & airports aside, you can carry anywhere. This in contrast with "gun-friendly" states like Georgia where you can't carry in alcohol-serving restraunts or at "public gatherings" (very loosely defined) etc., laws which strictly speaking disarm you for an entire trip (no leaving gun in car).

Kinda perverse.
NY: hard, if possible at all, to get guns - but you can carry 'em almost anywhere anytime.
GA: trivial to get any kind of gun - but you can't carry 'em half the time or to many common places.

GnL
September 23, 2006, 11:26 AM
There is no requirement for how long you have known your references. The only restrictions on who can be a reference are they must not be judges, town or city justices, police officers, correction officers, persons to whom the applicant is related or any persons in the same household.

This might be county specific.

In Monroe County (Rochester area) the instructions for the application state:
"You must provide 4 character references that must be Monroe County residents that have known you for at least 3 years. These references may not be law enforcement, family members or anyone who may be included as a member of your household."

If you have lived in Monroe County less than 3 years, there is a provision for obtaining additional references from the state or county where you previously resided (with notarizations). Basically a huge PITA.

This provision is what keeps me from obtaining my permit. I have only lived here for 3 years, and I don't know many people in my county (I worked in a neighboring county). I am not sure I want to ask my neighbors for the reference because they don't know I have guns (and I'd like it to stay that way).

wuchak
September 23, 2006, 11:39 AM
Thanks for the correction. I wasn't aware that the counties had the ability to change the provision for length of time know.

gezzer
September 24, 2006, 07:37 PM
Move your parents.

If you enjoyed reading about "Encouraging News from New York" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!