[haole_boySS]

I have an Armalite AR-15 with a 20" SS match barrel. Its a heavy SOB and I was looking around to get another upper to replace it. 16 inch, maybe lightweight, but I dont know where to even start looking.
Do I need to go to Armalite for the new upper?
Can I use an upper from anyone that makes them in .223?
Do I need to get a new bolt-carrier and charging handle?
Am I looking at spending $500 for a complete upper?

Where do I start looking?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Andy

[CDignition]

AR Uppers are pretty much interchangeable...as long as the front hinge pin is not like the Colt(large, screw in type) the Bushmasters use 2 push pins that hold it together...most non colt AR's are this way...the carrier and bolt are interchangeable, just check headspace, but it should be OK...this saves alot of $$$...go to Bushmaster.com to see what they offer..:)

[Artful]

I usually check on AR15.com - you can move your bolt from one upper to another but I prefer to match them as it keeps wear down and your sure the headspace isn't off.

You will loose velocity by shortening the barrel but increase the handiness. 16 inch is as short as you can go (including any non-removeable flash suppressor) with out having to do $200 tax stamp to SBR (short barrel rifle) and having the paperwork mess.

I personally like my pencil barrel 20" upper best - most velocity and light weight but my heavy barrel does have a tighter group.

see if you can find some different ones to try when your out at the range.

[haole_boySS]

Does anyone use Model 1 Sales? is their stuff any good? should I just spend the extra and get an upper from bushmaster or RRA?

[Beren]

http://www.eaglefirearms.net/ef_upper_assy.htm#5.56mm%20Uppers

Better folks to deal with than M1S, and better quality. They also sell Stag Arms and RRA uppers, not just their own house brand.

[DMK]

I've always dealt with www.adcofirearms.com (http://www.adcofirearms.com/rockriver/rrauppers.cfm?page=rra). Great prices and good service. Mostly RRA stuff. I got a midlength carbine and had Steve "contour the barrel", lightening it under the handguards (an option under shop services). It's nice, handy and light.

[Don't Tread On Me]

OK, here's what you want to know.


16" will have less velocity than 20". M193 does 3250fps out of a 20", it will do about 3100fps out of a 16".


When you get a 16" do NOT get an Hbar. Go for the light profile. This is often called a "pencil" barrel, or a "superlight". It is actually the original thickness of the A1 rifles from the Vietnam ear.


The one member above who told you about Colt pins is only half right. Older Colt's (green label) have the incompatible larger front take down pin. All new Colt's have the standard pin like any other AR manufacturer. Green label Colt's are much more rare and usually cost a lot, so it is almost a non-issue. Even if you got the older large pin Colt, they have adapter pins for cheap.


Model 1 Sales is not that good of a parts provider. However, their uppers are pretty decent. Their barrels are made by ER Shaw, and their uppers are forged by Cerro (same place that does Colt, and a number of others). So the components making up their uppers are pretty close to just about anything else out there. It is their lower parts and bolt/carriers that are severly lacking in quality.


Model 1 Sales (http://www.model1sales.com/item-detail.cfm?ID=UCE16LCL&storeid=1&image=u16carprel.gif) offers a lightweight barreled upper in either A2 or A3.

Bushmaster (http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/uppers/pre-ban/bura2b16sl.asp) offers the same in A2 or A3.

Colt has a lightweight upper, but it will be well over $500.

JT Distributing (http://webcats.net/store/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=J&Product_Code=1APBU&Category_Code=BU) offers a good quality light weight upper in A2 or A3 (they are also a kit seller like M1S) JT Distributing is the kit business side of DSA arms, who makes a decent AR.



Bushmaster is by default chrome lined in the chamber and bore. M1S, JT will have it as an option. All will be 1/9 twists.



As for the Bolt carrier group. If you are going to shoot this upper a lot, then yes - you should get a seperate bolt and carrier w/ charging handle for the lightweight upper. This is so they "wear together". Headspace is not an issue on bolts or barrels that aren't shot much. However, some people say that it may become an issue when using a well worn bolt and a new rifle, or swapping well used parts.


The M1S and JT upper can be had with chrome lining and boltcarrier + charging handle for less than $500 easily. The Bushmaster is $405 less bolt and carrier and charging handle. Figure $150 for those ($130 for BCG, and $20 for CH)


I'd get a Colt, but since your budget is $500, I'd try and stretch that to a Bushmaster with bolt and carrier for $535. Note that Bushmaster has a huge backlog and will take a while to get your order out. Call before hand.

[haole_boySS]

Are the BCG/CH interchangeable in uppers like uppers are with lowers? ie: Could you get the upper from A1 and then the BCG/CH from Bushmaster, or is that not recommended?

Another thing I am looking at is getting the upper with either a flip down for removeable front sight. Reason being i'm going with the A3 upper so that I can put on the carry handle or take that off, flip down the front sight and put on a holosight or aimpoint style sight. does that make sense.
Or, Will the aimpoint/holosight be looking over top of the front sight if I dont get a flat top riser?

A1 is the only one so far that offers the lightweight barrel with the flip/remove front sight.

Sorry for all the dumb questions but you guys are giving some great information.

Andy

[demusn1979]

yes they do interchange.pretty much the only thing you have to worry about is Colt front take down pin size(large or small)the pin that separates the upper and lower receivers by front of magwell.
whats wrong with cowitness w/flip rear.


http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/th_IM000419.jpg (http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/IM000419.jpg)

[haole_boySS]

I'm ok with that. I have an armalite and the front pin is push like the rear.

[demusn1979]

talking about the diameter.

[Old Dude]

I don't own an AR15, but I am easily tempted...

OK, so if I can buy a complete upper to my liking, and a lower (from one or more manufacturers), I can just pin them together and voila!, I own an AR15. Just add mags and ammo. And I've saved myself a bit of change.

Do the necessary pins come with either the upper or lower? Probably not the hardest question you've ever seen, but it's the best I could come with on short notice. :evil:

[demusn1979]

yes the pins come with the lower receiver.and or the LPK(lower parts kit)

[Old Dude]

Thanks! Quick and complete answer. What more could I ask for? :D

[Zen21Tao]

Keep in mind that building an AR can be just an expensive (if not more so) as buying an AR. The difference is you get more quality for your money when you build it yourself.

For example, my last completed AR build:

Stag lower receiver (bought from friend so no shipping or transfer fee): $110
Parts kit with NM 2 stage trigger: $150
A2 Buttstock: Free (donated by friend)
Buttstock cheek piece: $40
Ergo Pistol grip: $50
Punch kit and hammer: $20
Upper receiver from White Oaks Precision: $1000
Harris bipod: $80
Leopold Scope and rings: $320

Total: $1770 for an incredibly accurate rifle

Also, I just bought a complete lower from a friend for: $250
His cost:
Mega lower: $90
Transfer fee and FFL call: $27
Parts kit: $50
Tango down battle grip: $40
Vltor collapsible stock: $150
His Total: $357

Now I'm looking for Upper half to add (might have to wait till I finish my FAL build). When all is said and done I should have a nice high quality Tacticool CQB rifle for the cost of an entry level complete AR.

[mtnbkr]

Hey haole_boySS, if you can get out to the NRA range in Fairfax some time, I'll let you try out my 16" lightweight upper on your gun.

OK, so if I can buy a complete upper to my liking, and a lower (from one or more manufacturers), I can just pin them together and voila!, I own an AR15. Just add mags and ammo.
Not only that, but you can build the rifle completely from parts. That's what I did. The only preassembled piece in my gun is the bolt assembly.

Chris

[demusn1979]

armalite m-15 16" flattop complete 500.00

mid length gas system (more reliability)
has to be ordered!
thats what i would get for a armalite! :D

[kikilee]

Why not just change out the barrel? Put a new shorter gas tube in it and mount a new set of handguards and use your current upper with your B,C, & CH. All you need is an "Action" block, and barrel wrench, and a few common tools and your good to go. The action block and barrel wrench run about $60.00 for both. New barrel, $150.00 - $175.00, Handguards - $20.00, Gas tube - $8.00 - Done. Not much to it. Step by step with pics on ar15.com. I''ve built several from scratch. Great fun.

[Zen21Tao]

Peronally I would go for a new upper and keep the old one. Then you'd have a short light weight tacticool setup for cqb type shooting and a match setup for benchrest shooting. If you do decide you only want the new upper you can always list your old one on AR15.com. You may get enough to cover the entire cost of your new upper (see below).

Check out Eagle Firearms (http://www.eaglefirearms.net/ef_upper_assy.htm). They have a 16" light weight upper for $329 without Bolt/Carrier/Charging Handle or $419 with B/C/CH.