Problem with my wife...


PDA






balletto
October 24, 2005, 06:10 PM
I want to own a gun, she doesn't want me to.

Brought up the issue about 6 months ago, had a fight, and put it aside for a while.

Brought up the issue this past weekend. My attempting to logically explain my reasoning to own a firearm resulted in her:
1. equating me with the rednecks she grew up with, despite an incredible display of bigotry and ignorance on her part
2. stating that she would not want to be associated with anyone who owned a firearm
3. stating that having a piece of metal in the house that fired a bullet was "not who she wanted to be", despite my protests that she never had to touch the thing, much less learn how to use it

She's definitely displaying many of the problems listed in this article:
http://www.jpfo.org/ragingagainstselfdefense.htm

Anyone have any advice? Divorce is not an option; we're otherwise very happy. Really!

Thanks!

If you enjoyed reading about "Problem with my wife..." here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Lupinus
October 24, 2005, 06:14 PM
I'd get one anyway

...but then agian thats me.....and my track record with women isn't a great one.

FPrice
October 24, 2005, 06:16 PM
Anyone have any advice? Divorce is not an option; we're otherwise very happy. Really!

What are your reasons for wanting to own a firearm? Have you talked to her about this? Is this typical of her attitude about things you want? Are there things she has wanted that you did not like but let her have?

You may have to decide which you want more. A firearm or a wife (this wife). As this thread unfolds I bet we learn more about her (and you).

Strings
October 24, 2005, 06:17 PM
We're really very happy, except for the raging coniption fits she throws when I bring up buying a gun... :rolleyes:


If it's important to you to have the means to defend yourself, then she needs to be willing to at least discuss it. If she's comepletely, irrationally unwilling to discuss the issue, you have three choices:

1)divorce, and buy whatever gun you wish

2)forget about owning a gun, and stay in the marriage

3)try sneaking behind her back to buy what you want, and have LOADS of fun being dishonest to her until she finds out (and she will), THEN divorce.

Only you can decide which route to take. You can try educating her, but that doesn't work in any way reliably (I'd say Jennings are more reliable than
a man's ability to change a woman's mind)...

50 Shooter
October 24, 2005, 06:17 PM
Sorry, just couldn't resist.:neener:

The top ten reasons why handguns are better then women:


#10. You can trade an old 44 for a new 22.

#9. You can keep one handgun at home and have another for when you're
on the road.

#8. If you admire a friend's handgun and tell him so, he will
probably let you try it out a few times.

#7. Your primary handgun doesn't mind if you keep another handgun for
a backup.

#6. Your handgun will stay with you even if you run out of ammo.

#5. A handgun doesn't take up a lot of closet space.

#4. Handguns function normally every day of the month.

#3. A handgun doesn't ask , "Do these new grips make me look fat?"

#2. A handgun doesn't mind if you go to sleep after you use it.



And the number one reason a handgun is favored over a woman

#1. YOU CAN BUY A SILENCER FOR A HANDGUN.

Gunpacker
October 24, 2005, 06:29 PM
Or is she just vehemently opposed? I would tell her that she is welcome to voice her opinion (just like you), she has the right to make a choice (just like you), and that as an American YOU have a right to decide for yourself (just like her).
I would then buy myself a gun, reminding her that she has the right to not touch it, ask for defense from it, and that you will even refuse to defend her in a problem situation if she insists. Certainly, if she expects you to defend her, she should not tell you how you will do it. Personally, I never bothered to ask, and it never even occurred to me that my wife would object, or that I might listen to her if she did.

hksw
October 24, 2005, 06:30 PM
Where do you live? Matbe someone on here ould be willing and able to bring BOTH of you to the range to give gun ownership and use a trial run (by example and opinion).

HighVelocity
October 24, 2005, 06:30 PM
Get a nickel plated 22 single action. The prettier the gun is the better. She'll come around.

Hobie
October 24, 2005, 06:31 PM
Well, I feel for you because you must choose, then, she must choose. You will choose gun or no gun and then...

If gun she will choose balletto or no balletto.
If no gun you will get progressively resentful until she must choose as above or you are...

gone any way.

Face it, she married you because you had at least some redeeming characteristics. Does she think you no longer do? I'd ask. No, I haven't been that good with stupid women myself. I do great with intelligent women.

Best of luck to you. I won't think worse of you no matter what happens. Honest.

FNFiveSeven
October 24, 2005, 06:32 PM
Don't hide anything, don't back down and do as she tells you, don't ask for a divorce. Just be your own man. If you want to buy a gun, buy one. Let her figure out what she's going to do, but stand your ground. If she goes completely nuts and wants a divorce... well... better get it done with sooner rather than later. Right now it's firearms... later it might be a motorcycle, or who knows what. The last thing you want is someone who thinks she can control you forever by holding the threat of divorce over your head for the rest of your life. Just the thought of living that way... makes me... want... to.... :barf:

MikeJ
October 24, 2005, 06:33 PM
If you told us the reasoning (argument) you used in trying to sell her on the idea it would be most helpful.

It is very difficult to change someone's opinion on something until you know the real reason for their belief. If I were you I would try to get at that first so you can attempt to overcome the objection. I assume this can be done in a calm and rational manner. If not, I think you have more than just a gun issue to deal with.

Smurfslayer
October 24, 2005, 06:34 PM
Anyone have any advice?

I don't put my wife on a shoe budget, she doesn't put me on a gun budget. :cool:

I consider it a fair and equitable compromise which allows her to remain married to me :scrutiny:

Stop asking for permission. If you're a responsible adult, law abiding citizen and you want a gun, exercise your right and buy one. Your wife can help you pick out the right color for the safe ;) :uhoh:

Or you could go the alternative route:

her: "where are you going?"
you: "shooting."
her: "you don't have a gun."
you: "that's why I'm going, so I can decide which one to get"
her: "I thought I told you..."
<interrupted at the sound of engine's exhaust drowns out her protests>

You can pick it up later by bringing back catalogs with pictures and literature of the fine firearms you're considering for your purchase. Don't compromise on the issue of whether or not to purchase, it's not negotiable. Be honest and tell her you're interested in them and you want one. You'd like her to be on board with it, ask her to join you in helping decide - like shopping for a car. Sometimes a 'disinterested party' can help you make a rational choice. Of course if she decides to be a stick in the mud it won't work, but you'll have to make a judgment on that at the time.

I made a trade off; got snookered into a wedding or something, as payment, I required my wife's presence at NRA Basic Pistol class :neener: It swayed her a bit, because there were other women there.

I had guns when we started dating so this was not an issue.

Good luck...

Missashot
October 24, 2005, 06:35 PM
Sort of sounds like you will have to choose what is more important to you. Since you entered into the marriage without guns, it doesn't seem unreasonable for her to expect it to stay that way. She may feel like you came out at her from the blind side on this issue. If I were you, I would just keep trying to talk her into it. From what you posted, it sounds like she has not had any positive experiences with guns or the owners of said guns. Maybe rent a gun at the range or something like that. What ever you do, Sneaking in a gun is a BIG no-no. She will just take that in the divorce.:neener:
Best of luck to you.

gulogulo1970
October 24, 2005, 06:36 PM
Get one, and prepare for a storm. You'll ride it out.

Someone who really loves you won't divorce you over a you owning something. If I'm wrong, well, you had problems you didn't know about.

Oh yeah, first gun, you better try to find something innocent looking. Maybe, buy some pink stocks for it. :D

Turkey Creek
October 24, 2005, 06:40 PM
It might be helpful to know how long you have been married, and if she has ever been this negative about other situations non firearms related- with limited info to go on it's hard to give advice- every marriage is different-

Lupinus
October 24, 2005, 06:42 PM
Get one.

If such a little thing as a gun is enough to make her divorce you....well you have bigger problems then owning a gun.

You have two choices. Either you can take it and be the submissive one. Or you both can be adults about it and understand that the two of you will not share the same intrests all the time and some of the things one does the other isn't going to like. If it is something that doesn't hurt the other then the other should deal with it.

If one trys to control the other who doesn't want to be controled then better it happening now then later over more and more things.

jsalcedo
October 24, 2005, 06:42 PM
Just buy it.

If she finds out and decides to divorce because you own a gun then she probably wasn't that committed in the first place.

Sorry if that sounds harsh but marriage is about compromise and it has to be a two way street. If one person leaves no room for bargaining or leeway
then it backs the other person into a corner.


Maybe my marriage is weird but it is based on mutual respect and being open minded enough to at least accept one anothers point of view.

If you can love her even though she is a raging hoplophobe she should feel the same if you are a raging gun enthusiast.

Sadly, extremists rarely accept those who do not agree with them.

middy
October 24, 2005, 06:43 PM
You have to decide which is more important: marriage or freedom :neener:

OK. I'm not bitter, am I? :uhoh:

Seriously, you've gotten good advice here. You could buy one and see what happens, you might lose her, she may not be worth keeping if that's the case, but, then again, she might be. Whatever you do, don't buy one and try to keep it a secret.

Or, you could forget about the gun... maybe she'll let you buy swords :evil:

TMM
October 24, 2005, 06:45 PM
don't let her control you. you buy a gun, and let her know that. plan this so once you tell her, you can leave to the gunshop... otherwise, you may lose your hearing(screams of protest/anger/etc) and get injured...

~TMM

Mulliga
October 24, 2005, 06:50 PM
...but I don't know if they really help any. No one here knows your wife better than you do. Heck, no one here knows you better than you do. Missashot is right - you didn't have guns before, so it's probably a shock to her that you want to buy guns now (and visiting THR, nonetheless).

I will say this - I've never been married, but my parents have been happily married for 25 years. From what I've seen, my Dad has never, ever made a major decision (and yes, buying a gun is a major decision) without consulting my Mom.

Try talking to her. Show her Oleg's site. But going behind her back is a bad idea.

Felonious Monk
October 24, 2005, 06:52 PM
balletto--
The one thing I haven't heard anyone say is that you DO have another option entirely.

Bring reading material into the home:
In the Gravest Extreme by Massad Ayoob
ANYTHING by Paxton Quigley (female author and advocate of women's self-defense).
The SCADS of blurbs that come out every month in the NRA periodicals about how people have successfully defended life and limb with their personal defense guns--be they handguns, rifles, or shotguns.

I'm sure there are TONS of other "girl shooter" stories I'm missing, but you get the idea.

If she is even a SLIGHTLY intelligent individual, she will be able to discern factual truth from misconceptions, and after a while, will come around.

If not, she's a fool, and led by her emotions and not reality.

KriegHund
October 24, 2005, 06:56 PM
I feel sorry for you!

Work with her You can give somewhat like that all the arguments in the world, but it wont work.

Buy a gun, and let her know you bought it. Buy ammo.
If she really loves you, then she wont do anything that is permanant (IE a divorce).

The key is compramise, and you have to work your way slowly.

If thats too drastic a step for you, buy an airsoft.

balletto
October 24, 2005, 06:58 PM
Why do I want to own a gun?
1. I think it would be a fun hobby. I took a trap shooting class, and visited a pistol range recently, and enjoyed both.
2. I'm concerned about not being able to defend us in our home. We live in a nice neighborhood and town

I stated both reasons to her, attempting to convince her that I had thought things through. I don't think I've ever given her any reason to think that I'm reckless, foolish, or worse. Money is certainly not the problem either.

My reasons for owning a firearm seem to pale in comparison to her dislike of them. Typically she's very supportive of things I've wanted to do during the 5+ years we've know each other.

How serious is she?
Before this weekend, I thought that her objections could be dealt with, and a reasonable compromise struck between the two of us. She seems to be drawing a 'line in the sand', despite any of my various attempts to compromise, eg) weapon will always be locked up, unloaded, etc.

Why not sneak one into the house?
Sorry, that would be a violation of our vow to each other not to do things behind each other's backs.

I suppose what's really upsetting me is her massive display of prejudice, and willful belief in remaining ignorant about the facts of gun ownership and self- defense in this country. I don't mind a good discussion about the issues; she doesn't even want to discuss them.

KriegHund
October 24, 2005, 07:05 PM
Thats really, really wierd balletto. Her ignorance (please take no offence) must truly be deeply ingrained.

Will she even look at guns? Maybe the literature idea isnt that bad, assuming she will even read it.

I have an idea! Take her here! Let the smarter, more eloquent speakers (some of the mods) among us send their arguments.

Perhaps she will realize that we are not all wierdos. If her husband of 5 years, whom is a reasonable person, wants to own a gun, then has he suddenly turned wacko? I think not.

Fred Fuller
October 24, 2005, 07:10 PM
On the national political scene, gun control is not about guns. It's about CONTROL. As far as I can see it the same thing is true in your house as on the national scene- it's a matter of control. Guns are just the crutch.

Someone has some getting over it to do, it's your marriage and you get to decide who. Ain't but one pair in the house, if you aren't gonna use 'em, you might as well let her.

Good luck,

lpl/nc (in your next life marry a woman who's a shooter, and find out what happiness really is)

Old Fuff
October 24, 2005, 07:20 PM
The real problem here (and it's not unusual) is that she is dealing with the issue on a totally emotional level. When that's the case all of the reasoning and logical arguments on your side won't work. What she is doing is drawing a line in the sand because she is deathly afraid of guns. I have no idea why. But it doesn't matter. It is unlikely you will get her to go to a shooting range because all she wants too do stop what you propose, and not think about it again. There may also be an element of control on her part. On this subject she want to be able to control what you do or don't do. If she can't stop you from getting a gun her fears will simply be intensified.

What you need to find is a marriage or domestic relations counselor who is experienced with dealing with this kind of situation and can give you some pointers on how to deal with it. – and as I said it isn’t unusual.

I wish you luck.

KriegHund
October 24, 2005, 07:23 PM
What you need to find is a marriage or domestic relations counselor who is experienced with dealing with this kind of situation and can give you some pointers on how to deal with it. – and as I said it isn’t unusual.

I wish you luck.

Make sure that counseler isnt anti gun :evil:

Darth Ruger
October 24, 2005, 07:24 PM
We all hopped on this particular merry-go-round a few weeks ago with another guy having the same problem with his girlfriend. Anti's can be some of the most illogical, closed-minded, raving people you will ever encounter. I don't envy the position you're in.

I'm a certified gun fanatic. If I couldn't shoot, read about, and talk about guns, I'd be miserable. That's just the way I am. It's a passion of mine. If you're not really into guns on that level, but you think maybe you should get one just for home defense, then you might be better off just getting a baseball bat. Less strain on the marriage and you'd be less of a danger to yourself and others with a bat than a gun.

However, if you really want a gun, then it gets difficult. You're trying to be yourself and she doesn't want you to. It's not a matter of owning a particular material object (whether gun, motorcyle, or anything else). It's a matter of her trying to control you to be what she thinks you should be, rather than letting you be who you are. Unlike some others, I don't think it boils down to the simple question "What's more important to you: your girl or your gun?" In my opinion, it boils down to "What's more important to your wife: her man being honest about who he is or her marriage being based on conditions?"

If you're just trying to do the things you want to do with your life, she has to respect that. As long as you're not trying to keep her from doing the things she wants to do with her life, then she has no right to do that to you.

A typical argument (I'm sure she'll say this to you) is that being yourself is fine as long as you're not putting her in danger by owning a gun. You'll have to explain to her, then show her, that guns are only dangerous in the hands of irresponsible people.

Since she won't listen to reason, there's really only one way to reach her. Next time it comes up, don't let yourself get mad. Be the calm, logical one. When she raves, let her. When she wears herself out, continue with your calm logic.

Here's where you really have to stick to your guns (pardon the pun). At this point, calmly, but seriously, tell her "I'm going to get a (revolver, rifle or whatever) because I want to. You can either run screaming in fear because you suddenly think you married a hillbilly, or you can keep an open mind and let me show you that guns aren't inherently dangerous and that having a gun hobby doesn't make you a redneck."

Don't cave in to her threats of leaving you. She might threaten it, but she won't. Go buy your gun. If she doesn't even want to see it at first, fine. Don't bring it out when she's around. Pushing it on her will make her resist more. Eventually, she'll start to realize that you aren't going to kill anyone anytime soon. When she starts to open up a little and ask about it, take the opportunity to explain why gun ownership is clouded in myths in the minds of the general public. Gather information like real statistics to show her to back up your reasoning. If you ever manage to get her to the range, rent something she'll enjoy shooting, like a .22 rimfire. Don't take her out the first time and put a .357 in her hands.

Even if she never wants to try shooting, she'll still live with the fact that you own guns. At least you'll have exerted your right to be who you really are and shown her that her emotional unlogic had no basis in reality.

hillbilly
October 24, 2005, 07:24 PM
balletto.....first, congratulations on discovering the wonderful world of shooting.

Second, sounds like you've got quite a situation there with the Mrs.

Couple of things (And yes, I've been married for 12 years, to the same woman, who owns several guns that started out as my guns, originally, and then became "ours" and have ultimately become "hers.")

First, if you took the classes you mentioned, why not invite your wife to go back to those classes with you?


On the other hand, you did write this bit of information:

"1. equating me with the rednecks she grew up with, despite an incredible
display of bigotry and ignorance on her part

2. stating that she would not want to be associated with anyone who
owned a firearm"


It sounds like she has some major issues at work here.

Either she means exactly what she says, or she doesn't.

I know how I feel about gun ownership and shooting.

I know how I would react to such an ultimatum.

But then again, I have been into a shooting since I was 8 years old, and would never have married a woman with these outlooks and attitudes in the first place.

You don't have that background that I do, as you just got into shooting.

But, only you know.

Only you know what your marriage and what your wife and what your interests in shooting really are.

Ee all must make choices about priorities and wants and realities.

I don't know a darn thing about your situation.

But I do know what choices I would make, if it ever came down to it.

Good luck on your decisions and I hope everything works out for you.

hillbilly

Barbara
October 24, 2005, 07:35 PM
Buy the gun.

Don't lie to her.

Treat her concerns with respect but make it clear that it is your decision.

Do your best to address her concerns, especially if they involve children. If you have small children, make sure she understands that the gun won't be a danger to them. Buy proper equipment to keep the gun out of the hands of people, big and little, who shouldn't have it.

If I had to make a recommendation, if you don't have your heart set on a gun yet, don't choose an evil black rifle or big old honking revolver. Look for a nice traditional-looking gun, wooden stock..maybe some nice engraving. There really is something to be said for appearances for many people and a pretty gun will seem less threatening.

ewb45acp
October 24, 2005, 07:55 PM
She's definitely displaying many of the problems listed in this article:
http://www.jpfo.org/ragingagainstselfdefense.htm

Anyone have any advice? Divorce is not an option; we're otherwise very happy. Really!

Thanks!


Did you read the whole article in the link above? It gives some good advice on dealing with an "anti".

You can try to discuss this with her calmly. See if you can get her to open up and examine her fears with you. Don't talk like there's "something wrong" with her attitude.
Don't belittle or talk down to her. If it gets heated, let it go. When people get emotional, the defences go up and thinking shuts down.
Have lots of information available. A great resource for debunking alot of the antigun myths is "GUNFACTS" do a search. it's a downloadable PDF file. There are also some great essays and articles posted in this and other forums. If you're interested, PM me, I'll see if I can relocate a few that helped me out with an antigun friend a while back.
It will take time for sure, but if you can open her eyes, it will be time well spent. Good luck.

Standing Wolf
October 24, 2005, 08:00 PM
In my experience, the common thread in anti-gun people is rage. Either anti-gun people harbor more rage than others, or they're less able to cope with it appropriately. Because they can't handle their own feelings of rage, they are forced to use defense mechanisms in an unhealthy manner. Because they wrongly perceive others as seeking to harm them, they advocate the disarmament of ordinary people who have no desire to harm anyone.

I clicked on the link at the top of the thread. Interesting stuff.

bogie
October 24, 2005, 08:01 PM
1. Do not buy an "ugly" gun.

2. I think the poster who suggested the "Hey, where are you going?" "Shooting." routine was on target. Go trap/skeet shooting if you can find a place that will rent you a shotgun.

3. It's all in how it's presented. Leave a coupla books/catalogs out showing pictures of an over/under taken down and cased... Looks kinda cool, right? Kinda upscale? Non-redneck? Then, when you buy one, spend another coupla hundred, and get a nice take-down case for it.

Shorts
October 24, 2005, 08:09 PM
I want to own a gun, she doesn't want me to.

Brought up the issue about 6 months ago, had a fight, and put it aside for a while.

Brought up the issue this past weekend. My attempting to logically explain my reasoning to own a firearm resulted in her:
1. equating me with the rednecks she grew up with, despite an incredible display of bigotry and ignorance on her part
2. stating that she would not want to be associated with anyone who owned a firearm
3. stating that having a piece of metal in the house that fired a bullet was "not who she wanted to be", despite my protests that she never had to touch the thing, much less learn how to use it

She's definitely displaying many of the problems listed in this article:
http://www.jpfo.org/ragingagainstselfdefense.htm

Anyone have any advice? Divorce is not an option; we're otherwise very happy. Really!

Thanks!




Sounds like there's spme history or baggage. Try to get to the bottom of it. Ask her if she'd reconsider you purchasing a firearm if the BOTH OF YOU took an education class prior to purchase. I thinkyou should look at throwing a lot of good faith and thought her way in the forms or responsibility and education. Maybe that will soften her up a bit. Also, keep her a part of the purchasing process and up to speed on what gn you're thinking about and why. Heck even go as far as to pick one out together.

I know, its tough, but you need to go about swinging her your way through gentle persuation and hand holding. Yes that method is a pain in the butt and may seem completely off the wall, but if that what it takes, then that's what it takes. You've already flat out asked and that got shot down, so time for creative thinking.

She's got her reasons for saying no initially. But by figuring out exactly why and ways to go about solving those issues, you might get her doing a complete 180, she might enjoy shooting.

Baba Louie
October 24, 2005, 08:12 PM
A gun. What type? Shotgun for hunting or home defense? Handgun for plinking, competition or self defense? Rifle for hunting, plinking or competition? Old timey historical cowboy/CivilWar/Milsurp like Daddy shot back in the great war, etc.
Each present similar yet different logical reasons for ownership as well as safety issues. Issues you need to know and understand well enough to explain the who what when where why and how of each.

Problems with significant other.
Control Issues? (i.e. TRUST)
Safety?
Money?
Liability?

Is she too good, no... wait, wrong choice of wording... too intelligent, for anything bad to ever happen to her family?

Can she not see how the challenge of mastering a dangerous sport/hobby would be fulfilling to you? Actually FUN? As in, allow you to have fun without her, maybe? (if that's her ultimate choice)

OR... does she know you well enough to know that you may not be "right" for firearms ownership? (I hate to ask this... I know it's not possibly feasible that anyone here on THR could ever be, careless or have a momentary lapse of reasoning, drink too much, etc.)

Guns are scary things. To some, they're actually... evil.

Guns are expensive things. To some, they become an obsession and a place to throw a lot of the disposable income you make.

Control of fire is one of the things that separates humans from the other animals. It is dangersous, yet has it's uses.

If you really have no specific uses for a firearm, if it's just a want kinda thing...

I say go get it.

And if she gives you a hard time about it... give her a good spanking. :p

After you spend an equal amount of money on her via weekend vacation, nice dinner, dancing, etc. Something of Equal value, of course.

After that weekend is over she'll have the memories, (so will you) and you'll still have your firearm. It's value will never outlast the wonderful memories of a romantic weekend away (if you give her a proper good spanking that is ;) ), but if you do things right, and slowly convince her to join you (it might never happen) going out on weekends "shooting" together, attending classes at Thunder Ranch, Gun Site, etc, doing the SASS thing or skeet/trap shooting across your state and region's on various weekends each month... making new friends (who are high class, non-redneck types who own several thousand dollars in quality arms, can actually read a book without moving their lips and discuss anything they choose)...

Talk about good memories.

YMMV

Shorts
October 24, 2005, 08:23 PM
The problem with lying and being deceitful to your wife about this 'thing' she really hates is you're creating more problems for yourself. Yes, you will have a gun, but your wife will not be happy. And she won't be unhappy for a day or two, she will be unhappy every time you go to the range, you take out your pistol to clean, you talk of shooting, you're arguing over something completely unrelated and the gun thing comes up....you're asking for trouble.

Then it is the guy who comes around griping and complaining "she won't let it go and just get over it!". No, a woman will not. That's a fact of life and the way it goes. So, you can either go about this diplomatically with minimal if any lingering affects on your marriage, or you can be a jackass ;)

Reading from previous post about different issues that might be at work here, going through and buying a gun without your wife's knowing about it is asking for the black death, especially is her dislike for gun is a deep emotional one.

SpookyPistolero
October 24, 2005, 08:26 PM
I'd agree with others that you need to find a way to respectfully dissagree, with action. If you feel it is important to you, then go and buy one. She will learn to adjust or she won't. Pretty simple. No one 'own's' anyone else's decisions.

I would agree with Barbara, though, that it might be worth the effort to get a more traditional looking piece. If you're just starting, a .22 would probably work great right now. Something very elegant and simple looking, maybe a bolt action for that extra look of strength in the action. And maybe when she sees the cartridge it fires, she'll feel a little silly (not that a .22 isn't a dangerous round...).

I don't think this has to be an ultimatum situation unless she feels like making it one, in which case it's all out of your control anyway. All I can reccomend from my experiences is to remain calm. In all things be calm. Make it seamless and natural and not a big deal.

All in all, I hope you get a chance to post more about your and her backgrounds so we can better guide a healthy discussion.

Best of luck-

Atticus
October 24, 2005, 08:30 PM
You need to work on a sales strategy. First you need to choose a calm quiet time to sit down talk. Ask her to reserve comment until you've stated your piece.

" Dear, this is very important to me. These are the reasons I would like to have a gun (list reasons here - wanting to learn how to hunt and/or target shoot are good ones - ten guns later she will give up on your sick condition). I am aware that they can be dangerous if improperly used. That is why I'm going to take a safety class and buy a lockable storage container. If you do not trust me or care about MY needs then we have a bigger problem than this. I would like to buy (blank), and this is how I'm planning on paying for it."

Or...just buy and hide. :neener:

balletto
October 24, 2005, 08:32 PM
What sort of gun do I want to buy?
A .22 pistol to start with, hopefully a 9mm later on. A full-on AR would be cool of course, but I'm willing to start small.

Have I always wanted to own firearms?
No, this is something that I've developed over the past few years. I was somewhat anti-gun actually when we met.

We don't have kids, so that's not an issue.

I'm not about to lie to her, but her willful ignorance isn't helping the situation either.

geekWithA.45
October 24, 2005, 08:48 PM
+1 on Paxton Quigley.

Since you've already tried logic and struck out, what you have on your hands is an emotional issue, and these are resistant against any magnitude of fact or logic.

Normally, I'd say she needs professional help with her hoplophobia, but the problem is, our society has grown all sorts of factions who are only too happy to support her in her delusions, and the selection and training process our professional mind helpers go through only excaberate the problem.

Tread with care, but firmly and insistently assert your own agency.

kudu
October 24, 2005, 08:54 PM
I would say meet some other shooters in your area that are willing to help you out and maybe break the ice so to speak. Many shooters have wives (or husbands) that also shoot and could maybe get through to her on a different level. As many High Roaders that are out there, I'm sure that there are some close to your area that would be willing to help.

Strings
October 24, 2005, 08:54 PM
>What sort of gun do I want to buy?
A .22 pistol to start with, hopefully a 9mm later on. A full-on AR would be cool of course, but I'm willing to start small.<

Look into some of the special edition Ruger semis: they look "classy", are a hoot to plink with, and won't break the bank. Might want to post your rough location, I'm sure there are THR members that would be willing to let you try theirs...

>Have I always wanted to own firearms?
No, this is something that I've developed over the past few years. I was somewhat anti-gun actually when we met.<

That's actually something of a plus, assuming she knew you were moderately anti. You'll have to get her to discuss it rationally with you, but point out WHY you're now interested. And as others have said, make the effort to get "safety measures" (things I don't use, but I'm barred from buying more guns for myself until I get the Missus caught up).

Probably THE biggest thing you can do to help your cause is to find female shooters in your area that you can introduce your wife to. Once she sees that it isn't just a "boy thing", and the women aren't trailer trash, your fight will be MUCH easier...


If you're in Wisconsin, PM me

Werewolf
October 24, 2005, 08:55 PM
A marriage is a partnership, not a dictatorship.

Right now balleto your marriage seems to be a dictatorship. In the short run most folks can deal with something like that; in the long run it is a recipe for disaster.

Your wife says:that she would not want to be associated with anyone who owned a firearm

On the face of it it seems that your values have changed to a degree that you and your wife just may not be compatible any longer. If she dictates no firearms and your fundamental values conflict then sooner or later (later - if you give in now) there's going to be a coming to Jesus and the mother of all battles. That will be one battle that neither of you will be able to walk away from.

So face the music now. Attack the problem from the point of view that you each have equal standing in the marriage and that neither has the right to dictate to the other (don't bring up the gun at this point). If she agrees you've set the stage for a discussion of firearm acquisition.

If she doesn't then you've got a really major problem on your hands that has nothing to do with firearms. Are you her slave subject to the whims of her likes and dislikes? Can you accept that? If so then no problem and no gun.

If not then you've got a bigger problem than her freaking out and putting her foot down about you getting a gun.

It may take professional help to save the marriage and that may not even work.

Good luck to you in this - you're gonna need it for you've got a tough row to hoe ahead of you - later or sooner. One way or the other you're gonna have to deal.

ScottsGT
October 24, 2005, 09:37 PM
She said "you cannot have A gun"

Buy two....... :D

Actually, I had the same problem after 2 to 4 years of marrage. I grew up shooting Dads shotgun and .22. Never thought about them until I guess I got bored one day and decided to get myself a rifle. Man, she freaked! Didn't want any guns in the house with small kids, but I told her it was a marrage and I didn't "work" for her and she can throw all the hissy fits she wants to. I made a compromise by keeping them in the attic, for the first few months. :evil: I slowly kept creeping the gun culture on her, and now she just complains that there is no money to buy guns, so quit buying. OK, I will. :neener: Will quit letting her know about them! I keep everythign behind a steel door, so she feels safe around them. I even got her to shoot my Colt .380 one time. You've got to draw your line in the sand....... I think this is more than guns in the home.
BTW, we just celebrated our 17th year of weddid' bliss on the 21st!

4v50 Gary
October 24, 2005, 09:43 PM
Buy your friend a very nice gift. In fact, buy it in her presence with some plausible explanation as to why you're doing it. Next year, he "buys" you the gun you always wanted. Of course, you buy it first, pass it to him and he presents it to you. Christmas is coming up.

Rosstradamus
October 24, 2005, 09:48 PM
Wake up and smell the formaldehyde.

You've just discovered that you married a psychotic. It isn't going to get any better. It isn't going to go away. She isn't going to "come around." The best thing you can do now is cut your losses.

scout26
October 24, 2005, 09:52 PM
http://www.a-human-right.com

Ask her what she would expect you to do in case of a natural or man-made disaster to protect her.

Next time something go "bump" in the night, tell her to go investigate.

Or use the excuse that a co-worker or mine used. "Me, the five iron and the dog aren't as fast as we used to be."

Most local papers have the "Police Blotter" or "Crimes Reported" section. Leave the paper open to those sections. Even "good" neighborhoods get burglarized occasionally.

Use your interest in the shotgun sports as it is probably the best way to start. "Hey, we just breaking little orange frisbee's." (rather then something like IDPA). Join a trap league (hopefully with a friend that has an extra you can borrow or at a place that you can rent), surprise her once by taking her to dinner and then out to shoot, bonus if you can make friends with a another couple that shoots. Let the women work with your wife. Find a place that offers women's shooting clincs or women only events. Let her see that it good clean healthy outdoor sport.

There is really no compromise. It's either your way or her way. One side or the other has to give in.

If you give us your location, I'm sure you'll have plenty of people here who'll offer to take you and her out to shoot. Yours truly included.

CDignition
October 24, 2005, 09:52 PM
Ditch her, and let her become the victim she will be someday...

Oleg Volk
October 24, 2005, 10:07 PM
Another good site: http://www.io.com/~cortese/firearms/

mr_dove
October 24, 2005, 10:12 PM
My suggestion would be to move into the hobby without buying a gun (yet). Make sure she knows that you are going shooting. Make sure she knows how much fun you are having. Bring home gun related reading material to leave around the house. Bring home some of your targets and show her excitedly how good you're doing (probably not human shaped targets).

It may take some time but I think that this is a good step to soften her up a bit on the idea of guns being a part of your life.

I think that this method will allow her to get used to the idea of firearms as a sport and as a fun hobby without having to confront the actual firearm. It it probably subtle enough to avoid spooking her too much.

Eventually you should be able to move on and take some of the other suggestions that folks have made here.

Exposure
October 24, 2005, 10:43 PM
This is from my personal experience so take it for what it is worth.

When my wife and I first met (10 years ago, YIKES!) she was not pro gun, she was probably a bit anti. Guns made her nervous. I already had multiple firearms at that time. She didn't ask me to get rid of them but was kind of uncomfortable around them. As she respected me, and I respected her, I kept them out of sight.

After about 5 years of marriage she one day mentioned that when we first met I used to talk about shooting a lot and that I hardly mentioned it anymore. By this time all my shooting friends had moved on and my firearms mostly gathered dust. I think she took pity on me and asked if I would take her shooting, I think she did it mostly to make me feel better about all of my friends who I never saw anymore. :(

Now my mama didn't raise any dummies and I knew a golden egg when it was dropped into my lap. So with a fresh brick of .22's we took my Marlin Model 60 to the local sandpit and within 15 minutes she had the Coke cans dancing around. To say that her fear of firearms vanished on that trip would be a fair statement. The grin on her face told me everyting I needed to know.

As of right now my wife is an AVID firearms enthusiast. We currently own two dozen different firearms and she shoots them all. She is a good shot and will gladly pick up my M1 and blast off an 8 round clip to the amazement of the other shooters at the range. It is always a crackup for me to see her little 5'2" frame wielding the old Garand while the other guys look on with their mouths hanging open!

To make a long story longer let me say this: Marriage is all about give and take. You will each have things that you like and dislike about each other. She needs to respect your want for a gun and you need to respect her dislike of them. That doesn't mean that either one of you should dictate to the other, but there has to be middle ground.

Good luck. I understand where you are at. But with a little perseverance (sp?) things will pay off! My wife is even into the NFA stuff now! :cool: Did I get a keeper or what?????

Sam
October 24, 2005, 10:44 PM
Swap her for a '56' Buick and be happy if the guy only wants an extra $7-800 to boot.

Sam

SR_
October 24, 2005, 10:52 PM
I didn't read all of the replies so this might be a repeat.

You have to pick your battles - is this important enough to you to declare war? Don't just argue to argue.

Is there a compromise - for example renting range guns?

I have to admit my wife was not real wild about a hand gun in the house. Then I started going to the range and rented a few. She saw I enjoyed shooting. Then I took a firearms class - surprised me, she joined me and had a good time.

So, take it one step at a time. Try renting at the range and go from there. If she sees it's important to you then things might not change. At any time in the future you can decide if you want to declare war.

Rembrandt
October 24, 2005, 11:02 PM
Option #1....Take a part time job that requires you to own a gun.

Option #2....Be just as stubborn when she begs you for something she really wants....then cut a deal for the gun.

Option #3....Call Dr Laura

30 cal slob
October 24, 2005, 11:05 PM
I am not going to be flip about this.

Sounds to me like an irreconcilable difference.

As harsh as this sounds, if it were me, the matter would be resolved with a divorce.

Period.

No further discussion, no hollering or argument.

Some things are too important to me to be co-opted by the whims and prejudices of a hopelessly obstinate third party.

I've snoozed with a S&W 686 revolver under my pillow and a Remington 870 12 gauge under the mattress long before I shared my bed with the missus.

Just telling you how I would deal with it.

If you handle it differently I'm far from one to criticize you.

Good luck resolving this.

RandyB
October 24, 2005, 11:09 PM
For what its worth, been there done that. What worked for me and the Mrs. was a compromise. I could own guns, but they had to be 'locked up'. And since I already owned guns and had a safe, she felt it was "ok". Anne Colton's book on how to talk to a liberal, is a good book and has a chapter on a female perspective on owning firearms. Good luck!

stevelyn
October 24, 2005, 11:11 PM
I want to own a gun, she doesn't want me to.

Brought up the issue about 6 months ago, had a fight, and put it aside for a while.

Brought up the issue this past weekend. My attempting to logically explain my reasoning to own a firearm resulted in her:
1. equating me with the rednecks she grew up with, despite an incredible display of bigotry and ignorance on her part
2. stating that she would not want to be associated with anyone who owned a firearm
3. stating that having a piece of metal in the house that fired a bullet was "not who she wanted to be", despite my protests that she never had to touch the thing, much less learn how to use it

She's definitely displaying many of the problems listed in this article:
http://www.jpfo.org/ragingagainstselfdefense.htm

Anyone have any advice? Divorce is not an option; we're otherwise very happy. Really!

Thanks!

This isn't about guns. It's a control issue. You are an adult capable (or should be) of making your own decisions. Marriage is supposed to be a partnership not a dictatorship with both parties respecting and accepting the other warts and all. If she is raising hell about something as benign as you purchasing gun, what else is she trying to control? Can you really be that happy if she can dictate what you can and cannot buy or if you have to adhere to a list of "approved" hobbies? Sorry, I've been down that road before. Never again.
Since life is too short to be miserable, buy the gun anyway. Don't try to convince, convert, cajole, justify or suck up. If she doesen't like it too bad. She can hit the road if she feels that strongly (if it were me I'd help her pack). You're not hurting her or anyone else by buying it.
Women can be replaced. Freedom and sanity are a little harder to come by.

kel
October 24, 2005, 11:12 PM
Let her deal with it. This is not her perogative.

Psssniper
October 24, 2005, 11:19 PM
Threaten to withold sex till she gives in ;)

mpthole
October 24, 2005, 11:27 PM
Threaten to withold sex till she gives in ;)
LOL! Oh man, that made me laugh!

Seriously though... if you're interested in the Paxton Quigley book Armed & Female, I've got a copy that I'll practically give to you. How does $2 to cover postage sound? I bought it for my wife to read - which she never did. My wife's not an "anti", just not quite as enthusiastic about guns as I am. ;) I read it and its a good book for a beginner.

Live Free Or Die
October 24, 2005, 11:41 PM
I apologize in advance for the long post. I hope the original author of this thread finds my story interesting, and maybe even encouraging.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When I got married about 7 years ago, neither my wife nor I were pro-gun. I wasn't an 'anti,' but I hadn't really formed my strongly pro-gun beliefs that I hold now. Those came over the past few years, coinciding with my transformation into a small 'l' libertarian. :)

As my pro-gun philosophy took shape, the differences between my views and my wife's latent anti views became increasingly pronounced. I didn't blame her for being a little annoyed at my new stance, since I didn't hold those views throughout most of our relationship. It probably didn't help that I was quite gung-ho and vocal about my beliefs.

Inevitably I decided I wanted to buy my first gun, and we certainly had a few mild/moderate arguments about it. She used the "I don't want a gun in our house" line more than once. I was a bit intolerant of this argument, and made it clear that it was an insufficient reason to stop me from buying one. Importantly though, I remained calm and carefully attempted to explain exactly what my reasons were for purchasing a firearm. When it became obvious to her that I was going to do it anyways, she changed her tactic and wanted to be assured that I would store the gun out of sight in the basement, where "it couldn't accidentally hurt someone." :rolleyes:

When it came time to actually buy my first gun, she would start to get antsy again, and I appeased her several times by delaying the purchase. Then one day I said to myself, "Screw it!" I went directly to the gun shop after work and bought it (didn't get it for 7 days though...stupid MD!!). She was pissed that I bought it without telling her. She was pissed 7 days later when I brought it home. Shortly afterwards though, I think she realized how much my new gun made me happy, and it appears that she just gave up.

Within a few months I had joined a .22 bullseye league, and she seemed to take at least a mild interest in how my skill was progressing. If I ever missed a league night, she would wonder why, and remind me to go the next week. To this day, less than a year and a half after I bought my first gun, she encourages me to go to the range with my pro-gun friends. She's agreed to go to the range with me if I agree to join her running (she's an avid runner). The other day, she stunned me by saying, "When we have kids, you can teach them to shoot -- the boys and the girls -- if I can teach them to sew...the girls and the boys." Fine with me! :D

A couple weeks ago I bought my first rifle. I told her about it beforehand, and other than a brief discussion about our budget, she gave me no grief. When I brought the rifle home, I talked her into holding it and examining it. Much to her surprise (I imagine), nobody was killed accidentally or otherwise. A few days later I mentioned I wanted a rifle case. We went to Bass Pro together, and she helped me pick it out. She hasn't reacted negatively to my overtures about picking up a Yugo SKS, even after I made a point to mention the grenade launcher. :neener:

Now, I'm not fooling myself: my wife is not pro-gun (yet). She might never be. I'm pretty sure she's not really an anti anymore though. At the very least she tolerates my obsession well, and at times she appears to even encourage me. I'm OK with that, and if it never improves, I believe we can remain happily married under these conditions. :)

balletto, your situation might be a bit different from mine, and your wife might respond differently than mine has. Don't give up though. Use my experience as evidence that it can work. Best of luck to you!

otasan
October 24, 2005, 11:42 PM
Don't hide anything, don't back down and do as she tells you, don't ask for a divorce. Just be your own man. If you want to buy a gun, buy one. Let her figure out what she's going to do, but stand your ground. If she goes completely nuts and wants a divorce... well... better get it done with sooner rather than later. Right now it's firearms... later it might be a motorcycle, or who knows what. The last thing you want is someone who thinks she can control you forever by holding the threat of divorce over your head for the rest of your life. Just the thought of living that way... makes me... want... to.... :barf:


Sure, buy a gun, get served with divirce papers, complete with the Klinton restraining order, and lose the gun anyway. Get divorced FIRST, then buy a gun.

losangeles
October 25, 2005, 12:30 AM
Get divorced FIRST, then buy a gun.

Not that sounds like good advice!

Horsesense
October 25, 2005, 12:32 AM
"3. stating that having a piece of metal in the house that fired a bullet was "not who she wanted to be", "

She wants a Glock! :neener:


If she can not give a rational reason why she doesn't want a gun in her house, how is she going to act when the two of you try to raise kids?


Perhaps the two of you should see a marriage councilor…. Or call DR. Laura

Johnny_Yuma
October 25, 2005, 01:03 AM
I will never marry a woman who has fewer guns than me:D .

el44vaquero
October 25, 2005, 01:08 AM
Simple answer: Happy Wife = Happy Life

jamz
October 25, 2005, 01:44 AM
I was in the same boat, more or less when I started getting into this a couple of years ago. I decided on a year long plan which would get me from "No guns in the house, don't own one" to having a gun safe with rifles and handguns. This plan started more or less when I joined THR, so fall of 2003.

I fully understand the desire for domestic harmony, which is why I ignored the "buy a gun, ride out the storm" advice. It will work, but the payment is pretty high. I'm also fairly sure that a lot of people here haven't found the right woman who is just the best except in this one case. Putting your foot down and just buying a gun to a hoplophobe is something they are going to resent for a long long time. I'm a very patient guy, so I decided to trade time for peace and certainty, and most importantly, understanding.

The steps were, basically, I got involved in shooting a lot with my Dad, went out shooting every other weekend, which got her used to the idea.

Then, I joined a local shooting club, using other people's guns. Eventually, It became apparent that this was not a fad, or a short lived hobby, but something I would be doing for a long time. It became apparent that it was silly for me to borrow all the time, and that I should have one of my own. She came around to this view, but still did not want one in the house. Eventually, we agreed that I could own a gun so long as it was "not kept in the house."

Fine, my first gun was a Birthday gift from my Dad. I told her that I would keep it at the club, but that it would take a while to get on the waiting list. I showed her the gun (Ruger 77/22, very innocent looking), and showed her how it would break down, barrel off, stock off, bolt out, into a few harmless peices. I told her that if it was in the house, it would be kept in this condition until I could "get room" at the club. She agreed that as long as it was locked up and totally dissassembled, it was safe. I also told her that there was no ammunition in the house. I even put a trigger lock on the dissassembled action! :p

Fast forward a couple months, gun was still in the garage, all broken down, except when I took it to the range. She got used to seeing all the pieces around. She got used to seeing the soft side gun case around. Eventually, in the summer, I bought a little .22 walther from my dad, took it home and dissassembled it. took a handful of barrel, spring and guide rod and told her that I had bought a SMALL pistol, asked her if I could keep these parts home while the frame was elsewhere. Opening my hand, she saw the little collection of harmelss metal, and had to admit that two tubes and a spring was pretty unthreataning.

So, she came to acccept that fact that there were guns in the house, albeit broken down and unloaded. Fall came, and her brother really wanted to go deer hunting with me, and she wanted me to spend time with him and thought it would be fun, me being a city boy and all. Just before the season started, I bought a cheap Mosin M44 and told her it was going to be my Antique hunting rifle, which it was for that year. I was very excited about it, stressing the sheer history of the piece, the 1944 production date, etc. I think I even got her to watch Enemy at the Gates and got her wondering if my rifle had seen action during that time.

The M44 does not break down much, but the bolt comes out, so I told her that the bolt would be locked up and the gun just would be in a case with a trigger lock. She got used to seeing this new gun around, saw my 4 year old son helping me clean it, etc.

At this point, she told me that she realized intellectually that these guns were completely harmless, but that she was suffering from a purely visceral reaction when seeing them, and that was something she just needed time with.

I let time pass, and coming up that winter, one day SHE told ME that we needed a gun safe to store all these guns in! :D :D I knew that her "no guns in the house" policy, which was Ironclad and Absolute the year before, was now broken, as I knew it would be eventually. All you need is the application of logic, starting slow, using baby steps to get her used to the idea of guns in general. More important than any of this though, is you need to give her TIME. It takes time for one to work through their personal demons and fears regarding guns.

Once the safe was in the house, well, I pretty much buy what I want, so long as we can afford it. Her only stipulation is that I don't keep any gun secrets from her. I agree, I don't keep any secrets from her regarding guns, but then again, she doesn't ask me a whole lot about them. :evil:

So my plan worked, from "no guns in the house", to a safe with 5 or 6 handguns and long guns in one year.

Now I'm working on getting her to accept me carrying, but my plan isn't worked out about that yet. :)

-James

SMLE
October 25, 2005, 02:21 AM
In my experence, hoplophobes are totally untrustworthy and if not outright insane, less than fully sane. I would not have a woman who would not be willing to use any means available to defend her children. You do what you have to do, I'd have been out the door after the first fight. That may sound harsh, but I hold that firmly to my principles.

GunnyBob
October 25, 2005, 02:47 AM
Save yourself a lot of grief and for now, capitulate. Let her know that she's won the argument. Tell her you respect her feelings and have decided to forget purchasing a handgun.

Then, a few weeks, or a month from now, bring up the subject again, never forcefully, but in a conversational tone and demeanor. At that point in time discuss it from an intellectual standpoint, never turning it into another disagreement.

Now, most people feel good about themselves when they've won an argument, and feel especially pleased when a spouse is thoughtful enough to see their side of the story to the point that the argument ends without recrimination.

If it still doesn't work, all you can do is keep trying, but never, ever let her see you mad or truly upset because that will reinforce the guns are violent and he wants to be violent thoughts that are in her mind.

Erosion can wear down the mightiest of mountains, and occasionally, even a stubborn, no offense intended, woman.

good luck

silverlance
October 25, 2005, 03:20 AM
How about a muzzleloader? Your wf can't possibly be upset by a "harmless old antique".

heh.

don't tell her about civil war field surgery.

Mixlesplick
October 25, 2005, 04:02 AM
Brought up the issue this past weekend. My attempting to logically explain my reasoning to own a firearm resulted in her:
1. equating me with the rednecks she grew up with, despite an incredible display of bigotry and ignorance on her part
2. stating that she would not want to be associated with anyone who owned a firearm
3. stating that having a piece of metal in the house that fired a bullet was "not who she wanted to be", despite my protests that she never had to touch the thing, much less learn how to use it

These statements all sound like she grew up around people who had attitudes and ideas, and coincidently guns, that she didn't like. Was her marriage to you a way out of a life around the people she didn't like? Does she have her own career and her own identity or is her self image tied closely to yours? Does her attitude about herself come from what kind of man she married, his career and his hobbies? If so, she may see your interest in guns as leading you and her back into a life she was glad to leave.

If this is the case you can try to show her how you are still the same man she married. Tell her you still hold the same values as before but you are now interested in this new hobby that you find enjoyable and know can make you happy for years to come. Buying a gun isn't a reflection on you or her. Don't try to bring up the self-defense and defense of her issue. She may associate that with the "tough guy redneck" attitudes she left behind when she married you. Some people are afraid of violence and don't differentiate between aggression and self defense.

It sounds like she has at least as much of a problem with the preconceived notion of what gun owners are like as she actually does witht the gun itself. You could continue to go shooting weekly with rented and borrowed guns. Let her know you are going shooting and let her see that you are still the same person in the rest of your daily life. Maybe if she sees that you really haven't changed she will come around in the issue of having a gun in the house.

My mom never liked that my dad hunted but it was compartmentalized. The guns were stored in the basement and he took them out for two weeks a year to go deer hunting. He never talked about guns or hunting with her and the only time it really came up was when she put venison burger in the chili she cooked.

Most gun nuts can't live like that but you went into a marriage not being a gun nut or into hunting. If you want to stay in the marriage and own and shoot guns you may have to compartmentalize this part of your life. Shoot guns once a week and if you purchase any keep them in the basement and lock them away for the rest of the week after shooting and cleaning them. Don't show your wife your targets or talk about it a lot but just make it a part of your schedule once a week. She may come to see this as simply a hobby rather than an assault on her values or lifestyle.

Combat-wombat
October 25, 2005, 04:22 AM
Based on my unscientific, limited, anecdotal observations... it seems that relationships where one partner tries to control the other in any significant way do not work. Your wife needs to respect that you are your own person and, although you share your time and living quarters together, you can make your own decisions about your life. If she isn't forced to see the gun or touch it, it's your decision to make. And, of course, this respect is a two way street- you need to give this autonomy to your wife too.

It's all too common for men to be too dominant (not "letting" their wives go somewhere alone, for example), and even more common for women to nag and treat their husband like a child. My neighbors have 2 kids, and what seemed like a healthy relationship, for almost 20 years. However, the wife was a health food nut. She controlled what her husband ate. He literally got up early to give himself time to buy coffee in the morning, because she didn't *allow* it. Other controlling behaviors could easily be seen as well. Anyway, they filed for divorce about a month ago. I can think of several other examples of this type of situation that I've seen in my short life... I can only assume it's a pretty widespread trend.

bg
October 25, 2005, 04:43 AM
No weapon for you, no new shoes for her..

zookrider
October 25, 2005, 05:47 AM
My advice (worth what you paid for it):

1. Reach down into pants and ensure your nuts are still in their rightful place.
2. Inform your wife that you are not a pet, child, slave, employee, or any other entity that is subject to her whim. Let her know that you will be buying a gun and that it will be safely stored. If she wishes to become educated on the operation of this tool and how it can be rendered harmless, then by all means you will assist, otherwise she is free to remain ignorant, it's all the same to you.
3. Go pick out your new gun.

Worked for me, she got over it in a day. YMMV.

Barbara
October 25, 2005, 06:53 AM
(Ever notice you can almost pick out the single guys vs. the married guys in these threads? :D )

KC&97TA
October 25, 2005, 07:01 AM
I didn't ask when I bought the first hand gun, made her go pick it up with me and carry the ammo out of the store. I told her, "it was for her". Only thing she didn't like was the loaded mag in the gun with the "decocking lever off". Although she didn't ask when she bought me a Kimber TLE for my B-day either.

My advice, go pick up a small home safe, not a lock box, like a 1.6 cuft Sentry safe, stick it in the bed room closet. Wait a little bit... then go buy a hand gun and a 22lr coversion for that hand gun... don't hide the bigger caliber, but take her shooting with the 22lr and then pop out the main caliber that came with the gun.

My wife has taught several females how to shoot with the 22lr on the 92fs and then changed over to the 9mm after they were comfortable. Start her off slow, the safe is the best way to get the foot in the door.

280PLUS
October 25, 2005, 07:44 AM
While my wife is not what you would call an avid shooter she HAS given me guns as gifts. I love her soooooooo much :sigh: :D

I say buy the gun and let her decide what to do about it. If you have a strong marraige it will be no more than a bump in the road. If it is a weak marraige, better to find out now. If you kowtow to her every demand she'll get the idea she's the boss. Say something like, "I understand your position on this but I feel very strongly that I would like a gun around here for our defense and I'm afraid that THIS time I will have to go against your wishes." At least that way she'll know she's not going to get her way ALL the time. Maybe even MOST of the time but not ALL! Marraige is supposed to be some semblance of "give and take". This is one time she'll have to give. I will admit, the FIRST thing I moved into the house when we got together was the safe. Maybe start with that and when she asks about it tell her it's for the gun you're buying. Hope this helps.

Doug b
October 25, 2005, 08:42 AM
ago. Adios baby.Life has been grand without her.

triggertime
October 25, 2005, 09:17 AM
Love is grand. Divorce is 20 grand.

You can buy alot of guns with 20 grand...

svtruth
October 25, 2005, 10:04 AM
Have her open a correspondence with pax.

Lupinus
October 25, 2005, 11:38 AM
I like zooks plan lol

balletto
October 25, 2005, 11:48 AM
...I appreciate everyone's opinions.

The funny thing is that this is the only issue that we haven't been able to compromise on, everything else has been pretty easy to work out. A hallmark of our relationship is that we've generally been 'on the same page' about many issues. She votes democrat, I vote republican, but we generally see eye to eye on many things.

Maybe I'm still young and stupid (33), but my wedding vows are still too important to me to give up on the marriage just yet. I understand that getting out early is easier and cheaper than getting out later, but the optimistic side of me isn't ready to give up.

I certainly don't think that we've got a pressing threat to us that would mandate us having a gun and me immediately pushing the situation. We live in a nice neighborhood and town. The vast majority of crimes in the weekly police blotter are DUI's, and shoplifters caught at the local Target.

My next compromise, would be to get my FOID (I live in IL), take a training class, rent handguns occassionally at the local range, and play up the sporting aspects of the hobby. Back when we started this whole mess, she indicated that she would be amenable to my taking up a shooting sport, but not having a gun in the house.

Perhaps if I put a sword under the bed for home defense she'll think differently :what:

Lupinus
October 25, 2005, 11:50 AM
perhaps when you need to defend your home she will think differently

R.H. Lee
October 25, 2005, 11:54 AM
Advice

Have her open a correspondence with pax.
That's the best idea yet.

FPrice
October 25, 2005, 12:19 PM
A hallmark of our relationship is that we've generally been 'on the same page' about many issues. She votes democrat, I vote republican,

That's a rather large difference right there. At least for many people. It shows a marked divergence in how you think about political and social issues and who is responsible for correcting societal problems.

I admire your desire to keep your marital vows intact. That shows a tremendous amount of character. I just hope that you can do both.

ScottsGT
October 25, 2005, 12:26 PM
Perhaps if I put a sword under the bed for home defense she'll think differently

Better idea, Buy a horney pit bull and leave her at home alone with him! She'll welcome the gun real soon!

Lupinus
October 25, 2005, 12:38 PM
scott.....

I can think of things I'd rather leave home with my wife lol

axeman_g
October 25, 2005, 12:40 PM
Your wife sounds exactly like mine... the "why do we need it" defense or "I wont ever be a victim of a serious crime because we live in a nice area".

Get her the book "Armed and Female" by Paxton Quigley. It took my wife two maybe three chapters and she was at the range the next weekend with me.

DO NOT listen to anyone here telling you to divorce your wife. I am sure their lives are just perfect. It sounds like you have a great relationship, cherrish the differences.

dakotasin
October 25, 2005, 01:12 PM
patient, firm, persistence will pay off.

i've converted anti's, and it isn't easy, and it is possible for it to take a looooong time.

shooting sports: try trap... a rem 870 is durable, inexpensive, and busting clays is fun.

iamkris
October 25, 2005, 01:42 PM
I think the best advice here so far has been from Barbara. If this is truely important to you (and it sounds like it is) you need to state that this is important, you will make accomodations to address hert concerns but in the end, it is what you want to do and do it. Continue to work with her to educate...eventually she may come around.

My wife of 13 years wsn't crazy about guns either but we discussed and she realized it was important to me and agreed. I keep them locked in a safe. I have a quick access pistol safe in the bedroom. She has become more accepting as time has gone on because 1) it's important to me, 2) I've stayed true to my word on my promises of safety first and 3) the older we get the more we realize that only we are respopnsible for our safety. If you give in to this, you may hold resentment for a long time.

If she doesn't accept that then she's got the problem not you...who knows what the next issue is that she will be unyielding on. Better to take this on now.

Ky Larry
October 25, 2005, 01:53 PM
Love is grand. Divorce is 20 grand.

You can buy alot of guns with 20 grand...

Which is worth more: A few months salary or a lifetime of misery?
Seriously, I have a problem with ultimatums. I was always the kid who would accept a dare, even when I knew better. I can't tell you what to do but I know I could never live with a woman who tried to controll my behavior. As my mother-in-law recently told me,"You just don't mind worth a damn, do you?"

Ryder
October 25, 2005, 02:06 PM
Try buying a dart board. When she gets good and worked up over the holes in the wall tell her tossing bullets down at the range would be a good trade off. If she doesn't mind the little holes in the walls switch to throwing knives. :D

In any event if you get good enough with those they'd make dandy self-defense weapons themselves.

XLMiguel
October 25, 2005, 02:45 PM
We live in a nice neighborhood and town

Ummm, that's where the bad guys like to 'shop'. Geography has little to do with safety, bad stuff can (and does) happen) any/everywhere. Your (and her) personal safety is your responsibility.

I hope you can work things out, but her refusal to even discuss it is not a good sign. Give it your best shot, but remember, ther reason divorce is so expensive is because [when it's necessary,] it's worth it. Good luck, best wishes for a good life.

Lupinus
October 25, 2005, 03:01 PM
Get the gun she is being unreasonable.

If she at least offered a good reason but just refusing to even talk about it or compromise is unreasonable.

johnnymenudo
October 25, 2005, 03:08 PM
I don't see this as being that much different than anything else one party might not want, that the other might want. Kids, a dog that sheds a lot, cats, a motorcycle, etc. Ask her point blank - what is going to happen someday if she wants something for herself or the home that you don't want? Ask her point blank if you want to get a gun and do, what will her response be. This will probably make things pretty clear.

JM

torpid
October 25, 2005, 03:31 PM
scout26
Next time something go "bump" in the night, tell her to go investigate.

+1 ;)

pax
October 25, 2005, 03:39 PM
balletto ~

If you wanted to buy yourself some personal item, you'd probably have simply bought it and brought it into the house -- without asking her permission & approval. By asking her permission to buy yourself a gun, you gave her veto power. Now you're unhappy because she's used her veto, and she's going to be unhappy if you break the veto.

Your first post had a telling quote from your wife, that owning a gun was "not who she wanted to be." But she wouldn't be owning the gun. You would.

Both your behavior (asking for permission) and her belief (that your owning a gun says something about who she is) indicate that there's a boundary problem in your relationship. Right now, because you generally agree on most things, the boundary problem is minor, and only affects whether or not you purchase a piece of property. But if you ignore it now, it will get bigger and will become a major problem in years down the road.

If it were a girlfriend instead of a wife, I'd say you should simply buy a gun and let the chips fall where they may. Such a shock treatment often works to establish where the personal boundaries are -- and when it doesn't, at least it puts an end to an unhealthy relationship. But since you take your vows seriously, I recommend that you get yourselves to a marriage counselor, quickly. That boundary problem is only going to get worse if you don't get it straightened out.

pax

Nekron
October 25, 2005, 03:59 PM
A spouse who draws that kind of "line in the sand" deserves to be an ex-spouse, IMO.

If you fall prey to that tactic of hers, other ultimatums won't be far behind. It just all depends on how much of your individuality you're willing to part with.

If she starts picking out matching outfits for the two of you, RUN!! :eek:

:D

Grump
October 25, 2005, 04:00 PM
Dealing with your two reasons:

1. Hobby. Frequent the range once a month and shoot a rental handgun. Maybe if you feel like it, show her your best targets and your rental receipts so she knows you're not BUYING a gun. See how that flies.

With trap, that's a bit more problematical, maybe. Are there rentals at shotgun facilities? I'm not a clay birder, so I just don't know--but I'm sure you can BORROW a new-found friend's smoothbore once every other month or so during what we might call a trial period.

2. Self-defense. Okay, no gun, so start buying pepper sprays for each keyring and each car and ask if she wants to attend some martial arts classes. Do a risk walk-through the house with her and re-assess how the kitchen knives are so easily picked up on the way to your bedroom. Discuss the dynamics of recent newspaper reports of home invasions and candidly assess the quality of both her friends and your friends and whatever party/drinking habits you know of. Bring her some TASER literature and articles criticizing TASERs and reporting the rare deaths they cause. Bring home articles recounting failures of TASERs and PR-24s (Remember Rodney King's beating?!?!?!) and pepper sprays and the now-moribund CS and CS sprays.

Be prepared to either spend $$$ on a biometric safe or one of those mostly-reliable quickie-unlock devices, or just commit to CCW inside your house all the time, still with some sort of lock for your sleep time.

Also freely acknowledge to your wife that SD scenarios are very rare and are best avoided by living a low-risk lifestyle (no drugs, no cheating on each other (jealous sex partners of your paramour are deadly!), no hanging out with druggies, and no boozing at your house except perhaps with ONE trusted friend or couple, and no other criminal activity). But point out the instances when truly clean people had their peace violated by a criminal. One of my favorites was an elderly couple in Henderson, NV who were severely beaten by an escaped prisoner who just happened to find their home as the nearest potential hideaway in the early (IIRC) 1980s. Prisoner transports between UT and AZ since that time have STOPPED their practice of leaving the cuffed subjects unsupervised in the locked van while getting gas and bathroom breaks at that gas station. Me, I'd still be more comfortable knowing I had an unused gun locked up somewhere and a *ghost* of a chance of getting that into action. I can live with that irony. Being totally de-fanged sucks.

You may share my post with her, if you are still married...

Igloodude
October 25, 2005, 04:12 PM
My recommendation parallels Jamz's for the most part (and sorry for the blurry pronouning below).

The first thing I'd do is sit down with her and explain that her refusal to even discuss the matter is straining your relationship and goes against the agreement (in spirit at least) that you both made a few years ago. I wouldn't even discuss the aspects of the gun-stuff, focus on the process and her lack of participation in it. Then (at the end of that discussion, or in a later one) I'd explain that I'm joining a league (trap, bullseye, whatever) and will use a rented or borrowed gun kept at the range for it. Either then or later, depending on reaction, I'd bring up practicing at home a little bit (this works better for bullseye leagues than trap leagues) I'm going to bring home a pellet gun. Pellets aren't bullets, see? They're certainly not fatal. I'll handle and store it exactly as I would a "real" gun, though, in deference to her sensitivities. If she wants to get divorced over a pellet gun, well, there's not much I can do about that, but perhaps marriage counseling really is a good idea in that case.

dk-corriveau
October 25, 2005, 04:14 PM
Balletto,

This is a tough situation. My wife is not anti-gun, but she wants nothing to do with them all together. When I brought the first gun, an M1 Garand :D , into the house, she was clearly uncomfortable. This is something that I understand; she came from a liberal family where guns were very taboo. That being said she has come around.

First and foremost, she sees how much I enjoy my shooting, both on a physical level (going to the range and shooting) but also on an intellectual level (I’m always reading gun stuff and learning about gun/ammo design). Knowing how much I enjoy my sport, she has come around to support all of my gun habits/purchases/activities.

Furthermore, she has come to agree with my thinking on self-defense and the RKBA. That being said, I have not been able to get her out to the range to learn how to use on yet, but I am still working on it. I figure once I get my son shooting (he’s only 15 months old) that will be the time to get her involved too.

In fact, she will go the occasional gun show with me and at one recently I showed her a Springer XD-9 and when she saw the $450 price tag, she said, “You want one, that is about half the cost of your other guns.” I should have snapped it up, but I was just window shopping.

I general approach would be to continue your research into the shooting sports and expand it slowly until she comes around to the idea that this isn’t some type of snap decision. Here is I did:

1. Get some shooting friends and shoot with them as often as possible. Perhaps seeing the enjoyment the sport gives you she will some around. Bring home your target to show her how good/poorly you shot and how you are improving.

2. Join the NRA. This may put her over the top, but it will demonstrate your support of your rights and will allow you to get American Rifleman once a month. Having reading material around may reinforce your commitment to shooting.

3. Go to gun shows. I know that this will be tough if your wife isn’t ready to let you bring something home, but you will enjoy yourself and she will get the idea that you are continuing your interest in this sport.

Regardless, this is a very touchy situation and you should take as much time as is necessary. I had been with my wife probably 7 years before I brought the M1 home and it took about 6 months of working on her before I thought she was comfortable enough with it for me to pull the trigger. It was quickly followed with my childhood .22 that I picked up form my parents. In the past two years, I have added three handguns to the home and I carry daily. Hopefully she will come around with a little guidance and understanding. It sounds like you are very respectful of her viewpoints and concerns and that makes me think that this can be done, it just might take a while.

I will warn you though, like tattoos, guns are addicting and you should be comfortable with buying multiple before you buy the first, because there is no turning back. My wife jokes about my obsession, but is happy that it makes me happy. Hopefully your wife will find that place as well.

silverbird
October 25, 2005, 04:17 PM
We all hopped on this particular merry-go-round a few weeks ago with another guy having the same problem with his girlfriend.
Who would that be? LOL

These guys have a lot of good opinions, but if your wife is anything like my girl, you are in for a bumpy ride.

I just bought the damn gun. Happy I did too. Then I went out and bought a rifle. I shoot about every other week or so, and have a great time doing so. Get the gun if you feel you need it. If you all like each other enough, it will work out (after a few longgggg, uncomfortable arguments that go nowhere). Eventually things will settle down to normal, tensions will ease, and she will become indifferent. Just be respectful and try to keep it out of her sight, make sure she knows where it is so she doesn't accidently stumble into it (unless there's a high risk of her taking it and selling it), and try to keep a low profile when going shooting.

I was in the same boat, more or less when I started getting into this a couple of years ago. I decided on a year long plan which would get me from "No guns in the house, don't own one" to having a gun safe with rifles and handguns. This plan started more or less when I joined THR, so fall of 2003.

I fully understand the desire for domestic harmony, which is why I ignored the "buy a gun, ride out the storm" advice. It will work, but the payment is pretty high. I'm also fairly sure that a lot of people here haven't found the right woman who is just the best except in this one case. Putting your foot down and just buying a gun to a hoplophobe is something they are going to resent for a long long time. I'm a very patient guy, so I decided to trade time for peace and certainty, and most importantly, understanding.

The steps were, basically, I got involved in shooting a lot with my Dad, went out shooting every other weekend, which got her used to the idea.

Then, I joined a local shooting club, using other people's guns. Eventually, It became apparent that this was not a fad, or a short lived hobby, but something I would be doing for a long time. It became apparent that it was silly for me to borrow all the time, and that I should have one of my own. She came around to this view, but still did not want one in the house. Eventually, we agreed that I could own a gun so long as it was "not kept in the house."

Fine, my first gun was a Birthday gift from my Dad. I told her that I would keep it at the club, but that it would take a while to get on the waiting list. I showed her the gun (Ruger 77/22, very innocent looking), and showed her how it would break down, barrel off, stock off, bolt out, into a few harmless peices. I told her that if it was in the house, it would be kept in this condition until I could "get room" at the club. She agreed that as long as it was locked up and totally dissassembled, it was safe. I also told her that there was no ammunition in the house. I even put a trigger lock on the dissassembled action! :p

Fast forward a couple months, gun was still in the garage, all broken down, except when I took it to the range. She got used to seeing all the pieces around. She got used to seeing the soft side gun case around. Eventually, in the summer, I bought a little .22 walther from my dad, took it home and dissassembled it. took a handful of barrel, spring and guide rod and told her that I had bought a SMALL pistol, asked her if I could keep these parts home while the frame was elsewhere. Opening my hand, she saw the little collection of harmelss metal, and had to admit that two tubes and a spring was pretty unthreataning.

So, she came to acccept that fact that there were guns in the house, albeit broken down and unloaded. Fall came, and her brother really wanted to go deer hunting with me, and she wanted me to spend time with him and thought it would be fun, me being a city boy and all. Just before the season started, I bought a cheap Mosin M44 and told her it was going to be my Antique hunting rifle, which it was for that year. I was very excited about it, stressing the sheer history of the piece, the 1944 production date, etc. I think I even got her to watch Enemy at the Gates and got her wondering if my rifle had seen action during that time.

The M44 does not break down much, but the bolt comes out, so I told her that the bolt would be locked up and the gun just would be in a case with a trigger lock. She got used to seeing this new gun around, saw my 4 year old son helping me clean it, etc.

At this point, she told me that she realized intellectually that these guns were completely harmless, but that she was suffering from a purely visceral reaction when seeing them, and that was something she just needed time with.

I let time pass, and coming up that winter, one day SHE told ME that we needed a gun safe to store all these guns in! :D :D I knew that her "no guns in the house" policy, which was Ironclad and Absolute the year before, was now broken, as I knew it would be eventually. All you need is the application of logic, starting slow, using baby steps to get her used to the idea of guns in general. More important than any of this though, is you need to give her TIME. It takes time for one to work through their personal demons and fears regarding guns.

Once the safe was in the house, well, I pretty much buy what I want, so long as we can afford it. Her only stipulation is that I don't keep any gun secrets from her. I agree, I don't keep any secrets from her regarding guns, but then again, she doesn't ask me a whole lot about them. :evil:

So my plan worked, from "no guns in the house", to a safe with 5 or 6 handguns and long guns in one year.

Now I'm working on getting her to accept me carrying, but my plan isn't worked out about that yet. :)

-James


Best plan ever, right there. I didn't have the time (or patience) to gamble with that plan though, so I went my own route.

20cows
October 25, 2005, 04:22 PM
Perhaps if I put a sword under the bed for home defense she'll think differently
It's a start. Make it a BIG, ugly, two handed jagged edged head lopper.:D It would make a gun look so much more.... civilized.:)

280PLUS
October 25, 2005, 04:36 PM
Right now, because you generally agree on most things, the boundary problem is minor, and only affects whether or not you purchase a piece of property. But if you ignore it now, it will get bigger and will become a major problem in years down the road.

+1

I think that's what I was trying to say...

MAUSER88
October 25, 2005, 04:42 PM
I guess she wears the pants in the family, huh???:rolleyes:

Chrontius
October 25, 2005, 05:16 PM
Thats really, really wierd balletto. Her ignorance (please take no offence) must truly be deeply ingrained.

Will she even look at guns? Maybe the literature idea isnt that bad, assuming she will even read it.

I have an idea! Take her here! Let the smarter, more eloquent speakers (some of the mods) among us send their arguments.

My most effective argument was printing out a copy of Gunfacts 4.0 (http://gunfacts.info/) and inserting post-it tabs at the reply to every single argument thrown at me, with everything down the right hand side and the really important stuff along the top. This was left lying on the dining room table.

I have managed to "open a dialogue" which will involve going to the local gun range and renting a .22 this weekend.

I'm intending to find my mother a Taurus PT22 with pink grips, possibly getting it engraved as "PINK HAMMER" or something like that based on an economics discussion about a month ago (Hardware, loss leaders, and females taking charge of interior decorating... long story)


And if she gives you a hard time about it... give her a good spanking.

Art's Grammaw! Art's poor grammaw!


What sort of gun do I want to buy?
A .22 pistol to start with, hopefully a 9mm later on. A full-on AR would be cool of course, but I'm willing to start small.

Have I always wanted to own firearms?
No, this is something that I've developed over the past few years. I was somewhat anti-gun actually when we met.

We don't have kids, so that's not an issue.

I'm not about to lie to her, but her willful ignorance isn't helping the situation either.

Seriously look into pink (or bright yellow or...) furniture for that -- see Oleg's 'teaching responsibility' posters for an example. It might help dampen the inevitable gut reaction should she agree but still have reservations about it.

WarMachine
October 25, 2005, 05:20 PM
You firearm ownership has not and probably will not bring any harm upon your family. If she can't respect your hobby, I don't know what to tell you. I find it EXTREMELY difficult reason with individuals who are unwilling to be rational. They let their passion and prejudices override their better judgement, and it does nothing but makes me heated :fire:

balletto
October 25, 2005, 05:23 PM
I'm better at making (and accepting) the difficult decisions, but she's more effective at whining until she gets her way. Or maybe I have a lesser tolerance for listening to the complaints before I give in :(

I'm now thinking that getting some counseling is the way to go. Having a third party mediate the issue may help meaningful conversation get started, which is our most immediate problem, as I see it. I'm pretty confident that once she actually starts listening to the facts of the matter, and the seriousness of my safety intentions are made clear, she'll come around. I hope.

Of course, the prospect of bringing someone as anti as her into the mix may do more harm then good.

Lemon328i
October 25, 2005, 05:35 PM
If it is your money that is going into buying the firearm, then it is your right to do so. I would suggest that you also purchase a gun safe to properly secure the firearm and simply do not tell her the combination number. She will always be safe from that "evil" firearm while you are not home. Go on as many out of town business trips as you can during the winter. Remind her that there is no way she can get to the firearm should something happen; she should be sure to have a phone handy to call the police and wait for help.

shooterIII
October 25, 2005, 05:45 PM
balletto

One of the previous posters said join the NRA. That is good advice, and also subscribe to other shooting magazines like Outdoor Life, Rifleshooter, Trap and Field or whatever, etc.
You don't have to buy the firearm right away, but you are showing that you enjoy the shooting field. Let the magazines lay around and maybe when you are not around she will look at them. The magazines laying around just might start her on the way to mentally accepting the idea. As far as shooting, I am an avid trap shooter and trap shooters are a great bunch of people. If you went to a trap range and talked to a board member or someone behind the sign up counter and said that you had a spouse that didn't want a gun in the house, would it be possible to rent a gun or borrow one to shoot. I have borrowed some of my guns to ladies, kids, and other people that came to the club. It was rewarding to me to see these people enjoy them selves.

Try it, it might work.

Werewolf
October 25, 2005, 05:56 PM
belleto told us that:I'm now thinking that getting some counseling is the way to go. Having a third party mediate the issue may help meaningful conversation get started,Friend, you still don't get it. The issue is not the gun. The issue is that your wife is dictating to you what you can and cannot buy.

Counseling is in order if the problem cannot be resolved internally but make sure when you go to counseling that the problem is defined correctly. The counselor isn't their to adjucate specific issues. The counselor is there to help you and your spouse solve a marital problem.

If you go to the counselor with the specific issue and that counselor is anti-gun (very good chance of that IMO) you'll become the problem and not the real issue which is:

A marriage is a partnership - not a dictatorship.

Z_Infidel
October 25, 2005, 05:58 PM
For any person to be as opposed to gun ownership as your wife, that person must not only reject the object of the gun itself but also the American traditions of gun ownership and self reliance. It is a deep and important issue that is about not only control within the marriage but also core beliefs and values. The prospect of ending a marriage is pretty heavy, but you must draw a line in the sand with respect to your own personal convictions. Be sure of your reasoning before you make a decision either way.

cowboy77845
October 25, 2005, 06:05 PM
You are not going to change her mind. Reason does not enter the discussion. If you want a gun, get one and let the chips fall where they may. You may be happy now but as time goes on this will become an issue. Undiscussed maybe, but an issue. And it will grow bigger and bigger in your mind. YOU ARE AN ADULT, SHE IS TREATING YOU AS A CHILD.

pax
October 25, 2005, 06:20 PM
Counseling is in order if the problem cannot be resolved internally but make sure when you go to counseling that the problem is defined correctly. The counselor isn't their to adjucate specific issues. The counselor is there to help you and your spouse solve a marital problem.
+1

edited to add: despite all the chest-pounding, it's not about "who wears the pants in the family" or anything that macho. It is simply that you and your wife need to work out, now, where "she" ends and "you" begin. You're both stepping on each other's boundaries.

pax

Average Joe
October 25, 2005, 06:31 PM
Be a man, and just buy the dam thing! Any married man, that has to ask his wife's permission to buy something, is not a man, but a child..

Wastemore
October 25, 2005, 06:47 PM
I'd rather have a disappointed wife than a dead wife...

Jim Watson
October 25, 2005, 07:01 PM
I am not married - and gladder of it most every day - but can suggest you go to
http://www.john-ross.net/ross_in_range.htm
and read articles 14, 24, 28, 29, 42, 43, 44, and any he references in those. He is extremely cynical about marriage but he makes a lot of good points and I can see from your (balleto's) posts and his articles where you are headed.
Let us know if you arrive at a decision, be it counselling, knuckling under, or asserting yourself; and how it works out. It might help the next guy picking or dealing with a wife.

Flatfender
October 25, 2005, 09:01 PM
Idea! Take her paintballing. Airguns. Ease into it. Arguing will not persuade her. Just do it. She's a gun virgin.

My wife, of 27 years, isn't into guns. She will target shoot a .22 and casual clay shoot in the back yard, if I catch her in the right mood.

Other than that, she see no purpose in them. The other day she asked me when I was going to "grow out of your gun thing". She already knew the answer and just laughed.

mole
October 25, 2005, 10:58 PM
Sometimes it's easier to ask for forgiveness than for permission. :evil:
If I recall correctly---correct me if I'm wrong please---blackpower guns aren't considered "firearms". Get yourself a blackpowder revolver and sneak by on a technicality.;)

Joey2
October 25, 2005, 11:02 PM
If my wife of almost 40 yrs. took that stance way back when she would of been my "ex" of 40 yrs.

The soft line would be to tell her no sex until you gun safe (which you buy ahead of time)is full of all the weapons you want.

If that apporach don't work make plans for escape and evasion out of the marriage. Slowly sneak assets out of the house and into safekeeping elsewhere. Take a lower paying job that will keep your support down. You do this after you have quietly squeezed as much money and assets away from the home without her knowing or being able to find out.

This will take maybe months, but it will be worth it in the long run.

A man does not need a woman all over his _ss for petty s-it.

DontBurnMyFlag
October 25, 2005, 11:06 PM
i am sure youve got some great advice already. i was in the same sitauation with my girlfriend. we comprimised. she doesnt care that I have a gun as long as it is locked up in my parents house (their wishes) and that she doenst hear about me owning them. I just keep my mouth shut, dont bug her about what gun I just bought, and we get along fine. she went to the range recently wiht me to watch. :)

HI express
October 25, 2005, 11:39 PM
One thing I've learned from THR is that is an important question to ask before going steady. After you marry ...then you decide if it is a battle to fight over...then the question is having a gun more important than being married to the lady?.

Personally, Both my wife and I have been in situations, both together and separately where a gun was important in not letting the situation escalate.

One situation was where my daughter came close to being kidnapped when she was about 5 years old.

Your choice. Your life.

garrett1955
October 26, 2005, 12:02 AM
One thing I've learned from THR is that is an important question to ask before going steady. After you marry ...then you decide if it is a battle to fight over...then the question is having a gun more important than being married to the lady?.

Personally, Both my wife and I have been in situations, both together and separately where a gun was important in not letting the situation escalate.

One situation was where my daughter came close to being kidnapped when she was about 5 years old.

Your choice. Your life.



yes sir, i also have learned that, make shur they like, or allow guns... or else....

AnthonyRSS
October 26, 2005, 12:08 AM
For the life of me I cannot understand how anyone can hateor be afeared of guns. At their most basic, they are just a tool.
My father cut his thumb off with a table saw a while back but has never shot himself accidently. Which tool is more dangerous?
(Rhetorical, neither, really.)
I understand being afraid of dogs- you cannot control them sometimes. etc etc

I can't see any remotely reasonable reason why someone would hate guns.

People get their panties in a wad over nothing. Not you, balleto, your poor wife.
Good luck

Anthony

Jackthelad
October 26, 2005, 12:10 AM
:) Don't give up!! My wife grew up in Hudson, Ohio, in a VERY anti gun household. I went through the same thing with her a few years ago, but went out and bought a shotgun I wanted anyways. As you can see from the pic taken on the day I brought it home, she was NOT HAPPY. After I showed her what a responsible gun owner I was, despite the media, and that the "evil gun" would not steal her breath while she slept, she slowly became very accepting. After seeing how much fun I was having shooting skeet with a buddy and his wife, she came along. Then she moved into handguns with me and has gone to the range with me. I have since obtained my CHL. Now, when I do not go out armed, she gives me that look, "Why aren't you taking your gun?" SHOW her that you are a responsible gun owner. I never thought my wife would change, but she has- and even defends me to her family.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y210/jackthelad/081802013.jpg

EddieCoyle
October 26, 2005, 12:19 AM
I'm now thinking that getting some counseling is the way to go.
Bad idea. If the couselor even hints at agreeing with you, your wife will dig in her heels and fight you tooth and nail. If the counselor is anti-gun, she'll validate your wife's perception and the counselor is likey to start working to "cure" you.

One of the previous posters said join the NRA. That is good advice
Very bad idea. You said that she's a Democrat. She probably sees the NRA as the enemy and "that's not who she is." Again, the ganging up on her thing won't work. She sounds like the "dig in her heels" type.

I'm not about to give you relationship advice. I'm divorced (but have a very good relationship with my GF). My ex was rabidly anti-gun and took a similar stance with me. I "took a break" from shooting sports long enough for our marriage to dissolve. Her anti-gun stance was not the first or only uncompromisable position she took, it was however indicative of the way she wanted our relationship to be. I saw it different and we ended up parting ways.

Ironically, she's starting to come around now (just for the record, I'm not regretting the divorce - even if she were to start carrying we did the right thing by splitting up). Two things caused her to soften her stance.

1. She works in the city and takes the subway to and from a garage where she parks. She somehow attracted a street-person stalker that gradually got bolder and bolder. Finally, he followed her home on the subway. She called me because I was near her stop and she was scared with a capital "S". I showed up and talked to the guy, he left (and hasn't bothered her since) and I escorted her to her car. She remarked that she thought the guy was intimidated by my confidence (big guy, I go 200lbs and he was bigger than me) and asked why I wasn't scared in confronting him. I opened my coat and showed her the S&W 4506 on my hip and told her, "This is why." That was both an explanation, and an answer to her age-old question of "Why do you need a gun?"

2. We have kids. My 12 year old son is interested in guns. He'd gone shooting with one of his friends and the kid's father. I know the guy and he's a knucklehead. To make sure he learned right, I started taking him to the range and let him shoot with me. I figure it's much better he learn from me than from an often-drunk Dirty Harry wannabee. My son has since tried most of the guns that I own and I bought him a Taurus copy of a Winchester .22 pump-action gallery gun for his last birthday. When my ex found out about our trips to the range she was apoplectic.

See, she imagined that the range was a place where rednecks shoot it up like an Iraqi wedding. I offered to take her and my boy to the range so she could see what it was like. To my surprise, she agreed. On the ride over, I quizzed my son on the 4 rules (he nailed 'em). We got there and we were the only ones there. This is typical. We were there on a weekday and I explained to her that we usually had the place to ourselves. I put up a few targets and handed her a Ruger MK III, showed her how to put in the magazine and pull back the bolt and let her rip. She fired off 10 shots and wanted to try again. She's getting hooked. Incidently, my boy put 8 rounds out of my .45 in a group the size of my hand. What can I say - I'm a proud parent.

Anyhoo, sorry for the long-winded explanation but if I were you, I'd continue to take classes, join and go to a range/gun club. Don't get a gun of your own yet. Do not leave gun magazines around the house because she's likely to pick one up and read one of Cooper's columns and turn off. She sounds like she's left-leaning and might use the right wing Cooper-esque stuff to validate her position.

Instead, I'd try to emphasize the precision, technical aspects of the shooting sports. If you join a club, you may find that there are some actual liberals that shoot there. If you want to use the social aspect to get your wife involved see if you get along with the lefties and hang out with them. I know a bunch (here in Mass they're the majority - even at the gun club). They're some of the most knowledgable people I've met, plus they're fun to argue with. Right now, I'm learning to handload from a Kerry campaign worker. (Read that line again - amazin' ain't it?).

It sounds like she associates shooting and guns with something very negative from her past. You gotta show her different.

Good luck.

One last dig: If you let her shove you around on this, it's likely to happen again. I don't know you and I don't know her, but I'd bet everything I own on it.

mr.trooper
October 26, 2005, 01:24 AM
Hey man. Let me see if i can offer a smidge of advice?

I dont know if this is your "style" or not, but its what i would do if my GF gave me this kind of greef.

One night after supper, help her do the dishes. GIve her a hug and let her know you love her. About an Hour or so later, tell her you need tot alk to her. Be the leader in this conversation; firm, but gentle. It is utterly important that she feels confortable talking to you; an important thing under any circumstances, but especial so at this point. :)

in a calm firm voice, tell her:

1) You ARE going to buy a gun EVENTUALY. Don't let her get histerical on you. You mentioned you want a .22lr revolver. Be sure to tell her this, and make sure she know that this is a gun cappable of little else that killing squirels, and punching holes in paper.

2) Make sure she knows that you are NOT going to go hillbilly on her, and start shooting stop signes, and sitting on you porch drinking with a shotgun and a banjo. :D

3) Re-emphasise that you have her best interests in mind.

4) GO BUY A GUN. Do it with no fan fair. Pick it up after work, and when you get home, put it strait away, and lock it up. If she happens to notice, and goes ballistic, just remain calm and continue buisness as usual.

Even if she does go hysterical, it WILL blow over. IF she is REALY stubron, she might remember it in the morning. if She is REALY REALY stubron, she will still be over it after two days of you coninuing to be a loving husband.

If the unthinkable and exoribantly unlikely happens and she actualy LEAVS, Then Im sorry my friend, But she would have done it over the NEXT issue she has some paranoid dillusion about. :(

silverlance
October 26, 2005, 02:20 AM
pax is so wise & deconstructive! yay pax!

...

that picture is worth a thousand words, jackthelad. the expression on your girl's face is several pages long and ends with "ewww.....harumph!"

The Tourist
October 26, 2005, 03:06 AM
This topic came up on another forum, a concealed carry issue. The topic focused on how a woman's new fiance' felt about concealed carry, her rights, and his ability to accept it. The fact that this issue was a "deal breaker."

I'm all for rights, but coerced freedom isn't really free. And that brings up the aspect of the 'deal breaker.'

If you buy a gun and she leaves you then her love was conditional. That 'condition' could be anything--money, children, style of home--but in your case it was a firearm.

The crux is not the metal implement, but how you feel about its worth and the worth of your wife. My opinion on the issue means nothing.

later it might be a motorcycle

Okay, now we're just talking crazy. Leave her. Get far from her. I recommend buying the V-Rod. As a traditional Harley owner, I dislke the bike, but it is faster and accelerates harder for the necessity of the getaway from this emotional succubus.

OEF_VET
October 26, 2005, 03:44 AM
Hey, I know a great divorce lawyer. My ex-wife used her.

Seriously, you two have bigger issues beyond gun ownership. You need to do something fast, before it gets worse. If she won't concede to you owning a tool necessary for a hobby you enjoy, how do you think she is going to react when you have children and have a difference of opinion on how to raise them?

I don't mean this to be offensive, so please don't take it that way. However, you really need to put your foot down now and show her that you have just as much of a backbone as she. She's definitely displaying some stubbornness here. Between the lack of willingness to accept your hobby/interests, her unfaltering will to not discuss the issue, and her inability to trust that you can be a gun owner without being a "redneck", I get the feeling that she's a very stubborn person who is unable to accept the fact that her opinion just might be wrong. If you don't stop this trend now, you'll never be able to stop it.

You have a major decision to make, and it's not whether or not you are going to buy a gun. You need to decide if you want to be a partner in your marriage, or do you want to be a subordinate? Are you going to MAKE your wife discuss issues, or are you going to allow her to refuse to discuss them, thereby letting her get her way? If she's allowed to win by refusing to discuss this issue, she'll continue to use that tactic for the rest of your lives. Why should she change tactics if she's using a successful one now?

There is always a third option, divorce. Sometimes it is the right option, but not always. If you can get her to calmly and rationally discuss the issue, you'll be much better off in the long run. However, if she can't be brought around, you might want to think about how happy you want to be during your lifetime. If you do divorce, be smart about it. Pay off all of your credit cards and close the accounts before you ask for the divorce. "Sell" to your friends any items you don't want to lose to her. Just have your friends agree to "sell" them back to you a few months after the divorce is final. Don't allow yourself to get into a situation where a judge orders you to sell things which have sentimental value, just to give her some money.

Whatever happens, I hope your couch is comfortable. Because, I have a feeling that you'll be spending some time on it. That or you'll just get weak in the knees and let her dominate you until six of your friends are hauling your pine box to the cemetary.

Good luck,
Frank

FPrice
October 26, 2005, 01:05 PM
I don't know if anyone else has seen this thread:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=1992955#post1992955

It's about a guy who ended up having to say good-bye to his gf who had a similar attitude towards guns.

Hemicuda
October 26, 2005, 02:34 PM
Best bet, own the guns already when you meet a girl... if things look good, and start to get more serious, then let it be known that you are a gun owner...

(I know, too late in this situation.)

my gf (of 14 years) was not a total anti, but wasn't "warm" twards guns when we met... but she liked me well enough to tolerate my guns... fast forward 14 years, i no longer have a gunsafe, i have converted a walk-in closet (used to be hers, where she kept her clothes and shoes) into a safe-room, with a safe door and all... this happened at HER sugguestion... when she realized i needed another safe because the 3 i had were not enough...

she still doesn't own a gun, but when we go out, she checks to see if im printing, and if she doesn't seee evidence, she asks where and what i am carrying... and she buys me gun stuff all the time... (and she isn't bashful about shooting MY guns...)

as was said, open communication and TIME are what'll cure this problm you have...

DarthBubba
October 26, 2005, 03:07 PM
Now that I think about it,

Let the door hit her in the A** on the way out.

DarthBubba:D

AZ Heat
October 26, 2005, 03:10 PM
I went through the same thing. Here is some more free advice that worked for me...

Watch the news together. Every home invasion, robbery, rape and other crap that happens, bring it up and discuss it. I'm talking about EVERY story! This is opening her eyes and pretty much scaring her with the realities of the world.

My wife never really "heard" these stories and thought about them. Every time a home invasion happened, anywhere in the country, my wife heard about it from me. Then she started hearing about it all the time locally. It is because of something in the brain called the Reticular Activation Center. Kinda like when you buy a new car, all of a sudden everyone has the same car. Or if your wife is pregnant, all of a sudden there are tons of pregnant women around. When these things start coming into her mind, she hears about them everywhere. It is awareness.

After my wife started seeing the crap that happens in the world, she became very accepting and comforted with the idea of having a gun around. She expected me to carry when we went out and asked me to get one out for her when I was going to be out late. After you have accomplished this, turn the news off and stop talking about the crap (after you are prepared). Watching this stuff all the time becomes depressing.

I used this same tactic to get me a new dog too (for protection of course ;) ). It works on many levels. Whether you think this is a good thing or not, my intentions were based upon protecting my family. YMMV.

Good luck! Convert her the right way and she will be a great support for you.

**Also, don't take her out shooting with a .45 and 12g for the first time, this delayed progress for me for about 6 months. Now her favorite is the .357.:D

Flatfender
October 26, 2005, 07:53 PM
Today on NRA News with Cam Edwards, he had a women caller (at about 45 minutes into the 1st hour) that had a very anti-gun daughter (that was a total wreck whenever she brought the grandkids over) and told how she turned her daughter around towards the light.

They only have the replays for 24 hrs, so try to catch it.

http://www.nranews.com/nra.html

c3006
October 26, 2005, 08:09 PM
On our second date many years ago I had to get on the brakes of my datsun truck hard resulting in my 1911 slideing out from under the seat. She said eewww is that a gun I hate guns. She is now the cowner of our gunshop:)

Flatfender
October 26, 2005, 08:12 PM
Her Name is Lori Lee Dovey with Womens Outlook Magazine. The article she wrote is called "Friendly Persuasion: Make Your Points with Anti-Gunners Through Relaxed Dialog and Education"

Cam said that his wife is an "Absolute Hoplophobe" :D

FYI - Woman's Outlook is a NRA publication so maybe someone here has a copy.

Flatfender
October 26, 2005, 08:14 PM
Buy her an NRA membership! ;)

http://www.nramagazines.org/womansoutlook.html

Flatfender
October 26, 2005, 08:19 PM
OK - I'm shutting up on this thread. Right after this.

I know the NRA isn't everyone's cup of tea, but they do have some good programs aimed at women.

http://www.nrahq.org/women/

Shutting up now. :neener:

Joey2
October 26, 2005, 10:54 PM
I have been thinking that maybe she is using this as a control issue. She is controlling you and seeing how far she can go.

GunGoBoom
October 27, 2005, 12:11 AM
Ask her to please read this thread in its entirety - maybe she'll see gun owners are not all neanderthals (are we?). Oh, yeah, on the women & guns things, tell her that the pres of NRA is a woman, Sandra Froman, as was at least 1 other past president, Marion Hammer, for what that is worth.

PCGS65
October 27, 2005, 02:16 AM
Be carefull, if you get one against her will she might get mad enough to use it on you. You make the call.........:uhoh:

owsi26
October 27, 2005, 10:56 AM
Make it about HER. Tell her how much you love her and want to protect her, how you couldn't live without her. Go through what could happen if you had a home invasion, you dead or gravely injured and her raped, then killed. ask her to explain how could you possibly defend her with fists against several guys, or even one nut with a bat, knive, gun, etc.

She may counter with just calling 911. Explain that by the time help arrived, it would all be over. Only you are responsible for your safety, not the police.

What would she do if she was assulted in a parking lot? How could she keep from being carjacked, kidnapped, raped or mudered? Point out such true-life stories in the media. Find some where guns saved lives.

Give some thought as to what you want to say and her possible responses. Have your replies already thought out. Common sense is on your side. If she is that afraid of a gun sitting in a drawer, with a lock on it and only you have the key, tell her how afraid she would be if someone else had THEIR own gun and it was pointed at her. Would she be more afraid of that gun than your gun that might just save her (and your) life?

Before long not only will you both have a gun or guns but also stun guns, pepper spray, cell phones, car and home alarms, a safe room, assult rifels, shotguns, RPGs, etc.!

Good luck!

(If none of this works, get the gun anyway!!)

Red_SC
October 27, 2005, 12:23 PM
My attempting to logically explain my reasoning to own a firearm resulted in her:
1. equating me with the rednecks she grew up with, despite an incredible display of bigotry and ignorance on her part


Hey, what's wrong with rednecks?:neener:

J/K:evil: Can't help you much, my wife understands that it's a sickness and not something that I can help. I just emailed her the link to the RRA AR-15 I want while I was on the phone with her. The conversation basically went, "Why do you want that thing? It looks just like a military gun. You have a fascination with those, don't you? $950? That's not too bad. When are you going to get it?"

I'm trying a little psychology here. The most expensive gun I've bought, a Rem PSS, was $750 with a cheapy scope and a bipod, and was a bunch of money at the time. Now, I keep telling her about these $3000 custom rifles and $1200 scopes, and a $1K rifle suddenly "isn't too bad." Hey, it's working for me. (But if any of y'all meet her, please don't tell her what I'm doing!:eek: )

OEF_VET
October 27, 2005, 12:37 PM
(But if any of y'all meet her, please don't tell her what I'm doing!

Don't worry. We'd never tell on a man for doing the same thing we'd do ourselves. (Or have already done in the past. :evil: )

ccw007
October 27, 2005, 12:39 PM
I have not read all of the post, but my motto is that it is easier to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission…. However, the owner of the gun store I frequent now ask if I have my permission slip from my wife LOL. :D

KC&97TA
October 27, 2005, 12:52 PM
You know, one thing nobody brought up... and I have to do it still with car parts. When the old lady owns a Match Grade AR, you know I have it good. :neener:

Step 1. Buy her a set of really nice earrings, a ring, braclet, something she really wants and buy your self a gun. Put them in seperate boxes then put the 2 boxes in one box.

Step 2. Sit her down with the big box, pull out her present, then pull out your package. Tell her if she wants to keep her present you get to keep your present,

Result 1. You figured out how to get her attention off the horrible metal item you brought into the house.

Result 2. If you aren't going to be allowed to keep the gun, take her present back and lock he gun in a safe out in the garage. Tell her the gun is staying there and her present is going back to the store, and she's being an unreasonable person. Use the money from her present to buy another gun. :evil:

Can't believe there's people that would divorce thier wives, if they said "no gun". Go buy the thing, don't be sneeky, throw it right in her face when you bring it home. Keeping little secrets is were the trust ends.

SteveS
October 27, 2005, 01:10 PM
Bad idea. If the couselor even hints at agreeing with you, your wife will dig in her heels and fight you tooth and nail. If the counselor is anti-gun, she'll validate your wife's perception and the counselor is likey to start working to "cure" you.


I work as a counselor, though working with couples is not my area of practice. A decent counselor will not do any of the things listed above. If they do, leave. You would be wasting your money if you stayed.

A decent counselor is not there to tell you what to do or impart their own values or beliefs on you. They are supposed to help you solve your problems and hopefully get you to the point where you can solve your problems without any kind of third party.

If you decide to go the counseling route, look around until you find someone that you can both agree to work with. Also, it should be someone that primarily does marriage counseling and has a lot of experience.

Mad Man
October 27, 2005, 01:19 PM
Don't bring a wife to a gun fight.

Darth Ruger
October 27, 2005, 01:48 PM
A decent counselor is not there to tell you what to do or impart their own values or beliefs on you. They are supposed to help you solve your problems and hopefully get you to the point where you can solve your problems without any kind of third party.A decent counselor would do that, but not all counselors are decent. There are some out there that don't take such a neutral, objective approach to their job and they shouldn't be in the business, just as there are gunsmiths, car mechanics, and doctors that aren't very good at their jobs.



A decent counselor will not do any of the things listed above. If they do, leave.
The problem with that is if the counselor does do those things and he wants to leave, it won't matter because the the damage will already have been done. She'll be convinced of her position even more, and she'll insist he just wants to find a different counselor because the current one agrees with her instead of him.

Leaving at that point will save money otherwise spent on further counseling, but his situation will be even worse.

atk
October 27, 2005, 03:10 PM
While I haven't read the whole thread, I'm surprised I haven't seen the following advice:



Why not lead her to understand why you want a gun? IIRC, you said that you want it for two reasons:

target shooting
protection


Well, why not start with:

Target Shooting: "Honey, let's watch TV. Oh! They olympics are on! Let's watch." turn to olympics, watch people shooting skeet. "That looks like fun. And I'm told it takes a *lot* of skill."


Make it subtle. Don't push hard. Lead her in the direction you want her to go, but make sure she's the one traveling in that direction.


Protection: "Honey, I was just watching the news. They said that someone was raped two towns over. And I always thought that was a safe place."

Bring up enough of these, on enough days (not all consecutive days!) and start talking about how you're worried about her: "Gee, there's been a lot of crimes like that committed lately. It makes me worry about you - I love you and I don't want to see you get hurt." See how she goes. Don't talk about getting a gun. Talk about her being able to defend herself. Get her into a class where she can begin to understand self defense.

Remember, people who are indoctrinated require time, combined with they're own ability to think, and someone to gently guide them down the path, so that they can figure out reality for themselves.


And then there are some people who will never be convinced.

SteveS
October 27, 2005, 03:51 PM
A decent counselor would do that, but not all counselors are decent.

Very true. I know plenty that I would never refer anyone to.

The problem with that is if the counselor does do those things and he wants to leave, it won't matter because the the damage will already have been done. She'll be convinced of her position even more, and she'll insist he just wants to find a different counselor because the current one agrees with her instead of him.


The point I was trying to make was to counter the assumption that all counselors are anti-gun and are just going to "cure" you of your fondness for guns. While there are some, I would say that most marriage counselors are going to not take sides in this type of issue. If they did, I would suspect they wouldn't have much repeat business. Your best bet, if you want counseling, is to not just pick a name from the yellow pages. See if anyone you know has ever been to marriage counseling or try to find one through your doctor. Let them know that you want someone that is unbiased and objective.

svtruth
October 27, 2005, 04:14 PM
My advice FWIW, is to introduce her to pax on this forum. She, pax, is rational, logical, and very persuasive.
Good luck.

DRZinn
November 2, 2005, 04:35 AM
I haven't read the whole thread, but enough to be pretty sure no-one else has said this yet:

BUY TWO.

Darth Ruger
November 2, 2005, 05:29 AM
The point I was trying to make was to counter the assumption that all counselors are anti-gun and are just going to "cure" you of your fondness for guns. While there are some, I would say that most marriage counselors are going to not take sides in this type of issue. If they did, I would suspect they wouldn't have much repeat business. Your best bet, if you want counseling, is to not just pick a name from the yellow pages. See if anyone you know has ever been to marriage counseling or try to find one through your doctor. Let them know that you want someone that is unbiased and objective.
Good point, but that brings up another question. Doesn't the counselor need to be educated about guns in order to deal with this problem? How can a counselor be effective at helping them deal with this issue if the counselor doesn't know anything about the issue that is causing the strife in the marriage?

I'm not saying this must be a prerequisite, I'm just asking because I don't know. My wife doesn't have a problem with my guns. :D

balletto
November 2, 2005, 01:20 PM
Had another discussion w/ the wife this past weekend, it went a bit better, giving me new hope.

I think the idea has been planted in her head that I can logically justify owning firearms. I think that she's made the mental breakthrough that will eventually get her past her emotional reaction to the whole topic.

Thanks again for everyone's opinions.

Darth Ruger
November 2, 2005, 01:39 PM
That sounds hopeful. But don't get over-eager and start pushing too hard, too fast, or you'll risk closing her up again. Take it slow and don't come across as being pushy. Give her time to get comfortable with the idea and start to accept it. I'm not saying you should do absolutely nothing until she says it's okay, just don't try to push her too fast. If you're patient and not pushy about it, she'll be more receptive to the idea.

deadly50bmg
November 2, 2005, 01:45 PM
3. stating that having a piece of metal in the house that fired a bullet was "not who she wanted to be", despite my protests that she never had to touch the thing, much less learn how to use it


Thanks!

You know, they make an ultralight AR-15 now that is all carbon fiber...even the barrel.

Shoot that back at her..Haha

If you enjoyed reading about "Problem with my wife..." here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!