California handgun law questions part two


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magsnubby
August 11, 2005, 12:48 AM
This thread asked the question:

www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=148643

I sent this e-mail to the Cal DOJ:

If a person is a legal resident of California and has property in Arizona and buys a handgun in Arizona (providing he has documentation proving he has an Arizona residence) what would be involved in bringing the gun back to California? Would it have to be on the Roster of Handguns Certified For Sale? It would be for personal use and not for resale.

This was the answer:

Dear Mr. Higgins:
A California resident does not acquire (that is take possession of) firearms out of state. If you lawfully purchased a firearm in Arizona and qualify as an Arizona resident, then you maintain the firearm in the state you purchased it in. If you wish to transfer your firearms into California, have them sent to a dealer in your area who will process the needed paperwork. Also the California dealer can ensure you are in compliance with California firearm laws and not acquiring a firearm that a California resident cannot lawfully acquire. The handgun would have to be on the Certified Roster of Handguns, unless otherwise exempted pursuant to Penal Codes 12132 and 12133. You can read penal codes in their entirety in the on line publication, Dangerous Weapons Control Laws, found on our website:www.ag.ca.gov/firearms.

Sally Carney,Field Representative
Firearms Division

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Jim March
August 11, 2005, 04:50 AM
<scratches head>

You know...I'm not CERTAIN, m'kay, but I suspect that's a load of BS.

OK. Somewhere in the California tax code is the concept that one can be a resident of more than one state at a time. (Actually more than one "residence" but they don't all have to be in Calif - same difference.)

Now this has interesting implications for CCW when we're talking multiple in-state residences. People often set up second residences in counties with rational CCW policies (Mendocino, Butte, Kern outside of cities, etc.). But law enforcement hates this concept and as one example, San Bernadino has "caught" people doing this and dragged them out of CCW class for "lying on their application as to residence". Or so I've heard. Law enforcement wants to read "residence" as "PRIMARY residence" when the latter isn't in Penal Code 12050 covering CCW jurisdiction (just the term "residence", otherwise undefined).

So.

IF the same thing is going on here, and it's not at all impossible, then...if one came into California as a dual-state-resident, the "moving in" rule might apply instead, which is "if you're in-state with your guns from out of state for 60 days, you have to voluntarily register them with Cal-DOJ" - but in that case they don't need to be on "the safety list", they can be anything Federally legal (with rare exceptions - a .410 cal revolver isn't a sawed-off shotgun anywhere EXCEPT California).

BUT: I don't know how Federal law impacts this...it's possible that as far as gun buying goes, you can only be a resident of one state?

Gray Peterson
August 11, 2005, 07:31 AM
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b12

raghorn
August 11, 2005, 11:29 AM
A California resident does not acquire (that is take possession of) firearms out of state.

How do they hire these bozos? They must have to use some special screening process to find them.

El Rojo
August 11, 2005, 12:39 PM
A California resident does not acquire (that is take possession of) firearms out of state.You have to look at it from a PRK DOJ perspective. As far as they are concerned a Calfiornia resident does not pick up any kind of gun out of state and then transport it back into the state. That is what you need an FFL for, a 4473 for, and a 10 day wait for. So they are right, as a California resident you cannot get guns from out of state. You can do it as a resident of another state, but you are not a California resident as far as the DOJ is concerned.

However, this brings up a good question. If you live in another state and you come back to California you can bring your hand guns with you and you don't have to bring them through a FFL. So what are the specifics of that? Anyone care to post some laws?

MrTuffPaws
August 11, 2005, 01:14 PM
However, this brings up a good question. If you live in another state and you come back to California you can bring your hand guns with you and you don't have to bring them through a FFL. So what are the specifics of that? Anyone care to post some laws?

If you move to CA, you can take your handguns with you as long as they can't be considered AWs (i.e. no more than 10 round mags, no threaded barrels, etc) As far as I know, they do not have to be on the roster of certified handguns for sale, being that they are not being sold. You will have to register them within 60 days to be legit though.

So, does that mean that you can have dual residences and go buy guns in Nevada and then transfer them into CA? Well, I have never read any CA gun law that prohibited one for doing so, but they would catch you on the registration 60 day limit.

Jim March
August 11, 2005, 01:16 PM
If you're an out-of-stater coming in you follow the "60 day reporting rule" I sketched out briefly above - there's more details in the other thread but that's the gist.

----------

Now here's a puzzle: you're a California resident, you buy guns legally, you move out-of-state for a while then move back in. All your handguns are still registered in California. Do you need to report 'em? Seems like a product of the "department of reduncancy department" but it would seem to be required...?

Standing Wolf
August 11, 2005, 09:37 PM
How do they hire these bozos? They must have to use some special screening process to find them.

People without moral integrity are often deficient in other respects, as well.

magsnubby
August 12, 2005, 01:25 AM
Hi Jim. Good to hear from you again.

Looks like instead of getting clarification on one specific issue it just opens up a big ole can of "What if's". I also have to wonder about the dual state "moving in rule. Sounds like an interesting concept though.

The whole thing gives me a headace.

.

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