[Woody_in_MN]

I think this may have been asked before in other ways, but I thought I would throw it up the flag pool anyway.

I looking for a cheap relable auto to keep in the trunk. I'd like another 9mm, but may have to consider other calibers with my price limit. Here are ones I'm considering so far:

STAR BM - Kind of heavy and after looking at one for reasons I can not explain I'm having trouble warming up to it.

CZ52 - Pluses are nice caliber, negetives are kind of ugly, a wierd caliber meaing I'll have to go out and buy yet another caliber for my closet. Also I heard of problems with the firing pin

MAKAROV - I kind of like these. But are the 9x18 ammo a decent self defense ?

FEG - Similiar to Makarov, but harder to find. Another 9x18 caliber.

Other???

What do you think?

- W

[CajunBass]

Hi-Point, C-9, compact. 9mm. $140.00 NIB. I've shot 1,000 rounds through mine. It works.

[MtrCty]

Well I have a FEG PA-63, you will get mixed reviews.After about 300rds mine is reliable. I changed out the springs to lighten the trigger and it is a pretty good shooting pistol. Light and flat. I had a Star BM great gun , heavy, like you said couldnt warm up to it even though I'm a 1911 guy. Don't have the others so I can't comment on them.

[pauli]

What do you think? i think the trunk is the perfect place for a long gun.

[Woody_in_MN]

MTRCTY - Is that FEG PA-63 the Walther PP knock off - does it shoot the 9x18 ?

- w

[dasmi]

Go with the Makarov. 9x18 is sufficient, and cheap. See http://www.ammoman.com.
But, I have to ask, if it's going to be a trunk gun, why not go with a 12 gauge or an SKS?

[Woody_in_MN]

dasmi - I can not hide a shotgun from my boss. You know the boss with the MRS degree.

- w

[Harry Paget Flashman]

For a cheap, reliable pistol to keep in an automobile I'd go with a CZ 52. If I was a BG I'd hate to be downstream of the muzzle blast. Push comes to shove it'd probably perform better disabling BG's or their vehicles.

Had a FEG PA-63. Good looking little gun but a handful of recoil and a horrible trigger pull. Priced about the same as a Mak or a little more (IIRC ~$140).

Maks are nice but the CZ 52 would seem to fit the bill better.

Magazines for Mak's an CZ-52's are cheap too.

[MtrCty]

The PA is 9x18. It also could be for sale.

[MtrCty]

The spring kit and grips from Makarov.com take care of the trigger pull and recoil issue's.

[Woody_in_MN]

I can get CZ52 for $99 thru SOG. But I'd pay about $20 transfer fee. So net like $120.

My local crusty hole in the wall favorite gun shop has FEG (I think the 63) for like $150 - but I think that is high.

What is IIRC ?

(MTRCTY - I sent you a PM.)

- w

[Exposure]

I'm going to vote for the CZ52 as well. I recently recieved a pair of them from SOG, paid the $10.00 extra for handpick and got what appear to be two brand new pistols. I have found them to be extremely accurate and ultra reliable.

The only drawback is the occasional spent shell cracking me in the head, ouch! These things really chuck the brass!

Good luck, I think with the choices you have outlined any one you pick will be a winner.

[Woody_in_MN]

EXPOSURE - How does hand-pick from SOG work? Also how is the size of the CZ compared to say a 1911 45acp?

- W

[Soap]

I own a Makarov. The gun is reliable and accurate. But I have to admit I'm baffled why you would want to keep a gun in a trunk? :confused:

[clone]

+1 Hi-Point

[arinvolvo]

a gun is a tool, most people have tools in their trunks.

i vote makarov.

[Moonclip]

I'd say get a Makarov over a Hi Point. But to each his own. Makarov is a all steel gun with a long proven history behind it and has actually been in use for over 50 years by many countries.

CZ 52 would mafe a decent car gun but ammo tends to run higher for it than for a Makarov or a 9mmpara chambered gun. Defensive ammo is a bit tough to find in 7.62x25 sometimes too.

Star BM might be an ok choice too, read about them on the internet some and see what you think.

[355sigfan]

I would say get a anything but a highpoint.
Pat

[tomkatz]

If you want a good low cost gun get a makarov.....

What is IIRC ?
If I Remember Correctly :D

....tom

[Onmilo]

For 160 bucks get a good used Mossberg 500 or Remington 870 riot gun.
No handgun that I would trust my life on comes that cheap, but those two shotguns can be had for that money or even a bit less.

[Jim101]

I vote Hi-Point 9mm, I have one, no problems.....~$100 new at a gun show..

Jim

[71Commander]

A makarov or a used Bersa Thunder.

[sfhogman]

I'd go with the handpicked CZ52. Well designed, solid service pistol. Mine shoots and works great.
Jeff

[Exposure]

Woody-

The hand pickfrom SOG simply amounts to you specifying that is what you would like when you place the order. They go through the crates and crates of them they have and cherry pick the best ones for an extra 10 bucks per pistol. I don't know what the condition is of the non handpicks but these are very nice!

As far as physical size goes I have attached a pic and you can see it is very comparable to a 1911. While not as comfortable for me to hold I do like how the gun feels. The angle of the grip on the CZ is closer to vertical than the 1911, not uncomfortable, just different. The grip is comparable as far as width but front to back it is deeper and my hand wraps around it less. I don't dislike it I just like the feel of a 1911 better. I am really a 1911 guy at heart so I may be a bit biased here.

The only real warning against the CZ52 I might have is that if you are on a limited budget the 7.62X25 ammunition is definitely not cheap. The Makarov would be a better choice if you are planning to do a fair amount of shooting as the 9X18 can be had much, much cheaper.

Again, good luck and give us an update as to what you end up with!

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b301/paulj1973/3c509aa9.jpg

[Javelin Man]

The suggestion for the Hi-Point is a good one. For $160, you might also be able to land their 9mm carbine. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone that truthfully says anything bad about it. But for under $100, a Hi-Point pistol will leave you with lots of cash to buy ammo to practice with.

Though I've never handled one much less shot one, people talk up the Mak a lot. I'm hoping to some day buy a CZ52 if gas prices don't go up. :cool:

[Soap]

a gun is a tool, most people have tools in their trunks.

By that same token I keep tools in my garage but would I keep a lugnut wrench in my garage? No. Because to do so would render it useless for nearly any conceivable situation where I would have to use it.

[Woody_in_MN]

How is the size of the mak compared toi the CZ. I had a Berreta .25 cal with like a 2 inch barrel - is that about the size of the mak?

- w

[Juna]

I've actually held a Mak at a local shop, and I believe it's bigger than that. Not sure of the actual BBL, but it's larger than you probably think. Feels like a nice, solid steel gun.

[RoyG]

The hand pickfrom SOG simply amounts to you specifying that is what you would like when you place the order. They go through the crates and crates of them they have and cherry pick the best ones for an extra 10 bucks per pistol.

Not quite...

They take 5 guns put them on a table and pick the best one.

[arinvolvo]

I heard its not even a table, but more like a piece of plywood on top of some saw horses.

[telcom911]

If you are determined to buy a chep gun, Hi-Points are they way to go. Thier pistols leave a lot to be desired as far as looks and ergonomics go, but you are getting a new gun made in America by Americans. Not some Com-block surplus who knows who is making money off they thing when it is imported. On top of supporting American jobs, you get a lifetime warranty and very good support from the factory, try get that with your Markov- no freaking way buddy.

I will only say one good thing about Hi-Point handguns, they shoot, every time.

That is, however, the only thing that really matters.


If you want to talk about thier carbines, Those are real work guns, taking it down to clean is a real bitch, but mine in 9mm is going on 4 years and well over 5000rnds since I did more then punch the bore and shoot WD40 in the action, works perfectly every time. It is my kids favorite 'big bore' plinker.

Support Americans, get a warranty, enjoy the factory service program.

[355sigfan]

My limited experience with highpoints has not been good. I have shot 3 all would not even feed standard hardball ammo in 45 and 9mm. They are pot metal junk. I am surprised to see anyone recommending them in a serious fourm. The mak as much as I don't like it was designed as a military firearm and is realiable and reasonably accurate. The Highpoint is a POS.
Pat

[Woody_in_MN]

Guys,

I put money down on a FEG 63 in the 9x18 cal. I went to my hole in the wall store. They had a CZ52 in pretty good condition for $150...arghhh...overpriced. They showed me this FEG 63 - nib condition for $159 - complete with 2 mags, holster, owners manual. I liked the way it fit in my hand. I like the size of the gun - I thought it would be about the right size for that caliber. I tried to talk them down $10 - but it was a cconsignment gun, they could not come down. So I took it. In the back of my mind I thought, I really did not have a concealable gun - the 45 auto would be the closest. Only real down side, that was some hickup in the fed system, and the gun approval was left in a delayed status. I expect I can pick up in a few days.

MTRCTY - Sorry dude - I would have had to go thru FFL fees, and shipping - that adds $30 to $50 to a gun.

- w

[Major Beer]

cheap = yup
ugly = you bet
my experience = great
factory support = great

i bought one for the the fact that i live within 20 miles of Mansfield, Ohio where some are built. so far i have put more ammo through the thing than what it is worth. i have heard two stories about them:

1 - people like them / good luck (for the price)

2 - people don't so they send them back and they work fine after Beemiller tweaks them.

my complaints - a bitch to tear down, and kinda clunky.

i shoot mine a off and on only because i do not own anymore nines. the upside is i have not had a misfeed / jam in ages. it was a little tight when i bought it but after about 500 rounds, it has been heck of a pistol for the $119.00 i paid three years ago.

heck save up another 100 bucks or so and get a Smith and Wesson VE. i shot my buddies and it shot great for the price and it is one heck of a lot nicer than the HiPoint or Mak. why not used revolver?

as far as the Makarovs go - i still want one to play around with. good luck in your search - like someone stated earlier - give us an update on what you buy.

shoot safe
-----------------------------

[Clean97GTI]

I vote Makarov.

Such a versatile little weapon. Eats the nastiest ammo on the planet, conceals easily, built like a tank...heck, it doesn't even look half bad.
Looks are important when you consider some of the monstrosities to come out of the USSR. :what: Man do they make some ugly guns...functional yes, but UGLY!

Anyway, reliable, fairly cheap to feed, accessories are plentiful
I love mine!

[355sigfan]

My biggest problem with the mak is the wee little round it fires.
Pat

[M2 Carbine]

I've got the PA-63,
and a CZ52
and 14 Makarovs.

Get the Makarov (if you can find one)

But not from SOG
http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=418593

[TimboKhan]

Man, people on THR love thier Maks, although I must confess I don't own one and I don't recall having shot one. I know people love thier Hi-Point pistols, but they still seem a little shaky to me, buts thats just my opinion, and there are plenty of people that will disagree with that sentiment, and the responses on this thread reflect that. However, I am inclined to agree with the Hi-Point carbine. I don't wanna hijack the thread, but I really have never seen anyone that dislikes or has a bad thing to say about that carbine either, and truth be told, if I run across one at the right price, I will probably but it.

[DrDanke]

I have a couple of pics on file that might be of some interest for this thread. In my opinion, the Makarov IS the best bang for the buck low priced pistol. The 9x18 performs awesome, topping the .380 and has the little bit more velocity that aids reliable expansion, which most .380's lack. 9x18 ammo is so very cheap. I can't stand paying $10 a box of 50 rounds of 7.62x25, while you can get nice reliable 9x18 ammo for $5 a box of 50. Both the Makarov and CZ-52 are utterly perfectly reliable pistols. (remember if your CZ-52 is chucking brass too fast, you need a new recoil spring). 99.9% of the CZ-52's that you buy today need a new recoil spring, and by new I mean modern, not just a new original old replacement. The Wolff 16.5 lb spring has made every CZ52 I've seen run flawless, (the spring is really cheap).

http://host.jwcinc.net/1190199/drdanke/images/brownbearsized2.jpg

http://host.jwcinc.net/1190199/drdanke/images/2guardian6.jpg

http://host.jwcinc.net/1190199/drdanke/images/2guardian5.jpg

http://host.jwcinc.net/1190199/drdanke/images/2guardian4.jpg

http://host.jwcinc.net/1190199/drdanke/images/makammo1.jpg

http://host.jwcinc.net/1190199/drdanke/images/makammo2.jpg

[denfoote]

I'd get the Makarov, but I would not subject the poor beast to the rigors of a trunk!!!

One thing you have to think about is what if your car gets stolen??
I personally have had my truck stolen twice!! Thank God, I decided to take my carry gun into the theater that day or I would have been out a Kahr MK9!! I decided then and there that there would be no weapons left in my vehicle. The second time it was stolen, all they got was the truck, nothing else!!
I don't know about you, but I would have no desire to put a weapon into the hands of the goons that stole my car!!

[Juna]

Dang, you need to stop parking your car wherever you are! :what: Where do you live? :uhoh:

And I thought Detroit was bad... :eek:

[Pilot]

Nice pictures Dr. Danke!

The Makarov is the only way to go for that price. The 9x18 round is fine for self defense. More important than the round is the reliability of the firearm. Makarovs can't be beat.

[Woody_in_MN]

Hello...I BOUGHT THE FEG PA-63.

Really thats fine - you guys can keep talking if you like. BTW, People say the FEG 63 has a stiff trigger. I don't think its that bad. Or maybe its been worked on. I'll find out when I put some sheels thru it.

- w

[astraman]

if you shoot the star bm, you'll be in love. the makarov is the same. being a lefty, i'd go w/ the mak as it is da & ready to go. my bm is more accurate than my mak and fires a more powerful rd, but parts for the mak are plentiful which cannot be said of the bm. both are good, dependable, well made guns, but the mak is world renowned for it's super reliability in all kinds of harsh conditions. the bm's sights are better, but, all-in-all the mak wins out.

[Woody_in_MN]

astra,

My bud has a STAR BM. I looked it over, held it, never shot it. For reasons I can not explain I could not warm up to it - maybe because I already have a 1911 type auto.

BTW - The trigger on the FEG is not bad, but double action is a joke. But we never hit anything with double action anyway - right?

- w

[Ruger Shooter]

At that price point you just cannot beat a Makarov. Allthough my neighbor had a Hi Point and it was a good gun just large for a 9mm.