American religious extremists dishonor soldiers funeral


August 5, 2005, 11:08 PM

Phelps' Group Protests At Soldier's Funeral Fri Aug 5, 7:58 PM ET

Members of the Rev. Fred Phelps' Westboro Baptist Church in Topeka, Kan., are picketing military funerals, KMBC's Micheal Mahoney reported Friday.

The group has made national headlines for traveling throughout the country to picket gay churches, gay weddings, and the funeral of Matthew Shepard, a gay college student who was murdered in Wyoming in 1998.

Friday, about 15 members of the group -- some of them children -- picketed the funeral of a St. Joseph soldier who was killed in Iraq. Mahoney reported that the group stood across the road from the Grace Evangelical Church during the funeral of 21-year-old Spc. Edward Myers.

"The first sin was being a part of this military. If this young man had a clue and any fear of God, he would have run, and not walked, from this military," said protester Shirley Phelps-Roper. "Who would serve a nation that is godless and has flipped off, defiantly defied, defiantly flipped off, the Lord their God?"

One protester had an American flag tied to his belt that draped to the ground. He was holding a sign that read, "Thank God For IEDs," which are explosive devices used by insurgents to blow up military convoys.

Protesters said America has ignored the word of God, and those who defend the nation must pay a price.

"That's the first piece of solid evidence that you have that the young man is currently in hell," Phelps-Roper said.

"The soldier is in hell now, you believe?" Mahoney asked.

"Absolutely," Phelps-Roper said.

'Protesters Were Rude'

About a dozen veterans stood across the road from the protesters, and Mahoney reported that there were some harsh words and insults traded between the two groups. However, sheriff deputies were stationed about 100 yards away and there was no violence.

"The protesters were so rude -- were disrespectful," said veteran Jim Fields.

"Do I like it? No, I don't. But what can you say, it's a free country," said veteran Dave Campbell.

Veterans told KMBC that a member of the soldier's family shouted at the protesters to leave, and they left about 20 minutes after the funeral started. Mahoney reported that there was applause from veterans and other crowd members when the protesters left.

After the funeral was over, one of the mourners commented on the irony of the protesters showing up at a soldier's funeral.

"They shouldn't protest the funeral for a man who was out there dying to protect the rights that they're demanding they receive," said Marvin Russell.

Russell said he thinks the soldier's family saw the protesters.

"I think it saddened them. They didn't say anything outright, but you could tell by the way they looked down that this was a sad thing to do. They're already in mourning, they don't need people like this to make it worse," Russell said.

Myers was buried with full military honors in Leavenworth National Cemetery. He leaves behind a wife and two children.

One of the protesters said the group is planning to picket other military funerals.


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August 5, 2005, 11:16 PM
Dear God, not that Phelps creature again ... ya know, that schmuck was here in Colorado Springs protesting at Focus on the Family headquarters one day because Focus is supposadly "too soft" on gays ... on the same day there was some gay group protesting Focus for being anti gay.

I read a newspaper editorial back in Wichita Kansas several years ago when he protested some aids victims funeral there (or maybe it was the aids quilt) ... the editorial was from the head of some sort of local gay rights group and it basically said he felt bad for Evangelical Christians because of Phelps ... he said something to the effect of "Fred Phelps is to the Evangelical Christian community what NAMBLA is to the Gay Rights Movement."

August 5, 2005, 11:17 PM
they couldn't have done the 21 gun salute...with live ammo...and not quite pointed into the air, if ya know what I mean..... :evil:

Serriously, it truly is a pity that these creeps can't appreciate that folks like this have and WILL die to protect their right to do such garbage, no matter how tasteless it is.

August 5, 2005, 11:40 PM
Good ole Phelps...a good picture to go along with this :cuss:

Jim March
August 5, 2005, 11:49 PM
Oh man, not these clowns again.

If it's not clear yet, this is basically a cult. Most of the members of this "church" are one giant family. The term "inbred" has been kicked around a bit.

Fun fact: when Al Gore ran for president in 1988, Fred Phelps was his Kansas state campaign manager. In 2000 during the Bush/Gore race, I kept posting photos of Phelps arm in arm with his good buddy Gore and some very determined people launched "denial of service" (DOS) attacks on every site I posted 'em to.

Yup. The DNC had a black-hat hack team in play.

Al Norris
August 6, 2005, 12:22 AM
I sure wish Phelps and his groupies would come to Idaho, for a serviceman's funeral (please note: we've had our share of these and I reaaly don't want more!). Disrespect of the Dead is a misdemeanor... But I bet I could talk the police into charging them with a felony. Just so's it could be plea-bargained down. :cuss:

Dan from MI
August 6, 2005, 12:36 AM
Those pricks threatened to go protest a soldier's funeral out there. I'm glad they didn't, but if they did, It really would not surprise me if some of the cops "didn't see a thing"........

August 6, 2005, 12:50 AM
He's a nobody who has made himself famous by being repulsive. The best thing to do about him would be for everyone to ignore him. I wish the news media would stop covering him. Then he would crawl back into his hole.

August 6, 2005, 12:50 AM
"Then he would crawl back into his hole."
If he needs any help getting back into that hole, I will help!

My God-I cannot believe what is happening to some people. My son Paul called me about this person. Paul is a medical corpsman with B 3/69th in Samarra. Edward Myers was killed when either an RPG or an IED exploded next to the humvee in which Myers was riding in. Lucky for the protesters that the men from 3/69 were not in attendance at the funeral-the protesters might well have been attending their own next :cuss:
Good thing we have icons, because I would be permanently banned for typing what I think right now. My son had a perfect record of no deaths in his company since his arrival last January. They are due to rotate in December.

Edited for content

August 6, 2005, 12:56 AM
The guy is a complete lunatic. He's a total prick. Luckily, he's old, so he'll be dead soon. Man, I would not want to be him when he meets the God I believe in, cause He is not going to be pleased with our boy Fred.

August 6, 2005, 01:00 AM
What the...? Crazy cultists, go drink some damn punch or something. :cuss:

Jim March
August 6, 2005, 01:04 AM
Nope. She's gonna be very pissed off indeed.


August 6, 2005, 02:17 AM
It really would not surprise me if some of the cops "didn't see a thing" Another one of the few good things about my neck of the PRC, (San Diego,) is that a good chunk of the LEOs are prior service. If disrespect of the dead was an enforceable misdemeanor here, (As opposed to a "blue law") I don't imagine the cops would turn a blind eye. Most of the boys in blue I have run into around here are pretty pro-military.

August 6, 2005, 02:25 AM
Perhaps his address and the address of his "church" should be published where Team Jihad can find it. :fire:

August 6, 2005, 02:57 AM
The phrase "shocked and appalled" doesn't even begin to describe my feelings on this matter.

Eddie was a good friend of mine back in highschool. It was bad enough to learn that he'd died, but then to find out that some half-assed religious group actually picketed the funeral, paraded a sign saying "Thank God for IED's" in front of his wife and children, not to mention the rest of his family. . .suffice it to say that I'm closer to pure, black hatred than I've been in years.

According to local news, there was another group there (Veteran Bikers, I think?) who kept the protesters on the far side of the road from the funeral. I couldn't help but think that if a drunk driver had come along, he could have rid us of the whole lot of them. A particularly poetic stroke would have been them tripping over a roadside IED of their own. I'm still having trouble getting my head around what their gripe was. They protested (in a rude and tasteless fashion,) because he had joined the army of a country that doesn't burn gay people at the stake. ***?

I think that's about as much as I can rant without giving the forum a burnt language filter circuit. Can anybody tell me what'll happen with Eddie's wife and kids? I mean, will they get Social Security or a pension or something? I hate to think of them facing financial hardship on top of everything else.

August 6, 2005, 03:06 AM
suffice it to say that I'm closer to pure, black hatred than I've been in years.

Sometimes pure, black hatred is entirely appropriate.

August 6, 2005, 03:08 AM
Religious wackos come in all shapes and sizes.


I'd like to think I'd have the self-restraint not to uh, deal with them. Not sure if I could or not. Best not to find out, and Phelps would be unwise to test it at any funerals I attend.

August 6, 2005, 03:24 AM
This guy is the Christian equivalent of the Imams that preach nothing but hatred for the west. I wouldnt shed a tear if they found space in Gitmo for this loser.

Jim March
August 6, 2005, 04:34 AM
You know, there's a lesson from these turkeys that they definately didn't intend.

Their first foray into religious hatred was aimed at gays, and while most people thought they were pretty ugly for picketing the funerals of dead gays, they didn't get all that much notice.

What's interesting is that now their need to hate has spilled over onto somebody else, some other group, and now they're detested even more.

Not to be too blunt here, but what we have is a textbook example of the argument in favor of "hate crimes" - the idea that violence motivated by pure bigotry is so dangerous that it needs extra punishment.

Because if you don't stop it where it starts, it spreads like cancer.

Now I'm well aware of the arguments against "hate crimes" and I find myself torn on the matter. Phelps however has managed to show that a life fed by and in support of hatred and bigotry seldom stops at the first target.

For that matter, by the end of their sick reign, the Nazis had managed to hate an astonishing number of different people: Jews, anyone Slavic, anyone Gypsy, anyone African or of that origin, the disabled, the mentally ill, all political dissenters even when completely non-violent, the...dang, do I need to go on?

Hate is a horrible thing...and addictive as hell once it eats you up.

August 6, 2005, 07:07 AM
I think that Phelps' father was probably some crazy fire and brimstone preacher, and this is how Phelps deals with his own homosexual cravings generated by his overbearing father. Someone should lock him up the next time he spews 'fighting words' so that he can get some of the rough gay sex he wants :)

I agree with the earlier poster that said all Americans should receive the same rights. Honestly I think ******bags like this guy advance gay rights by accident.

1911 guy
August 6, 2005, 07:53 AM
This sickens me. As a vet of the first Gulf War who was lucky enough to come home unharmed, I feel for these brothers who are in a protracted bad situation where politics is the major player rather than military thinking. That's bad enough, but to have some jerk-off picketing funerals is over the top. Maybe they wouldn't be so thankful of improvised explosives if a few went their way? The fact that they are using an American freedom to protest the folks who protect it just adds to my disgust.

August 6, 2005, 08:14 AM
Shows an astonishing lack of intelligence to picket a military funeral, being as any other military folks attending would likely pound this twerp's brains into a finely ground mush. I guess his saving grace is that most of this soldier's comrades are still deployed.

This is nothing more than political self-gratification :fire:

August 6, 2005, 08:19 AM
He practices a religion that is alien to me.

He came to Michigan to protest a cities policy on gay's and no one showed up. He got :fire: and went home, but left his daughter/wife in charge. She's going to take over when he's dead and gone.

August 6, 2005, 08:23 AM
This Phelps creature claims to be:
1. Christian
2. Baptist
Which is enough to make me feel an especial desire to give him some wall-to-wall counseling while using a hard bound printing of the Good Book to drive home some telling points to Brother Phelps (seeing as I identify my self as both 1 & 2).

But, Phelps also claims to be a Democrat*.

Like I said, thank G-d for small favors.

* I do not hold Democrats responsisble for Phelps.

August 6, 2005, 08:58 AM
I'm disgusted.

He's sick. :barf:

1911 guy
August 6, 2005, 09:42 AM
I beieve we think alike. I, too I.D. myself as a Christian and a Baptist to boot. This fool is out there pandering an ideology that I am quite sure I have never read in the Bible. As for your "counseling"...I'll hold 'im, you hit 'im.

August 6, 2005, 10:03 AM
proud2deviate asked:
Can anybody tell me what'll happen with Eddie's wife and kids? SGLI just went up in June, not sure if that effects him or not. The benefit was $250k when I was in, and the max benefit is now $400k, I believe. That won't make his family rich by any means, but it should cover any debts, and make a nice nest egg for a house/IRA/college money for the kids. I am not sure what kind of hoops his widow will have to jump through, but one would think a combat casualty would have less paperwork hassle than and off-duty traffic accident, for example.

It can't even begin to replace the loss of a loved one, but if he had SGLI, they should be taken care of. (A lot of married folks had SGLI and outside coverage as well.)

It saddens me that an already heart-breaking event was marred further by a misguided bigot.

Randy in Arizona
August 6, 2005, 10:05 AM
I am amazed that this thread has not been locked for not taking "The High Road" standards below the waterline. :confused: :neener: :confused: :what:

That said, I hope this Phelps clown meets someone that will 'instruct' Phelps in the error of his ways, without being arrested for his public service! :fire:

Bruce H
August 6, 2005, 12:31 PM
Phelps and company are no different than Osama and company. They should both be dealt with the same way.

Guy B. Meredith
August 6, 2005, 02:59 PM
Counter demonstration could point out "Phelps is not God", "God is not the twisted creature Phelps claims."

August 6, 2005, 11:25 PM
Why can't the religious extremists (from all walks and callings) get together for a meet and great and "work it out" amongst themselves?

Byron Quick
August 6, 2005, 11:33 PM
Simple. Even the most courageous of them are cowards. They prefer striking at the unarmed. Facing an armed enemy is against their religious beliefs.

August 6, 2005, 11:47 PM
These people are sick and closer to evil than holiness. They give Baptists and other loving Christians a bad name. There's a place for these kind of people, I have no doubt they'll find it if they continue their ways.

August 6, 2005, 11:57 PM
VARifleman, you sumbich - I just had tacos chips and milk come up and out my nose - great picture; lmao!

Jeez, those guys really know how to make friends eh?

August 7, 2005, 12:17 AM
He gonna do that in TX, you think? :D

August 7, 2005, 01:30 AM
Wow, I can't think of much that is more reprehensible. One of these days these guys are going to get what's coming to them. If it happened in front of me I'd probably have trouble constraining my usually peaceful self. I know I wouldn't resort to violence, I'm not that kind of guy (I never institute violence), but this would definately require some real willpower.

August 7, 2005, 02:45 AM
Jim, if you making being an ??????? a hanging offense, we'll have to find rope for half of LA and most of New York.

Best thing you can do with folks like him is turn your back. That drives 'em nuts. Ignore them.

Let the kluckers march - but when their little group comes along in the parade, everyone turn around.

I figure one or two of 'em may stroke out right then...

August 7, 2005, 02:59 AM
Jim, if you making being an ??????? a hanging offense, we'll have to find rope for half of LA and most of New York.
Yeah, but there might be a downside, too.

August 7, 2005, 03:41 AM
"He gonna do that in TX, you think?"

I would highly suggest he stay away from Texas. Jim Bob and company may well be Baptist down here, but they are a very different breed. People wonder about muslims-what if everyone thought all Baptists were like this clown??

August 7, 2005, 10:34 AM
I am not Christian, and in my critical examinations of the Bible I have come up with this gem (and off the top of my head, this general sentiment comes across many times in the Bible).

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them. Lev 20:13

And to be fair, the context:

Lev 20:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

I am not in any way defending these people, I am strongly both pro-service(wo)men and pro gay rights. But I think sometimes people ignore facts that they do not agree with, and in the spirit of inteligent discussion, I share this with you.

(Zippers up flame suit)

August 7, 2005, 10:45 AM
Lots of people get that verse..but so darned many forget "judge not, lest ye be judged."

August 7, 2005, 11:07 AM

This guy is a superlative Pecker. :fire:

Having said that...isn't it interesting that he still hasn't resorted to suicide-bombing innocents like the radical Islamic terrorists?

Comparison of extremes is sometimes illuminating.

This should NOT digress into a religious debate; however, please note that with reference to:

Lots of people get that verse..but so darned many forget "judge not, lest ye be judged."

Take a look at the kind of harsh words Jesus (the author of these words) had for the Pharisees, scribes, and even his own disciples [Matthew 16:23, Matthew 7:21-23, Matthew 15:1-9, off the top of my head]. "Judge not" does not mean "do not judge" in context, else the Author himself would have been the consummate hypocrite. Might be worth reading the entire paragraph in Matthew 7:1-5; the idea is the avoidance of hypocrisy, ref. John 7:24.

Quotation out of context is pretext... :)


August 7, 2005, 11:33 AM
Malice-git out of that flame suit, its too darned hot today! Actually, most folks might not have had issues with them holding up signs pointing them towards their Lord/Superior Being/Grand Poobah/Whatever in a positive way.

It's quite another to hold up signs saying "Thank God for IED's" :cuss:

Even if this brave young man had been a former member of their flock-and we see no evidence that he was, I see no instruction to mock the dead in the Book. For all they know, the recently departed didn't know they even existed. What a fine way to win over converts.....gee, we spit on your son's/father's/husband's grave and sacrifice-and you should join with us! What a recruiting tool :rolleyes:

August 7, 2005, 12:05 PM
I think that it's of greater consequence not WHAT he said (even though I think he's a complete putz) but WHEN he said it. This action had nothing to do with spreading his message, but only to direct attention to himself.

If his message had any validity, it would stand on its own and not need the inflammatory nature of picketing a fallen soldier's funeral.

Guy B. Meredith
August 7, 2005, 02:31 PM

You are making the same mistake that so many "Christian" zealots make--other than going around "quoting the Lord" so much they begin to believe those are their own words and they are God.

Christianity has to do with the second half of the Bible--the New Testament. Your quote and so many used by "Christian" extremists come from the Old Testament. The Old Testament is Jewish tradition/history. The New Testament is built on the teachings of Jesus and the history of his disciples. Jesus had a different take on things than the Old Testament.

There is nothing Christian about these zealots.

August 7, 2005, 03:42 PM
> The group has made national headlines

Thats because it serves the agenda of the leftist media, which seeks to portray as a loon anyone who believes in God.

I fault the media much more than this small band of kooks.

best regards

August 7, 2005, 06:04 PM
I'm amazed to see how this thread is starting to delve into a religious debate, way below the high road standards.

I am not Christian, and in my critical examinations of the Bible I have come up with this gem (and off the top of my head, this general sentiment comes across many times in the Bible).

Malice, how does this have anything to do with the start of the thread. And I believe that there are many on THR that don't care about where you stand on gay rights and women serving in the military. The point of this thread was about some religious extremists protesting a serviceman's burial. And what was the point of quoting an Old Testament verse dealing with homosexuality? Next time, please read the first post of a thread before you rant and rave about things completely off topic. And last time I checked, this whole forum is supposed to deal with GUNS, not religion.

If any moderators read this, please shut this thread down before it delves into anymore low standard, off-topic garbage.

August 8, 2005, 01:08 PM
Who would serve a nation that is godless and has flipped off, defiantly defied, defiantly flipped off, the Lord their God?

What makes these people so attractive is their eloquence. :rolleyes:

August 8, 2005, 01:16 PM
Being a Baptist, these fools donít speak for the rest of us. :mad:

August 8, 2005, 01:23 PM

I believe if you actually read the entire first post that started this thread, you'd find the people who were picketing the funeral started out as a "Christian" anti gay group. Malice was simply providing a biblicle reference to their orginal mission.

Giving us his view on gay rights and women in the military to clarified his neuterality on the specific topic. Now you may have no interest at all in where other THR members derive their opinions - but many of us on THR find it relevent.

Your post was miles off topic compared to his.

rock jock
August 8, 2005, 01:39 PM
Not to be too blunt here, but what we have is a textbook example of the argument in favor of "hate crimes" - the idea that violence motivated by pure bigotry is so dangerous that it needs extra punishment.
I can't agree. This guy's group hasn't gotten much larger, even with the publicity. Let him protest to his heart's long as he does it w/o violence. If he resorts to violence, well, we have ways of dealing with that too.

August 8, 2005, 01:46 PM
why cant the local government, in honor of the deceased, show support by parking city buses in perimeter around the graveyard or at least in the key areas to block the funeral goers from seeing them :evil:

They protesters aren't allowed ON the property right??? if they are supposet to be OFF the property and the busses are ON ....

August 8, 2005, 02:04 PM
Why weren't they arrested for inciting a riot?


That one sign at a soldier's funeral is ample evidence of their intent.


P.S. - People in this country used to spread straw in the street in front of a family's home to muffle the sounds of the horses and wagons so they could mourn in peace.

August 8, 2005, 02:56 PM
The problem is, these nuts are attracted by the media- they will go anywhere and do anything to get on TV or in the paper. The media, to its credit, does its best to ignore them and keep them off the news. Thus, they escalate to more and more outrageous behavior hoping that they can either attract attention or start a riot.

I don't know what the solution is, beyond continuing to ignore them. If ol' Fred happened to walk into a soldier's fist, though, I hope I'm on the jury!

Byron Quick
August 8, 2005, 03:20 PM
They'd better stay out of this part of Georgia with their protests. A soldier at Fort Gordon was once robbed by a well known low life in Augusta. The scum made his living stealing from young GI's in the vicinity of the Gordon Bus Stop on Broad Street. The robbed soldier tracked the robber to his home and knocked on the door. Cut the robber's throat on his own door sill.

The judge put the soldier on probation. First offender status.

August 10, 2005, 07:56 PM
Sounds like this is an ongoing situation.

Unfortunately, the only thing that seems to shut these idiots up is ignoring them.

August 10, 2005, 08:35 PM
Holy crap!

I just read their upcoming picket schedule. Looking at just where they're planning on going almost makes it look like they actually hope to get into a physical confrontation.

I need to stop writing here. Far too great a temptation to ramble down the low road right now.

August 10, 2005, 09:05 PM
The thing about looking for trouble is that sooner or later you find it (or it ifnds you). Here's hoping Fred & company find what they're looking for w/o any media presence while the local constabulary is on a protracted break on the other side of town and the only witnesses are alzheimer's vicitms. :evil:

August 11, 2005, 06:09 AM
Here's one they'll be at:
September 11, 2005

8:00 am Ė 12:00 pm

Arlington, VA

Memorial Bridge, Arlington National Cemetery, for ?America Supports You Freedom Walk

Can anyone think of a less appropriate date or location? Anyone?
:cuss: :fire:

By my calculations, that's a Sunday......I may just have to be there to make my, ahem, displeasure known.

August 11, 2005, 10:54 AM
Hmmm, these guys are really asking for it.

I think, rather than beating them up and giving them something to whine about, it would be better to attack them with, say, ballons full of rotten vegetable/egg-drop soup, and squirtguns filled with buck scent and india ink...


August 11, 2005, 11:09 AM

Is "invading space" a crime? I mean ... what if this a$$h**e was standing there doing his frothing at the mouth thing at a fallen soldiers funeral, and out of nowhere, 2-3 (or 4-5) largish guys who often wear french hats come across the street to him. They stop about 10"-12" short of where he's standing and just cross their arms and stand there blocking his view of the funeral across the street. (and the funerals view of him at the same time.)

He moves to the side - they move to the side. He backs up, they move foreward to him. Never saying a word - just standing there staring straight ahead, minding their own business (as he should be doing) - *right* in front of him.

Sooner or later, the iD10T will push one of them out of his way.


August 11, 2005, 11:23 AM
There are not enough expressions of contempt in this world or the next to describe how I feel about this ahhhhhhhhhhhh.........

Can't find an appropriate wording here.


another okie
August 11, 2005, 02:49 PM
I was at a concert once they picketed. I don't know why the picketed it, there was nothing gay about it, nor did their signs make any reference to the concert. Their signs were all about Matthew Shepherd. They were careful to follow instructions by law enforcement and any rules of their permits (I think this Phelps is a disbarred lawyer). I thought at the time that in a way it's an honor to cross their picket line. The concert was excellent, by the way, Phillip Glass performing his own piece, Monsters of Grace.

August 11, 2005, 03:24 PM
As wrong, and infuriating it is what these... people... are doing, one quote keeps coming to mind:
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it."

Keep that in mind, as they say, free speech is easy to approve of when you agree with it. As horrible as this is, and how morally wrong their point of view is, they should not and cannot be harmed for expressing it.

I believe I have said before, the 1st amendment is THE most important amendment*, and should not be limited.

*I do believe the 2nd amendment is almost as important, but the 1st amendment has the ability to be used immediately, while the 2nd ammendment is a doomsday, or "when it all goes to hell" provision. It is important that we, as 2nd A supporters, fight for 1st amendment rights just as quickly as we do the 2nd.

August 12, 2005, 01:54 PM
This group pickets my wife's church at least once a month. They, by law, must stay 100 yards from the entrance to the church, but they block the sidewalks, sometimes sing hymns with different words, call out the names of local politicians, police officials, and others they see going in. Once the service starts, they leave. Fred may not be as psycho as you think. I would guess he is receiving contributions from all over the world from persons as misguided as he is. The church seems to have no desire to fight back, legally of course, so on and on they go. Incidently, at his church he flies the Stars and Stripes upside down.

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