How to convince the girlfriend....


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BowStreetRunner
March 27, 2003, 07:50 PM
Ok guys (and girls),
I love to go shooting...just turned old enought to start buying guns and i intend to do that
I love my girlfriend to death, and I am in the process of trying to convince her that a gun will not jump up and kill me...and that because i act responsibly there is little danger.....
I am sure that eventually she will come around and realize that im she shouldnt worry.....I am just looking for advice on how to get her over that....she is cared to death of guns....
im hoping to get her out to a range and shoot a .22 or something that isnt too intimidating.....does anyone have any experience breaking in people who are scared stiff of guns ?
And no, getting a new girlfriend isnt an option:)
BSR

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280PLUS
March 27, 2003, 07:54 PM
I think we need a pic of the girlfriend to be able to discuss this competently...

:evil:

maybe take her to the gun shop and show her all the pretty blue and red p-32 keltecs, the girls really think theyre cute...

Standing Wolf
March 27, 2003, 08:03 PM
Maybe a low budget BB gun for starters would help.

BowStreetRunner
March 27, 2003, 08:04 PM
......ill show her the shiny derringers and find a red kel tec
:)

spacemanspiff
March 27, 2003, 08:05 PM
yeah, thats why tamara, pax, runt, and all the others of the 'fairer persuasion' post pics of their 'cute' guns. :evil:

bowstreet, simply tell your sig other that you cant be there all the time to protect her, nor can her father, her priest, or her hairdresser. if she has even the slightest touch of self sufficiency she will understand that she has to be prepared to take care of herself, including self defense.

280PLUS
March 27, 2003, 08:20 PM
yea, but those girls are pretty tough,,,i'm talkin about your basic chicken type girls...

besides, they all think the keltec is cute till they pulls the trigger, then it aint so cute anymore...

:eek:

synoptic
March 27, 2003, 08:25 PM
My girlfriend used to be the exact same way, she didn't want me to have them, said that when we were married I WOULD NOT have guns in the house. After our first range trip she realized it wasn't as bad as she thought, she even likes shooting, although won't admit it very often :) Her favorite gun is my 12 guage. She still doesn't like me buying guns because she thinks the money can be better spent on, say, a ring for her finger, or more toys for the sugar gliders. My point is, get her out to the range, let her shoot the .22 and maybe a pistol or two, hopefully she'll come around.

Bobarino
March 27, 2003, 08:36 PM
let me know if you find a sure-sire way to get the non-gun-liking girlfriend to go to the range with you. i've been trying to convince mine for over 3 years now. so far no luck. i was even going to buy a P22 to start her on. (actually just an excuse to buy a new gun) still no dice. i'll keep trying.

Bobby

Kahr carrier
March 27, 2003, 08:40 PM
Most people are scared of new things .Show her your guns and the safe and proper way to handle them. Then take her to the range and start her small like a 22 and work your way up . Thats how my little Sis started and now she thinks a 629 is a small gun.;)

JohnKSa
March 27, 2003, 08:51 PM
besides, they all think the keltec is cute till they pulls the trigger, then it aint so cute anymore...
Huh?

My wife is very recoil sensitive and she LOVES her P32...

wun_8_seven
March 27, 2003, 08:56 PM
dump her!! , life is too short to deal with BS. 187

BowStreetRunner
March 27, 2003, 08:57 PM
.....yeah,
id love to convince her that guns are useful for self protection.....but she said that She has never been robbed before.....so apparently she is hoping on that luck to hold out.......she is an Ed major and i am a criminal justice major.......i have to believe that there are bad people who need regulatin' on and she has to believe that she can help everyone.....nothing against teachers.....we are philisophically different on that....she thinks that using a gun to defend yourself will only make the bad guy get more violent......thats not so much the problem....she knows im going to have guns....would i like her to like them, carry one to protect herself? yeah, i want her to be safer.....but i cant make that choice for her.......so right now im just going to try and get her fear of guns down and see what happens....

MitchSchaft
March 27, 2003, 09:12 PM
All you can do is go about like you please. You give into all her BS, she will own you and you won't be able to go to the bathroom without her permission. Yes, relationships are about compromise, but there are things that you can't compromise with. This is one of them. My wife tried the same BS as your girlfriend is doing now. I bought my guns and ignored her BS nagging and now she doesn't bother me about stuff. It tooks some time, but you have to stand your ground! A woman isn't worth your life if that ever arrises.

Redlg155
March 27, 2003, 09:23 PM
I'd suggest enrolling her into a good gun safety class followed by taking her out to dinner somewhere nice in exchange.

She can learn from you of course, but sometimes it's a bit easier to have her go to a class and get her to understand things her own way. She may have a more relaxed attitude towards guns as it will take all of the mystery and misconceptions of gun ownership away.

She still may not want to shoot with you, but at least she will know how to check the condition of a weapon to ease her mind.

Good Shooting
RED

Edward429451
March 27, 2003, 10:15 PM
The best way to convince her is to dont argue with her on it and be absolutely impeccable in your safe handling of weapons around her. No gun jokes and follow the 4 rules at all times. Eventually she'll realize that you're respectably safe, get comfortable with them and let you teach her.

If your lucky!;)

Mastrogiacomo
March 27, 2003, 10:16 PM
From a female shooter -- something with a safety so she won't freak out about it just going off. I use a Beretta compact M. The 9mm are gentle, the Beretta is beautiful and the shooting is fun. Again, the safety factor may help her ease into it.:D

English John
March 27, 2003, 10:27 PM
She's working on emotion, you're working on logic- you lose.
Tell her:
1) Not everyone in the world is as nice as she is
2) She really doesn't know what she's talking about when it comes to guns, because she doesn't know about them.
3) She should go to the range with you ONE TIME to try it out.

Take a .22 rifle (not a black gun) and go when you can be alone (take earmuffs). Use some paper targets, and some pop cans for plinking. If it's fun, she'll come back. Good luck.

coonan357
March 28, 2003, 12:35 AM
oneI would try is the womans guide to arms videotape to help ease here into to it then take her to the range not as a trainee but to show her what it is like (comprmise by going to one of her outings that you might think stinks or you possibly wouldn't like ) then take her out to a private range or freinds farm with permission , and start off with the .22 or a .38 with light loads and let her try .. don't bring out the artillery and try to be he macho man , that turns them off big time . and most of all be patient ...

kalibear45
March 28, 2003, 12:45 AM
I think we need a pic of the girlfriend to be able to discuss this competently...

:D

Elmer Snerd
March 28, 2003, 02:42 AM
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?threadid=1778

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?threadid=3121

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?threadid=15439

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?threadid=10863

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?threadid=9712

samualt
March 28, 2003, 05:07 AM
If you take her to the range to shoot .22's then for Gods sake choose a time when few others are there. Else, you will end up with someone in the stall next to you with a .50 caliber Desert Eagle that will scare her to death.
Those guns are so loud they scare me! :what:

BogBabe
March 28, 2003, 06:25 AM
You're a criminal justice major who is into guns, and she's an ed major who believes there are no real bad guys, just people who need to be "helped."

I wouldn't be optimistic about the long-range chances of this relationship.

You'll be one of those guys who, at 50, has to sneak a new gun into the house and still gets grief from the wife about the guns he owns and his desire to carry.

280PLUS
March 28, 2003, 06:49 AM
Looking at the p-32, "oh, thats cute, i can handle that!"

then pulling the trigger, "WHOA!! Here take this back!!"

me, "ROFLMAO"

she'll go shooting with me, occasionally, still not her favorite thing to do but she at least tolerates it.

she also just laughs and says "i thought you weren't going to buy any more guns"

and i say, "but honey, its not a new gun, it was just hiding in the back of the safe!"

ok, i stole that one...

her dad did take her shooting when she was a kid so she wasn't a complete newbie. that probably helped.

good luck...


:D

or, what bogbabe said...she's got it right.

Nightfall
March 28, 2003, 08:00 AM
I can't say I'm in a similar situation myself. My girlfriend doesn't like guns... she's terrified of ‘em really. But what does she have to say about this? Direct quote:

"I don't hate guns, I'm just scared of them. I don't know anything about them. Teach me."

Now how many of you would KILL to have everybody on earth be this logical and honest? If this was the case, gun control would be a no-go non-stop.

I'm looking to get a nice .22 to take her shooting with. I'm so glad she's not a lost cause like so many other more liberal types... thus far, I've managed to get her considering moving to Texas when we're older (rural areas too!), reversed her stance on ‘no guns in my house', was able to change her positions with actual logic (can she be considered a liberal if she's really able to understand logic? :D)... now I'm working on getting her turned on to shooting, thinking about concealed carry eventually... I got lucky having somebody who can listen and understand our pro-gun reasoning. :)

rxw
March 28, 2003, 09:08 AM
New member... long time reader of TFL, and now, THR.

I had the same issues with my wife. Of the two of us, I am more security conscious (check doors twice at night, etc). I asked her if she's ever been stalked or has anyone ever tried to open our doors at night. I also asked her to explain how she could know for certain. It made her think.

I told her that she can never know what another person (neighbor, stranger, etc) is thinking and she would be wise to think ahead and be prepared. She won't go to the range, but she's tolerates my guns. It is a cultural thing, she has never been around guns and grew up in liberal USA. She may not be a convert to weapons, but at least she understands why I feel they are necessary.

WhoKnowsWho
March 28, 2003, 09:22 AM
My wife was very inbetween with I got my first gun. But then after the first range with a rented .22, she has quickly come over to the side of liking them. She has the 3 guns she mainly wants, but she originally only wanted 1. Just like me... 1, then 2, etc...

Carlos Cabeza
March 28, 2003, 09:41 AM
It is always easier to find out about these things early in the relationship than later. Trying to convince a woman about guns is largely a practice in futility. It helps if you already have similar interests BEFORE you decide to get serious. (Little tale) I dated this girl I was absolutely in love with. I didn't know how she would react to my owning, shooting, hunting, etc. of guns. Still I did not want to end it solely on this alone. So I never mentioned it for the first three months of said relationship. Then one day she is looking for something in her purse and dumps it out on the coffee table and !!! out pops a little black .32 KelTec !!!! I said "What's that"(dumb look) :D She say's "Oh, that's Pete, my purse friend" Long story short she is now the missus. :D
I hope it works out for you as easily, BUT don't give up what you believe in or you will someday regret it and that will be the END..................
Good luck !
Carl

BogBabe
March 28, 2003, 09:56 AM
"Oh, that's Pete, my purse friend"

That's a great story, Carlos!

Carlos Cabeza
March 28, 2003, 09:59 AM
:) Wouldn't trade her for nuthin' !!!!!!!:D

braindead0
March 28, 2003, 10:14 AM
I noticed you're in Ohio. I can put you in touch with a couple that does womans only classes, starting with revolver..and then (if they do good in the revo class, semi-autos..). Both instructors are NRA certified, and have papers a mile long (I think they've completed all the LFI training ;-).

My wife loved the class, and as they do womans only.. it's a bit less intimidating.

These classes are in the NorthEast of Ohio..hopefully you're nearby..

Edward429451
March 28, 2003, 10:52 AM
I wouldn't be optimistic about the long-range chances of this relationship.

With all due respect, this may be true but...Pshaw! Have a little faith man, if you go around thinking like that, your doomed to failure before you start.

Guns are secondary item in a relationship. Pursue the relationship regardless of the secondary details and be patient. If you hold back the least little bit due to the pessimistic sarcasm, she'll pick up on it and feel second to your guns and you lose.

If you pursue it optimistically, wholeheartedly, patiently, she'll pick up on that too and your relationship will prosper from it. If not and it goes to crap, at least you'll know you gave your 100%.

(No disrespect intended to bogbabe, just another opinion that worked for me!)

BogBabe
March 28, 2003, 11:08 AM
Guns are secondary item in a relationship.

True enough, in most cases, most of the time.

But it sounds like there are profound differences in how these two view the world, and those are not a secondary item..

BowStreetRunner and his girl may be able to overcome those differences . . . . or they may not. It's all too easy, in the first flush of a new relationship, to ignore things about your beloved and convince yourself that he or she is what you wish for them to be. It's important to see them as they really are and evaluate whether there are basic, profound incompatibilities that will eventually doom the relationship. Wishful thinking and expecting the person to change won't accomplish anything but heartache.

braindead0
March 28, 2003, 11:09 AM
You know, my wife takes pottery classes... she doesn't bug me about not taking pottery classes.. (although she tries ;-).

One thing to remember, you are two different people... Just because you love guns, doesn't mean she has to as well.

aka: what Edward429451 said...just different ;-)

jade
March 28, 2003, 11:13 AM
my suggestion would be to present the gun to her in seperate pieces so that she can see it in a different light. if possible, have it in pieces before she comes in so she sees the parts first. then put it back together and see how she reacts.

find out if she has an actual reason for being afraid of them, or if it's just because they are "evil". you might also see if there is a womens gun club in your area. my first shooting trip was with the Colorado Womens Shooting Club. i was much more comfortable being around other women shooters for my first time out.

hope this helps.

jade

BowStreetRunner
March 28, 2003, 12:18 PM
....to everyone who posted advice.....
some people said that our difference in philosophy on guns could be difficult to get by and i realize that but we do love each other for our similarities and differences......id love for her to come around to my point of view, but hey, if she doesnt, ill still get guns, and well be ok...thanks
BSR

Trisha
March 28, 2003, 12:51 PM
BowStreetRunner;

1) You might think about "The Long Kiss Goodnight" as a date movie.
2) Have your girl do some ride-alongs with female LEO's in Narcotics & Vice, and Street Crime units.
3) Get her into martial arts (do it together) - and stick with it.
4) Hand her a copy of Paxton Quigley's book, "Armed and Female."

Despite the likely urge to browbeat her (pound some sense into her cute head), you'll have an opportunity to both gain insight into her perspective as well as demonstrate depth (often a tad lacking in one becoming of legal age) by sharing the importance of this with her over time. Going to martial arts classes together for at least a year will give you both common ground. If she intuitively sees LEO's in a positive light, then the ride-alongs will be a constructive addition; and she'll be presented with women who see the horrors of unarmed women on a daily basis.

Paxton, of course, is priceless as a relevant resource, as she was vehemently anti-gun at one time.

I deal with exactly the same problem as you are confronting - save that my students come to me after surviving being terrorized. It is usually a complex knot to unravel, and it takes time and heart to listen, really listen, to understand their underlying reasons for having a dread/loathing of firearms.

Don't just throw arguments at her, draw her out in an environment of mutual interest:

(you) "Lover, I honestly can't understand your perspective; but I need you to know just how much I cherish you - and I get more than a little scared at the thought of you being defenseless!"

(her) "I'm not worried, I have a cell phone (and pepper spray). I live in a nice neighborhood. I'm careful!"

(you) "I know you see me as a little overbearing on this - so will you come with me to (a) a battered women's shelter (b) the Street Crimes Unit? "

BowStreetRunner, approach this with completely genuine compassion, or you'll immediately sound condescending - and you'll get cold fish for dinner.

I may not always understand straight people, but in this, we're all the same as we share the same fears and hopes for those we hold dear. Feel free to write me anytime OTB.

Let us know how this progresses, will you?

Trisha

MitchSchaft
March 28, 2003, 12:53 PM
if she doesnt, ill still get guns, and well be ok

Good! If you guys are really in love as you say you are, she'll bitch about it but still stick around.

thrifty7
March 28, 2003, 12:57 PM
Be careful. Not one person in a hundred has any luck changing their partners attitude, particularly on an emotional subject like this. Marriage counselors are unanimous on this. To those who think they have done so, I suggest that she wasn't too strongly into hating guns in the first place. Remember that she probably plans to change you to her way of thinking, and ask yourself why you should be any more successful than she will. Among my three brothers, I am the only one "allowed" to have guns in the house. We all grew up as shooters, but I was the only one that you would call "dedicated." My sister was the least tolerant of guns as we grew up, but now her husband is better armed than all of my brothers, thanks mainly to their wives. Although I didn't realize it at the time, I screened my wife quite effectively by taking her to browse the gun shops and shows frequently while we were dating. She never became interested in shooting, but never came to feel threatened by it, either. If she had, I probably would have convinced myself that I could change her mind, and wound up either gunless or divorced like so many others. My son just went thru his second divorce, and it was a disaster. She dragged him thru the mud in ways I didn't know were possible, because the laws are strongly biased in favor of the woman. Thanks to her false accusations he will never own a gun again.....think about it. His mistake , of course, was to not get to know her before getting her pregnant. Please, guys, be careful, or you will regret it.

Sign ME
Sader but Wizer,
thrifty7
P.S. One other thing that all marriage counsellors that I have read or talked to agree on: Love does not conquer anything. Love results from compatible thinking.

Bobarino
March 28, 2003, 01:41 PM
at least i'm lucky enough to have a girlfriend that completely understands why i like and carry guns and has no problem with them in the house. since we don't have joint finances, she has no objection to me buying as many as i want. she even feels safer when i'm armed. dumping her is not an option. i'm going to marry her.

she had a bad first experience when she was a kid, about 10 yrs old. her half drunk dad gave her a .357 and said "shoot that stump" so she did. she had no hearing protection and she hurt her hands and wrists. since then she's been affriad to shoot a gun.

i keep offering to take her to the range and teach her properly and safely on .22 but its just not her cup of tea, so i don't force the issue. i just keep offering to take her, and she keeps politely declining. so i leave the offer open and leave it at that. maybe someday she'll change her mind, but i'll let her do it on her own terms. you just can't force something on someone and expect them to like it.

Bobby

Frohickey
March 28, 2003, 04:22 PM
Tell the girlfriend that you want her to pose like this. :D
http://www.amderringer.com/pix/postera.jpg

Waitone
March 28, 2003, 04:33 PM
If your girlfriend is into, "Guns are evil" have her identify other inanimate objects that are evil.

My now 21 year old daughter was into "GAE" routine. What swung her around was seeing a 1911 in pieces in a box. She watched me clean and reassemble it. I then got to explain all the safeties:
--guns-are-always-loaded-safety
--finger-off-the-trigger-until-sights-are-on-the-target safety
--never-point-a-gun-at-anything-you-won't-destroy safety
--be-certain-of-your-target-and-everything-behind-it safety
--thumb safety
--grip safety
--"round-has-to-be-in-the-chamber-before-it-will-go-boom" safety

My daughter is now a gun nut. She will apply for a CCH in May and will purchase a handugn in two weeks. She shot a .22LR, .38spl, 9mm, .40, and .45. She like the big bore best.

Oh, BTW what really helped her attitude was the night someone pulled a gun on her. It sorta clarified the mind.

Shoeless
March 28, 2003, 04:50 PM
Although he has been shooting a few times, I would never call my husband someone who shoots. He is just not as into it as I am and probably will never be.

That being said, he's also not actively against me shooting or teaching. However, if he were, it would not deter me, nor change my mind. You are two different people and you are both entitled to your own interests, even if the other doesn't see the appeal in it.

I'd never tell him he "can't" do something and he would certainly afford me the same courtesy.

If you allow this woman to dictate what you will or will not keep in your own home, you deserve whatever living situation you get, IMO. Sometimes one spouse has to accept things about the other that they don't really like, and this one may be yours. :)


Shoeless

twoblink
March 29, 2003, 01:12 AM
As someone who had an "anti" for a gf for 7 years (now I have a very tactical gf, life is infinitely better!)

Let me give you the recipe, if giving up the gf is not an option.

Twoblink's quick and dirty guide to turn an anti-gf, to a Runt or Tamara... (Ok, maybe not that extreme.. but at least to a non-anti)

#1) Buy an airsoft.
These things are the "gateway drugs" of the gun world. Shoot it around the house, set up little targets. She might be annoyed, until you tell her "I'll put it away after you take 10 shots". After 10 shots, she'll be hooked.
Then tell her her that these things kick more then a .22LR. :D

#2) Ask her THE QUESTION..
No no no, not marriage,.... THE QUESTION.

Don't know what THE QUESTION is??

THE QUESTION::

"Do you want to put 100% of your safety into the hands of the government (Police, Military)... KEEPING IN MIND THEY ARE THE SAME PEOPLE THAT RUN THE POST OFFICE AND THE DMV....? (Make sure you say... DMV... a few times.) That thought alone should give her nightmares at night.

#3) If she says yes; FIND A NEW GIRLFRIEND. ANY GIRL THAT WOULD TRUST HER LIFE TO THOSE WHO RUN THE DMV, IS A DYED IN THE WOOL TOE TAG SHEEPLE.

#4) Assuming she answers no: Ask her then... "Do you know the difference between a: boy, man, real man?"

Boy = cannot defend himself
Man = can defend himself
Real Man = can defend himself and HIS LOVED ONES.

Tell her that you would like to be a "Real Man" instead of a boy.

#5) Ask her "Do you know the difference between a: girl, woman, real woman"?

Girl = defenseless
Woman = Can defend herself
Real Woman = Can defend herself AND HER LOVED ONES.

Tell her, you would like to date a real woman.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
After that introduction, we now get into the hypotheticals.

Scenerio #1) You two are walking down a street; when you are held up by a man with a gun. If the man were to shoot one of you, who do you think is the more likely target? You, or her?

Answer of course is You; because you are a bigger threat to the mugger. So tell her, there is a very high likelihood that if confronted, you might become seriously wounded, and so the responsibility of defending herself and you, now rests on her shoulders. So from that scenerio, let her know what it's not enough that you know how to use a gun and carry one, but she should as well.

Scenerio #2) She's asleep, hears her front door being kicked down. Two items on the table:

a) A gun
b) A telephone

Ask her which item would she pick up?
If she says a phone... ask her, "What are you going to do with the phone? Throw it at him?"

If she answer phone: Here is the follow -up question.. to it..

"You walk into the house and find a man, raping your girlfriend... There are two items on the table, a phone and a gun... WHICH WOULD SHE WANT YOU TO PICK UP??"

If she says phone... DUMP HER. Not worth having.

Another followup question you can ask is.. "Which will arrive faster... a 357Mag 125 grain Jacketed Hollow Point aimed at the rapist's head, or the police to her front door?" Given roughly 1000fps, that's less then 1/100th of a second for the first to happen, while it might take up to 2 hours for the second one to happen.

That is my "starter" kit. Give it a try. Thus far, hasn't failed.

twoblink
March 29, 2003, 01:17 AM
As far as her fears, I forgot to address that part;

Tell her statistically, that she is more likely to get hit by a drunk driver then die from a gun shot. Tell her also, that kids are 100x more likely to drown in a swimming pool than die by a gun shot. Also, children 3 and under, die from plastic bags more than gun shots. Tell her she has greater danger of serious injury riding a bike than PROPERLY handling a gun.

If she cannot accept a gun, then she should fill every swimming pool she sees, never use a plastic bag, never ride a bike, and find a new boyfriend...

4 eyed six shooter
March 29, 2003, 01:34 AM
Teach her about gun safety, then proper grip, trigger control and sight picture, then start her out with a pellet pistol in the back yard. It's been my experience that woman turn out to be pretty good shots with the proper instruction. Once she sees that she can shoot the pellet pistol well, move up to a .22 LR. In no time at all she will be hooked.
Now about that picture:evil:
Good Luck, John K

Diane
March 29, 2003, 07:15 AM
Tell her you don't want her to go! You know how we women are when we're told we can't do something! Then start her on a .22 and she'll see that it could be fun and the .22 won't scare her with recoil.

Good Luck!
Diane

280PLUS
March 29, 2003, 08:05 AM
ah, diane hit the nail on the head

a rare opportunity to see the inner female mind at work.

i like the airsoft idea around the house too, but using dianes insight i'd probably say,

"i'll give you ten shots and i bet you can't hit that target over there"

how'd i do, diane?

:evil:

incidently, my brother owns all the various barretta types, his wife outshoots him consistently and they both started together.

of course she works at the state pen here so i tell them i figure she's got more of an incentive.

but yes, women are normally better shots than men, theyre more patient and they are less aggressive on the trigger.

ok, how many of us here know that the russians fielded over 2000 women snipers in ww2? they were deemed better than men for the above reasons and fought valiantly. only ~ 500 survived the war. :(

Logistar
March 29, 2003, 09:22 AM
My wife didn't "believe in guns". I did not know this until AFTER we were married. (Mistake #1!) She didn't want ANY guns in the house. I basically said," I WILL have a gun in the house."

We compromised :rolleyes: and I was "allowed" to have ONE revolver.

Today, I live alone! I can have all the guns I want! (And I want a lot of guns!)

Bottom line is: Straighten this out now. I know you love her, but this is one of the things that can mess your relationship up later.

FWIW

Logistar

Diane
March 29, 2003, 09:35 AM
280PLUS,

PERFECT!

Diane

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