My C&R came today ... now I have questions


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Zundfolge
March 22, 2003, 11:34 PM
Well I opened the mailbox and there it was ... an envelope from the BATF with my C&R FFL in it :D

But now I'm left with a few questions.

I understand that I must keep track of firearms I buy using my C&R in a book.

Do I need to log in any non C&R firearms I purchase now that I have the C&R?

Do I need to enter in any C&R firearms I owned prior to getting the C&R FFL? If so, what about non C&R guns I own now?

If I purchase a C&R eligible firearm from a local individual, do I need to log it into my book?

If I purchase a C&R eligible firearm from a local gun shop do I have to go through the regular old NCIS crap or will they accept my C&R FFL? If they won't do I need to log those firearms in my C&R book?

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CZ-75
March 22, 2003, 11:54 PM
Do I need to log in any non C&R firearms I purchase now that I have the C&R?

No.

Do I need to enter in any C&R firearms I owned prior to getting the C&R FFL? If so, what about non C&R guns I own now?

No, and No.

If I purchase a C&R eligible firearm from a local individual, do I need to log it into my book?

Not sure. "Yes" if your license was involved in the transaction.

If I purchase a C&R eligible firearm from a local gun shop do I have to go through the regular old NCIS crap or will they accept my C&R FFL?

You are exempt, unless state law specifies otherwise.

Note that Bubba at the local shop may not know this or even have heard of a C&R 03 FFL.

Another situation is that they don't know if the gun is C&R (e.g., production ranges outside the 50 year threshhold). You should get letters and docs from BATF. Go to their website to find PDAs pertaining to C&R licenses and eligible guns and have these when going to shops to provide documentation from the horse's mouth, should they not arrive in the mail.

If they won't do I need to log those firearms in my C&R book?

Not sure.

DMK
March 22, 2003, 11:54 PM
*All* C&R firearms that you purchase, regardless of whether or not you actually use your licence for the purchase, must be logged. Non-C&R firearms do not get logged at all.

It's debatable as to whether you need to log any C&R firearms that were purchased before you had the licence. Some say do it anyway, but you might not have all the records and information necessary to do so.

A local dealer may or may not honor your class III licence. Unfortunately most are clueless about it. It's not that big a deal for a face to face purchase except you'll have to get the NICs check. The C&R licence mainly benefits you for out of state commerce and shipping it direct to you instead of through a class I FFL.

It is in your best interest to read those law books they sent you very carefully! Of course, you will have even more questions after that. :scrutiny:

Zundfolge
March 22, 2003, 11:58 PM
It is in your best interest to read those law books they sent you very carefully!

Law books? What law books? All I got was an envelope with two pieces of paper in it.

I kind of expected a packet of brochures or something but all there was in the envelope was a cover letter and the license.

CZ-75
March 23, 2003, 12:01 AM
You will get a book of federal regs and another with state regs.

BenW
March 23, 2003, 12:01 AM
Zundfolge -- the Parallax boards and cruffler.com have some good info on that in non-headache inducing language (as opposed to the BATF manuals). But a quick rundown on your questions:

You don't log any non C&R firearms you purchase or own in your book.

You don't have to enter any C&Rs that you held PRIOR to obtaining your license, but you DO have to record those firearms in your book if you sell them. You can make a note in your log that you were disposing of pre-license C&Rs.

You have to log ALL C&R purchases in your logbook for as long as you hold your license.

Purchasing from a gunshop depends on the laws in the state you live in. Whether you go through the DROS paperwork or not, you still have to record it in your logbook. The easiest way to handle it is to remember that you have to log EVERY C&R purchase in your logbook, no matter how you legally acquired the firearms.

DMK
March 23, 2003, 12:03 AM
Law books? What law books? All I got was an envelope with two pieces of paper in it. That's odd. Usually a few days before you get your licence, you recieve a big thick envelope with some bulletins, forms, a state law book and a federal law book. Some folks get multiples.

Your licence might have just beat it to you somehow. If you don't get it in a week or so, call them and ask for it. It is pretty important to have for CYA.

BenW
March 23, 2003, 12:03 AM
Wow -- I didn't know there were this many C&R folks on the forum. There were no posts when I started writing my response, and next thing you know, my answer is at the end of the line.:D

CZ-75
March 23, 2003, 12:07 AM
Wow -- I didn't know there were this many C&R folks on the forum.

It's good use of $30.

I'm letting mine run out, since I don't want to have to keep reapplying as my job takes me from place to place.
Besides, it discourages me from buying too many guns for my financial resources. :D

CZ-75
March 23, 2003, 12:09 AM
I have my own C&R question, which I believe I know the answer to, but have to ask, in case of exception.


If my (valid) license is for a location in another state, can I have a distributor ship me a firearm in a different state?

DMK
March 23, 2003, 12:13 AM
You have to have it shipped to the address on the licence. They won't ship it elsewhere.

CZ-75
March 23, 2003, 12:19 AM
Thanks. That's what I expected.

Hkmp5sd
March 23, 2003, 12:20 AM
If my (valid) license is for a location in another state, can I have a distributor ship me a firearm in a different state?

You may purchase and receive C&R firearms from ANY person or dealer ANYWHERE in the US. As just mentioned, they must send it to your licensed residence (unless you are present in person to take possession).

CZ-75
March 23, 2003, 12:40 AM
So I could pick it up from the depot (or have it delivered at work), in another state, so long as I do so IN PERSON?

Or do you mean that I must pick it up from their premises, IN PERSON?

I expect that you mean the latter.

I understand that anyone authorized to do so may ship me a weapon from anywhere in the US; It is where I can receive that is my quandry.

DMK
March 23, 2003, 12:45 AM
Hkmp5sd, is right. You could pick it up in person and present your licence then.

However, that still poses three potential problems. Many class I FFLs won't recognize your licence due to ignorance of the regs, many wholesalers (who we usually deal with) won't sell over the counter, and it is likely that your licence is technically not valid with the incorrect address.

Hkmp5sd
March 23, 2003, 12:49 AM
You may take possession from a dealer at HIS licensed premises or from a non-licensee anywhere you can meet him face-to-face. Otherwise, they must ship it to YOUR licensed premises.

CZ-75
March 23, 2003, 12:52 AM
Then I'll have to continue w/ my plan to submit my license to get "authorized" to purchase from the wholesaler and use an 01 in my current state to do the transfer.

Hkmp5sd
March 23, 2003, 01:03 AM
CZ,

If you are being transferred to another state, all you have to do is fill out ATF Form 5300.38 (Application for an Amended FFL) and they will send you a license with your new address on it.

CZ-75
March 23, 2003, 01:35 AM
It expires in 2 months; not worth doing the paperwork.

Neither is reapplying when I don't expect to be here same time next year.

firestar
March 23, 2003, 03:18 AM
What do you guys use for a "bound book"? I have heard that a simple notebook can be used but I was thinking about putting it all on a spreadsheet.

Kharn
March 23, 2003, 09:04 AM
I use the bound book Brownells sells for $3, it has space for something like 440 entries and includes examples on how to fill it out for varying situations (recieved from individual, seized by police, sent to a gunsmith, etc).

To do all the record keeping on the computer, you'll need permission from the ATF (a "variance letter", just basically write to them and ask for permission to use Excel, promise to keep a few backups, etc); you could make a spreadsheet, print it out and then write in all your transactions as long as it follows the format shown in the rule book.

Kharn

Hkmp5sd
March 23, 2003, 11:41 AM
"bound book"


I just used the "Firearms Collectors Acquisition and Disposition Record" format (178.125) to create the form in Lotus 1-2-3 (been a while since I printed those!), printed them out and placed them in a 3-ring notebook.

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