Tell me about the Saiga 308-1


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epijunkie67
October 12, 2005, 01:31 AM
I'm not at all familiar with the weapon but happened to run acrossed one in my local shop this afternoon. .308 of course and looked to be in good condition. Had a tag on it of $325. Serial number H04740XXX.

Good? Bad? Accuarte? Typical Ak reliability? Whats the story? Google was pretty much no help what so ever.

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Kjervin
October 12, 2005, 02:06 AM
Have you tried over at saiga12.com (http://www.saiga12.com) they have a forum (see the forum link on the left side) specifically for the rifle (as well as it's brothers in other calibers/gauges). I have one in 7.62x39 and put a .308 on layaway today. I love my 7.62 and look forward to the 308.

Good Luck!
Kj

SpookyPistolero
October 12, 2005, 08:58 AM
I've got the .308. I really enjoy shooting it. I scoped it once and even with a loose mount I got 1 MOA out of it. That was with the 16" barrel. The only thing that is irritating is that I have never been able to find extra mags for sale, and that God has decided that he hates the idea of hi-caps existing for this rifle. So what you see is what you get. Good overall though.

TexAg
October 12, 2005, 02:25 PM
Thats a good price for one. I have the 7.62x39 and its a great shooter, very accurate. I have not heard anything bad about the .308 version unless you count the low amount of mags available and no "high caps", but 8 rounds is plenty for most people and they will be importing them again soon.

Crosshair
October 13, 2005, 12:52 AM
There is supposed to be a new importer, they are just waiting for the ATF to clear the forms right now.

/Owns a Saiga 7.62x39
//Converting it to pistol grip.

beerslurpy
October 13, 2005, 01:14 AM
Russian American Arms had a great website up, but they took it down and stopped answering the phones because I assume they arnet ready yet and they got bombarded by interested FFLs and gun owners. They are the new importer FYI. I heard they will have 8 rd saiga12 mags, hopefully at a price that isnt gay.

Correia
October 20, 2005, 02:39 PM
Russian American Armory should be getting guns out in November. My company has signed up as a distributor and we are getting a pile of them next month.

TexAg
October 20, 2005, 02:42 PM
Correia,
Do you know how much the MSRP has changed? What will it be?

Correia
October 20, 2005, 03:15 PM
I've got my planned prices up at www.fbmginc.com in the guns section.

SpookyPistolero
October 20, 2005, 03:58 PM
Got any idea how much mags will run once they start importing them, Correia? It's the achilles heel for this rifle. If I had some of them and could get that PG conversion done, Id be a happy camper.

Correia
October 20, 2005, 03:59 PM
Let me check. I'll get back to you.

Drakejake
October 20, 2005, 08:06 PM
The Saiga .308 is an excellent rifle. Its only drawback is the lack of hi-cap mags. Available mags hold only eight rounds, are scarce, and expensive. But if you live with that, you have a fine .308 carbine. I took out my new FAL and my Saiga .308 yesterday. The Saiga was right on target at 50 yards even though I had pulled the scope and put it back. The FAL jammed miserably.

Drakejake

Crosshair
October 20, 2005, 09:02 PM
How well do they hold zero with a scope?

GunGoBoom
October 20, 2005, 09:18 PM
Russian American Armory should be getting guns out in November. My company has signed up as a distributor and we are getting a pile of them next month.

Wow, straight from the horse's mouth, guys.

I was really skeptical until you said that Corr - after all, why would you take down a website promoting your product unless you were closing down? I had read an ominous thing into that fact - that their red tape must not have cleared a hurdle like sporting purposes or something - you sure about that? I can see why you wouldn't publish a phone # if you're getting deluged by calls and can't get work done - but why take down a website if not throwing in the towel? Just remove phone, fax, and email from said website, leaving snail mail addy only.

Crosshair
October 20, 2005, 11:57 PM
Actualy from what I understand (AKA: rumor) GunGoBoom, their website was just an unlisted beta version that they had up for testing so they would be ready when they got the guns imported. Someone over at forum.saiga-12.com found it and posted it on the board. It soon spread and they started getting calls. Since everything was not finalised, they took the site down until they are ready to begin selling. Though they at least know there is a large interest in these rifles.

Correia
October 21, 2005, 12:31 AM
Well, I'm pretty sure. But I don't have any guns yet. :)

I'll be sure to keep you guys up to date.

Euclidean
October 21, 2005, 01:46 AM
I'm so happy... I just emailed my local FFL. I want me a Saiga or two.

antarti
October 21, 2005, 11:37 AM
Any idea of the availability of their 30-06 AK-pattern?

I sure would like to see if I could get surplus BAR mags to fit. Would tickle me to no end.

GunGoBoom
October 21, 2005, 11:59 AM
K, thanks for the info. Yeah, I know that they know there is a high demand. I just thought that maybe there was a red-tape problem related to 922 and/or sporting purposes test, etc, that was nixin the whole deal. Can't *wait* to get my Saiga-12.

As to the original question, My Saiga .308 shoots great, although the trigger pull is pretty bad. I have a "BP-02" mount from Tantal on it, with a Bushnell Elite 3200 2-7x32, and it's a hoot. This is the 21.8" bbl one with wood furniture. If 20-rounders for the Saiga .308 are ever forthcoming, then I'm going to add the 16" bbl one to the collection as well.

Antarti, when EAA was importing saiga's, their website showed that one of the Saiga models was in theory available in (1) .308 win, (2) .270 win, (3) .30-'06, and (4) .243 win. So apparently they were being made. But to my knowledge, none of them other than the .308 were ever actually imported. Having one in .30-06 would be awesome wouldn't it?

Beren
October 21, 2005, 12:16 PM
SAIGA GROUP BUY!

Including 8 round Saiga-12 mags please!

Oh please oh please oh please. :D

SpookyPistolero
October 21, 2005, 12:25 PM
And some 8rnd .308 mags for crying out loud! But we have to wait a while so I have money when the buy goes down. I'm always poorest when there is a good deal happening.

antarti
October 21, 2005, 05:59 PM
GunGoBoom,

I was waiting for EAA to bring the 30-06 AK pattern in, they never did AFAIK. However, it WAS on the RAA website, so I am still hoping for the best, AND that BAR mags can be made to fit.

I wish there were a hicap option for the .308 (the 16"bbl one), that would be my 2nd choice right behind a hicap 30-06. If I'm going to be limited to 8rds, then a CMP garand is in the cards instead.

Correia: If either a hicap Saiga 308 or 30-06 happens, I am 100% "in", just PM me and let me know.

MY AK
December 1, 2006, 01:25 AM
I noticed you wrote "I took out my new FAL and my Saiga .308 yesterday" and was interested which gun you prefer? I am in the market for a .308 and am undecided over the FAL or the Saiga. I am not much of a hunter, just a weekend plinker. Which do you prefer?

rockstar.esq
December 1, 2006, 02:23 AM
Two things that'd make a Saiga in .308 a slam dunk.

1) Bolt hold open

2) FAL mag compatibility

Failing #2 at least a significant stock of high caps plus some 5 round hunters.

Correia
December 1, 2006, 10:50 AM
Rockstar, since this old post we've had a few developments in the Saiga world. FBMG has designed, built, and is now shipping 20 round magazines for the Saiga .308.

My thumbs hurt from putting together another 100 last night. :)

rbernie
December 1, 2006, 11:43 AM
Does the 308 *not* have the Saiga BHO? More importantly, does the Tromix conversion have it?

quatin
December 1, 2006, 12:27 PM
What substantiation is there on accuracy differences between a 16'' barrel and a 22'' barrel?

Drakejake
December 1, 2006, 12:39 PM
MY AK,

Buying a Saiga 7.62 by 39 and a Saiga .308 (7.62 by 51) got my feet wet in the world of rifles. Previously I had only bought and shot handguns. The "by 39" had a really poor trigger and I sold it. The .308 has a really good trigger, although there have been complaints about the way the trigger fulls back and up rather than straight back. My .308 Saiga is a carbine (16 inch barrel) and therefore shorter and lighter than the FAL. My Saiga has been totally reliable and is a handy rifle. I like it even better now that it has a factory thumbhole stock. It takes a handy side-mount for a scope but I have had to shim the thing in order to get to zero. Many people know that the only mag available for this rifle is 8 rounds. Although a private company is producing 20 rounders, these will cost $40-$50, much more than $10 or less for FAL mags. My FALs can also shoot from 30 round Bren mags, about $30 each from DSA. The Saiga is a new, modern rifle, not a Frankenrifle assembled from parts by Century and other American companies. I paid only $250 for my Saiga from CDNN and at that price it was one of the best values in rifles. If you can get a Saiga .308 for $300-$350, I think it is still an excellent value. Once you add the cost of a number of mags, it will not be much cheaper than a Century FAL. The FAL comes with a pistol grip; you have to "Americanize" the Saiga to install a pistol grip without violating federal law. You decide. I like both rifles.

Drakejake

1911JMB
December 1, 2006, 12:54 PM
That 30/06 one and the BAR mags got me thinking I'd buy one if they ever import them. But anyway, my theory is that it makes more sense to get a FAL, G3 or M1A because of magazines. There is a real good chance of a new and even worse AWB which will never expire, so now is the time to stock up on mags. Its a lot easier to do when mags are cheap. I got a boatload of mags for 5 bucks a piece from DSA.

I think its fantastic that Correia is supplying the 20 rounders, but as far as I'm concerned the Saiga .308 doesn't make a lot of sense unless you really like the gun.

Correia
December 1, 2006, 01:34 PM
rbernie, it has a BHO, but it is a push button to hold the bolt back manually. It is not an automatic bolt hold open.

quentin, there is no difference in accuracy. Just velocity.

Yes, the magazines are $45, but we put a ton of money into getting them designed and manufactured. (try buying a new magazine for your AR10 and let me know how that goes for you) :p

This was my philosophy, and the reason that I personally put up a whole mess of money on this project. The Saiga .308 is an awesome rifle. Honestly I think that the bang for the buck is the best of any semi .308 ever. Price wise is smokes everything else. The only thing that was holding it back was the 8 round magazines.

The days of cheap parts FALs are over. And even then, the cheapest available ones were of very hit or miss quality. (I have an excellent Century L1A1, so you never know. I've seen others that were total garbage). Most of the kits are gone.

DSA FALs start in the $1200 range. Springfield M1as about the same. Armalites even higher. DPMS slightly less. The Cetme is a hit or miss gun that will have the same parts issues as the cheap FALs. The PTR is a nice gun starting at between double and triple what the Saiga is.

You can have the base Saiga, new for $350. You can get a top of the line, all the bells and whistles Tromix for $700 on up. You can do a conversion to AK configuration yourself for $100 and twenty minutes of time if you have a little bit of knowledge and skill.

For $1200 I can get a Saiga and 19 magazines or a Tromix and 10 magazines. Or I can get a basic DSA, and then buy cheap magazines after.

About once a month there is a question about which battle rifle should I get, and it was always the same choices. I wanted a whole new choice. I'm not knocking the other rifles, I own some of each. But I think the Saiga is a great gun.

But I'm biased. I've got 2,200 magazine bodies sitting in the center of my gunstore right now. :D

Highland Ranger
December 8, 2006, 10:48 PM
Just bought one today! Kind of on impulse, glad to hear they are well regarded.

Unfortunately can't buy the 20 round mag in NJ. 15 or less or you'd have an order.

Does anyone know where to get a few 8 rounders?

Also heard there are two tabs at the bottom of the 8 rounder you can break off and make it a 10 rounder.

Correia
December 9, 2006, 03:02 PM
I sell 8 rounders off of the webpage in my sig line.

Highland Ranger
December 9, 2006, 04:17 PM
Thanks.

wally
December 9, 2006, 05:15 PM
The eight rounders aren't too hard to convert to 10 rounds, but the price of the 8-rounders on FBMG web site made me forget about them and order some of the 20-rounders instead.

Correia, I note my credit card was charged, I assume this means mine will be shipped within 30 days.

--wally.

Highland Ranger
December 9, 2006, 05:33 PM
unless all u can have is 15 . . . .

wally
December 9, 2006, 05:38 PM
Right, I got that, its why I mentioned the bit about being pretty easy to modify them to take 10-rounds, or would this be illeagal in NJ?

--wally.

Highland Ranger
December 9, 2006, 05:43 PM
No that's ok as long as it's not more than 15.

Guy in the gun store mentioned something about breaking off some tabs inside the mag but from what I saw on the Saiga forum, seems to be a bit more complicated than that . . . .

280PLUS
December 9, 2006, 11:48 PM
I love mine, Trigger is a bit long of a long pull but breaks clean when it does. I'd rather have it in 7.62x39 but they won't let us have it in that caliber in CT. It recoils pretty stoutly in .308. If I was to complain it would be about the price of factory .308 and apparent lack of decent milsurp. If anybody knows of any around let me know!

Corr, money is tight right now but I will be ordering a couple 20 rounders in the relatively near future, good to know you have a "few" hanging around. :D

Kymasabe
December 10, 2006, 04:25 PM
went to the local gunshow today, they had piles of Saiga 308-1's for sale around $350 AND even had the wooden stocked ones, with or without scope and mount.

wally
December 11, 2006, 11:02 AM
mentioned something about breaking off some tabs inside the mag but from what I saw on the Saiga forum, seems to be a bit more complicated than that . . . .

Not really, but you have to cut off the tabs instead of breaking as there is a little bit on the bottom that has to remain.

I just loaded 10 without the spring and baseplate with the mag body in the gun sitting "upside down" (so the rounds don't fall out) then pushed in the follower and marked where to cut. Then a little touch up with a file of where I'd cut so the assembled and loaded mag would insert and lock in with the bolt forward.

--wally.

boomer49
September 25, 2007, 09:06 AM
I see the last post to this blog was in 12/06. After reading the entries I interested in the Saiga 308. Corriea, are you still selling the higher capacity mags?

elmerfudd
September 25, 2007, 06:04 PM
I love mine. Some of the accuracy figures I've seen thrown around I think are wildly optimistic like the guy that said he got 1 MOA with a loose mount, but I can get an honest and consistent 3 MOA out of mine. By that I mean that with ammo it likes I can fire as many shots as I like and put them all into a three inch circle at 100 yards. Most of the shots probably go into a 1.5-2 MOA circle and I do get the occasional MOA group out of it, but I can't rely on it to do that. So you get an idea of it's limitations. Converted, with a 16" barrel, flash suppressor and folding stock it measures 28" folded and has rock solid reliability. I don't find the recoil to be bad at all.

I don't think there are new 20 rounders available just yet, but FBMG is supposed to have a new batch ready to go very soon. At $45 each they're somewhat pricey though.

MD_Willington
September 25, 2007, 08:14 PM
He's waiting on parts from Russia...

Samuraigg
September 25, 2007, 10:02 PM
So using those high caps doesn't run you afoul of 922r?

edit: assuming these guns are unconverted...

MD_Willington
September 25, 2007, 11:30 PM
For me, I wouldn't run a higher than stock capacity mag without playing the 922r points game... that's just me...

Samuraigg
September 25, 2007, 11:34 PM
For me, I wouldn't run a higher than stock capacity mag without playing the 922r points game... that's just me...

Same here, which is why I get nervous whenever I see a thread here talking about using high cap magazines with Saigas without mentioning either 922r or converting the rifle.

Really don't want to see a THR member get thrown in jail because of this ridiculous law.

JWarren
September 26, 2007, 01:26 AM
Before I used a high-cap in my Saiga 308, I did the 922 game in converting it. Sure, it's a grey area-- but I have NO intentions of being the test case.


-- John

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