Do You find this OFFENSIVE?


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Werewolf
October 23, 2005, 02:37 PM
I am a member of the NRA and subscribe to both America's First Freedom and American Rifleman. I'm not a huge fan of commercials on TV nor ads in magazines and pretty much ignore them.

Unfortunately an ad in AFF on page 11 caught my eye. :what:

The ad follows Wayne LaPierre's monthly diatribe and the bold sentence top right meant to catch your eye states:Writing the words took minutes. But now I'll defend freedom forever.At first glance I thought this was a follow on to Mr LaPierre's article.

NOT! :cuss:

The sorry SOB was begging for people to put the NRA in their wills. I found this to be really tacky and terribly, terribly offensive! :fire:

Come on! If a member feels strongly about the RKBA and the NRA the thought would probably occur to them to leave a bequest to the organization. To beg folks to do so is just wrong. :mad:

If the shoe was on the other foot like this:I've been a loyal member of the NRA all my life. Now the NRA can return that loyalty... and that was a lead in to asking Wayne to leave me something in his will...

Not quite the same but it would be just as tacky and offensive.

In the mid 80's I worked for a TV station in OKC. Part of the reason I moved on was I just couldn't deal with the smarmy, no morals, plastic people scum bags that ran the advertising and marketing groups. Now I find that the NRA is run by the same kind of scum.

Am I alone in this feeling? Am I wrong to feel this way?

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Cacique500
October 23, 2005, 02:42 PM
I don't think it's such a bad thing. You hear all the time about people leaving millions to their cats or dogs or parakeets. :rolleyes:

For those that don't have any children or other close family to leave it to, why not? They won't be first on my list, but since we don't have any children it's certainly something to consider. Much better than letting the .gov have it!

Lupinus
October 23, 2005, 02:53 PM
Im not a member at the moment but from my understanding they beg for money alot as it is no?

repsychler
October 23, 2005, 02:54 PM
I don't have a problem with it either. I think its a good way to help leave a better world for your children, and I don't think its bad that the NRA reminds people that leaving them a gift is an option they have. (I wouldn't have necessarily thought about it, but I'm interested in doing so)
Now NRA's money grubbing in general is pretty shameless, but I have no specific problem with them asking for a piece of your estate.

Old Fuff
October 23, 2005, 02:54 PM
Maybe the method was tacky – I don’t know because I haven’t seen the advertisement (or appeal as the case may be). But we all need to consider that many folks, including a good number of members on this forum, are very demanding in their opinions about what the NRA should or could do.

That’s all very nice, but “doing” often requires a lot of money. It’s bucks that make things happen, not gab. The only way I know the association can get money is through various appeals to its members and others. I personally would like to leave them a million dollars, but that’s not likely to happen. Never the less I won’t get mad for they’re asking.

shaldag
October 23, 2005, 02:56 PM
A number of charities and political organizations make these appeals. I guess it's a pretty wide practice. Why not the NRA?

hillbilly
October 23, 2005, 03:03 PM
Werewolf, if that offends you, then you best not ever, ever, ever read any alumni publication put out by any college, university, community college, or any other institute of higher education.

Getting rich old people to give endowments to colleges and universities through their wills is a very, very old fundraising technique.

In fact, if you do a little research, you'll see that's how lots and lots of colleges got started.


Here's one more example.

Ever hear of a little old museum called "The Smithsonian?"

That obscure museum was started when one John Smithson of England left his entire forturne to be used for the benefit of the American people....even though he'd never been to America.

But the technique of urging giving through wills is a long-standing, often-used fund raising technique that shows up in any sort of organized giving.

hillbilly

Werewolf
October 23, 2005, 03:11 PM
Werewolf, if that offends you, then you best not ever, ever, ever read any alumni publication put out by any college, university, community college, or any other institute of higher education.Actually I trash everything I get in the mail from OU without even opening it and hangup on telephone beggars within the 1st 10 seconds or so.

Honestly begging folks to put them in their wills - jeeeez - I've been all around the world - literally - more than once and to more and varied places than probably 95% of the US population and this is the first I've heard of the practice.

Wonder what kind of a response I'd get if I paid for an ad in a newspaper or magazine asking folks to put me in their will just because I'm a nice guy and served my country when I didn't have to. Nah.... even the idea gives me the shivers. Some things just shouldn't be done but then I've never been accused of being a mainstream kind'a guy. ;)

eagle45
October 23, 2005, 03:12 PM
I really don't find it offensive at all, just a part of estate planning and something to consider when doing that. That does not mean I would take the suggestion but I'm not offended at all by it. Just from the general tone of your message though Werewolf, it doesn't sound like you are glad that you are a member. There are lots of other ways to support RKBA and gun ownership.:)

antsi
October 23, 2005, 03:22 PM
Im not a member at the moment but from my understanding they beg for money alot as it is no?

They do a lot of fund raising. Lobbying and legal and political action are expensive. In order to be an effective gun rights organization, the NRA needs to do a lot of fund raising. I do not have a problem with that.

TexasRifleman
October 23, 2005, 03:25 PM
I am a member of the NRA and subscribe to both America's First Freedom and American Rifleman. I'm not a huge fan of commercials on TV nor ads in magazines and pretty much ignore them.

You apparantly have not been a member very long. The NRA has had a foundation for folks to include in their wills for many many years, as do lots of other organizations.

Sounds like you just woke up on the wrong side of the bed.

Basically, lots of people want to include NRA or whatever group in their wills, but these groups need to have that information so they know to ask for it.

If you happen to have a will contested, and your wish is that NRA or whoever get some money, if they don't know you put them in the thing they won't know to participate in the will probate.

Lighten up.

SomeKid
October 23, 2005, 03:38 PM
Werewolf, I have actually heard of people doing that. Advertisements asking for people to place them (the writer of the ad) in their wills. Supposedly, it works.

As for leaving the NRA money, if I give money, GOA gets first dibs. So sick of these little compromising losers...

mec
October 23, 2005, 03:44 PM
"Werewolf, if that offends you, then you best not ever, ever, ever read any alumni ...."

When I saw the first post, I immediately thought of Baylor University. They do the same exact thing. They are shameless and inventive about extracting money from all and sundry and make Wayne LaPerrier look like Moshe ben Maimon by comparison.

bdhawk
October 23, 2005, 03:54 PM
the n.r.a. needs money, lots of it, to do what they do. they have their faults, but, if not for the n.r.a., we would probabally be crocheting instead of shootin' for a hobby.

like others said. wills and endowments are just another trendy way to raise money. i saw the add, and it did not trouble me at all. the Y.M.C.A. has been doing it for years.

i am not in the demographic they are targeting. when i die, they will probabally have trouble scraping enough money together to bury me.

Sistema1927
October 23, 2005, 04:00 PM
Do I find it offensive? No.

R.H. Lee
October 23, 2005, 04:11 PM
I thought it a little odd, but certainly not 'offensive'. Some people can afford to be philanthropic, others are just struggling into retirement, let alone having enough left over for their own heirs.

Johnny_Yuma
October 23, 2005, 04:14 PM
Let's get the facts straight, first. The ad you saw was not for the NRA but instead the NRA Foundation, a charitable organization created by the NRA. The Foundation has been doing this for years. The Foundation supports youth education, hunter education, shooting sports, conservation, and other issues championed by the Association. The "sorry SOB" is trying to garner financial support for these activities. You think that's a bad thing?

I give up more than a few personal purchases each year and instead give the money to the NRA Civil Rights Defense Fund, NRA Institute for Legislative Action, and the NRA Foundation. I do it because I would rather see the money spent at those places than on dine-out meals, NFL and NBA games, and fancy clothes. When I die, some of my money will go to the NRA Foundation and the NRA Civil Rights Defense Fund. You decide your own level of involvement.

For those who care to read about it before trashing it: www.nrafoundation.org

Infidel
October 23, 2005, 04:19 PM
No, I don't find it offensive.

I do find Wayne LaPierre somewhat offensive. He seems to be completely and totally dedicated to his own aggrandisement and empire building, to the detriment of the NRA in general and its soi-disant role as champion of the 2nd Amendment.

Majic
October 23, 2005, 04:20 PM
Reading the quote you posted I only see somone making a statement about what they did. There is nothing to suggest that someone else should follows suit. Is there more that you didn't post or are you really upset over just what you posted?

Standing Wolf
October 23, 2005, 04:47 PM
Offensive? Tacky?

No, not at all. After I've gone to that great shooting range in the sky, everything I own is to be divided between the G.O.A. and the N.R.A. I.L.A.

Kim
October 23, 2005, 04:57 PM
No not offensive. Have you ever checked out all the leftist Foundations-Ford ,Hewitt Packard, Heinz,Joyce etc. Where in heck do you think these Foundatins got their hundreds of millions of dollars ---not from a tree. Money makes things happen. Money is just another way that you have a part in getting things done. It is a way a like minded group of citizens can affect government. I think it is wonderful. It is a way for you to keep up the fight after you are dead.

M2 Carbine
October 23, 2005, 04:58 PM
As has been pointed out this is a common money raising tactic of organizations from colleges to animal shelters.

Simply give them money or don't.

It's nothing to get upset about.

Werewolf
October 23, 2005, 05:27 PM
1st off - I do support the NRA and have donated to the ILA portion of it.The "sorry SOB" is trying to garner financial support for these activities. You think that's a bad thing?I don't believe soliciting funds is a bad thing . For many organizations it is a necessary part of their ability to do the work they are set up to do.

On the other hand I do believe that soliciting people to put their organization in their will is indeed in very bad taste. AND using the President of the organization as a schill for it is even worse.

It seems though that I am alone in that belief. :) I can live with that. It will not be the first time.

I wonder if it was normal 100 years ago or so for organizations to ask people for money when they die?

Mannlicher
October 23, 2005, 06:59 PM
I don't find it offensive, and yes, I think you are over reacting. well, you did ask :)

Kamicosmos
October 23, 2005, 07:05 PM
My plan is to donate all my guns to the NRA when I pass, unless I ever have children, which right now, I don't plan on doing.

I don't find the ad offensive. And it's been in every single issue of First Freedom I have recieved over the past 3 years, so dunno why you just now noticed and got 'offended' by it.

And yes, many many organizations asked people to put them in their wills. Almost all buildings on college campuses are named after people that donated money to the institution in thier wills. Many business buildings are also named after people who left money or land in thier wills. Street names, entire freaking towns!

And since you mention travelling the world, I am extremely surprised that this is news to you! Europe as a whole is built on vast family fortunes! Did you know that most of the Louve is the Napoleon family mansion? I wonder if they left that to France via thier wills? Hmmmm.

larry starling
October 23, 2005, 07:08 PM
I don't have any problem with it. I can't think of any better gift to leave your children than trying to help maintain and keep our second amendment right......:D

Hawkmoon
October 23, 2005, 07:55 PM
Yeah, it is offensive ... but hardly unique to the NRA. All sorts of organizations have been asking people to name them in their wills for years now. It doesn't surprise me any more when I see it ... I just ignore it.

In general, any organization that would ask me to do that is probably not an organization I would name in my will. If they were, they wouldn't be asking.

FNFiveSeven
October 23, 2005, 08:01 PM
The NRA's money pandering is shameless and blunt, as it has always been. I'm sure their constant begging for cash has turned off more than a few would-be NRA members, myself included.

NHBB
October 23, 2005, 08:04 PM
The NRA's money pandering is shameless and blunt, as it has always been. I'm sure their constant begging for cash has turned off more than a few would-be NRA members, myself included.

+1

I have donated to a few causes, and they never asked me for the money... I did it on my own accord.

Justin
October 23, 2005, 08:14 PM
If you want a list of things to get offended about, I'd be more than happy to send you part of mine.

This doesn't even rate.

Jeeper
October 23, 2005, 08:57 PM
Not offensive at all. It is commonplace in a lot of charity mailers. Maybe it is just the first one that you have ever actually read the whole way.

rust collector
October 23, 2005, 09:05 PM
As amazing as it seems, many people want to help but nothing gets done until they are asked. Some folks don't like to admit they will die some day, but some want to make the world a better place with their good fortune.

A savvy estate planner can even get more money to your offspring by using charitable gifts and trusts to minimize estate tax. It's not just for the Rockefellers, and it says a lot about someone when they want to help projects they believe in without sticking around for the pictures and accolades.

thatguy
October 23, 2005, 09:17 PM
Um, it's fundraising. Just about every organization from universities to political action groups do it. Why are you so upset by this?

I get appeals for money almost every day from churches, charities, the Republican Party, the local food bank, the Red Cross, the Salvation Army, etc, etc, etc. I got a phone call yesterday from one of the colleges I graduated from and they wanted $500 for the scholarship fund. They don't think small time, do they? They didn't ask for $10, or $25. No, they asked for $500!

Contribute or not. Participate or not. It's up to you.

FPrice
October 23, 2005, 09:40 PM
What most people do not seem to realize is that the NRA could lobby and change all of the anti-gun laws in America without any money at all!

Really.

I read it right next to the ad about the fuel system that will allow cars to run 100 miles on a gallon of water, not gas, but water.

It's just that the government is hiding both facts and will not let anyone know so that the gasoline company owners and Wayne LaPierre can get rich off of us. But these secrets will never be revealed.

[sarcasm mode off]

AirForceShooter
October 23, 2005, 09:41 PM
a whole lot of colleges and universities are doing it.
I'm not offended in the least

AFS

another okie
October 23, 2005, 09:44 PM
No, I'm not offended. I don't really understand why you are. You don't give a reason, you just say it's offensive. Do you find discussing death offensive, or discussing money offensive, or just the combination of the two? Colleges, churches, the Red Cross, the foundation for my local hospital... this is very common.

You say you've traveled a lot, and it is true that private charitable giving is stressed more in this country than in many others. That's the kind of country we are, and that's why many tasks done by government with tax dollars in other countries are done by private charity here.

magsnubby
October 23, 2005, 09:44 PM
Why is that any more offensive than asking you to donate your organs after you die?

Werewolf
October 23, 2005, 10:35 PM
Do you find discussing death offensive, or discussing money offensive,Neither - when the time and place is appropriate.

Death is a pretty personal thing. Death involves you, your family and friends. IMO, one's death should not involve some impersonal organization to whom you are only a source of MONEY! For an organization to insert itself into one's death process is tacky at best and sickening at worst. Imagine that an organization discovers you are suffering from terminal cancer. Would it be OK for them to contact you and ask that they be placed in your will. Would it be OK if they came to your hospital room with you on your death bed and asked. Would it be OK if they asked your grieving widow for money!!! My answer is a resounding NO! And I bet most of you would answer the same if you took the time to stop apologizing for the NRA and think about it because the above example is exactly what they are doing - they're just doing it a bit sooner. I for one am no fan of ghouls (now zombies on the other hand :D). IMO what the NRA is doing is not appropriate.

But as I admitted before - in this group I am resigned to be part of a miniscule minority in that opinion.

If the practice is as widespread as many appear to believe then more's the pity for our society for that is a strong indicator that the decline of good taste and manners has progressed further than I could have imagined.

However, I don't believe the practice of asking folks to add an organization to one's will is all that common. Sure organizations beg, they ask, they wheel and deal, they make you feel guilty but not once - with the exception of the NRA has one ever asked me to put them in my will. To be fair, though, I usually don't read that far or give the phone beggars the chance.

Yes - many, most universities and colleges are left money by alumni but I'd bet few have out and out been asked by the university to be left that money in a will. Next time OU sends me a begging letter though, I'll take the time to read it. BUT - I'll be very, very surprised if there's any mention of leaving the university a bequest upon my death (and OU's president is David Boren - a <gag> democrat. Even he wouldn't be that crass).

Begging in today's society is quite common - too common IMO. Begging someone to put you in their will cannot be as common as it seems many of you believe.

My take on the almost universal support here for the practice is that all the NRA fan boys are making excuses for them because the NRA is the only game in town, the most effective one; we must stick together and support what ever they do no matter what because we don't have a choice. Sorry I don't buy into that one bit.

I'll continue to support the NRA because it does good work and I'll continue to contribute to the ILA but my respect for its money raising methods has taken a huge dive.

TexasRifleman
October 23, 2005, 11:05 PM
Yes - many, most universities and colleges are left money by alumni but I'd bet few have out and out been asked by the university to be left that money in a will.

Oh, you would lose that bet, of that I can assure you. They invented this system my friend.

Be offended if you wish, but it is a very good idea and good way to guarantee that you get what you want if you have the desire to help an organization.

I have the NRA, my college, and the National Review Foundation in my will, and I am proud of it. I also have notified these groups through their processes so that there will be no problems when my will is probated. It's not a lot of money, but it is important to me.

I don't take those ads as begging as much as informing. To me it says:

"You are already a member of the NRA or you wouldn't see this ad. So, we the NRA can assume
you have some interest in preserving our rights. Did you know that there is another way you
can make sure the fight continues, even after you are gone?"

Wow, what an interesting concept, I will have to look into this.

Not, Oh My GOD! The NRA wants me DEAD so they can have all my money.:rolleyes:

Rezin
October 23, 2005, 11:27 PM
I have no kids, and do not plan on having any kids. No real relatives to speak of....

I own a business, that I'll sell at retirement time... So, at the time of my/my wife's death, there is no one to leave this too....

We will probably be looking for something do do with what we have accumulated near the end, so I can understand it to a point. To solicit is.... almost tacky. But how would you breech the subject, to reach folks like me?


I gotta leave it to someione, and if all goes well, it'll be a decent chuck o' change I am sure.. (I hope, lol)

luxone
October 23, 2005, 11:47 PM
Offended, that cracks me up! You really shouldn't be so sensitive. People who complain about the pro-2nd organizations (i.e. - NRA, GOA, JPFO) doing their fundraising, irritate me. I don't know if you realize it or not, but fighting these battles cost more than your measly 35 bucks a year!

thorn726
October 23, 2005, 11:58 PM
ehh, i see a point-
IMO, one's death should not involve some impersonal organization to whom you are only a source of MONEY!

but not quite at offended here myself. tacky and annoyed. typical.
SAd that i have been conditioned to find this acceptable, but thats the way it is.

another okie
October 23, 2005, 11:59 PM
The fact that it's the NRA is not the reason I don't find it offensive. I also don't find it offensive for OU or the Red Cross to ask me about it.

I guess the answer to my question is that you're offended by someone else talking about your death. Well, we're all going to die sometime, and we should think about what will happen to our money and our possessions when we die. I want my money and and my guns to go the right persons, and it doesn't bother me for an organization like the NRA or the Red Cross or the University of Oklahoma to make suggestions. I mean, the NRA is not going to send someone around to pull out my feeding tube to get their bequest (though some of my relatives might) because the NRA won't know about my bequest to them until I die.

Now I do think it would be in poor taste for my friends to ask me to leave them my money, but not for a charitable or advocacy organization to do so. If you care about the work of an organization you should want it to continue and be willing to support it. Preserving our freedom and teaching people to shoot costs money. Many people would never think of putting a bequest to charity or the NRA in their wills if they weren't asked about it.

What do you want to happen to your money when you die?

GunGoBoom
October 24, 2005, 12:45 AM
I find nothing wrong with that - why not ask? Someone may not have thought of it, but has an a-ha moment and decides they want to put NRA in their will when they see the ad - no problem. It's their money - they can do with what they want - whether they have heirs or not, but esp. if they do not. This can be one way to have a little recognition as a benefactor, after death - we all want that smidge of immortality, and that is one small way to get it.

rallyhound
October 24, 2005, 12:57 AM
No, I don't find it offensive.

I do find Wayne LaPierre somewhat offensive. He seems to be completely and totally dedicated to his own aggrandisement and empire building, to the detriment of the NRA in general and its soi-disant role as champion of the 2nd Amendment.


Having met and dined with MR LaPierre about 5 years ago I must dissagree.
That man is passionate about the second ammenment.
He is the most powerful lobbiest in washington and certainly has been offered more money to work for other organizations.
You should be glad he is on our side.

Fletchette
October 24, 2005, 02:25 AM
Having met and dined with MR LaPierre about 5 years ago I must dissagree.
That man is passionate about the second ammenment.
He is the most powerful lobbiest in washington and certainly has been offered more money to work for other organizations.
You should be glad he is on our side.

I'll second that. LaPierre may be agressive, but he HAS to be. Think of his/our adversaries, like Soros. They are certainly very aggressively (and underhandedly) trying to take our rights.

LaPierre really believes in the Constitution. You can't buy that level of commitment.

ssr
October 24, 2005, 02:35 AM
I don't find it offensive at all. I wouldn't have neccessarily thought about it without the ad. Now I am considering it.

I don't know why people get so bent out of shape about the NRA (or any other gun organization) asking for money. If you don't like it, ignore it and throw the stuff away. It's not that hard. It's not wasting money sending out the mailings. It makes them money in the overall picture. If it didn't they wouldn't do it. For me, I find the cause important so I donate what I can when I can, to all gun organizations. So I get requests from them all, not just the NRA.

4v50 Gary
October 24, 2005, 03:09 AM
I may leave some left handed guns to them (specifically, the National Firearms Museum), but no ducats.

geekWithA.45
October 24, 2005, 08:22 AM
Like everyone else, I find myself mildy annoyed by the NRA's constant begging for funding, but I give them a break.

They really are funded $20 at a time by us, and they need that stream to be constant. This is the NRA's achille's heel.

For the most part, they're wickedly effective with the funding they do have, and spend their money well.

Our enemies, the Joyce Foundations, and all their leftist ilk are funded on an entirely different basis, and don't have that liability.

Their funding is large and self perpetuating, based on interests from umpteen bajillion dollar principal laid out in trust funds. These things are damn near bulletproof and unnassailable.

oct_97
October 24, 2005, 08:36 AM
Im not a member at the moment but from my understanding they beg for money alot as it is no?

I'm glad that they are not too proud to beg, how else are they supposed to fight for our RKBA when you freeloaders refuse to contribute? It's people like you that do nothing but complain and will not help that I find ofensive.

saltydog452
October 24, 2005, 09:13 AM
werewolf, I think that you're being a bit 'thin skinned' regarding money.

It really does not matter what personal agenda that you subscribe to, those folks are going to ask for help in spreading that point of view.

I'm a Red Cross Volunteer, complete with Photo ID Badge and all the trimmings. I regularly donate blood, skill, and other resources. Guess what, they still ask for more help. I'm on a mailing list. Impersonal computer generated correspondence/phone calls just keep on commin'.

Church activities are the same.

Contribute money to any worthwhile cause, and, guess what, you're gonna hear from them again in the future.

Fact is, gettin' the message out, no matter what the message is, or where your sympathies lie, costs money.

If you wanna ride along of the coat-tails of someone else's commitment and dedication, you are free to do so.

Kinda like other aspects of 'freedom', you are free to enjoy the benefits, but it seems as though you are offended if you are asked to participate.

The term 'sophmoric' comes to mind.

You seem to be happy to let someone else pay for your admission to the picture show, and then complain that you didn't like the movie.

salty.

P.S...

It you care to continue this conversation, I suggest we use PMs. The keyboard is starting to get a bit warmed up.

sd.

Greymoor
October 24, 2005, 10:49 AM
It takes some money to pay the salaries of these top Non-profit groups CEOs. See below . . .

Name & Title Organization Top Salary*
Harold Varmus, M.D., President/CEO Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center $2,252,818
Avi Becker, Secretary General World Jewish Congress (American Section $1,266,106
Includes $1 million in severance pay
Stephen D. Solender, President Emeritus United Jewish Communities $1,068,924
Includes $694,212 in supplementary employee retirement plan benefits
Roy Williams, Chief Scout Executive Boy Scouts of America - N.O. $913,022
Barbara M. Silverstone, President/ CEO Lighthouse International $820,392
Includes $510,427 of unpaid vested benefits
Wayne Lapierre, Jr., Executive VP National Rifle Association $810,705
John Seffrin, CEO American Cancer Society $760,953
Lynn Taussig, M.D., President/CEO National Jewish Medical & Research Center $721,186
Edwin J. Feulner, Jr., President/CEO Heritage Foundation $687,296
Richard A. Murphy, President/CEO Salk Institute for Biological Studies $666,592
Steven E. Sanderson, President/ CEO Wildlife Conservation Society $651,243
Myra Biblowit, President
Breast Cancer Research Foundation $645,271
Brian A. Gallagher, President/CEO United Way of America $629,950
Larry E. Kun, M.D., Chair Radiation Oncology St. Jude Children's Research Hospital $599,448
Robert J. Beall, President/CEO Cystic Fibrosis Foundation $599,156
Mitchell S. Rosenthal, M.D., President Phoenix House Foundation/ Development Fund $584,007
M. Cass Wheeler, CEO American Heart Association $583,787
Has $814,006 severance agreement about which the AHA states, "The likelihood of meeting the conditions for full payment is remote. A more likely future severance payment would approximate $203,502."
Christopher C. DeMuth, President/ Trustee American Enterprise Institute for Public Policy Research $567,092
Peter Van Etten, President/CEO Juvenile Diabetes Research Fdn. $544,853
John H. Graham IV, Past CEO American Diabetes Association $533,058
Includes supplemental executive retirement benefit of $362,522
John P. Howe III, M.D., President/ CEO Project Hope/People to People Health Foundation $523,038
Hugh B. Price, President/CEO National Urban League $513,275
Gloria A. Feldt, President Planned Parenthood Federation of America $507,762
Marilyn Gentry, President American Institute for Cancer Research $497,434
Includes housing allowance


It takes almost 1100 new life members a year to pay Waynes salary :)

Werewolf
October 24, 2005, 10:50 AM
[throws hands up in a gesture of surrender] Y'all win!

I will close though with this one last thought...

Isn't it ironichttp://members.cox.net/werewolf1326/images/Digital/ROFLMAO.gifthat most folks are terribly offended and find it in bad taste for someone, even a friend, to ask them how much they earn a year or what they paid for their house but find it totally alright for an impersonal organization to request that it be added to that same person's will... :banghead:

GunGoBoom
October 24, 2005, 11:47 AM
that most folks are terribly offended and find it in bad taste for someone, even a friend, to ask them how much they earn a year or what they paid for their house but

Frankly, most folks where you are must be different from me and my friends. We wouldn't think twice about asking how much one another's house costs, or other belongings. Earnings are a tad more sensitive though, I'd admit that.

MAUSER88
October 24, 2005, 12:43 PM
A number of charities and political organizations make these appeals. I guess it's a pretty wide practice. Why not the NRA?

Agree 100%

Byron Quick
October 24, 2005, 12:52 PM
I don't ask what others make. I'm not really worried about offending them, I just don't care:D One of the reasons people get touchy about that is status. I judge status by things other than bank account. I'm not worried about telling what I make. After all, the IRS knows and I don't know anyone who scares me more than them. I didn't buy my house, I inherited it. But I paid the last ten years of the mortgage payments on it. About 36K. It ain't a big deal, guy.

The will thing is a common request by many organizations in fund raising.

It's not a big deal. And, no, I'm not offended. Reckon I don't get offended as easily as you do.

PressCheck
October 24, 2005, 04:18 PM
I know two people that have the NRA in their Wills/Trusts.

SamV
October 24, 2005, 06:00 PM
Hmm, lets see, my wife and I receive requests for trusts/wills, and annuities from at least 1 grade school, 4 high schools, 3 universities, 10 (at least) religious groups, 2 military groups, 2 veteran groups, 1 church, 3 magazines!!, 2 conservation groups, 1 state government department, who knows what else that I toss out.
Don't get too uptight about this. Everyone asks for you to help them with their political, religious, missionary, charitable, whatever cause. If you don't like it, ignore it. They are not hovering over your deathbed like vultures eagerly awaiting your demise.
Responsible people plan for what happens to their assets after they move on. Try to make some plans. I have had to deal with three family estates with no wills and one with a will. They can be hard work even with planning. Think about what you want to do with your stuff. Who gets it? family? friends? charities? causes that you like?
Me? If all those groups wanting something from me later actually found my true net worth, they would regret wasting their postage on such a pauper!

Mr. James
October 24, 2005, 06:28 PM
As TexasSIGman notes, National Review, supposedly a for-profit weekly opinion magazine, has a Foundation; they hawk for it in every issue.

The NRA needs money, lots of it. If they never ask, they'll never receive.

And asking for people, in the course of their estate planning, to consider making a bequest to a worthy cause, like the NRA Foundation or the NRA Civil Rights Defense Fund, is entirely meet. They are not coming to your death bed, or to your widow at your funeral. It is an ad aimed at the entire readership of AFF or AR.

Nothing tacky or offensive about it.

BenW
October 24, 2005, 06:45 PM
If I were in a hospital with a terminal illness and Wayne walked up to my deathbed asking me to put them in my will, I'd probably be offended. Otherwise, as most others here, I don't find the ad offensive in the least.

Everyone leaves their money behind to someone or something. Money left behind to an organization like the NRA-ILA is in my view, better than leaving money behind to say, Paris Hilton. :)

magsnubby
October 24, 2005, 06:50 PM
[throws hands up in a gesture of surrender] Y'all win!

I will close though with this one last thought...

Isn't it ironichttp://members.cox.net/werewolf1326/images/Digital/ROFLMAO.gifthat most folks are terribly offended and find it in bad taste for someone, even a friend, to ask them how much they earn a year or what they paid for their house but find it totally alright for an impersonal organization to request that it be added to that same person's will... :banghead:

Don't bother me a bit.

orangeninja
October 24, 2005, 08:02 PM
guys I got news....colleges and universities make the same requests of their alumni....this is nothing new.

geekWithA.45
October 24, 2005, 09:05 PM
Oh, yeah, and since we're on the topic of wills:

Whoever lives the longest, and dies with the most toys, the most debt, atop the biggest pile of brass, in front of the largest field full of dead enemies....wins. :neener:

Kim
October 25, 2005, 01:03 AM
Well since we are talking about death and the NRA I knew this guy I grew up with. He looked like a sterotypical country boy which he was. He wore over-alls, was a big BUBBA in size and I would say average IQ. But see he had a big heart would do anything for anyone. He was never going to be close to rich if he cleared 10,000 a year he would have felt rich. He was the type of person so many just ignore. Well he died about 3 years ago. I remember his obituitary in our small town paper. It really touched me where it was listed --------He was a member of the NRA. That was his big thing in life and he was proud of it. That 35.00 he sent in each year was like the poor woman in the Bible giving a penny and Jesus saying she gave the most because it was all she had. He was a nobody to most but being part of the NRA made him part of something important.

ezypikns
October 25, 2005, 01:10 AM
Yes. Will I continue to support the NRA? Yes.

Byron Quick
October 25, 2005, 04:15 AM
Poor fellow, you sure must get offended often.

Matthew748
October 25, 2005, 07:28 AM
No I do not find it offensive. If you outlive your immediate family and have no children, the money has got to go somewhere. Better the NRA get it than the state.

oct_97
October 30, 2005, 06:25 PM
In response to a PM from Werewolf.

Please reread my post.

Thank You

Matt G
October 30, 2005, 07:37 PM
Am I alone in this feeling? Am I wrong to feel this way?
No, I don't guess that you are.
No, I don't guess that you have to be wrong.

That said, while there's a certain macabre take on this, there's a lot of practicality to it, to. The median age for NRA Life Members is pretty high. Many NRA members have funds that they can's really afford to spend right now, but feel strongly about supporting the RKBA. It's a worthwhile resource to consider tapping.

DeadCalm
October 31, 2005, 05:55 AM
There's no need for this post since you've all responded to the question with about every reasonable argument that can be made. I confess to being an ex-fundraiser, professionally. The only other small point that I can add is that in survey after survey, what is the number one response to an organization's query, " Why haven't you given money to XYZ before?"

1. "Because nobody asked me."

Werewolf, I do get exactly why you're offended. I just ask that you take a deep breath and let the logic of this thread's arguments percolate a while. Sure as death and taxes, literally, if the NRA doesn't ask for you support, it will go to someone else. That's just the cold hard reality of it. Organizations ask for money from us whle we're alive. So why not give that one last gift as we go to that big shooting range in the sky? And let me assure you, from one who has asked for donations many times in many ways, all gifts are deeply appreciated by the asking organization. If not, they've got their heads in a pretty dark place, so to speak. So just let it sit a while. Is there any church, university, hospital, anything that you believe in passionately enough to ask for its support from someone else? It can be a hard thing to do, and I suspect you may be projecting your own persona onto the task and that you find it odious. But even if you can't imagine yourself doing it, a little tip of the hat to those who do might be appropriate. Wayne LP does not like doing this, probably. Heck, the whole NRA staff would probably jump for joy at never having to ask for a dime if it were all taken care of. But who or what would do that? So, for all the faults of the NRA, of distasteful money-grubbing, and the dog-eat-dog world of non-profit survival, do you really want to sit this one out? Someone's going to benefit by your estate. Why not the NRA?

DeadCalm
October 31, 2005, 06:10 AM
PS—To those of you who are childless and pondering how to pass on your gun collections, I offer myself up for adoption. White male, 52, doesn't smoke cigars indoors, overwieght but cuddly, housebroken. Reasonably good company. Wife also available for light housekeeping.

Moonclip
October 31, 2005, 02:45 PM
Didn't really bother me at all. In fact, as I have no children and have never been married and have a very small immediate family, I may just be donating some stuff to the NRA when I die.

I not sure if I'll ever marry or have children, I'm already a "old maid" (what do you call the guy eqiuvilant?) in my culture! Funny, it seems that women and my hobby just don't mix at least in my area!

hso
October 31, 2005, 02:55 PM
Not well worded, but the idea of establishing a trust to fund the NRA or GOA or any other social organisation is an excellent idea if you believe in the cause.

If I can receive the begging letters in the hereafter I'll be impressed.

Werewolf
October 31, 2005, 03:22 PM
If I can receive the begging letters in the hereafter I'll be impressed.Which begs the question:

Is GOD a contributor? ;)

rick_reno
October 31, 2005, 03:31 PM
Werewolf,

You're spending too much time on the toilet to have read that stuff.

ruger270man
November 1, 2005, 10:23 AM
I get AT LEAST two items per week from the NRA asking for money and to renew my membership. :cuss:

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