[smokin'n gun]

Any thoughts on the H and K esp. the USP? Thanks. :confused:

[psyopspec]

I'd suggest using the search function, then if you don't find the info you're looking for, start a thread asking a more specific question.

[Ala Dan]

I owned a full size H&K USP in .45ACP for awhile; and it was a great piece,
with one exception. I found it too be larger than my .45 caliber SIG-SAUER
P220A. Therefore, I got rid of it and returned to my all time favorite; the
P220A.

[HSMITH]

I don't like the USP line at all. Bad ergonomics, funny feel in recoil, and priced about double or a little more than they are worth. Just my opinion.....

[SouthpawShootr]

They're nice guns, but terribly overpirced. The USP line, in my experience, is satisfactory with respect to reliability and accuracy. No better than Glock, but they're priced almost $300 more than than like chambered Glock models. The full size line seems to be way oversized for their chamberings. I'd love to have one of the P2000 with the LEM trigger, but the best price I can find is $850 out the door so it may be a while before I can save it up.

[Noah Zark]

Huge in dimensions, heavy, overpriced, lots of bits, pieces, pins, and springs inside, and middlin to poor ergonomics -- and it comes with the famous H&K superiority "take-it-or-leave-it" attitude that H&K has towards non-LEO customers, i.e., the public. Had a used one that I bought in a moment of weakness and regretted it soon after; something I rarely do with a gun purchase. Let my heart make the purchase, not my head; after all it was and H&K for Pete's sake!

IMO, the SIG 220 is everything the H&K should be, but H&K just had to go "bigger" and they blew it.

Sort of comparing a Jeep Cherokee Classic to the full-size Hummer H1.

Gimme the Jeep, gimme the SIG.

Noah

[BlkHawk73]

Have had one since they first came out and had had zero problems with it (.40). Performed admirably at a weeklong Thunder ranch stint without a hiccup. frame is a bit large for some, especially in the .45 models. DA trigger isn't great but just takes getting used to. SA is quite nice. Very accuarte. Was the first of what's currently 3 HK handguns with another coming quite soon (either a P2000sk or a Elite)

[Dollar An Hour]

Good, but overpriced, polymer.

Sig Pro polymer on the other hand, is a bargain. Check 'em out.

[PO2Hammer]

H&K's are great exept for one problem-ergonomics.
I keep coming back to Sig for a quality high end pistol.

[phantomak47]

Over Priced ....the Frame cant cost more than $5.00 to make....

[Black Majik]

Only thing I really like about the USPs is the capability of decock or Condition 1 carry, or decocked and safetied carry.

[WT]

Great gun. The Variant 9 is just like a 1911. The full size USP is a little large for my hands, but so is a Glock 21. The compact models are really nice.

Very accurate and reliable. A quality machine.

[XLMiguel]

I have two USP/C's in 9mm & .45 (both V1). Like 'em a lot. Just wish the .45 had a higher capacity. Thoroughly reliable, eats everything, accurate, and the ergonomics work fine for me. They are a bit blocky, but either conceals OK and they're relatively light. They are expensive if you pay anything close to list, but I shop hard . . .

[valor1]

Very reliable but very overpriced.

[Tokugawa]

P7 is a truly great carry gun -slim, ambidexterous, simple, user friendly manual of arms, accurate and extremely reliable. And as safe as a gun can be. Especially for IWB carry.

[rick_reno]

Best ergonomics I've found in a handgun - mine points right on target. If it fits your hand and you like the way they point it's a good choice. I have only two 45's that have been 100% reliable - and the H&K is one of them.

[Frandy]

My USP 45C has been flawless, accurate, and therefore a dependable sidearm that I trust my life with. In an Alessi holster, it's perfect.

[CB900F]

Smokin';

I've had a USPc .40 for years. It's my everyday carry gun. Zero problems with it. I had H&K do the ambi control retro-fit, & the work was done for the money quoted & quickly.

The ergonomics are far superior for me than the Glack. I don't mind having to pay a bit more for better merchandise, & there's no doubt in my mind the H&K is the better gun by far.

900F

[Sylvilagus Aquaticus]

I'm with Ala Dan. I have shot several, including GWG's (www.geekswithguns.com) USP .45 . It was accurate, but it sure is big. My P220 is a lot more concealable, not to mention it just feels better in my hand. The upside to the USP is the capacity; the downside, to me, is the feel and size over the P220.

Ever looked at the CZ97B?

Regards,
Rabbit.

[mpthole]

Love 'em. Own 4: 2 in .45 and 2 in 9mm. My 1 experience with customer service was very good. Those who say that customer service is poor, I think are repeating an old internet rumor. If they fit your hand, you won't want to shoot anything else. That said, I'm becoming more of a 1911 man. But I'll never give up my H&Ks.

[Sir Aardvark]

Like almost everyone else has said - they are very expensive!

[10-Ring]

Consistently the nicest guns I've owned...I currently have 4 from the USP line & my all time fave my P7M8. Recommend them highly. Yes, there is a premium to ownership, but it is well worth it! :cool:

[MTMilitiaman]

Noah, the USP is polymer so you can't really call it heavy. My Tactical I think weighed less than 30 oz with an unloaded magazine. This is a good 5 to 10 oz lighter than most 1911s with the possibility of nearly twice the capacity. Also, other than grip size, why are people complaining about ergonomics. The grip angle is similar to the 1911 and the controls are located and operate in a nearly identical fashion.

The USP is a solid peice but it is big and it does cost more than it should. There is no way it gives you $300 more than a Glock.

A lot of people have had very good luck with the HK, but I have not. Mine would fail to completely go into battery even with some ball ammunition so although it was accurate and fit me fine, I never was able to completely trust it as a defense peice, which is what I bought it for. Also, the included 10 round magazines now fail to lock the slide back on a fairly regular basis (about 50% of the time). To say that I would be disappointed with it's performance at half of its $1000 purchase price is a drastic understatement. As soon as I can find the money, I will be sending it in for repairs and then more than likely selling it or trading it towards a Glock 30 or a SIG P220ST.

[larry starling]

Crap! Over priced handguns. I had a USP compact in .40 it was unreliable and I had numerous examples of the slide not returning to battery and FTE. I would suggest you avoid and find a more affordable handgun..... :D

[waterhouse]

I never had a problem with my USPc .45. Accurate and reliable gun. I liked the way the SIG 220 felt in my hand so that is the one I kept, but if the USP fits your hand well I think they are great guns. I did like the ability to carry with the hammer back and safety on like my 1911s.

I did just order a Tactical because I got a really good deal on a suppressor and I needed something to put it on.

Also, they get bashed a lot because they are expensive. I got my compact on gunbroker for $500, which is pretty middle of the road as far as my pistols go (most have cost me anywhere from $300 to $800).

[Newton]

Grossly over-priced and worth every penny :D

[albanian]

Any thoughts on Glocks? Just wondering what you guys think of them. :evil:

[CB900F]

Albanian;

Aren't trying to stir the pot or anything are you?

But, thank God we left handed people literally don't think like you poor 'lowest common denominator' types! See, pot-stirring at it's finest.

:D 900F

[Feanaro]

I haven't much experience but what I do have suggests that the USP is accurate, durable, and reliable. I even like the ergonomics, especially if you slap a Hogue Hand-All on. Expensive devils though. You might try shopping gunbroker.com for a deal though.

Why everyone hasn't gone to their magazine release is beyond me.

But, thank God we left handed people literally don't think like you poor 'lowest common denominator' types!

The right hand is controlled by the left brain, the logical side. For the left, the opposite. Guess that means lefties run on emotions 'n probably cry during soap operas. :evil:

[CB900F]

Fella's;

I see somebody bought two issues of 'Psychology Today'.

:neener: 900F

[ziadel]

if I had the spare scratch I'd pick one up in a heartbeat, and assuming I could conceal it properly, it would most likely repalce my 1911 as my daily carry gun.

[Tokugawa]

My carry gun experience - Walther PPK .380 Vicious recoil, dubious accuracy, underpowered .Unreliable.carrried six months.
Full size
1911, great shootability, reliable (stock colt weapon, 70 series) too heavy by far, carried one year.
HK P7, accurate, powerfull, reliable, carried 12 years.

[ziadel]

anyone wanna explain the difference between variant 1 and variant 9 USP's?


both are locked and cocked capable..

[g1726]

The HK pistols are all very high quality. Even their biggest "dog" the VP70Z was a well made pistol, just not what the market was looking for.

HK's offerings are always unique and innovative. I love them for that, but they're often just a little too quirky for many shooters. My dad and brother for example do not like them. I've always loved them, except for the price tag. I'd love to have a P7M8 for concealment, a P9 for fun and a USP just because they are a well made high capacity pistol. At this time, I just don't have the spare money to do that. I do hope the time will come as each of the HK pistols excel in at least one area. The P9's are reported to be extremely accurate and ideal for use with supressors. The USP is good enough for the German military and the P7 series has one of the lowest bores axes available, not to mention a very safe and easy to shoot action.

All of the actual HK owners who shoot their pistols regularly really like them and have few complaints. Others who have handled them or shot them just once aren't so convinced.

I believe the difference between the V1 and V9 USP's is in the operating levers. Both are a safety when pushed up, but only the V1 has the spring loaded decocker when pushed past horizontal. The V9 lever is a safety only with no decocking function.

[ziadel]

I believe the difference between the V1 and V9 USP's is in the operating levers. Both are a safety when pushed up, but only the V1 has the spring loaded decocker when pushed past horizontal.


I'm not quite following that...


pushed past horizontal?
:confused:

[Kurush]

The right hand is controlled by the left brain, the logical side. For the left, the opposite. Guess that means lefties run on emotions 'n probably cry during soap operas.Maybe my left hand is defective but it doesn't seem to have any tear ducts on it :rolleyes:

[tomkatz]

I'm not quite following that...pushed past horizontal?

If you continue pushing the safety down past the fire position it decocks the gun, then springs back to the fire position, ready for a double action first shot....
I like the usp guns, they have the only ambi-mag release that works, and they are accurate and dependable.....if they work for you ergonomically, what else is there?
......tom

[toocool]

I have a USP full size .45 that I carry daily. I think H & Ks are worth every penny. The ergonomics are better than any other handgun I've handled (especially Glock), it points naturally for me, the DA trigger is better than the Sig P220 I traded away for it, and it holds more rounds. I don't hesitate to recommend them.

[ziadel]

how hard is it to push past fire?


is there a danger of decocking on a draw?


I'm trying to figure out if its worth it to have someone special order a variant 9, as they do not seem to be very prevalent.

[duncan]

Tokugawa, is right on target.

Other than the MP5 carbine, HK's best pistol ever is still the HKP7.

http://www.hkp7.com/p7m8/hardchrome.jpg

High quality steel, precise and finished machining, attention to detail.

Cannot ever remember hearing of a P7 that was not a keeper or a Monday gun.

The USP just replaced the P7s when polymer became the rage.

If you want a Timex-type shooter, the P7 is one of the few to consider. Many of have several even though HK has stopped production. They'll just restart production in a couple of years and run limited special production runs and jack the prices up.

[Onslaught]

I've owned a total of three USPs... Two .45's and one .40, all full size.

Ergonomics is a funny thing... The USP45 is the best feeling pistol I've ever held in my hand! The controls are in just the right spot (I'm left handed) and no matter what else I'm holding, (Glock, Walther, SigPro) when I put it down and pick up my HK, the USP feels better. For some odd reason though, the USP40 didn't share that trait. I didn't like the grip, it felt too small.

I like that my USP is a BIG pistol. The USP fits my size XL hand just perfectly. I don't need to conceal it (although I have done it twice) as I have other pistols specifically for that purpose. The USP is my primary "house" pistol and also the pistol I use when I compete in the local matches (every blue moon), so it's exactly what I need.

All my USPs have been 100% reliable, period. My USPs have also consistently been the most accurate "out of the box" pistols I've ever owned. The Walther P99 in .40 I owned was probably just as accurate as the USP40, but the .45 is amazing.

Now, all that mushy stuff aside...

I paid around $500-ish each for all my USPs... Bought the first .45 new in '94, and the other two were bought used. I would NOT pay $800 for a USP, period. 12 round mags for my .45 cost me $50 a piece and usually require a custom order, while Glock mags sit on the dealer's counter in HUGE piles and laugh at me with their $24.95 price tags.

I sold my original .45 (regret that) and the USP40. IF the Glock 21 felt half as good in my hand as the USP45, I'd probably sell or trade this last USP, but it doesn't (big brick with tiny, smushed together finger grooves)...

Bottom line, they're great pistols, but I won't purchase another one unless the price comes WAY down, and maybe not even then... I recently went to purchase a used USP40 Compact for $550, but walked out with a brand new Glock 23 for the same price instead :)

[Cueball]

Consistently the nicest guns I've owned...I currently have 4 from the USP line & my all time fave my P7M8. Recommend them highly. Yes, there is a premium to ownership, but it is well worth it! :cool:
I would have to agree. I have a USP full size in 40cal and it's the best gun I have ever owned. 100% reliability, quality workmanship and it takes any ammo you feed it without a problem. And I have no doubt that when I pull the trigger, it will definitely go boom. Granted they are not cheap, but they are quality. The big question is whether it fits your hand well or not.

[jlh26oo]

anyone wanna explain the difference between variant 1 and variant 9 USP's?


both are locked and cocked capable..

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Variant 1 DA/SA with control lever (safety/decocking lever) on left. Standard model.
Variant 2 DA/SA with control lever (safety/decocking lever) on right.
Variant 3 DA/SA with control lever (decocking lever) on left.
Variant 4 DA/SA with control lever (decocking lever) on right.
Variant 5 DAO with control lever (safety lever) on left.
Variant 6 DAO with control lever (safety lever) on right.
Variant 7 DAO with no control lever.
Variant 9 DA/SA with control lever (safety lever) on left.
Variant 10 DA/SA with control lever (safety lever) on right

[Medusa]

Sorry, only experience with HK has come from their rifles (shot the UMP, G3 and own the G36K), but so far so good, those are built like tanks. Badass technology they've got there :cuss:

[Boss Spearman]

I like the USP 9 so much I have two of them.

[MMcCall]

Everyone who's posted something along the lines of "USPs are way too expensive, so I went with a SIG 220" is either the world's worst shopper, or being intentionally biased. Mag prices are (unreasonably, IMO) higher for USPs, but the weapons themselves are in the identical price range, and considerably lower than a Kimber or something similar. Issues of ergonomics are valid and individual, but the quality of the HK line is indusputable.

My bedside gun is a USP Tactical + UTL, and I have a USPf45 I've modded as my winter carry gun. They've always been 100% with everything I've thrown at them.. they're the last pistols I'd ever give up.

[Dr.Rob]

USP = brick like ergodynamics, pricey, very very effective and well mage pistol. Polymer grip is stiffer than a Glock.

P7 = slimline, pricey wondernine that only holds nine. Wicked accurate. Mostly steel.

P9S = pricey wierd decocker BIG for a 9 or a .45 dead on accurate.

Are we seeing a trend here?

Very good guns but a tad expensive.

[BlkHawk73]

USP = brick like ergodynamics, pricey, very very effective and well mage pistol. Polymer grip is stiffer than a Glock.

P7 = slimline, pricey wondernine that only holds nine. Wicked accurate. Mostly steel.

P9S = pricey wierd decocker BIG for a 9 or a .45 dead on accurate.

Are we seeing a trend here?

Very good guns but a tad expensive.


Seems that accuracy is a common trnd with them as well. As for pricey...well, you get what you pay for. ;)

[litework]

I personally feel that HK USPs are great pistols and fairly priced. They offer a great compliment to my 1911’s which are heavier and carry less ammo; the 1911’s are certainly fun to shoot. It is the subtle things about the HK that I appreciate and for which I am willing to fork out my hard-earned Presidents. I prefer a useable slide release. I love the magazine release and shape of the grip. I can change magazines and get back on target faster with the USP than any other weapon I own. The fact that HK actually tapers the slide around the ejection port makes it and the Beretta 92FS the only two pistols I own that will not snag on my waistline if I have to carry Mexican. I like to carry my USP cocked and locked but like to place it on the nightstand hammer down, safety engaged. The polymer frame is lighter than steel and more durable than some of the alloys used on my other firearms. The fact that plastic costs less to manufacture is irrelevant if the cheaper material is more suitable for my uses.

My personal experience with HK’s customer service was exemplary. They responded to my email and answered all my questions within hours of having sent it. I feel they are superior to Glock in that they are readily available through the Internet. How long have the Glock 45 GAPs been out? Have they updated their website so that people who are (or “was” in my case) interested in their “new” offering might be able to find some useful information? Sorry, but to the 98% of the people who will never have to return a pistol for service, an informative website is the only customer service they’ll ever use and HK is a lot better than Glock in this respect.

My thoughts on the HK…they are often criticized because there are cheaper alternatives. My Glocks and XDs are less costly and adequate. I cannot shoot or carry the Glock or XD as comfortably as the USP but they’re definitely cheaper. I’m still more than willing to pay extra for the gun I like.

[boing]

Every DA USP trigger I've tried has sucked hard, and the P7 isn't as thin and flat as I was led to believe.

I'd still have one of each, though, if there weren't so many other priorities on my list.

[AMT]

I carry a H&K USP .45 compact. I shoot it all the time and have never had a FTF or FTE. For home defense I have a fullsize H&K 40 with a H&K light, at 7 yards the light and the bore is perfectly aligned. The bullet goes where ever the light shines.:)
I am a big person and the H&K's feel right at home in my palm, For me Glocks are too small and uncomfortable to shoot.
I also own an H&K 4, and a MARK 23.

My two cents worth.

[Onmilo]

You can buy a slighty used Glock 17 9mm for $399 in my neck of the woods.
You can buy a slightly used USP 9mm for $499 in my neck of the woods.

I just bought a grossly overpriced USP Elite .45acp for a little more than twice the higher priced gun above.

I like Glocks and I like USPs, one can't go wrong with either unless your personal preference is for something different.

[Devonai]

H&K pistols are the choice of space Marines everywhere!

VP70 (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090605/)

USP (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0419706/)

They're also the choice of discerning guns for hire.

USP (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0202677/)

USP (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120008/)

USP (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0369339/)

Not to mention improbable globe-trotting treasure hunters.

USP Match (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0146316/)

Or picky Navy SEALS who don't like the Sig P226.

Mk 23 (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0314353/)

Finally, you wouldn't want to steal $300 million without an expensive sidearm.

P7 (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0095016/)

[Jeff]

My USP .45 full size has been an absolutely flawless pistol in performance and fit & fitness. I tend to believe you get what you pay for.

[Rob96]

Alright, allow me to add a little kindling to the fire.
Personally I don't like the feel of the USP line. I do think they are overpriced when you see them new in the case. If you like them, look for a used one. It is a much better deal.
Now with each manufacturer of polymer framed guns, each has done some kind of torture, durability reliability testing. Same with the gun rags and different other entities. For me in a polymer framed gun in 45acp, the Ruger P97 fits the bill nicely. And with all of that $$$$ I saved, I can buy a lot of ammo.

[Medusa]

I also own an H&K 4, and a MARK 23.

The Mk23? Allright. All I have heard from it praises this to heaven. How's it like? :cool:

[Caseless]

I WILL trade any of my steel handguns for a P7M8 or P7 PSP,:evil: but no other polymer gun has surpassed my USP 40 in reliability and recoil control yet.

[hkuspnine]

I've had Glocks, Sigs, Springfield XDs, and the H&K USPs I own are both superior to any of them, IMO. Others that have fired mine have agreed and said it doesn't feel to them like they are shooting a polymer gun.
I used to think they were overpriced until I got one. I loved it so much I got another one. The Browning HP in my collection is the only one I will not part with to get another HK.

[Quickdraw Limpsalot]

At one point, I had both an HK and an XD. Both were good guns, but I didn't see a $300-400 difference between the two. Ironically, I paid more for my XD than I did the HK... and after using both extensively I'd say I paid about what they were each worth to me.

[Justang]

I have 10k rounds through my HK USP40 fullsize and it has never failed me. It's never had a jam, FTE, FTF, ect. Not so much as a hiccup from this gun. I would bet my life on this gun!

My dad has one of the first USP's made in '93 and it has just over 50k rnds through it. Never a jam or FTF or FTE. And after 50k something in the trigger mechanism did break, HK's awesome customer service took over and fixed the gun, no charge.

I love the ergonomics of this gun. I'm not a large frame guy, and my hands aren't the largest things either. This gun fits me perfect. Although the USP45 was too large for my hands.

Overpriced? I used Buds Gun Shop to search for price. And you have to compare apples to apples, so I'll compare the HK USP40 Compact and the Sig 229. The HK (http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_47/products_id/15379) cost $673.68, whereas the Sig (http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_28/products_id/29170) cost $651.43. For a grand difference of $22.25. Doesn't seem "grossly overpriced" to me. I don't think people actually compare price, they just repeat what they hear on the internet.

I'm in the process of buying a HK P2000SK to conceal. Glocks are too block like (can't believe you would say the HK was blocky. :uhh:), the XD is better than the Glock, but the HK is so much slimmer and has better ergonomics.

So lets review...

Overpriced = unfounded
Bad Ergonomics = subjective
Poor customer service = internet rumor and unfounded.
Accurate = very
Reliable = bet your life on it

[HKGuns]

It simply kills me everytime I read the USP's ergonimics are bad! What a subjective load of CRAPOLA.

This lunacy is coming from folks who've handled the pistol ONCE and don't like the magazine release location. Which, after practice, is the easiest of any pistol to operate. It certainly can't be the safety/decoker as its perfectly placed for thumb operation and it can't be the slide release as its well located and designed as well.

I guess you folks can continue to buy your Glock mag release extentions. I'll take my out of the box USP every day of the week.

[Justang]

The ambi mag release is one of the reasons I got the gun.