China needs more gun control!


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Michael Zeleny
October 13, 2005, 03:37 PM
Chinese children hurt in shooting

A man armed with homemade guns has shot and wounded 16 children at a primary school in the eastern Chinese province of Anhui, according to state media.

Seven of the children were in a serious condition in hospital, Xinhua said.

Police are hunting for the man responsible, who escaped after the shooting at the Niutoushan Primary School in Guangde County, Anhui.

China's government has tightened security at schools after a number of such attacks in recent years.

STRING OF ATTACKS

November 04 - man knifes to death eight children in high school in Ruzhou
September 04 - man knifes 28 children in day care centre in Suzhou
September 04 - man knifes 24 children at school in Shandong
August 04 - 15 children and 3 teachers knifed in Beijing kindergarten, by man with history of mental illness. One child died


The latest attack happened at 0815 local time (0015 GMT) at the Niutoushan Primary School in Liudong Town as the schoolchildren were doing their morning exercises, Xinhua reported.

It said a cable television company employee who was working nearby, Chen Yongfeng, ran to the school after hearing the shots and tried to pick up the man's guns, but the assailant hit Mr Chen on the head with one of the weapons and escaped.

According to the local Xinan Evening News, doctors removed six bullets from one student and two from another.

It is the latest in a series of attacks on schools in China in the last few years. They include the knifing to death of eight children in a high school in Henan province last year, and two separate attacks on kindergartens in Beijing which left two children and a teacher dead.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/asia-pacific/4337056.stm

Published: 2005/10/13 06:18:27 GMT

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Henry Bowman
October 13, 2005, 03:40 PM
Looks like they need knife control -- or else that the knife control laws are now working.

cuchulainn
October 13, 2005, 03:41 PM
I'm shocked. Shocked, I tells ya.

rick_reno
October 13, 2005, 06:35 PM
Global warming, it's making people crazy. :rolleyes:

Beetle Bailey
October 14, 2005, 01:20 AM
I voted for "No. Arm everyone. . . "

If you disarm the government, I guess there would be parity between the government and the people, but obviously the criminals would still have guns.

MSG in my dimsum? No thanks. HK MSG-90 with my chow mein? Yes, thanks :D !

beerslurpy
October 14, 2005, 01:53 AM
He made a homemade gun that shot 16 bullets? Holy crap, it's Chinese Macguyver.

I vote that we arm all chinese people everywhere and tell them there is only enough rice to feed half of them lol messy.

By the way, why is there Metal Gear Solid in my dim sum?

KriegHund
October 14, 2005, 01:59 AM
By the way, why is there Metal Gear Solid in my dim sum?

im a little confused on that too....

Anywho, arm the teachers, says i.

Beetle Bailey
October 14, 2005, 02:26 AM
I vote that we arm all chinese people everywhere and tell them there is only enough rice to feed half of them lol messy.


In that case, you can send all your guns to my FFL. I will take care of distributing them to the local Chinese American population. You can lie about the rice, but just be aware: we eat noodles, too! :neener:

silverlance
October 14, 2005, 03:36 AM
he's also a bona fide chemist.. sixteen bullets... considering that cartridges have also always been banned, how the heck did he manage to get sixteen rounds downrange?

and if that was a blackpowder gun, damn, he must be davy crockett as well.

if the crime wasnt so horrendous, i'd be proud of also being chinky.

gunsmith
October 14, 2005, 05:53 AM
If Bush hadn't stolen the election then there wouldn't be a crisis in NOLA!

oh wait... wrong forum!:neener:

Soap
October 14, 2005, 08:28 AM
They need less gun control, but I didn't vote to arm them...let them arm themselves as they so choose. So I didn't vote.

El Tejon
October 14, 2005, 08:48 AM
If only China had a seven day waiting period before one could pick up his homemade firearm, this would not have happened. At least that's what the Brady Bunch told me.:neener:

boofus
October 14, 2005, 09:59 AM
The homemade firearm was obviously sprayed from the hip and indiscriminately injured school children. Homes should be banned so no firearms can be homemade.

meef
October 14, 2005, 10:07 AM
He made a homemade gun that shot 16 bullets? Holy crap, it's Chinese Macguyver.

No no no no no....... :eek: !!

That dude would never touch a firearm! He was much too demonstrably, pointedly anti-gun on that program (and in real life) to ever stoop to such a repulsive thing.

elric
October 14, 2005, 10:56 AM
No no no no no....... :eek: !!

That dude would never touch a firearm! He was much too demonstrably, pointedly anti-gun on that program (and in real life) to ever stoop to such a repulsive thing.

But then why did he go do Stargate SG1, where he uses MP5s and P90s to solve his alien problems in every other episode? :)

odysseus
October 14, 2005, 01:04 PM
only is he a chinky mcgyver

Nice Silverlance...:fire:

Maybe you have been in a cave for a while, but the word "chink" is a term used by racists against Chinese and Asian Americans. Being one who has ancestory from China, I find your use of it offensive; and not High Road.

gunsmith
October 14, 2005, 03:24 PM
As some one who's ancestors hail from Ireland and Norway I find that term
offensive as well.

moderators???

Declaration Day
October 14, 2005, 03:31 PM
By the way, why is there Metal Gear Solid in my dim sum?

I figured it out. If you look at the poll, MSG is mistakenly spelled "MGS", which is a commonly used acronym for Metal Gear Solid.

Oleg Volk
October 14, 2005, 04:18 PM
As racial terms go...many people seem to use them self-referencially. Should I forbid these people to offend themselves, especially since they think the terms are more humorous than offensive?

odysseus
October 14, 2005, 05:12 PM
Oleg,

I do not know what racial background a poster is or is not, nor do I think a lot of people here who may read this do either. So when a post is placed using a term like that; I think it is safe to say it could offend someone - it certainly did me. I assume innocence here, and that's fine - but I certainly am going to say something about it; not just be silent.

Let's move the tables around there and say the post was about Africa and someone said "N----r Mcyver". Say it was about Israel instead, would "K--e Mcygver" be a good thing to write?" Would that be tolerated here? Is that HighRoad even if they were African American or of a Jewish heritage? Doesn't really nullify the reaction one exposes themselves to when they write it. I am not a PC kind of guy, but I do have certain lines I draw - and certain items I think in a public forum setting that I should respond to.

Michael Zeleny
October 14, 2005, 05:18 PM
As racial terms go...many people seem to use them self-referencially. Should I forbid these people to offend themselves, especially since they think the terms are more humorous than offensive?Can I make it kosher by identifying myself as a rootless cosmopolitan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rootless_cosmopolitan), potato-chugging, vodka-pissing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_slurs), chinky-chasing (http://www.livejournal.com/tools/memories.bml?keyword=wacky+punani&user=larvatus&sortby=user) yid (http://www.livejournal.com/tools/memories.bml?keyword=jews&user=larvatus&sortby=user)?

Michael Zeleny
October 14, 2005, 05:39 PM
I do not know what racial background a poster is or is not, nor do I think a lot of people here who may read this do either. So when a post is placed using a term like that; I think it is safe to say it could offend someone - it certainly did me. I assume innocence here, and that's fine - but I certainly am going to say something about it; not just be silent.The poster in question clearly stated:
if the crime wasnt so horrendous, i'd be proud of also being chinky.What exactly is your problem with a man making light of his own ethnicity?Let's move the tables around there and say the post was about Africa and someone said "N----r Mcyver". Say it was about Israel instead, would "K--e Mcygver" be a good thing to write?" Would that be tolerated here? Is that HighRoad even if they were African American or of a Jewish heritage? Doesn't really nullify the reaction one exposes themselves to when they write it. I am not a PC kind of guy, but I do have certain lines I draw - and certain items I think in a public forum setting that I should respond to.Back in the old country, I was eager to bust my knuckles at the sound of Russian counterparts to "******" (чёрножопый) and "kike" (жид). Now I just shrug it off. Which response do you take to be more conducive to tolerance?

odysseus
October 14, 2005, 06:03 PM
Back in the old country, I was eager to bust my knuckles at the sound of Russian counterparts to "******" (чёрножопый) and "kike" (жид). Now I just shrug it off. Which response do you take to be more conducive to tolerance?

I don't understand your point. Was my response to him a busting of knuckles so you seem to speak? No. Somehow you think silence=tolerance? I disagree. Must be my Socratic education. Nor do I normally operate on either of those extremes. I am not freaking out here, I was making a stern response to the use of this word. Russian or not, it doesn't make a difference.

I don't have a problem if HE wants to make fun of his own ethnicity. I have a problem with the derogatory word he used, and in a stern but clear message let him know. Simple. Get it? So what's your problem with that?

Michael Zeleny
October 14, 2005, 06:30 PM
I don't understand your point. Was my response to him a busting of knuckles so you seem to speak? No. Somehow you think silence=tolerance? I disagree. Must be my Socratic education. Nor do I normally operate on either of those extremes. I am not freaking out here, I was making a stern response to the use of this word. Russian or not, it doesn't make a difference.

I don't have a problem if HE wants to make fun of his own ethnicity. I have a problem with the derogatory word he used, and in a stern but clear message let him know. Simple. Get it? So what's your problem with that?I have much more respect for censorship roughly delivered within an arm's reach, than sternly dispensed through the digital constabulary detail of your choosing, all the more so when the latter is accompanied by disingenuous disclaimers of being "a PC kind of guy". As for your "Socratic education", I suggest dispatching a search party on a quest for eironeia (http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/cgi-local/DHI/dhi.cgi?id=dv2-70).

odysseus
October 14, 2005, 06:35 PM
have much more respect for censorship roughly delivered within an arm's reach, than sternly dispensed through the digital constabulary detail of your choosing
Hey - did you know this is an Internet forum? Just making sure you were aware of this. We are all typing on keyboards here.

all the more so when the latter is accompanied by disingenuous disclaimers of being "a PC kind of guy". As for your "Socratic education", I suggest dispatching a search party on a quest for eironeia.


So using "chink" to describe Chinese is alright in your book, and I am being disingenuous. Oh no - according to you, you can't have an opinion on that and you should just be silent. There's your "eironeia" right back to you. Sheez...

Who's censoring anything wiseguy?

ohh.. OK... You win big guy. :rolleyes:

Kjervin
October 14, 2005, 09:11 PM
Thread drift; move it along. nothing to see here.

KJ

PCGS65
October 14, 2005, 09:24 PM
They need to ban the material he used to make the gun.:banghead:

meef
October 14, 2005, 11:25 PM
Originally Posted by meef
No no no no no....... :eek: !!

That dude would never touch a firearm! He was much too demonstrably, pointedly anti-gun on that program (and in real life) to ever stoop to such a repulsive thing.

But then why did he go do Stargate SG1, where he uses MP5s and P90s to solve his alien problems in every other episode? :)

Okay, so he got off the MacGyver guns-are-evil bit for the sake of good old $$$. Yeah, MacGyver could defeat anybody, especially the nasty gun-toting villains with usually nothing more lethal than a bit of bailing wire, duct tape, paper clips, clothes pins, match books, or whatever other BS items the producers felt signified the triumph of brains over the nasty firearm-wielding neanderthals.

Still doesn't change the fact that Richard Dean Anderfeces will show up at the top of the list on whatever anti-gun Hollywood celebrity list you care to peruse.

Can't help it - people like that just Pi** me off! :fire:

Ahhhh.... I feel so much better now.... :)

joab
October 14, 2005, 11:43 PM
Personally I have no effect on or real concern for the events of another country.
Never felt that way until I wondered onto a board full of Australians who talked about nothing but how America is and should be run.
And made fools of themselves by getting most of the is wrong.

But the MSG issue is of concern to me.


As to the drift
Tolerance of intolerance encourages more intolerance

Racism and bigotry should be rejected in any form

Michael Zeleny
October 15, 2005, 03:25 PM
Hey - did you know this is an Internet forum? Just making sure you were aware of this. We are all typing on keyboards here.But only a select few amongst us use them as launching pads for stern rebuke to others.So using "chink" to describe Chinese is alright in your book, and I am being disingenuous. Oh no - according to you, you can't have an opinion on that and you should just be silent. There's your "eironeia" right back to you. Sheez...You might want to recall the way Socrates addresses Callicles (http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/callicles-thrasymachus/): ἐγὼ μὲν οὐκ ἔχω παρὰ ταῦτα ἄλλα φάναι, ὦ φίλε Καλλίκλεις: σὺ δ' εἰ ἔχεις, δίδασκε. (http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext?lookup=Plat.+Gorg.+507a)Who's censoring anything wiseguy?

ohh.. OK... You win big guy. :rolleyes:Somehow, ὦ φίλε seems more Socratic.

Michael Zeleny
October 15, 2005, 04:07 PM
Tolerance of intolerance encourages more intoleranceA slogan straight out of Newspeak (http://www.newspeakdictionary.com/ns-prin.html):Niggardly: A PC Nightmare

Wall Street Journal, January 29, 1999

What a Niggling Offense! Oops, We Mean . . .

By Richard Dooling, a lawyer and the author of "Blue Streak: Swearing, Free Speech, and Sexual Harassment" (Random House, 1996) and "Brain Storm" (Random House, 1998).

Back in the 1950s and 1960s, when the worst thing you could say began with F, Lenny Bruce was often arrested and charged with obscenity by prosecutors who usually couldn't utter the word themselves in open court. Instead, government lawyers used inventive euphemisms to make their case, like the prosecutor in Chicago, in 1963, who argued in court: "I don't think I have to tell you the term, I think that you recall it as a word that started with F and ended with a K and sounded like truck."

All of which prompted one observer to opine that the word duck is 75% obscene.

Liberals who once reveled in Lenny Bruce and in George Carlin's "Seven Dirty Words" routine now have their own lists of unspeakables, and the F-word is so popular it's downright proper. But the left is even more zealous than the right when it comes to censorship and punishment, particularly for any white person who dares to use the N-word.

The N-word is tabooed so thick, even words that sound like it apparently are too much for our modern sensibilities. In the 1950s, public officials weren't forced to resign for saying "puck" or "fire truck," but witness recent events in Washington, D.C. The nation's capital is in the throes of a compulsory vocabulary lesson, which is turning out to have considerably more sting than any spelling bee. The word in question? Niggardly.

On Jan. 15, after a meeting with Washington's new mayor, Anthony A. Williams, David Howard, head of the District's Office of Public Advocate, reported to two other aides that money would be tight at the constituent services office. "I will have to be niggardly with this fund," he said, "because it's not going to be a lot of money."

When Mr. Howard saw the looks on the faces of the two men to whom he was speaking at the time, he immediately apologized for using a word he had learned as a high school student studying for his SAT. But it was too late. One of the aides, Marshal Brown, a veteran government worker who is black, stormed out of Mr. Howard's office before Mr. Howard could explain himself. The complaints came rolling in, Mr. Howard offered his resignation, and Mayor Williams accepted it.

The word niggardly is etymologically unrelated to ******, which derives from Latin, Spanish and Portuguese words for "black." Niggardly comes to us from Middle English and perhaps Scandinavia, and means "miserly" or "stingy." Niggardly has no associations with race or color. A search of the Web sites of every major newspaper in the country turned up many recent articles using niggardly, even at the obsessively PC Los Angeles Times.

Not that any of that matters. What matters is that Washington is two-thirds black, and its new mayor (like the fictional Atlanta mayor in Tom Wolfe's new novel, "A Man in Full") is under attack for "not being black enough." If we were to go by the book, perhaps the new mayor needs to be denigrated (meaning "blackened"), but then well-meaning folks often admonish us not to denigrate black people.

Mayor Williams came under fire for accepting Mr. Howard's resignation--not by angry linguists, but by gay activists. For Mr. Howard is openly homosexual. Mr. Williams, however, defended his decision, saying that to use a word like niggardly in the District of Columbia's current political climate is like getting "caught smoking in a refinery that resulted in an explosion."

These language imbroglios are so ridiculous they would be the stuff of a "Simpsons" episode or a "Saturday Night Live" skit. But they have consequences in the politicization of reference works. Word scholars may want to hold on to those old dictionaries and thesauri, because newer editions will surely be bowdlerized to accommodate our new hair-trigger capacities for taking offense.

The same factions who submitted petitions to Merriam-Webster last year demanding that it remove the N-word and other epithets from its dictionaries will now presumably add niggardly, and perhaps niggling, to their list, simply because they don't like the sound of these words. The gay activists who called on Merriam-Webster to remove offensive synonyms for homosexual from its thesauri have met with apparent success, so it probably won't be long before Merriam-Webster agrees to clean up entries that offend other groups as well.

Expressions ranging from a nip in the air to a chink in the armor will be removed because they might be uttered in the wrong context. What about whopper or spick-and-span or a finger in the dike?

Or what if you were standing in a deli next to a redheaded Jewish man, and you happen to mention that you don't like orange juice?

The unspoken theory is that if we eliminate bad words it will eventually be impossible for a person to speak or think ill of someone else. The modern view of human beings is that people are neither good nor bad, they're equal. These social goals are already embodied in the evolution of thesauri.

In Roget's fourth edition (1977), the synonyms for bad person outnumber the synonyms for good person by almost three to one. Synonyms for vice outnumber synonyms for virtue more than two to one. When we get to the fifth edition (1992), good person and bad person don't even appear in the index, presumably because such classifications are too judgmental. What if the bad person we want to call a bald-faced liar was committing perjury only to protect his family?

Speaking of President Clinton, his attack on Iraq last month led to an incident that proves words speak much louder than anything so trivial as actions. During Operation Desert Fox, Pentagon officials saw an Associated Press photo that showed a 2,000-pound laser-guided bomb on the aircraft carrier USS Enterprise in the Persian Gulf. The bomb bore the inscription: "Here's a Ramadan present from Chad Rickenberg."

The Clinton administration promptly issued a statement on the importance of politically correct bombings and equal-opportunity mass destruction: "Department of Defense officials were distressed to learn of thoughtless graffiti mentioning the holy month of Ramadan written on a piece of U.S. ordnance during Operation Desert Fox in Iraq," said chief Pentagon spokesman Kenneth Bacon. "Religious intolerance is an anathema to Secretary of Defense William S. Cohen and to all Americans who cherish the right to worship freely. The United States deeply respects Islam."

As the Savannah (Ga.) Morning News editorialized: "Imagine the nerve of some sailor insulting Moslems right before they're bombed, maimed and killed." Ah well, it's easier to implement a bombing speech code than to remove a dictator. And anyway, it's not as if Saddam is a bad person.Racism and bigotry should be rejected in any formMust your lips move, or your fingers twitch, as you reject racism and bigotry?

joab
October 15, 2005, 05:49 PM
I have always felt that racism and bigotry were born of ignorance, thanks for proving my point.

Art Eatman
October 15, 2005, 05:59 PM
China may or may not need more gun-control, but some folks here probably need more self-control...

Night-night...

:), Art

Michael Zeleny
October 15, 2005, 05:59 PM
I have always felt that racism and bigotry were born of ignorance, thanks for proving my point.Aim to please. Shoot to kill. Is there anything else I can do to make you feel better about yourself?

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