Only in NJ!!!!


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MAUSER88
October 14, 2005, 12:39 PM
I emailed Evan Nappen's office with regard as to whether it's legal to carrying loaded magazines in a range bag in my trunk to my local range.Mags. would NOT be in the firearm. Below is the response I received. In case your not familiar with Mr Nappen, he is one of NJ's leading firearms attorney.

From: "Richard V. Gilbert, Esquire" <xxxx@verizon.net> [Add to Address Book] [View Source]
To: <xxxxxx@comcast.net>
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 21:06:45 +0000


Dear xxx

My name is Richard Gilbert, Esq. I am Evan's partner.

Do NOT carry a loaded magazine when you transport firearms. Police and prosecutors will consider it "part of the gun" and it makes a firearm more quickly usable. The gun would be considered loaded, and it would place you outside the exemptions for proper transportation of the firearm.

Therefore, you would likely be charged with Unlawful Possession of a Weapon, which is a third degree crime (punishable by up to five years in State prison).

It is simply not worth the risk.

Good shooting!

Rich Gilbert

My God, pretty soon breathing in NJ will come with some consequences!!!

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RavenVT100
October 14, 2005, 01:00 PM
As an aside, Mr. Gilbert has also stated to me that if you are pulled over and have firearms in your car in NJ, expect to be arrested and the guns taken regardless. You'll be arrested on an "assault weapons" charge, after which the DA's office will determine if your firearms are indeed "assault weapons" and you sit in jail. Meanwhile, your property may or may not be seen again--but don't hold your breath.

I hate to say it, and I don't consider myself a partisan. But this is what happens when the Democratic party gets what it wants. I hate the PATRIOT act too, but as a citizen of New Jersey who happens to own firearms, you have a far higher risk of having your life destroyed by this than through other means.

Coming soon to a state near you, of course.

Phoenix_III
October 14, 2005, 01:07 PM
Arrested for having firearms properly stored in your vehicle, that you inform the officer about, in a closed container, seperated from ammo (as per the law), expect to be arrested and sit in jail?

That's a little over the top. Yes I am an NJ res... You then have a lawsuit for unlawful detainment. Their excuse of 'we have to check to see if they are registered (by law it is not required so that's fallacious)', or 'we have to check to make sure they are not assault weapons' (also fallacious, cannot take your car away from you and check the VIN/everything else over the course of a few days... if they cannot determine it on the spot (meaning they are too ignorant, not 'filed off serial #'), then legally they are not entitled to with-holding your property. Some one with some spare time and $ needs to take on the state with their draconian BS stuff... [because even if [b]I[\b] think it's over the top, it could still happen...

My apologies for not being elloquent, very tired this morning.

geekWithA.45
October 14, 2005, 01:12 PM
Unloaded mags seem to be the prevailing practice in NJ, despite the fact that there is nothing in the statutes that refers to it.

It's simply a symptom of NJ's institutionalized distrust of arms, and those who keep and bear them.

RavenVT100
October 14, 2005, 01:16 PM
Arrested for having firearms properly stored in your vehicle, that you inform the officer about, in a closed container, seperated from ammo (as per the law), expect to be arrested and sit in jail?

That's correct. Bonus points for if it any way resembles a firearm that's on the "assault firearm" list, although that's by no means a requirement to the best of my knowledge.

That's a little over the top. Yes I am an NJ res... You then have a lawsuit for unlawful detainment. Their excuse of 'we have to check to see if they are registered (by law it is not required so that's fallacious)', or 'we have to check to make sure they are not assault weapons' (also fallacious, cannot take your car away from you and check the VIN/everything else over the course of a few days... if they cannot determine it on the spot (meaning they are too ignorant, not 'filed off serial #'), then legally they are not entitled to with-holding your property. Some one with some spare time and $ needs to take on the state with their draconian BS stuff... [because even if [b]I[\b] think it's over the top, it could still happen...

Given the mood of the courts, and given that we have an established precedent stating, and I quote "When dealing with guns, the citizen acts at his peril," I disagree. Should you happen to own guns, the fact that you do will be maliciously held against you should you ever enter court. People who do politically incorrect things or think politically incorrect thoughts are not entitled to the same measure of justice that an ordinary person would enjoy, after all.

If you're still not convinced, perhaps you should read this. (http://smallestminority.blogspot.com/2003/11/new-jersey-considers-this-to-be.html)

beaucoup ammo
October 14, 2005, 02:02 PM
I read "That" and still can't believe it! Damn! It would seem NJ is in dire need of a realistic weapons law.

Stone Harbor is mighty nice..but I'll suffer the hot weather here in Texas.. in October even.. for the rational flex we have in the laws governing fire arms.

Take Care

WT
October 14, 2005, 02:08 PM
In the New Jersey v. Pelleteri. case cited, it would be interesting to know why the police searched his gun vault. Why were they searching his house?

How could "an expert marksman who at one point was employed as a firearms instructor" not know?

Something is left out of the story .........

RavenVT100
October 14, 2005, 02:30 PM
WT: Yeah, something always is. And you never see the whole story on these things.

I don't think you're questioning, however, the utter absurdity of regarding a .22 tube-fed plinker like the Marlin 60 as an "assault firearm" or labeling it as a "dangerous offensive weapon." Whatever circumstances led up to the search, I think we can all agree that there's something seriously wrong with how it played out.

DeseoUnTaco
October 14, 2005, 02:33 PM
You need CCW reform. We have almost the same laws here. And yet... I can feel the faintest hints of a CCW reform movement here. CCW reform puts a decisive end to all such nonsense. CCW reform is the final demise of gun control.

Janitor
October 14, 2005, 02:40 PM
Hmm. I wonder ... does this:
won a Marlin semi-automatic rifle in the late 1980's by placing first in a police combat match.
have anything at all to do with that "irony" thingie I've been hearing about?

DontBurnMyFlag
October 14, 2005, 03:49 PM
this really makes me mad. as when I travel to and from the range I keep my yugo SKS in a bushmaster rifle case. For one, the case closes, but does not lock as there are no places for locks or combos. I have a volvo stationwagon, so technically, my car doesnt really have a trunk, it has a hatch. argh , this brings up so many questions.

MAUSER88
October 14, 2005, 03:54 PM
Yep, I agree. When I go to and from the range I drive like I'm driving a baby carriage. No way am I looking to get pulled over in a traffic stop with firearms in my vehicle. I know they are all legal but that doesn't mean the Cop who pulls me over does. :mad:

BadAsh87
October 14, 2005, 08:31 PM
damn new jersey liberals. Is there any way to change these damn laws? I know Republican candidate Doug Forrester is neck and neck with John Corzine for the governor race, can this change anything?

MAUSER88
October 14, 2005, 08:58 PM
Probably not, but he won't make it worse like Corzine will.

Shrinkmd
October 14, 2005, 09:46 PM
Either of you go to Cherry Ridge Range? I also drive the speed limit on Berkshire Valley Rd, even though everyone else is going 65 and seem like they're ready to push me out of the way.

I keep copies of the yellow form or the pistol permit in each case in the trunk, on the advice of my dealer.

MAUSER88
October 14, 2005, 09:52 PM
No, I shoot at Central Jersey Rifle & Pistol Club in Jackson. I too keep copy's of my pistol permit's with me and my FIDC.

Standing Wolf
October 14, 2005, 10:51 PM
CCW reform is the final demise of gun control.

Nope. It's a step. It's a good step, but only a step.

RavenVT100
October 14, 2005, 11:22 PM
I go to Cherry Ridge, but I'm looking for a range that will let me practice combat drills drawing from a holster. Any ranges in NJ that allow this? CR only lets you do it during the police combat matches.

LSCurrier
October 14, 2005, 11:29 PM
My God, pretty soon breathing in NJ will come with some consequences!!!


There are parts of New Jersey where breathing DOES come with consequences!!!

On the other hand, New York has Staten Island. :eek:

Luke

Shrinkmd
October 15, 2005, 12:03 AM
I must be lucky or going at odd times, but almost every time I've gone to CR it is almost deserted. I've had the pistol range to myself or nearly so more times than when it was busy enough to only change targets on the half hour.

I guess in NJ not only do people not own guns but they apparently don't shoot them all that often, either. Of course, when its nearly freezing at 8:30 AM on a Saturday, I don't expect much company...

RavenVT100
October 15, 2005, 12:43 AM
The pistol range is never really that busy. The rifle range always is.

You'll find me on the pistol range a lot because as of now, I have no other decent place to shoot. As soon as I find a place that lets me do combat drills, I'll shoot from there.

armoredman
October 15, 2005, 12:59 AM
Guys, there is lots of room in AZ. I carry my loaded pistol going to and from the range, to and from the store, to and from the bathroom! Please, move here, and counteract the influx of calil-liberals moving in. No registration, permits, waiting periods, magazine bans, AWBs, shall issue CCW, no ammo restrictions, purchase frequency restirctions, etc. Lots of room for good gun people!

Lupinus
October 15, 2005, 01:32 AM
AZ is to friggin hot. I live in florida and its to hot. In AZ I'd die.

How bout all the AZ people move to SC and get it into great shape

Shrinkmd
October 15, 2005, 09:53 AM
Maybe we should start a "where to shoot in NJ" thread.

The last two times I went to the rimfire (the new renovated one) and the shotgun range, there was no one around. I wish more people used the shotgun, since it would be easier to get some informal tips on how to do things. The rifle range is great for that.

LAR-15
October 15, 2005, 12:20 PM
New Jersey also restricts hollowpoint ammo.

Not even Hawaii and ********** do that!

MAUSER88
October 15, 2005, 07:54 PM
New Jersey also restricts hollowpoint ammo.

Not even Hawaii and ********** do that!


Totally WRONG!!! Hollowpoint ammo is perfectly legal if by way of the exemptions under N.J.S. 2C:39-3.g2 and N.J.S. 2C-6f. ( i.e, dwelling, land owned or possessed; while hunting, fishing or target shooting.)

People spread more wrong information about NJ than correct!!!!!!!!!!! :banghead:

bjbarron
October 15, 2005, 08:06 PM
Maybe we should start a "where to shoot in NJ" thread.

I shoot at ShoreShot in Lakewood (very friendly guys) and out at Range 14 at Fort Dix (open to the public, but bring everything you need).

We're looking at homes over the river in PA. It'll be closer to my work in North Joisey (and closer to the kids) as soon as we can sell. I can't wait to get out of this stinkin' state (and criminal enterprise).

Don't expect Forrester to do anything. He's a RINO of the worst type, has already said he will enact legislation to get 'illegal guns off the streets', is is only about an inch to the right of that person Corzine. Lonegan (http://www.loneganforgovernor.com/lonegan/questions3.aspx?#13) was the way to go if you support 2A, but he got beat in the primary.

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